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TDH - B10 BB Power Rankings: First Look at Forecast for 2022-23

rikki-tikka-tava

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IU should crush it this year. If the freshmen are as advertised, could be an amazing Season.

Remarkable how much contrast there is between IU and everyone else in terms of returning personnel/production - on paper not seeing a clear challenger in Conference. Going to have to be some serious effort by other coaching staffs to integrate so many new Players and develop Teams capable of high-level offense and defense for 40 minutes.

The fact that Woodson has such a strong veteran core should allow for a lot more 'polish' and greater focus/efficiency on offense. Expecting clear/strong improvement in shooting, A/TO ratio and OE.
 
I think OSU and MSU will be solid. Can't ever count out Wisconsin. Purdue has enough to be dangerous but I don't think 2nd is right. Illinois seems to have picked up good gusrds
 
I think OSU and MSU will be solid. Can't ever count out Wisconsin. Purdue has enough to be dangerous but I don't think 2nd is right. Illinois seems to have picked up good gusrds
MSU is my team to watch.
 
There’s no way Edey is going to play 30 minutes per game.
 
You know they have a lerch in training........
I remember something about a Scandinavian guy committing, but beyond that I'm clueless about what they have coming in. I know they had a rough go of it with the local kid decommitting, so that was enjoyable for awhile.

Almost all of my purdoo buddies have gotten really quiet about things other than NIL being evil and purdoo doing it the right way.
 
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I remember something about a Scandinavian guy committing, but beyond that I'm clueless about what they have coming in. I know they had a rough go of it with the local kid decommitting, so that was enjoyable for awhile.

Almost all of my purdoo buddies have gotten really quiet about things other than NIL being evil and purdoo doing it the right way.
They’re on the wrong side of shock and awe right now
 
I remember something about a Scandinavian guy committing, but beyond that I'm clueless about what they have coming in. I know they had a rough go of it with the local kid decommitting, so that was enjoyable for awhile.

Almost all of my purdoo buddies have gotten really quiet about things other than NIL being evil and purdoo doing it the right way.
some big viking kid named Thor...er, I mean Berg. No way Edey averages 30 min/game.

Two things I'm going to predict now....Nebraska will absolutely suck, and mayor Fred's time will expire after this season. Nebraska bball is in a death spiral.

to me U of I is the wild card....total revamp of the team but a lot of new firepower there. But can Underwood make a team out of all the new faces?

I think Bucky is starting a slow downward trend beginning this year. At least, I hope so. God do I hope so. So sick of us getting beat by a bunch of slow punkasses with one superstar carrying the scoring load.
 
some big viking kid named Thor...er, I mean Berg. No way Edey averages 30 min/game.

Two things I'm going to predict now....Nebraska will absolutely suck, and mayor Fred's time will expire after this season. Nebraska bball is in a death spiral.

to me U of I is the wild card....total revamp of the team but a lot of new firepower there. But can Underwood make a team out of all the new faces?
Sure miss those Miles-Crean dorkfest middle school boy staredowns …. Back when Neb was in the process of becoming decent
 
I think the one thing that will definitely show improvement will be defense with all of the experience coming back. Hard to believe I know, but the D will be even better this coming season.
 
I think the one thing that will definitely show improvement will be defense with all of the experience coming back. Hard to believe I know, but the D will be even better this coming season.
I expect this too. I thought Parker actually tried on D, but he was a half step slow, due to injury. I would hope that everyone with a year of experience in CMW's system, is a little better and that guys like Tamar and JG are a good bit better. Add in JHS, who sounds like a great perimeter defender, and Reanu and I'd be disappointed if we're not better defensively. Plus, I'd expect some new wrinkles too.
 
As good an analysis as any. I can't pick any other B10 roster that I'd say is better than IU's.

I'll just issue the warning that MSU, Wisconsin, Purdue...they lost a lot of dudes, but also returned a lot of key pieces. And their coaches have proven that they'll figure out how to be good, basically every year, no matter what. And Illinois, while completely different, has as much talent as anyone. It seams like we're the best team coming in, but its tough every year for a reason.

And specifically for us, we did go 9-11 last year, and we're going to see a ton of returning usage from guys that led that 9-11 campaign.

