Trump at Arlington National yesterday.

[Aloha Hoosier]

Aloha has said repeatedly in this thread that this shouldn’t be a story because the families of slain soldiers are always critical of the president at the time.

What I said is it’s not the story you think it is that families blame a CinC for loss of loved ones. It isn’t. Definitely not for me. This is being used for pure politics. You can certainly find that interesting if you want.

I did not say the grieving families are always critical of the CinC either. I said sometimes. It also depends on the circumstances. The withdrawal was botched so these families understandably blame Biden.

The story at Arlington National Cemetery is the Trump campaign violated the law and long standing protocol by using the site for political campaign purposes.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

Because that isn’t the story. Families of the fallen often blame the CinC. It goes with the job. That is not a story.

What I said is it’s not the story you think it is that families blame a CinC for loss of loved ones. It isn’t. Definitely not for me. This is being used for pure politics. You can certainly find that interesting if you want.

I did not say the grieving families are always critical of the CinC either. I said sometimes. It also depends on the circumstances. The withdrawal was botched so these families understandably blame Biden.

The story at Arlington National Cemetery is the Trump campaign violated the law and long standing protocol by using the site for political campaign purposes.

.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

.

It’s not unique. It’s not a story to me. If it’s a super exciting story in your mind - more power to you.

You care not about using ANC for political campaign purposes contrary to the law, protocol and tradition? I clearly failed in my attempt to explain that was the ANC story.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

It’s not unique. It’s not a story to me. If it’s a super exciting story in your mind - more power to you.

It’s a story. You said repeatedly it wasn’t, and then claimed you didn’t say that.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

It’s a story. You said repeatedly it wasn’t, and then claimed you didn’t say that.

Jesus Christ. The story at ANC was a Presidential campaign unprecedentedly using the sacred grounds to film footage for political ads. It’s against the law and breaks tradition and protocol. His campaign also bullied ANC personnel who informed them of this. That’s the ANC story, not that some grieving families blame Biden. Is this hard for you to understand, or am I not being clear?

The families blaming Biden isn’t unique and doesn’t qualify as much of a story to me and ANC isn’t important to that, but if it does to you I’ve already said that’s OK with me. I don’t care at all if you do.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

It’s a story. You said repeatedly it wasn’t, and then claimed you didn’t say that.

Also, you cut out the point of my post. My point all along. Why do you refuse go address that?

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

sources tell NPR

Do you feel like a dunce now that the sources have been confirmed? Just asking.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

Also, you cut out the point of my post. My point all along. Why do you refuse go address that?

I was addressing your claim that you never said it wasn’t a story. Which was obviously mistaken.

I’ve not said anything about Trumps actions in this thread, but if that’s what you wanna hear, sure.

Trumps an asshole, and filming at ANC was ridiculous. He should be criticized for that.

There, that wasn’t hard. My feelings about Trump are well know and I’ve been consistent with them. I’m certainly not “all in on Trump” as you accused me of being in this thread.

What do you have to say about no one from the Harris camp even returning the calls of these families? Is that newsworthy or not to you?

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

I was addressing your claim that you never said it wasn’t a story. Which was obviously mistaken.

I’ve not said anything about Trumps actions in this thread, but if that’s what you wanna hear, sure.

Trumps an asshole, and filming at ANC was ridiculous. He should be criticized for that.

There, that wasn’t hard. My feelings about Trump are well know and I’ve been consistent with them. I’m certainly not “all in on Trump” as you accused me of being in this thread.

What do you have to say about no one from the Harris camp even returning the calls of these families? Is that newsworthy or not to you?

View embedded media

Once again, it was not the ANC story. It’s a separate story, one which isn’t compelling to me, but you do you.

You said this which was wrong:

There’s really no way to criticize Trump here, unless you believe NPR’s “anonymous sources”. Lol.

You didn’t want it to be about what the ANC story was about. I get it.

Yes, if families actually tried to contact the Harris campaign they should have responded.

