Some thoughts on perception of paid players and dirty programs

[mushroomgod_1]

i struggled a great deal working about 20 hours a week to pay for my room and food. started washing dishes in a fraternity, line cook at the library cafeteria, more dish washing and waiting tables at howard johnson's, delivery and food prep at pagliai's restaurant. i ate where i worked. otherwise boxes of mac and cheese from no frills grocery, sometime adding some canned peas and tuna when i had the money. frozen fries and pork tenderloins "borrowed" from the library. fried baloney sandwiches. i'm pretty sure athletes on scholarship had, and still have, it better than i did. i don't feel the least bit sorry for them

There are still some young people with that attitude......not many.

 

[bailey777]

I’ll go off on a limb and say that the general perception that programs are dirty is mostly paranoia or jealousy.

In my opinion I think what is more likely is that individual assistant coaches or boosters are unscrupulous or even that individual recruited players and their families are shady.

Of course there is always the one off Coach Rick Pitino who left a mess and now can’t get a job anywhere.

God forbid IU ever finds itself in similar situation but don’t be naïve and think that we are immune.

You want top players in most cases you have to pay up. It's that simple. And if Sean Miller and will wade stay the pay to play will roll on in a big big way.

 

[ufo33]

I'd rather go fishing than watch NBA games.

I would rather go shopping with my wife than watch a Purdue game.
NBA is more fun to watch right now than college basketball.
College basketball is down and will likely get worse when the one and done rule changes.

 

[ufo33]

Skiles was arrested multiple times at MSU - pot, coke, DUI. He was no saint.

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1986-03-16-sp-26686-story.html

Scott Skiles was a ball player. A star.

 

[Courtsensetwo]

Well, there is no way Knight would have allowed a shoe company to pay a recruit's parent $100,000 to start an AAU team. Like him or not i do believe he played by the rules. I remember him sitting Alford against Ky because Alford had posed for a fund raising calendar. He purposely sat him against KY because they were seen as cheaters.

You are half right. The Ncaa gave a suspension for the charity calendar, Knight chose the game to make a point...which was not lost on anyone except KY fans.

 

[gmhowes]

Schools recruiting 5* players run the risk of recruiting and signing a player that has taken illegal benefits along the way. The school may not have been involved, but boosters at that school or one of the other schools could have provided something illegal. The dirt lands at the programs that do not take every precaution to limit access.

An example is Lilly King. She came home to Evansville after the Olympics to be honored at a minor league baseball game. The IU athletic department sent a representative to make sure she wasn't given any improper gifts. I remember they weren't going to allow her to sign any autographs due to the fear they could be sold. I believe they finally allowed her to sign autographs people brought to her, but I am not 100% positive.

Compare that with 30 years ago when UK's Richard Madison as a freshman was allowed entry into a night club/bar to meet a group of men. He never pulled his wallet out and he was bought drinks and food by a group of 40-50 year old men. Or, when Kenny Walker took a helicopter ride to the restaurant near our house 30 miles south of Lexington. You think the NCAA didn't know what every Central Kentucky resident saw everyday?

IU does not have a culture of boosters cheating and administrations that looks the other way. A lot of programs do. There is nothing to stop someone that doesn't know the rules from buying a cheeseburger for a player except for the player to know the rules and decline. Mistakes can happen. They happen to the clean programs.

The dirty programs are as careful and good with hiding cheating as the clean programs are at preventing violations. Coaches in trouble keep their jobs and players keep going to their schools. Nobody fears the NCAA or any punishment they can administer.

But the bright side is the stars nave no student loans to pay st dirty schools.

 

[bailey777]

I rather go shopping with my wife than watch a Purdue game.
NBA is more fun to watch right now than college basketball.
College basketball is down and will likely get worse when the one and done rule changes.

I don't care much for the NBA myself. I much prefer college but everyone's different.

 

[fpeaugh]

I’ll go off on a limb and say that the general perception that programs are dirty is mostly paranoia or jealousy.

In my opinion I think what is more likely is that individual assistant coaches or boosters are unscrupulous or even that individual recruited players and their families are shady.

Of course there is always the one off Coach Rick Pitino who left a mess and now can’t get a job anywhere.

God forbid IU ever finds itself in similar situation but don’t be naïve and think that we are immune.

Great post. Clean coaches don’t play in the mud. Only naive people believe they do.

So either the waters are cleaner than some believe or our coaches are dirtier than they think. But a clean coach is never going to recruit a dirty player. Just not how it works.