My reservations are mainly based on that. X, TJD, Race, Miller, Trey, Tamar, and Jordan were regular rotation guys last year, on a team that was hovering around 100th nationally in offensive efficiency. And while our defense was very solid, it wasn't top 10/dominant, and it had a very annoying habit of being horrid late in close games when we needed stops the most.

To win our league outright, to be a top 10-15 team at the end of the season, we're going to need to improve rather dramatically offensively, and figure out how to get stops when we need them. The pessimistic view, and one I probably bring up too often, is its hard to see THAT level of improvement, when the minutes and usage available to new players is so limited.

The optimistic view, however...is that while we weren't close offensively to being a top 15 team, a B10 champion, etc... last year... in nearly all the games we played, we put ourselves into a solid position to win. And that it won't take a ton of improvement to turn a sizeable chunk of those close losses, into wins. JHS, if he's as good defensively as is being reported, could have a HUGE impact in allowing us to win/close out close games. If Cav is even remotely close to what Tamar will bring, that will have a big impact on our numbers offensively. If Malik can come in and provide any sort of typical 5 star big man contributions, that'll greatly solidify our frontcourt depth and production. If Jordan can build on his late season emergence, and become a consistent athletic, rebounding, 3 point threat at the 3/4 position. If Trey can get healthy, and provide that spark he was starting to show before his injuries...then we'll be really good, and the best team in the B10. These are a lot of IFs, but individually, none of them are a stretch.

So...we return a lot of really good players. Potentially the best PG in the league. Likely the best big man in the league. Likely one of the better "2nd bigs" in the league. Why wouldn't those guys, that have talent around them, win a lot of games? I don't know?! They should! But those same guys should have won a lot more games last year than they did.

Can't wait to see how it plays out.
 
Assembly Call had a guy on last night (Matt Cox of 3 Man Weave?) and he seemed knowledgeable and obviously follows college bball closely and he predicted IU second in the B10... thinks IL is going to be really good.

Would be hard for me to predict that with as much as they lost and freshmen guards expected to be such a big part, I'd think it's equally (or more) likely they'll have pretty considerable growing pains. Wasn't that Skye Clark on Montverde with JHS, and isn't he the guy JHS basically jumped due to an injury?
 
Assembly Call had a guy on last night (Matt Cox of 3 Man Weave?) and he seemed knowledgeable and obviously follows college bball closely and he predicted IU second in the B10... thinks IL is going to be really good.

Would be hard for me to predict that with as much as they lost and freshmen guards expected to be such a big part, I'd think it's equally (or more) likely they'll have pretty considerable growing pains. Wasn't that Skye Clark on Montverde with JHS, and isn't he the guy JHS basically jumped due to an injury?
yeah like I said in my earlier post, UI is who I see as the wild card. Lost of lot of scoring (only one returning player who averaged 4+ ppg last year) but reloaded via the portal (including guard who averaged 20ppg for LMarymont) and 5 star frosh Clark. If they can merge well as a team, they may be a big problem. But for now they are an unknown as a complete team. I still think IU will be a much deeper team.
 
yeah like I said in my earlier post, UI is who I see as the wild card. Lost of lot of scoring (only one returning player who averaged 4+ ppg last year) but reloaded via the portal (including guard who averaged 20ppg for LMarymont) and 5 star frosh Clark. If they can merge well as a team, they may be a big problem. But for now they are an unknown as a complete team. I still think IU will be a much deeper team.
Threats to IU, in order, according to my August 26th expert opinion.

1. Michigan State
2. Illinois
3. Wisconsin
4. Purdue
5. Iowa
6. Michigan
7. OSU
8. Penn State
9. Rutgers
10. Maryland
11. Northwestern
12. Minnesota (dangerous team though)
13. Nebraska
 
As good an analysis as any. I can't pick any other B10 roster that I'd say is better than IU's.

I'll just issue the warning that MSU, Wisconsin, Purdue...they lost a lot of dudes, but also returned a lot of key pieces. And their coaches have proven that they'll figure out how to be good, basically every year, no matter what. And Illinois, while completely different, has as much talent as anyone. It seams like we're the best team coming in, but its tough every year for a reason.

And specifically for us, we did go 9-11 last year, and we're going to see a ton of returning usage from guys that led that 9-11 campaign.

