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Robert Mueller appointed special counsel

I'm sure that's part of their thinking, but it's a double-edged sword, depending on how fast Mueller moves and what he discovers.

If he discovers "not much", I'm sure we'll still hear that the fix was in. There are a lot of people who will never, under any circumstances, accept the legitimacy of a Trump presidency.

I'm glad this is happening -- and Mueller is a good choice to lead it.
 
Let's say the inconceivable happens and he clears Trump and his campaign. Will you and the others on here accept it? And before you ask I will accept his findings either way.
I don't think it's inconceivable at all. I still think it's likely as far as the Russia stuff goes. Obstruction of Justice is most likely at this point. Perjury too, if Trump is interviewed under oath - he can't stop himself from lying about anything.
 
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If he discovers "not much", I'm sure we'll still hear that the fix was in. There are a lot of people who will never, under any circumstances, accept the legitimacy of a Trump presidency.

I'm glad this is happening -- and Mueller is a good choice to lead it.

I fully expect a not much, except for Flynn. I think Flynn will go down hard either for Turkey or Russia.

I was hoping more for a commission. Sure, we should find out if Trump's campaign was involved. But we also need to figure out how to counter Russian moves. I'm not sure that will be in Mueller's plans.
 
Carbon Monoxide Hoosier
will exonerate Trump
regardless of the ultimate
facts that are found to exist.
 
They should respond by doing nothing but prepare for the upcoming foreign travel, because an unmoored Trump could make an Olympic sport of buffoonery and pratfalls abroad.

I don't understand how anyone else doesn't see it: Trump is farcically unfit. In just the most recent eight days he's fired Comey, then serially blundered his way right back into the appointment of a special counsel(!). He's the Inspector Clouseau of political corruption. Make Chauncey Gardiner a boastful rich asshole, and you've got Trump.

But the point of Being There isn't that Chance the gardener was a simpleton. The point was that those who elevated him were fools. I'd hate to be the last one to figure that out here.
Welcome back...As you say, Trump is farcically unfit. I would say he is more Caligula than Chance the Gardner. As a matter of historical accuracy perhaps that treats Caligula unfairly. An unfortunate minority of the American electorate went postal and elected Trump. The GOP has a clear path back to sanity by removing him and installing Pence. The Democrats have a duty to help them do this. We shouldn't forget that we are here because of a gross abrogation of duty by the Republicans who made it possible for Trump to get elected in the first place.
 
Let's say the inconceivable happens and he clears Trump and his campaign. Will you and the others on here accept it? And before you ask I will accept his findings either way.
Of course
 
They should respond by doing nothing but prepare for the upcoming foreign travel, because an unmoored Trump could make an Olympic sport of buffoonery and pratfalls abroad.

I don't understand how anyone else doesn't see it: Trump is farcically unfit. In just the most recent eight days he's fired Comey, then serially blundered his way right back into the appointment of a special counsel(!). He's the Inspector Clouseau of political corruption. Make Chauncey Gardiner a boastful rich asshole, and you've got Trump.

But the point of Being There isn't that Chance the gardener was a simpleton. The point was that those who elevated him were fools. I'd hate to be the last one to figure that out here.
Obviously he's farcically unfit

but does such a characterization along with the naivete of his proponents and enablers and along with namby pamby journalism risk overlooking his borderline sabotage of our national security? For Trump this is a child's game of king of the hill, for Israel, this is raw survival. Do Republicans really simple-mindedly think that Israel will automatically share the next ISIS threat to American security they uncover if Trump blithely endangers their intelligence assets?



How can Israelis ever achieve 100% certainty Trump won't turn around and hand Israeli intelligence to the Russians?

American politicians need to come to their senses but quick. This has now crossed the partisan Rubicon.
 
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Let's say the inconceivable happens and he clears Trump and his campaign. Will you and the others on here accept it? And before you ask I will accept his findings either way.
Sure I would. To the same extent the Rs here accepted Comey's July decision on Hillary. :)
I don't think it's inconceivable at all. I still think it's likely as far as the Russia stuff goes. Obstruction of Justice is most likely at this point. Perjury too, if Trump is interviewed under oath - he can't stop himself from lying about anything.
Be hard for me to imagine direct collusion between the campaign and the Ruskies, but all the ancillary stuff with Flynn and the pressure on Comey and the firing and so on... that's where the trouble is. That's where obstruction and perjury come into play. Even without a smoking gun, there's the whole failure to "faithfully execute" thing. Impeachment is a totally political process. Couching things in legal terms is the norm, but the law actually doesn't apply.
 
