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Well, I might have to support Bernie again this year

TheOriginalHappyGoat said:
For purely selfish reasons.

Have at it, responsible folks.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...K7jgz2LU&noredirect=on&utm_term=.c36db6f804de
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sorry to see Bernie get pulled further left, and jeopardize his other agendas.

MFA should still be goal one, with much cheaper higher education also a must.

i have no problem with moving everyone now in debt to fed rate interest rates and being able to BK on the loans, but not total amnesty.

or some means testing.

on a side note, do student loans also include money borrowed for housing and other expenses while in school, or just tutition, books, fees?

on another side note, i would like to see what percent of student loans never get paid back.

loans were made with rates set assuming X percent default rate, and any deal made with lending institutions for the govt to take over pmts, should take into account that default rate.

if going down this road, we need to make sure we're only bailing out the student, and not the lending institutions.
 
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TheOriginalHappyGoat said:
For purely selfish reasons.

Have at it, responsible folks.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...K7jgz2LU&noredirect=on&utm_term=.c36db6f804de
Click to expand...
From the purely societal point of view, that has got to be the dumbest liberal (major) policy initiative ever in the history of eternity. That seriously forces any sentient being to question if Bernie is more idiotic than Trump.

If I thought there were any chance Bernie could sign into law such legislation, I'd rather vote for Trump in a heartbeat. Then again, since Bernie is evidently the opinion leader for liberals and liberal politicians now, it makes me wonder if I want the Democrats to retake power. In the final analysis, women's issues are social issues more than political, so society will gradually take care of them. The worst thing about Trump, aside from threatening nuclear destruction, is his obliteration of safeguards for the environment.
 
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Univee2 said:
Of course you will.

Despite your little bon mot, one would think you might be slightly ashamed/embarrassed - you being an "attorney" and all - to have others shoulder the responsibilities into which you willingly and knowingly entered.

Now, go ahead and complain to the PTB about others being mean to you.
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I'll go ahead and support this if we also reimburse everyone who actually paid back their loans. Suckers.
 
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I have three kids that I have put through Columbia, Cornell (well, two more years to go), and UCF (in-state tuition for one of them, albeit on 6-year plan!)

I started saving like crazy, from the day that they were born, told them they could go to the best schools they could get into, and told them that they would graduate without a penny of student loan debt as long as they worked hard. Every bonus check my wife and I got went to college funds. More went there than into 401K, even. The small money from parents estate: all saved.

I kept my word and it wasn't easy. One year my wife and I paid $150,000 in tuition & fees. We both are, even now, driving cars past 300,000 miles to save money. 15 years ago I bought half the house that the banks said that i could afford. We always vacationed on a budget.

All three kids are grateful for what we did for them, since their friends all have massive debt.

On on hand, I feel sorry for those kids, and it would be nice if they didn't have all of that debt.

But then I think that 25 years of frugal living made it possible for my kids to not face any of that, and it does seem a bit unfair if other families who didn't buckle down like we did are bailed out. So I am a bit torn.
 
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I'd start simple: allow one to bankrupt student debt just like anything else.
 
outside shooter said:
I have three kids that I have put through Columbia, Cornell (well, two more years to go), and UCF (in-state tuition for one of them, albeit on 6-year plan!)

I started saving like crazy, from the day that they were born, told them they could go to the best schools they could get into, and told them that they would graduate without a penny of student loan debt as long as they worked hard. Every bonus check my wife and I got went to college funds. More went there than into 401K, even. The small money from parents estate: all saved.

I kept my word and it wasn't easy. One year my wife and I paid $150,000 in tuition & fees. We both are, even now, driving cars past 300,000 miles to save money. 15 years ago I bought half the house that the banks said that i could afford. We always vacationed on a budget.

All three kids are grateful for what we did for them, since their friends all have massive debt.

On on hand, I feel sorry for those kids, and it would be nice if they didn't have all of that debt.

But then I think that 25 years of frugal living made it possible for my kids to not face any of that, and it does seem a bit unfair if other families who didn't buckle down like we did are bailed out. So I am a bit torn.
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I’m not torn - I’m 100% against it. You don’t take a loan if you don’t intend to repay it. That makes a person a deadbeat. I put myself through college and that included a couple student loans and I repaid them. The thought of not paying them or asking them to be forgiven never crossed my mind.

Additionally, the cost of this is huge, like all the “free stuff” policies Sanders supports.

I cannot stand Trump, but nominate Sanders and I will have to vote for Trump. I sincerely hope I don’t have to do that. Democrats - don’t make me do it. There are many others like me.
 
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UncleMark said:
I'd start simple: allow one to bankrupt student debt just like anything else.
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Spartans9312 said:
Bankruptcy, the answer to all problems.
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Bankruptcy is a last resort. For those who truly cannot recover from their student debt without suffering extreme hardship, it should be an option. I'm not advocating for people who knowingly took on a heavy debt burden and are just whining about it putting a crimp in their style.
 
UncleMark said:
Do they make you sick or break your bones if you medically bankrupt?
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Medical issues are not things people willingly sign up for. And having them provides zero economic benefit to the individual (actually a negative economic impact, obviously.)

They aren't comparable.
 
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USAToday had a story a couple months ago about people struggling under college debt. An example was a microbiologist studying bacterial resistance to antibiotics. I think 90% of us agree this is something important. And probably not a field one can walk into with a 2 year degree. So do we want to pay these people more, makes the necessary degrees more affordable, or just not worry about bacterial resistance?

I know someone who worked in the process of getting graduate students admitted. They said they had a hard quota on Chinese students, or every single slot would be filled by Chinese students. China pays for them to come here and study, not just STEM but everything. We have to be running a huge trade surplus on education. Using Trump's math, we could just use that surplus to do Bernie's idea and not cost us a dime.