My reservations are mainly based on that. X, TJD, Race, Miller, Trey, Tamar, and Jordan were regular rotation guys last year, on a team that was hovering around 100th nationally in offensive efficiency. And while our defense was very solid, it wasn't top 10/dominant, and it had a very annoying habit of being horrid late in close games when we needed stops the most.

To win our league outright, to be a top 10-15 team at the end of the season, we're going to need to improve rather dramatically offensively, and figure out how to get stops when we need them. The pessimistic view, and one I probably bring up too often, is its hard to see THAT level of improvement, when the minutes and usage available to new players is so limited.

The optimistic view, however...is that while we weren't close offensively to being a top 15 team, a B10 champion, etc... last year... in nearly all the games we played, we put ourselves into a solid position to win. And that it won't take a ton of improvement to turn a sizeable chunk of those close losses, into wins. JHS, if he's as good defensively as is being reported, could have a HUGE impact in allowing us to win/close out close games. If Cav is even remotely close to what Tamar will bring, that will have a big impact on our numbers offensively. If Malik can come in and provide any sort of typical 5 star big man contributions, that'll greatly solidify our frontcourt depth and production. If Jordan can build on his late season emergence, and become a consistent athletic, rebounding, 3 point threat at the 3/4 position. If Trey can get healthy, and provide that spark he was starting to show before his injuries...then we'll be really good, and the best team in the B10. These are a lot of IFs, but individually, none of them are a stretch.

So...we return a lot of really good players. Potentially the best PG in the league. Likely the best big man in the league. Likely one of the better "2nd bigs" in the league. Why wouldn't those guys, that have talent around them, win a lot of games? I don't know?! They should! But those same guys should have won a lot more games last year than they did.

Can't wait to see how it plays out.
Fair points all, but if I might add:

Last Season was Woodson & Co.'s first - new Staff, new schemes, new routines and in many respects new for the Players. No doubt some of what transpired was 'experimental' given CMW's transition from the NBA, and there were probably a few aspects of Staff 'coalescence' (or not - sorry Dane) and a fair bit of 'making it up as they went along'. Much that is now familiar to the veteran Players and much that has been tried and tested by Staff to ascertain what works best. All that should contribute to better coherence and execution on the Court.

Believe IU showed what it's capable of in the Conference Tourney. Rallied to beat MI, whipped UI straight up and had IA down by 6 with 3:30 to go before losing on a last second shot. Expect that level of play to be far more typical this Season and regard the final game against St. Mary's to be an aberration for reasons I've enumerated previously (e.g., 5th game in 7 days plus two flights).

Agree big questions re: Player development. TJD, X, Trey and Jordan all improved as the Season progressed, and Race as well given his late/unexpected proficiency from deep. Tamar and Miller (and Leal) not so much. Your assessments of individual potential/contributions essentially mirror my own - do expect at least modest improvement from all the veterans and am hopeful that for a couple it will be much more 'dramatic'. Can only hope that the freshmen live up to their rankings.

We all tend to focus on off-Season improvement among the Players - imagining this year we might be overlooking the potential for Woodson and Staff to make some strides as well. That being said, can't wait to see if:

– Geronimo has developed the handles that will allow him to become a slasher from the wing;
– Galloway has fixed the hitch is his shot;
– Tamar has got his head back in the game;
– Trayce is any kind of marksman from deep;
– Xavier will continue his late-Season trend toward robotic efficiency;
– Miller (and Leal) will discover his inner cold-blooded assassin;
– how IU plays with two point guards on the Floor at the same time;
– Woodson starts wearing suits for away games.
 
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Fair points all, but if I might add:

Last Season was Woodson & Co.'s first - new Staff, new schemes, new routines and in many respects new for the Players. No doubt some of what transpired was 'experimental' given CMW's transition from the NBA, and there were probably a few aspects of Staff 'coalescence' (or not - sorry Dane) and a fair bit of 'making it up as they went along'. Much that is now familiar to the veteran Players and much that has been tried and tested by Staff to ascertain what works best. All that should contribute to better coherence and execution on the Court.