 

[Hoopsdoc1978]

Once again, it was not the ANC story. It’s a separate story, one which isn’t compelling to me, but you do you.

You said this which was wrong:

There’s really no way to criticize Trump here, unless you believe NPR’s “anonymous sources”. Lol.

You didn’t want it to be about what the ANC story was about. I get it.

That was before the altercation was verified, although I’m not sure we know even now what exactly happened, beyond the fact that there was some kind of altercation.

I don’t readily accept as gospel anything pertaining to Trump, especially when it comes from an outfit like NPR. They’re just like most of the rest of the media, completely unreliable when it comes to Trump.

Yes, if families actually tried to contact the Harris campaign they should have responded.

Ok, so there IS more of a story here than Trump. Thank you for finally acknowledging that.

You’ve spent the whole thread up until now denying that.

 

[secondasky]

Do you feel like a dunce now that the sources have been confirmed? Just asking.

First of all when a story comes out that says sources have confirmed, aren't you a little skeptical of that without corroboration ? What sources. As Senator Tom Cotton said today I believe on Meet the Press, He didn't take campaign photos there. The Gold Star families asked him to take photos.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

That was before the altercation was verified, although I’m not sure we know even now what exactly happened, beyond the fact that there was some kind of altercation.

I don’t readily accept as gospel anything pertaining to Trump, especially when it comes from an outfit like NPR. They’re just like most of the rest of the media, completely unreliable when it comes to Trump.

Ok, so there IS more of a story here than Trump. Thank you for finally acknowledging that.

You’ve spent the whole thread up until now denying that.

If that gives you a warm and fuzzy. OK.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

First of all when a story comes out that says sources have confirmed, aren't you a little skeptical of that without corroboration ? What sources. As Senator Tom Cotton said today I believe on Meet the Press, He didn't take campaign photos there. The Gold Star families asked him to take photos.

Sources were being confirmed rapidly. Tom Cotton put on his MAGA hat for Meet the Press and left out part of it. Yes, they took pictures with the families AND the Trump campaign also took pictures and video for campaign purposes. We know this because the campaign has already released them in campaign ads.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Smarter than the public at large? If you took 25 randos from target?

We're obviously more educated than the public at large. Doesn't mean we are smarter.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Aloha has said repeatedly in this thread that this shouldn’t be a story because the families of slain soldiers are always critical of the president at the time.

He is right in that many families will blame the president. My brother was mentally messed up in Vietnam, damn straight I blame Johnson. So I get why it isn't necessarily front page news, sort of dog bites man thing. But it is news, and certainly Trump is free to film their comments and use them in a commercial.

I don't recall the 83 Beirut bombing families being all over the news one year later before the 84 election. I would bet many blamed Reagan. The bombing happened Oct 23, 1983. If the families held events on Oct 23, 1984, they would have been covered in the paper on the 24th. Below is the NYT site map, it lists the various article titled that day. I do not see Beirut.

Site Map - October 24, 1984

All New York Times stories published on October 24, 1984.

www.nytimes.com

Americans tend to move on from events that don't strike directly at us. 9/11 involved everyone, it was remembered a loooonnggg time. Beirut, Abbey Gate, those are terrible in the moment, then the non-family moves on. I hear a lot of families of school shooting victims complain about that.

 

[UncleMark]

Sources were being confirmed rapidly. Tom Cotton put on his MAGA hat for Meet the Press and left out part of it. Yes, they took pictures with the families AND the Trump campaign also took pictures and video for campaign purposes. We know this because the campaign has already released them in campaign ads.

Yeah, but that's different. I'm not sure how, but it just has to be.

 

[secondasky]

Sources were being confirmed rapidly. Tom Cotton put on his MAGA hat for Meet the Press and left out part of it. Yes, they took pictures with the families AND the Trump campaign also took pictures and video for campaign purposes. We know this because the campaign has already released them in campaign ads.

Once again I was referring to the original story posted on here where "sources say" about some pictures and an altercation. Was there really an altercation and if there was what really happened. Did the Trump people have permission to have a photographer there or was the photographer hired by the families and they got permission. Were charges ever filed. If not why. A lot of conflicting statements in that original story just like in a police shooting. That's what I'm referencing.