 

[coachv jr]

Here's a link to the story about the DUI.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1985-11-08-8503170290-story.html

This link is where he was reinstated, and talks a little about the Marijuana possession charge.

https://www.upi.com/Archives/1985/1...cott-Skiles-arrested-for-drunk/9663500619600/

hell, i remember driving on dunn st trippin' my ass off on acid. the road kept undulating and the stop sign never got closer. guess skiles was just a kid being a kid

 

[cryano]

hell, i remember driving on dunn st trippin' my ass off on acid. the road kept undulating and the stop sign never got closer. guess skiles was just a kid being a kid

wtf

 

[coachv jr]

Not at MSU!
Skiles was a leader!!
Controversial maybe but what an intense competitor! I loved to watch Skiles as a player. His trash talking against Georgetown in the NCAA Tournament was the stuff of legend, as he walked the walk after he talked the talk. He was a stud. Skiles had multiple 40 pt games his Senior year.

i loved watching him play, too. wonder why he didn't play for knight?

 

[trailrunner]

Here's a link to the story about the DUI.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1985-11-08-8503170290-story.html

This link is where he was reinstated, and talks a little about the Marijuana possession charge.

https://www.upi.com/Archives/1985/1...cott-Skiles-arrested-for-drunk/9663500619600/

hell, i remember driving on dunn st trippin' my ass off on acid. the road kept undulating and the stop sign never got closer. guess skiles was just a kid being a kid

Did you play for IU and represent the state of Indiana?

 

[GregHaggard]

hell, i remember driving on dunn st trippin' my ass off on acid. the road kept undulating and the stop sign never got closer. guess skiles was just a kid being a kid

I always felt that way as well, but if Alford gets suspended for a game for a photo in his uniform for charity.....

 

[GregHaggard]

Did you play for IU and represent the state of Indiana?

Did you?

 

[coachv jr]

did

Did you play for IU and represent the state of Indiana?

did skiles?

 

[ufo33]

Skiles has had a more successful basketball playing and coaching career than Alford.

 

[glidresquirrel]

Skiles has had a more successful basketball playing and coaching career than Alford.

Thats debatable for certain. Olympic gold, 2 time 1st team AA, National championship. Skiles did more in the NBA . Coaching? Not an Alford coaching fan. I remember when Skiles was in HS and would come to my schoolsgym. people hated him and he thrived on it. I loved the way he played but he did have some issues and wouldnt have made it under Knight long in my opinion

 

[82hoosier]

Thats debatable for certain. Olympic gold, 2 time 1st team AA, National championship. Skiles did more in the NBA . Coaching? Not an Alford coaching fan. I remember when Skiles was in HS and would come to my schoolsgym. people hated him and he thrived on it. I loved the way he played but he did have some issues and wouldnt have made it under Knight long in my opinion

When you look at Skiles and Alford’s body of work it is not even close. Both were spectacular Big 10 program players. But the comparisons end there.

 

[glidresquirrel]

When you look at Skiles and Alford’s body of work it is not even close. Both were spectacular Big 10 program players. But the comparisons end there.

I agree with you , maybe I poorly stated it. Alford is a much more accomplished career . Skiles was a bulldog but their amateur carreers aren't even close

 

[82hoosier]

Skiles was a first team All-American, Big 10 MVP, and first round draft pick. He left as the MSU’s all-time leading scorer.

 

[glidresquirrel]

Skiles was a first team All-American, Big 10 MVP, and first round draft pick. He left as the MSU’s all-time leading scorer.

I am sorry, what argument are we having then? Yes Skiles did that , Alford did the same plus another 1st team AA, a national championship, Big 10 alltime scorer when he graduated . There is no case for Skiles is more accomplished than Alford

 

[seattlemike]

MSU and Maryland are the two in the Big Ten that I think are probably dirty.

MSU and Maryland are the two in the Big Ten that I think are probably dirty.

Huh? Izzo is consistently mentioned as one the few coaches who doesn't cheat. Did you follow any of the NCAA investigation? Brian Bowen's dad said the only school involved with his kid who didn't offer money was MSU.

 

[OhioBoiler51]

Huh? Izzo is consistently mentioned as one the few coaches who doesn't cheat. Did you follow any of the NCAA investigation? Brian Bowen's dad said the only school involved with his kid who didn't offer money was MSU.

Cool story. One player doesn't determine the entire story though. Your program is dirty AF.

 

[coachv jr]

Thats debatable for certain. Olympic gold, 2 time 1st team AA, National championship. Skiles did more in the NBA . Coaching? Not an Alford coaching fan. I remember when Skiles was in HS and would come to my schoolsgym. people hated him and he thrived on it. I loved the way he played but he did have some issues and wouldnt have made it under Knight long in my opinion

in a tantrum, he tore the locker door off the hinges belonging to joe barry carroll telling him to get the hell out. carroll was a lazy player with little passion for playing. my kind of coach

 

[mktmaker]

Compare that with 30 years ago when UK's Richard Madison as a freshman was allowed entry into a night club/bar to meet a group of men. He never pulled his wallet out and he was bought drinks and food by a group of 40-50 year old men.

How would you stop that? Would you have a guard tail each player?

During that time -- when IU was at the top of their game -- do you think that Indiana fans didn't offer drinks to players?