Believe IU showed what it's capable of in the Conference Tourney. Rallied to beat MI, whipped UI straight up and had IA down by 6 with 3:30 to go before losing on a last second shot. Expect that level of play to be far more typical this Season and regard the final game against St. Mary's to be an aberration for reasons I've enumerated previously (e.g., 5th game in 7 days sandwiched around two flights).

Agree big questions re: Player development. TJD, X, Trey and Jordan all improved as the Season progressed, and Race as well given his late/unexpected proficiency from deep. Tamar and Miller (and Leal) not so much. Your assessments of individual potential/contributions essentially mirror my own - do expect at least modest improvement from all the veterans and am hopeful that for a couple it will be much more 'dramatic'. Can only hope that the freshmen live up to their rankings.

We all tend to focus on off-Season improvement among the Players - imagining this year we might be overlooking the potential for Woodson and Staff to make some strides as well. That being said, can't wait to see if:

– Geronimo has developed the handles that will allow him to become a slasher from the wing;
– Galloway has fixed the hitch is his shot;
– Tamar has got his head back in the game;
– Trayce is any kind of marksman from deep;
– Xavier will continue his late-Season trend toward robotic efficiency;
– Miller (and Leal) will discover his inner cold-blooded assassin;
– how IU plays with two point guards on the Floor at the same time;
– Woodson starts wearing suits for away games.
I've been so focused on the style of play we should be playing...basically this entire offseason.

I'm starting to think, maybe you've argued this?...but to some of your points with coaching improvements, evolution, etc... but I'm starting to think its pretty much inevitable that we'll see a more open offense.

1. Its best for Race and TJD's professional aspirations...which I have no doubts that Woody is fully in tuned with. I'm sure he wouldn't put those aspirations in front of his own views for what's best for the team. But in this situation, coming off a pretty poor offensive season, I'd be surprised if he isn't open to changing most anything.

2. JHS is most likely going to have to play a lot. It'd be doing him, and the team, a big disservice to hide him on the wing somewhere as just another space away guy for kickouts from a traditional post focused offense (like last years). Xavier will have the ball in his hands a lot, but I anticipate a lot more free movement, with JHS also being up top. We'll probably see some dribble weave stuff with X, JHS, and Tamar. Also JHS coming off ball screens just like we'll see from X.

3. We're much deeper this year, and more athletic. One thing our offense last year did, was protect guys like TJD, Race, wing guys, from foul trouble and fatigue. This year, with 'Mo Better' players 5-10, I wouldn't think we'd be as worried about things like that, as I'm sure he was last year.

Potentially, if that were to happen, it would be as big as JHS and Malik committing and coming to Bloomington, as big as Tamar and Jordan realizing their potential, as big as TJD, X, and Race coming back for another run. A couple of those things have happened already, a couple haven't. We'll be good because of the frosh we got, and because our big 3 came back, potentially really good. If the other things happen, at any level, we'll start to have banner worthy thoughts at some point this season, I think.

That's a lot of optimistic words from me. So I'll anchor it with some reality. We've had optimism before. And there does need to be significant changes and improvements in a number of areas for us to actually become a really good team. The potential is certainly there for that to happen. But we can't just roll out the same old stuff as last year and expect huge improvements.
 
That's a lot of optimistic words from me. So I'll anchor it with some reality. We've had optimism before. And there does need to be significant changes and improvements in a number of areas for us to actually become a really good team. The potential is certainly there for that to happen. But we can't just roll out the same old stuff as last year and expect huge improvements.
Optimistic, or perhaps just realistic - certainly honest/abundant cause for positivity in the reasons you cite. Believe the upgrades in athleticism alone will redress at least in part any chance that IU will "roll out the same old stuff" - this year's Team should simply be able to do more given its greater experience, depth and skill.

Am a fan of anyone wearing the Stripes, but Lander was a mostly a liability, Rob for all his great Defense just awful from deep and not a great facilitator, and Durr was a stiff. Even Stewart, who started the Season shooting nearly 50% from deep, struggled during Conference play and ever seemed a half-step slow defending, whether fronting his man or recovering to the perimeter. Those chronic issues are no more, so while we await evidence of a new set of chronic dysfunctions, remain hopeful and of good cheer. They may not win it all, or even the B10, but they will be better and they won't be needing a play-in game to make the Dance.
 