 

[ribbont]

It’s not unique. It’s not a story to me. If it’s a super exciting story in your mind - more power to you.

You care not about using ANC for political campaign purposes contrary to the law, protocol and tradition? I clearly failed in my attempt to explain that was the ANC story.

I think the story is also how the Harris-Biden admin was invited but did not respond. Being busy is one thing. Ghosting them is another. Biden was just taking naps on a beach. Harris was somewhere. Cotton said in her mansion, but IDK.

Add in Biden checking his watch twice during the dignified transfer and it just shows the lack of care and empathy the Harris-Biden admin had for these families.

Finally, now the Harris-Biden admin is stating they were not invited even though family members are saying they were invited, thus calling them liars. SMH.

 

[VanPastorMan]

Honoring the fallen doesn't include taking pictures.

You are completely full of shit ..

The families are ticked there wasn't more coverage from the press. So they are not upset about pictures so why should anyone else?

 

[VanPastorMan]

Once again I was referring to the original story posted on here where "sources say" about some pictures and an altercation. Was there really an altercation and if there was what really happened. Did the Trump people have permission to have a photographer there or was the photographer hired by the families and they got permission. Were charges ever filed. If not why. A lot of conflicting statements in that original story just like in a police shooting. That's what I'm referencing.

I heard on the news today that Harris was invited to this memorial. She never responded and did not show. So people are upset Trumps people took some pictures? My understanding is the familes of the fallen are not upset with DJT or his people.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

The families are ticked there wasn't more coverage from the press. So they are not upset about pictures so why should anyone else?

What? There isn’t supposed to be press coverage at ANC for family events. How do you repeatedly not understand what the issue actually was?

 

[Lucy01]

What? There isn’t supposed to be press coverage at ANC for family events. How do you repeatedly not understand what the issue actually was?

Yeah, tell that to the Kennedys!

 

[T.M.P.]

What? There isn’t supposed to be press coverage at ANC for family events. How do you repeatedly not understand what the issue actually was?

He's in a right wing propaganda echo chamber and isn't very smart to begin with. A lot of that going on.

A few tried to frame it as an official Arlington event, which it wasn't, and trying to claim Harris and Biden skipped it, which is a lie. What it was was a Trump campaigner manipulating those families into having Trump appear in a bullshit campaign event using those families and the graves of our fallen as props ..

That there was an altercation over rules and protocol is just typical Trump bullshit... attention whoring drama queens always attention whore and cause drama.

 

[VanPastorMan]

What? There isn’t supposed to be press coverage at ANC for family events. How do you repeatedly not understand what the issue actually was?

People are making a mountain out of a mole hill. The families want the event covered. They feel like their loved ones are being forgotten.

 

[Aloha Hoosier]

People are making a mountain out of a mole hill. The families want the event covered. They feel like their loved ones are being forgotten.

You really do not understand what the problem is here. You don’t want to know the actual truth. Pastors should care about the truth. Why don’t you?

 

[ChicagoFineForNow]

You really do not understand what the problem is here. You don’t want to know the actual truth. Pastors should care about the truth. Why don’t you?

What is the line between political purposes and apolitical purposes. Is media of a President at Arlington not inherently political.

 

[DrHoops]

Chicago Fire, the loss of 13 military members in the poorly executed withdrawal from Afghanistan as the underrated Taliban swarmed the airbase was definitely a bad day for the Biden administration.

Cannot blame Trump for going to Arlington as the families of the 13 killed have gone on record as being unhappy with the way Biden dealt with their loss.

Arlington is a "no politics" zone. That's the problem with what Trump did.

 

[DrHoops]

What is the line between political purposes and apolitical purposes. Is media of a President at Arlington not inherently political.

View embedded media

View embedded media

View embedded media

That's because the President of the United States represents all of us. Trump is running a (terrible) campaign.