Even I do not support wiping out debt, but why not make it so as long as one is paying back on time that student loans be interest free?

Or maybe hope the Chinese make the breakthrough on antibiotic resistance.
 
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Hank Reardon said:
The only way I'd vote for Bernie is if he could somehow mandate the proper use of paragraphs in the Water Cooler.
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that's too "big govt" for me.

we all have to draw the line somewhere.

and it's a slippery slope you're going down at that point.

open this Pandora's box, and the next thing you know, the govt will be regulating use of capital letters.

then what's next, an "actual" spelling police?
 
i'vegotwinners said:
that's too "big govt" for me.

we all have to draw the line somewhere.

and it's a slippery slope you're going down at that point.

open this Pandora's box, and the next thing you know, the govt will be regulating use of capital letters.

then what's next, an "actual" spelling police?
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I think we need to find a way to curb the excessive use of quotation marks, particularly when used in lieu of italics.
 
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I need to start watching the polls very closely. At some point if it looks like Bernie is going to win I will just have my kid take out student loans for the first year of college (which starts in August) instead of wasting all that money we've saved for his education.
 
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outside shooter said:
I have three kids that I have put through Columbia, Cornell (well, two more years to go), and UCF (in-state tuition for one of them, albeit on 6-year plan!)

I started saving like crazy, from the day that they were born, told them they could go to the best schools they could get into, and told them that they would graduate without a penny of student loan debt as long as they worked hard. Every bonus check my wife and I got went to college funds. More went there than into 401K, even. The small money from parents estate: all saved.

I kept my word and it wasn't easy. One year my wife and I paid $150,000 in tuition & fees. We both are, even now, driving cars past 300,000 miles to save money. 15 years ago I bought half the house that the banks said that i could afford. We always vacationed on a budget.

All three kids are grateful for what we did for them, since their friends all have massive debt.

On on hand, I feel sorry for those kids, and it would be nice if they didn't have all of that debt.

But then I think that 25 years of frugal living made it possible for my kids to not face any of that, and it does seem a bit unfair if other families who didn't buckle down like we did are bailed out. So I am a bit torn.
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though a big Bernie guy, (he was also about the only guy with the insight and the balls to vote against the Iraq war), i agree with a lot of your point.

the free college was overly ambitious, but with economies of scale online learning facilitates, i thought it could be doable if structured correctly.

as i posted above, i could see some relief for those holding massive college debt, but amnesty seems problematic, and what about everybody else with a hard luck story, or the inequality of those who bore hardship to not incur massive debt with school.

i feel like Bernie has let himself get dragged into this, (which isn't like him imo), and would hate to see this jeopardize his credibility with those already on the fence with him, thus jeopardize the really good ideas he has brought forward as well.
 
Noodle said:
I think we need to find a way to curb the excessive use of quotation marks, particularly when used in lieu of italics.
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You lose the emphasis of italics when it's quoted. Hence my preference for underlines and bolds.
 
Noodle said:
I need to start watching the polls very closely. At some point if it looks like Bernie is going to win I will just have my kid take out student loans for the first year of college (which starts in August) instead of wasting all that money we've saved for his education.
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I'm golden. I have one who just graduated this Spring from BSU, and another who will be a Jr at IU this fall. My oldest will need to start paying her loans soon, but I'm watching the polling numbers. I might advise her to go full deadbeat for awhile and see how this plays out.
 
Do find it hilarious that the Democratic-Socialist running for President just proposed spending $3T+ on a highly regressive benefit.
 
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outside shooter said:
I have three kids that I have put through Columbia, Cornell (well, two more years to go), and UCF (in-state tuition for one of them, albeit on 6-year plan!)

I started saving like crazy, from the day that they were born, told them they could go to the best schools they could get into, and told them that they would graduate without a penny of student loan debt as long as they worked hard. Every bonus check my wife and I got went to college funds. More went there than into 401K, even. The small money from parents estate: all saved.

I kept my word and it wasn't easy. One year my wife and I paid $150,000 in tuition & fees. We both are, even now, driving cars past 300,000 miles to save money. 15 years ago I bought half the house that the banks said that i could afford. We always vacationed on a budget.

All three kids are grateful for what we did for them, since their friends all have massive debt.

On on hand, I feel sorry for those kids, and it would be nice if they didn't have all of that debt.

But then I think that 25 years of frugal living made it possible for my kids to not face any of that, and it does seem a bit unfair if other families who didn't buckle down like we did are bailed out. So I am a bit torn.
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You’re a goddamned American hero. I mean that with all sincerity.
 
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twenty02 said:
Do find it hilarious that the Democratic-Socialist running for President just proposed spending $3T+ on a highly regressive benefit.
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It is ironic, isn't it? Those complaining about their debt load are in many cases the ones who can most afford it.

I don't have any sympathy for the empty nester who goes and gets a grad degree in comparative literature. I have a lot more for the single mom who got a degree in education (which also almost requires you to get a grad degree later) or an RN. The ones I feel the most sorry for are the bright kids that "followed their passion" and got a history degree, then found out it was worthless. Four year liberal arts degrees are now a luxury of the already wealthy.

My dad got a degree in voice from the IU School of Music (via scholarships and working his ass off) in the early 50s. He had a job lined up as the musical director back in his home town upon graduation. Instead, he got drafted and sent to Korea. When he got back, the home town position wasn't there, and he went to work for American United Life in their mortgage loan department. He had zero background in business or finance or economics, but they took him on and trained him up. He later went on to be a top selling agent.

That doesn't happen nowadays. Employers want their cogs pre-built to their specifications, ready to plug into the machine. Colleges and Universities today are glorified trade schools. The days of getting an education for education's sake are long gone.
 
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