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Fair points all, but if I might add:

Last Season was Woodson & Co.'s first - new Staff, new schemes, new routines and in many respects new for the Players. No doubt some of what transpired was 'experimental' given CMW's transition from the NBA, and there were probably a few aspects of Staff 'coalescence' (or not - sorry Dane) and a fair bit of 'making it up as they went along'. Much that is now familiar to the veteran Players and much that has been tried and tested by Staff to ascertain what works best. All that should contribute to better coherence and execution on the Court.

Believe IU showed what it's capable of in the Conference Tourney. Rallied to beat MI, whipped UI straight up and had IA down by 6 with 3:30 to go before losing on a last second shot. Expect that level of play to be far more typical this Season and regard the final game against St. Mary's to be an aberration for reasons I've enumerated previously (e.g., 5th game in 7 days plus two flights).

Agree big questions re: Player development. TJD, X, Trey and Jordan all improved as the Season progressed, and Race as well given his late/unexpected proficiency from deep. Tamar and Miller (and Leal) not so much. Your assessments of individual potential/contributions essentially mirror my own - do expect at least modest improvement from all the veterans and am hopeful that for a couple it will be much more 'dramatic'. Can only hope that the freshmen live up to their rankings.

We all tend to focus on off-Season improvement among the Players - imagining this year we might be overlooking the potential for Woodson and Staff to make some strides as well. That being said, can't wait to see if:

– Geronimo has developed the handles that will allow him to become a slasher from the wing;
– Galloway has fixed the hitch is his shot;
– Tamar has got his head back in the game;
– Trayce is any kind of marksman from deep;
– Xavier will continue his late-Season trend toward robotic efficiency;
– Miller (and Leal) will discover his inner cold-blooded assassin;
– how IU plays with two point guards on the Floor at the same time;
– Woodson starts wearing suits for away games.
I clearly saw evidence that Galloway was improving his shot mechanics last season. I am concerned his surgery and required recovery time may be challenging for him and the team.
 
A good way to look at predictions is to see how they did last year.

They were wrong on 3 of the top 6. Mostly, they did not foresee the impact of Davis or Murray, and they over rated Michigan.

Newcomer impact and big jumps over previous years would be a way to usurp Indiana. But they safe bet is to go with experienced scorers plus high rated freshmen- and that's IU.
 

IU should crush it this year. If the freshmen are as advertised, could be an amazing Season.

Remarkable how much contrast there is between IU and everyone else in terms of returning personnel/production - on paper not seeing a clear challenger in Conference. Going to have to be some serious effort by other coaching staffs to integrate so many new Players and develop Teams capable of high-level offense and defense for 40 minutes.

The fact that Woodson has such a strong veteran core should allow for a lot more 'polish' and greater focus/efficiency on offense. Expecting clear/strong improvement in shooting, A/TO ratio and OE.
 
I remember something about a Scandinavian guy committing, but beyond that I'm clueless about what they have coming in. I know they had a rough go of it with the local kid decommitting, so that was enjoyable for awhile.

Almost all of my purdoo buddies have gotten really quiet about things other than NIL being evil and purdoo doing it the right way.
Purdue will be just fine in NIL if reports are accurate. The emphasis will be team oriented and not individual.
 
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Purdue will be just fine in NIL if reports are accurate. The emphasis will be team oriented and not individual.
I have no idea either way. All I hear is some combo of these big ones: they're behind, they're losing recruits, Mitch is right on the money, they'll never be able to compete, it's not the way purdoo wants to or should do things, what about JP club.
 
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“If reports are accurate”…. You mean the reports where your athletes made $179k in the entire first year of NIL?
The ones talking about the collective being active and the amount of funding they'd like, the brees stuff, the football team nil stuff that osu followed suit on. Purdue NIL isn't really behind now. Just took a DT UK and LSU really wanted and were both offering NIL to, so must not be to terrible. The past isn't reflective on the present.
 
The ones talking about the collective being active and the amount of funding they'd like, the brees stuff, the football team nil stuff that osu followed suit on. Purdue NIL isn't really behind now. Just took a DT UK and LSU really wanted and were both offering NIL to, so must not be to terrible. The past isn't reflective on the present.
You are kidding, right?