 

[DrHoops]

How long do you think it takes to process a Sgt Major's retirement request? They only returned from Italy in 2004 and the rumours prior to their 2003 deployment had been they were going to Afghan..Instead they had been sent to Italy to basically take the place of units there that had been deployed to Aghan.

So when they were told they could be deployed within a 2 yr window-, they certainly didn't know it was Iraq. This was a National Guard unit. A two year window is a long time if you're over 20 in and aren't planning for 30.Based on his formal retirement in May 2005, I'd say Walz had to have submitted his paperwork at least 6 mos to a year before the unit received orders in July. And even at that, they didn't actually deploy till early 2006. Did you just expect Walz to put his political plans on hold till he could run in 2008?

If so, why aren't you critical of Vance leaving the service when his 4 yr enlistment was up? Vance's only goal was to extend his resume and be able to have access to the GI Bill to go to school. No problem with that until you try to intimate that those goals were somehow more honorable than a kid who enlisted at 17 (and based on rank achievement alone) kicked your butt.

The War in Iraq was ongoing when Vance left, and I guess you expect Walz to remain in uniform till the Iraq war ended? IIRC Walz's unit had returned from Iraq by the time Vance even enlisted. I guess you think Walz (for some reason) was supposed to delay his retirement till the war ended, although others, including Vance continued to come and go and you have no problem with that.

Vance could have re-upped for a year or two and stayed in Iraq, he didn't have to get out. There were rumours about the upcoming surge, but for some reason little JD decided he wanted to miss out on all the fun. Yet he's the one who tried to bring up these nonsense accusations,and you give him a complete pass.

I almost hope that Vance shoots his mouth off on this issue at the debate and Coach decks him. I'd love to see that little sneer get wiped off his face...

I'd add that JD didn't ever see combat. He was in communications. Not saying there's anything wrong with his service, but he likes to pretend he was on the front lines when that is the farthest thing from the truth.

Alexander Vindman, a retired Army lieutenant colonel, wrote on X, formerly Twitter: "Vance enlisted & served 4 yrs, including 6 months in Iraq in 2005 as a reporter w/ a Public Affairs section of a Marine Aircraft Wing.

 

[DrHoops]

The story is standing on a fallen soldier's grave with a thumbs-up signal. The story is that fallen soldiers are suckers and losers. The story is, that he only likes people who are alive not fallen Medal of Honor winners. give me a break the man is an Ass-hole.

This story is all anyone needs to say about Trump and the military:

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/do...disparaged-us-service-members-vete-rcna118543

John Kelly, whose son is buried in Arlington:

Trump privately made damning statements against U.S. service members and veterans, such as the late Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., who had been a Vietnam prisoner of war, and former President George H.W. Bush, who was shot down as a Navy pilot in World War II. During a visit to France in 2018 for the centennial anniversary of the end of World War I, Trump also reportedly called Marines who died at Belleau Wood “suckers” and fallen soldiers at Aisne-Marne American Cemetery “losers.”

Kelly also slammed Trump as someone "who is not truthful regarding his position on the protection of unborn life, on women, on minorities, on evangelical Christians, on Jews, on working men and women. A person that has no idea what America stands for and has no idea what America is all about."

He continued, “A person who cavalierly suggests that a selfless warrior who has served his country for 40 years in peacetime and war should lose his life for treason — in expectation that someone will take action,” an apparent reference to Trump's recent statements about Army Gen. Mark Milley, who just retired as the chairman of the Joints Chief of Staff. “A person who admires autocrats and murderous dictators. A person that has nothing but contempt for our democratic institutions, our Constitution, and the rule of law.”

“There is nothing more that can be said,” Kelly added. “God help us.”

 

[DrHoops]

As an example, Trump's commercial caught other graves besides Hoover's. The family of of the Green Beret next to Hoover was not happy that tombstone was in the commercial.

And what is up with smiling and thumbs up in the photo? I have had a lot of photos in Civil War cemeteries, and at Arlington, never have I thought it appropriate to smile and thumbs up.

