Yeah. You’re clueless. The point made is about illustrating the humanity in the human suffering.
You see. I tend to think slaves were people, just like you and me.
But I guess it’s easier for you to view them as a mass of oppressed widgets.
You can’t say that!
- Thread starter CO. Hoosier
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You see. I tend to think slaves were people, just like you and me.
But I guess it’s easier for you to view them as a mass of oppressed widgets.
"Some slaves learning skills in the trades while enslaved is objectively true. Using those skills after emancipation for personal benefit is also objectively true."
So your position is that slaves were incapable of developing skills on their own without being enslaved" So in effectbeing stolen from their homes and forced into slavery actually benefited them?
And in over 200 years of chattel slavery in the US , how many folks do you think were "emancipated" and consequently able to "personally benefit" from those "acquired skills"? Clearly the poor unskilled Blacks owe a debt of gratitude to those magnanimous slave owners that allowed them to learn skills and thrive...
You sound like Jesse Waters, and that's no compliment. Listen for yourself...
I think Mark Morial, President of Urban League provides the best possible answer to counter the nonsense coming from people like DeSantis, Jesse and apparently you...
This is all abut indoctrinating the youth into American Exceptionialism, and trying to minimalize and whitewash one of the most shameful periods in American History. If they can lessen the evil of slavery by claiming that people learned trades, or that slaves were originally sold by other Africans, or that whites ended slavery then they can argue that chattel slavery is not an abomination but rather a more nuanced series of events that is somehow "misunderstood"...
It's no accident that this sort of Prager "Univ" reading of history just coincidentally happens to be happening in the state where Prager U kids courses are about to be recognized as some sort of "scholarly alternative" to actual History courses. What's next? Dennis Prager as head of the State Board of Education and Candace Owens as a model for teachers to emulate?
I thought "Pudding fingers Ronnie" was opposed to Indoctrination?
That's not the 'humanity in the human suffering'. It's trying to view slavery as transactional.
Which is clownish because where is the ironic prosperity that it's pushing?
Are there many examples that we can point to of black americans prospering because of the skills they learned in forced bondage that I'm not aware of?
That might help your argument.
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The curriculum literally goes on to cite I believe 16 different examples of former slaves. But you didn’t get that far because you switched into indignant mode like you were told to do before absorbing the whole point.
That’s okay. You’re not a nuance man. You’re a narrative man. The world needs followers.
When Michelle Obama spoke of living in the White House knowing that slaves built it, she wasn’t talking about those who picked cotton. . She was talking about those who knew construction trades. History tells us that in some cases the slaves and emancipated slaves used those skills for individual benefit.
I would think liberals would celebrate accomplishments and skills of blacks despite being owned like a wagon. I guess not.
I have no clue what Florida says about Jim Crow in its curriculum. Why don’t you research that and start a thread.
If the bolded is true, then I don’t have any objections.
It would just be another in a long line of LWNJ manufactured outrage.
Maybe they'll teach people about a slave who learned to sail and then sailed away under the nose of the confederates, taking others with him. Or maybe that's not worth people learning about?
Robert Smalls, from Escaped Slave to House of Representatives | African American History Blog | The African Americans: Many Rivers to Cross
Robert Smalls made a daring sea escape during the Civil War as a slave and went on to serve five terms in Congress as a Representative from South Carolina.
www.pbs.org
We need Abraxis (I think) to come over and teach us how most slaves were pretty happy with their situation, as evidenced by the fact they sang all the time.
This person goes through person by person and if true, absolutely destroys the examples given of slaves that thrived after being free.
Ooohh 16?
Was it like Schindler's List where the 1200 he saved is currently over 8500 just in America alone?
Where is this great prosperity?
Look I know what you think it is. Buttigieg got dragged for having a grade school event where he was asked about the forefathers who were slave owners and his reply was to the effect of 'they were brilliant because they knew that our country would grow and that the document that served them wouldn't be able to serve the future as well, so they made it an adjustable document to strive for a perfect document'.
That was a soft reply to a random question from a kid (again, he got dragged a little for it).
This is about school canon.
Unless there is some massive ironic prosperity (which there's not) it's probably best to avoid silver linings on such an inhumane topic as most grounded people understand.
Better yet stop lying. This isn't about human resolve like Schindler, a nazi, gaining the trust of the Nazis, finding massive success for the first time in his life from the Nazis but losing it all and risking his life by lying to the Nazis to save lives.
That story doesn't work without the evils of the Nazis.
In the case of slavery, you and I are the Nazis in this story.
Doesn’t matter. It was conceived and approved by African Americans.
You don’t get to decide for them what is an unacceptable representation of their history.
Sure, until they start demanding reparations and to defund police.
That goes a little beyond what is taught in a classroom, wouldn’t you say?
No White guilt cuck. My ancestors came from Finland at the turn of the century and worked in copper mines in the Upper Peninsula.
I’m not the oppressor in any civil rights story and neither are you, even if your ancestors may have been.
Your problem. Is you have zero lense to view the world through other than victim and victimizer. Like I said before. Incapable of nuance, incapable of seeing people’s humanity.
It’s a really dumb way to view the world but I’m not going to be able to talk you out of it.
You decided to read intent into the curriculum of a “silver lining” that’s not there. Nowhere does the curriculum credit slave owners with upskilling slaves. Nowhere does it credit the skills gained as a benefit to anyone but the slaves themselves, materially different from calling it a benefit of slavery.