1. The collective wants to collect $6 million per year, but there is no evidence that’s within the realm of possibility.

2. What Brees stuff?

3. Your football NIL collective is an absolute joke. It has currently raised $656… that’s $538 after Yoke takes their cut. That comes out to a whopping $7 per player. Incredible stuff really.

4. You took a hometown DL that UK wanted. If LSU wanted him they would have gotten him.

It’s an absolute joke that you think you are succeeding on the NIL front now.
 
You are kidding, right?

1. The collective wants to collect $6 million per year, but there is no evidence that’s within the realm of possibility.

2. What Brees stuff?

3. Your football NIL collective is an absolute joke. It has currently raised $656… that’s $538 after Yoke takes their cut. That comes out to a whopping $7 per player. Incredible stuff really.

4. You took a hometown DL that UK wanted. If LSU wanted him they would have gotten him.

It’s an absolute joke that you think you are succeeding on the NIL front now.
I didn't say succeeding. It's come a long way. LSU did want him. Draw to Purdue was more. Where do you see what the collective has raised? / it's literally getting going. If toy followed the collective, you'd know about Brees. The ball is rolling. Just because 6 mil is the goal doesn't mean they won't get more. What did edey get from the collective total since you know so much?
 
I didn't say succeeding. It's come a long way. LSU did want him. Draw to Purdue was more. Where do you see what the collective has raised? / it's literally getting going. If toy followed the collective, you'd know about Brees. The ball is rolling. Just because 6 mil is the goal doesn't mean they won't get more. What did edey get from the collective total since you know so much?
If came down to UK and Purdue for Gilbert. Congrats on your 3* DL that is the headline of your class.

Here is the link to the football team’s NIL collective:


Whatever the Brees thing is, it hasn’t been on your board, so it must be nothing.

Purdue won’t come close to raising $6 million a year in NIL.

No one knows what Edey got, because they were too scared to say it. Probably got like $25k.
 
If came down to UK and Purdue for Gilbert. Congrats on your 3* DL that is the headline of your class.

Here is the link to the football team’s NIL collective:


Whatever the Brees thing is, it hasn’t been on your board, so it must be nothing.

Purdue won’t come close to raising $6 million a year in NIL.

No one knows what Edey got, because they were too scared to say it. Probably got like $25k.
That is the football NIL thing that they just started. That isn't the collective. OSU did the same thing a few days later.

The collective is totally different from that. This is the alliance collective. https://www.boilermakeralliance.com/

The drew brees stuff has been mentioned on the board and on the alliance Twitter. We don't know what exactly it is. Announcement coming tomorrow. Stadium today.

I just figured you knew what edey got since you knew the financial details of the collective. You are really bad at finding this stuff I guess. Not hard.

Lastly, correct. It was Purdue and UK because Gilbert dropped LSU from contention it seems. Even if he didn't, still beat the UK payment. Where you seeing he's a 3 star?
 
That is the football NIL thing that they just started. That isn't the collective. OSU did the same thing a few days later.

The collective is totally different from that. This is the alliance collective. https://www.boilermakeralliance.com/

The drew brees stuff has been mentioned on the board and on the alliance Twitter. We don't know what exactly it is. Announcement coming tomorrow. Stadium today.

I just figured you knew what edey got since you knew the financial details of the collective. You are really bad at finding this stuff I guess. Not hard.

Lastly, correct. It was Purdue and UK because Gilbert dropped LSU from contention it seems. Even if he didn't, still beat the UK payment. Where you seeing he's a 3 star?
I said it was the football collective. I obviously know what Boiler Alliance is. Yoke is signing all these football teams up and they are the ONLY ones that will make any money on this. Laughable that you think that Football NIL club isn’t something to brag about.

So you use the Brees stuff as an example of Purdue being fine at NIL, yet you have no idea what it is? Don’t you think it’s probably just the Boiler Alliance exaggerating again? I mean when they announced the BA, they said it would be a game changer in the NIL space, yet it turned out to just be a copy of Hoosiers For Good.

How much did Edey get? If it’s so easy to find, why don’t you tell us? There is a reason they didn’t announce it like HFG does. They know it’s pennies compared to everyone else.

You didn’t beat the UK payment. Brian even said UK was offering more.

247 has him as a 3*.
 
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