Sure I would. To the same extent the Rs here accepted Comey's July decision on Hillary. :)

Be hard for me to imagine direct collusion between the campaign and the Ruskies, but all the ancillary stuff with Flynn and the pressure on Comey and the firing and so on... that's where the trouble is. That's where obstruction and perjury come into play. Even without a smoking gun, there's the whole failure to "faithfully execute" thing. Impeachment is a totally political process. Couching things in legal terms is the norm, but the law actually doesn't apply.

Since when is perjury an impeachable offense?
 
Do Republicans really simple-mindedly think that Israel will automatically share the next ISIS threat to American security they uncover if Trump blithely endangers their intelligence assets?
I don't even get why you would ask this question.
 
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Sure I would. To the same extent the Rs here accepted Comey's July decision on Hillary. :)

Be hard for me to imagine direct collusion between the campaign and the Ruskies, but all the ancillary stuff with Flynn and the pressure on Comey and the firing and so on... that's where the trouble is. That's where obstruction and perjury come into play. Even without a smoking gun, there's the whole failure to "faithfully execute" thing. Impeachment is a totally political process. Couching things in legal terms is the norm, but the law actually doesn't apply.
Mueller isn't investigating for an impeachment, he's investigating for possible, actual, crimes.
 
We shouldn't forget that we are here because of a gross abrogation of duty by the Republicans who made it possible for Trump to get elected in the first place.

It would seem to me the dems have a responsibility in this too. They nominated an unfit person as well.
 
Sure I would. To the same extent the Rs here accepted Comey's July decision on Hillary. :)

Be hard for me to imagine direct collusion between the campaign and the Ruskies, but all the ancillary stuff with Flynn and the pressure on Comey and the firing and so on... that's where the trouble is. That's where obstruction and perjury come into play. Even without a smoking gun, there's the whole failure to "faithfully execute" thing. Impeachment is a totally political process. Couching things in legal terms is the norm, but the law actually doesn't apply.

Explain how the Flynn/Comey thing is a crime? Is there a smoking gun that Trump said "drop it or I will fire you". Is there evidence that Trump/administration hindered the on going investigation?
 
Let's say the inconceivable happens and he clears Trump and his campaign. Will you and the others on here accept it? And before you ask I will accept his findings either way.

Your underlying premise is wrong. The media and Democrat resistance don't care about Russia or collusion. The objective here is to drive Trump out of the Oval Office. If Russia doesn't work out, it would be emoluments. if emoluments doesn't pan out, it would be about conflicts of interest. And so on and so on and so on. There will always be something to cause the Democrats to not meaningfully participate in government so long as Trump is POTUS.

I don't even think this is about Trump as much as it is about Hillary. She was supposed to shatter the highest glass ceiling. She was supposed to be the image of women FINALLY achieving parity. She was supposed to be the one to perpetuate and build on the Obama legacy. Any Republican who might have won the election would face severe resistance from all the media, from all the Democrats, and from large segments of the country. Trump with his stupid tweets and hamfisted way of doing things just provides more ammunition than somebody else woud have.
 
Your underlying premise is wrong. The media and Democrat resistance don't care about Russia or collusion. The objective here is to drive Trump out of the Oval Office. If Russia doesn't work out, it would be emoluments. if emoluments doesn't pan out, it would be about conflicts of interest. And so on and so on and so on. There will always be something to cause the Democrats to not meaningfully participate in government so long as Trump is POTUS.

I don't even think this is about Trump as much as it is about Hillary. She was supposed to shatter the highest glass ceiling. She was supposed to be the image of women FINALLY achieving parity. She was supposed to be the one to perpetuate and build on the Obama legacy. Any Republican who might have won the election would face severe resistance from all the media, from all the Democrats, and from large segments of the country. Trump with his stupid tweets and hamfisted way of doing things just provides more ammunition than somebody else woud have.
You're dead wrong. It's entirely about Trump. I couldn't care less that Hillary is not the POTUS.
 
Impeachment and removal from office are not the same thing. Clinton was impeached.

You're correct. I need to be more precise. I also shouldn't try to work and post with all you smart guys on here. I thought I learned my lesson and was only reading and not posting. I let my guard down and stupidly posted this morning.

If Trump committed an impeachable offense he should be removed from office. We will see what Mueller finds.
 
Explain how the Flynn/Comey thing is a crime? Is there a smoking gun that Trump said "drop it or I will fire you". Is there evidence that Trump/administration hindered the on going investigation?
Amazing how when the shoe is in the other foot, the standard is raised.

And let me save you some time. Don't bother trying to flip the hypocrisy card back on me. Just like with Hillary, I have no idea if Trump committed any crimes.
 
Your underlying premise is wrong. The media and Democrat resistance don't care about Russia or collusion. The objective here is to drive Trump out of the Oval Office. If Russia doesn't work out, it would be emoluments. if emoluments doesn't pan out, it would be about conflicts of interest. And so on and so on and so on. There will always be something to cause the Democrats to not meaningfully participate in government so long as Trump is POTUS.