Donald Trump disrespects the Arlington grave of a Phoenix-born war hero

Trump's thumbs-up at Arlington should disgust all of us, especially the family of Phoenix-born Sgt. Andrew Markesano.

www.azcentral.com

Psychopaths don't understand why people would care so much about the people who are buried there. Thus the "suckers and losers" comment.

Psychopaths don't understand why it's inappropriate to give a thumbs up on someone's grave. They don't understand why holding a campaign event at Arlington is SO absolutely inappropriate. Psychopaths have problems understanding the emotions of other people, which partly explains why they are so selfish and why they disregard the welfare of others.

Trump himself says he's disgusted with his voters and calls them "basement dwellers".

Isn't this funny?:

MSN

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...lled-supporters-basement-dwellers/ar-AA1p8Sov

 

[ChicagoFineForNow]

That's because the President of the United States represents all of us. Trump is running a (terrible) campaign.

One of those videos is a Biden campaign video from 2020.

 

[hoot1]

Arlington is a "no politics" zone. That's the problem with what Trump did.

Hoops, Arlington in my view is an example of politics dominating during an election year with the bigger problem being the divisiveness of politics doesn't end when the election is over. Instead of working together the parties and their followers continue attacking each other as if the election never occurred.

By the way in a post (#192) following the one you quoted I suggested the following... "Trump could have told the families he would have a special ceremony at the White House after the election".

 

[ribbont]

Hoops, Arlington in my view is an example of politics dominating during an election year with the bigger problem being the divisiveness of politics doesn't end when the election is over. Instead of working together the parties and their followers continue attacking each other as if the election never occurred.

By the way in a post (#192) following the one you quoted I suggested the following... "Trump could have told the families he would have a special ceremony at the White House after the election".

Not sure if a "later" ceremony would have helped. If Trump loses, then nothing would ever happen under Harris. The Harris-Biden admin has already shown their lack of care and empathy for these 13 by watch checking at the transfer and ghosting them on the invite.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/08/31/politics/video/christy-shamblin-arlington-national-cemetery-trump-controversy-sot-smr-digvid

 

[hoot1]

Not sure if a "later" ceremony would have helped. If Trump loses, then nothing would ever happen under Harris. The Harris-Biden admin has already shown their lack of care and empathy for these 13 by watch checking at the transfer and ghosting them on the invite.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/08/31/politics/video/christy-shamblin-arlington-national-cemetery-trump-controversy-sot-smr-digvid

Somewhere in all this, we should remind ourselves about the other 2,400 troops who were killed in Afganistan along with their families.

 

[ribbont]

Somewhere in all this, we should remind ourselves about the other 2,400 troops who were killed in Afganistan along with their families.

What does that have to do with the actions of the Harris-Biden admin that I discussed?

 

[twenty02]

What kind of sociopath stands behind a grave at Arlington with a big goofy smile and a thumbs up sign?

 

[mcmurtry66]

What kind of sociopath stands behind a grave at Arlington with a big goofy smile and a thumbs up sign?

that's why he's THE GOAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! our first AI president. cold and calculated decision maker. the money ball president. oh we have to help the poor. oh we have to help ukraine. we'll give you all our money. we'll play robin hood. NOT TRUMP!!!!!!!!!! what about bleach?? that shit kill covid? try it out on some of our poors. see if it works.

all while dropping SICK MERCH! TAKE MY MONEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Lucy01]

What kind of sociopath stands behind a grave at Arlington with a big goofy smile and a thumbs up sign?

Why do you support a party that wants to let non citizens to vote in our elections?

 

[mcmurtry66]

What kind of sociopath stands behind a grave at Arlington with a big goofy smile and a thumbs up sign?

you think it's a coincidence the world blew up when mushy peas and his social worker vp took over? puhleeeeeeze. they knew trump was a wild card. they're looking at him now, peacocking in arlington. you imagine putin and the rest. look at that mother fcker. posing and smiling. that man is a sociopath. a sociopath in decline. he might want to shoot a nuke just to see if they've expired