But you seethe with hatred for DeSantis and politics has broken your brain. Your are an unconscionable person and extremely feeble minded that you would allow politics to distort you to such an extent.
Nonsense. First, what "curriculum" are you referring to? We've been talking about the Florida Academic Standards for Social Studies and the "personal benefit" language. That entry is followed by commentary about the Underground Railroad and identifies various abolitionists. I see nothing at all in that section with examples of former slaves purportedly benefiting from slavery.
It's apparent you have no idea what you're talking about so I'll help you out here. There was a statement issued by two members of the African American History Standards Workgroup in response to the backlash over the inappropriate language in the Standards. They cite several examples of "slaves ... who developed highly specialized trades from which they benefited." Problem is almost half of the individuals identified by the two "scholars" were: 1) never slaves; or 2) never gained skills through enslavement! These people need to go back to school.
As for you, Goo, I'm proud of you for refraining from blow-job insults today. You're making progress. How's the job search coming?
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anon_6hv78pr714xta
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I don’t think they were trying to say that slavery wasn’t all bad.
I think they were trying to point out the fact that for emancipated slaves, those who had skills (even if taught to them while a slave) did better than those who did not.
You claimed slavery led to personal benefit due to the skills that were learned.
Again learning skills and slavery are not synonymous.
And again, where is this ironic prosperity that came out of human bondage?
It's trying to create this american exceptionalism which doesn't work when it came out of american exploitation.
Since I know you I very strongly doubt that it's born out of your 'feels' or your 'fears' because you and I know we come from the exploiters in this story.
Hey, speaking of that horrific era, next thing you know some of these morons will be here telling us about the wonderful skills developed by the Jews in Nazi forced-labor camps.
Calm down, relax.
As I said before, the logic is clownish because it's pushing American exceptionalism when it was caused by American exploitation.
Obviously the thought of there being an American villain is too much for some even though it's inevitable in this story and will follow through Jim Crow, etc.
We did get some great medical advances from it.
Amiright?
But seriously, look at how the Germans honor those that were percecuted and how they teach the rise of the Nazis, otherwise known as 'their history'.
They basically sacked up like a real man would.
We’ve seen this. It’s an example of a person on the committee and we know some of them were Black. I’d be interested in other opinions too, but obviously pay attention to his thoughts.
That post is brief but still one of the biggest loads of bullshit in the thread. You've outdone yourself.
Special place in hell for those fvcking monsters.
Edit: I didn't see the second half of your post when I responded. Yeah, that's an excellent point.
Claiming that all whites were exploiters is as dumb as claiming all blacks were since they, in most cases, sold or traded the slaves to Europeans.
What have you done to make amends, other than project your guilt to everyone else? Are you providing reparations, real man?
I don‘t know what kind of shithole you went to school in, but I was taught all about slavery…
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anon_6hv78pr714xta
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Your last line is exactly why we shouldn’t be teaching anything remotely resembling African American Studies (as opposed to African American history) in K-12.
Why in the world would you be a Nazi in the American story? You weren’t alive 160 years ago. Do you actually believe that you, personally, are morally culpable to any degree, no matter how infinitesimally small for something people who happened to have the same skin color as you and lived on the same continent did before your grandfather was even born?
This is, no doubt, the unsaid assumption behind much of this debate and I just don’t understand why you identify so much with slave owners. You are actually buying into their rationale, and the rationale of the actual White Supremacists that “whites” constitute some meaningful, metaphysical category across all time and space. I don’t get it.
A person may benefit from the skills they learned in spite of their enslavement and the brutality they endured. Ok.
Including that as context in any discussion of bondage is self serving only to the group that enslaved the other.
Including that as context in any discussion of bondage is self serving only to the group that enslaved the other.
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anon_6hv78pr714xta
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I think from the clip I saw linked here, the one black committee member said they were trying to provide uplifting stories and heroes for students so that black kids didn’t think their lot in life was to be victims. That seems like a noble goal. I think they are going to edit the offending sentence or paragraph.
Either perpetuate a se;f feeling of worthlessness and shame, or build toward a better future for all.
It's obvious that one of our groups is only interested in the negative of these two. Other wise their political message has nothing but failure... OH wait, it still does. Oh snap.
Then they should read up on their own history, because it's not accurate, which we want to be teaching with history, correct?
History isn't something that should be up for debate. Either it happened or it didn't, which a number of these things looks like clearly didn't, but because at most half of this group that approved this curriculum were black, it should be accepted. No. That's bull.
If their examples to hype this up are factually wrong with facts behind them, then they are wrong. We can't go around changing the past just because a panel says so.
I had read about that - an amazing story. Guy had a set!Maybe they'll teach people about a slave who learned to sail and then sailed away under the nose of the confederates, taking others with him. Or maybe that's not worth people learning about?
Robert Smalls, from Escaped Slave to House of Representatives | African American History Blog | The African Americans: Many Rivers to Cross
Robert Smalls made a daring sea escape during the Civil War as a slave and went on to serve five terms in Congress as a Representative from South Carolina.www.pbs.org
Henry Louis Gates Jr.
His show on PBS, Finding Your Roots, is fantastic. You often hear stories like this about his guest's ancestors.
A buddy loaned me his most recent book- Who's Black and Why. I need to do a better job of working through the nightstand pile.