I don't even think this is about Trump as much as it is about Hillary. She was supposed to shatter the highest glass ceiling. She was supposed to be the image of women FINALLY achieving parity. She was supposed to be the one to perpetuate and build on the Obama legacy. Any Republican who might have won the election would face severe resistance from all the media, from all the Democrats, and from large segments of the country. Trump with his stupid tweets and hamfisted way of doing things just provides more ammunition than somebody else woud have.

Thumbs up. Perfectly said.
 
You're dead wrong. It's entirely about Trump. I couldn't care less that Hillary is not the POTUS.

I believe you. But I think you are a minority leftist on that point. If a few other posters said this, I'd laugh out loud.
 
I believe you. But I think you are a minority leftist on that point. If a few other posters said this, I'd laugh out loud.
Fine. Except I'd love for you to explain to me what makes me a leftist. Not that there's anything wrong with being a leftist.
 
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No, Ranger is representative on this point. This has nothing to do with Hillary.

This has everything to do with Hillary.

The largest march in the history of the United States was the Women's March on Washington. People marched in every state and every city. This was the Hillary supporters response to Trump. The "Resist!" slogan originated there, Hillary joined the resistance as did millions of others.

22march8-superJumbo.jpg
 
Welcome back...As you say, Trump is farcically unfit. I would say he is more Caligula than Chance the Gardner. As a matter of historical accuracy perhaps that treats Caligula unfairly. An unfortunate minority of the American electorate went postal and elected Trump. The GOP has a clear path back to sanity by removing him and installing Pence. The Democrats have a duty to help them do this. We shouldn't forget that we are here because of a gross abrogation of duty by the Republicans who made it possible for Trump to get elected in the first place.
More like Commodus...which was when Gibbons pegged the beginning of "The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire" https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodus
Commodus was the emperor in the movie "Gladiator".
 
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This has everything to do with Hillary.

The largest march in the history of the United States was the Women's March on Washington. People marched in every state and every city. This was the Hillary supporters response to Trump. The "Resist!" slogan originated there, Hillary joined the resistance as did millions of others.

22march8-superJumbo.jpg
No. Hillary was just the candidate who happened to lose to Trump. The left's response to Trump is entirely about Trump. That's why it is consistent across all parts of the left, including those parts that didn't like Hillary. If your supposition were true, Berniecrats, socialists and anarchists wouldn't be walking hand in hand with the Hillarycrats.

This response, BTW is also shared by some on the right. So saying this is all about Hillary is just silly.
 
Thumbs up. Perfectly said.
Except it's completely wrong. It has nothing to do with butthurt over Hillary. Many of us held our noses and voted for since many of were in key battleground states.

Blaming this on Hillary butthurtedness is a Trump voter's way of not accepting culpability for electing an unqualified carnival barker to the most important office in the land.
 
Explain how the Flynn/Comey thing is a crime? Is there a smoking gun that Trump said "drop it or I will fire you". Is there evidence that Trump/administration hindered the on going investigation?
<sigh> My post that you responded to explicitly said that with regards to impeachment, "crime" or any other legal term is irrelevant, even if no "smoking gun" is found.
 
This has everything to do with Hillary.

The largest march in the history of the United States was the Women's March on Washington. People marched in every state and every city. This was the Hillary supporters response to Trump. The "Resist!" slogan originated there, Hillary joined the resistance as did millions of others.

22march8-superJumbo.jpg
I couldn't care less, and nor do most reasonable people, about the resist movement. The Resist Movement isn't going to drive this shameful carnival barker out of office, patriots in the form of adult lawyers will.
 
Perjury too, if Trump is interviewed under oath - he can't stop himself from lying about anything.

Well that would certainly make for an interesting conundrum -- as Congress has already established precedent that a president lying under oath does not constitute grounds for removal from office.
 
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Except it's completely wrong. It has nothing to do with butthurt over Hillary. Many of us held our noses and voted for since many of were in key battleground states.

Blaming this on Hillary butthurtedness is a Trump voter's way of not accepting culpability for electing an unqualified carnival barker to the most important office in the land.

I wouldn't say it's butthurt over Hillary losing (did anybody actually like her?)...just butthurt over Trump winning.

Hell, I didn't like Trump then and I don't like him now. He was, for me, the better of two bad options. And I still don't regret my vote. But we held the election and he won, fair and square. If he does something that compels removal from office, then he should be removed from office...same for any other president or elected official. But to just conjure something up to try to negate the result, well that's beyond the pale.
 
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Well that would certainly make for an interesting conundrum -- as Congress has already established precedent that a president lying under oath does not constitute grounds for removal from office.

Maybe all they established is if you lie about a BJ and using a cigar on a young intern you're okay? VBG
 
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