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Trump wants new Ukrainian elections and Musk castigates Zelensky: "He doesn't want peace."

This thread illustrates how politics has divided us.

This concerns me as it plays into the steady hand of Putin who maintains control as we flounder under our own failure to be unified.
You're leaving out a critical piece. What/who's the catalyst? Who's sucking up to Putin and enabling him?
 
Americans are entitled to their opinion about our support for Ukraine. Only 45% of Americans believe our support is adequate or should be increased. That figure will only continue to decrease as the war continues.

The real question is, given that American support will only wane, is Ukraine/ U.S. in a better negotiating position now, or a year from now? Three years from now?

Let’s see what concessions are made. Ukraine will not get all its territory back. They will not be in NATO. An acknowledgement of that from our end is the predicate to hammering out the rest of the details. That is unless and until the rest of NATO steps up and decides they want to own this conflict with minimal or no U.S. support.
I saw that poll, but is a lot different than you report. Overall, 30% of American adults say the U.S. is providing too much support to Ukraine in its war with Russia. That’s up from 27% in November 2024, just after the U.S. presidential election. At the same time, the share of adults who believe the U.S. is not providing enough support to Ukraine has increased slightly: 22% say this, up from 18% in November. These shifts mean that U.S. opinion about support for Ukraine is now closer to preelection levels.

About one-in-five Americans (23%) say the level of U.S. support for Ukraine is about right, down slightly from 25% in November. Another 24% say they are not sure, down from 29% over the same period.

The narrative on the poll states: "Slightly more Americans now say supporting Ukraine helps U.S. national security than said this when we last asked in April 2024 (39% today vs. 36% then)."
 
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Per what Trump said, did Ukraine really start the war with Russia?

Again, Trump stated Ukraine started the war.
We all know Trump is not a fan of Zelensky no secret stemming from the phone call. But I have not seen Trump say that Ukraine started the war. I alsowonder how big a Putin puppet Trump was when the US killed the 12 Russian soldiers?
 
Americans are entitled to their opinion about our support for Ukraine. Only 45% of Americans believe our support is adequate or should be increased. That figure will only continue to decrease as the war continues.
And as presidents Trump and Musk ramp up their propaganda and demonization of the leader of the sovereign nation that war-criminal Putin invaded - - - Zelensky.
 
I saw that poll, but is a lot different than you report. Overall, 30% of American adults say the U.S. is providing too much support to Ukraine in its war with Russia. That’s up from 27% in November 2024, just after the U.S. presidential election. At the same time, the share of adults who believe the U.S. is not providing enough support to Ukraine has increased slightly: 22% say this, up from 18% in November. These shifts mean that U.S. opinion about support for Ukraine is now closer to preelection levels.

About one-in-five Americans (23%) say the level of U.S. support for Ukraine is about right, down slightly from 25% in November. Another 24% say they are not sure, down from 29% over the same period.

The narrative on the poll states: "Slightly more Americans now say supporting Ukraine helps U.S. national security than said this when we last asked in April 2024 (39% today vs. 36% then)."
Minute momentary shifts mean little. In the long run, U.S. support will hit a breaking point as it always does. Care to revisit polling when/if the next multi-billion dollar funding package is proposed?



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Minute momentary shifts mean little. In the long run, U.S. support will hit a breaking point as it always does. Care to revisit polling when/if the next multi-billion dollar funding package is proposed?



GhRNQ49XsAAjI1P.jpg:large
I just pointed out that you left some important information off. My guess is that there will not be another funding bill for the Ukraine coming out of this administration.
 
Apparently someone in the right wing universe is now wanting Trump to receive the Nobel Peace Prize. Teddy Roosevelt received one for his work in ending the Sino Russian War of 1905. Why not Trump?
 
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Apparently someone in the right wing universe is now wanting Trump to receive the Nobel Peace Prize. Teddy Roosevelt received one for his work in ending the Sino Russian War of 1905. Why not Trump?
Would the Prize be for his proposed illegal forced displacement of millions of Palestinians in Gaza, or for letting war criminal Vlad have his way in Ukraine?
 
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Would the Prize be for his proposed illegal forced displacement of millions of Palestinians in Gaza, or for letting war criminal Vlad have his way in Ukraine?
What would you consider an appropriate outcome in the Russia/Ukraine war? What’s the hard line? Is it the return of Crimea to Ukraine?
 
What would you consider an appropriate outcome in the Russia/Ukraine war? What’s the hard line? Is it the return of Crimea to Ukraine?
Like Trump said immediately after Putin invaded-it was genius by Putin and he was getting land for cents on the dollar. Both Trump and Putin know that beneath the land that Russia has control of is just loaded with rare earth metals, which is why Trump wanted a 500 billion dollar pledge by Zelensky to defend it.

 
Like Trump said immediately after Putin invaded-it was genius by Putin and he was getting land for cents on the dollar. Both Trump and Putin know that beneath the land that Russia has control of is just loaded with rare earth metals, which is why Trump wanted a 500 billion dollar pledge by Zelensky to defend it.

What would be an acceptable conclusion in your opinion?

Bowl won’t answer because he wants to bitch without having an opinion for all to see. It’s easy for him that way.
 
For Putin to withdraw from Ukraine and reimburse Ukraine for its rebuilding.

Why should a thief and murderer benefit from his misdeeds?
Perfect. Let’s do it. We should have stopped the invasion of Crimea.

I think Ranger stated a long time ago that most of the people in Crimea and the eastern Oblasts considered themselves Russian.

It may be a tough battle but let’s send in the troops and get it over as quickly as possible
 
Perfect. Let’s do it. We should have stopped the invasion of Crimea.

I think Ranger stated a long time ago that most of the people in Crimea and the eastern Oblasts considered themselves Russian.

It may be a tough battle but let’s send in the troops and get it over as quickly as possible
Obama was very weak. It should never have happened.

The people in the eastern Oblasts and Crimea were Russians who Stalin installed to take over the vacancy that was left from Stalin’s mass starvation of Ukrainians termed the Holodmor where as many as 6 million people perished.

You know the US has no will to prevent the future mass genocide that Putin will inflict on Ukraine.


This will be a period of world history that will be really shocking to future generations, and we get to watch the slaughter in real time and won’t do anything to prevent it.
 
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Obama was very weak. It should never have happened.

The people in the eastern Oblasts and Crimea were Russians who Stalin installed to take over the vacancy that was left from Stalin’s mass starvation of Ukrainians termed the Holodmor where as many as 6 million people perished.

You know the US has no will to prevent the future mass genocide that Putin will inflict on Ukraine.


This will be a period of world history that will be really shocking to future generations, and we get to watch the slaughter in real time and won’t do anything to prevent it.
How do we get Putin to withdraw?
 
Promise to put in our best efforts to keep him from being executed for war crimes but with no guarantees. That’s about all I would offer given Sadam had a better army than he has.
 
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