Marty Simmons out at UE
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I’m trying to think who that would be.
Cheaney was never at K State, was he? Michael Lewis is from the area — but never coached at either IU or KSU. Pat Graham lives in Evansville...but has never coached in the college ranks.
Chris Lowery is from Evansville, was formerly SIU’s coach, is an assistant at KSU, but never had anything to do with IU.
I’m drawing a blank.
Purdue grad here, but I grew up in Evansville and am here to talk about the Aces. If the #1 criteria for hiring a coach is Evansville ties, the Aces are never going to make the NCAA tournament ever again. It's reflective of stodgy, small-time thinking. Bruce Pearl was an outsider, and he won a D-II title at USI. Why would you limit your candidate pool? It's not like Evansville would be so difficult a place for a good coach to get used to.
Marty Simmons had proven more as a coach when he was hired than Calbert has now.
Maybe it will work out, but there is still nothing that gives me confidence the UE administration has any idea what in the hell they're doing.
Marty Simmons had proven more as a coach when he was hired than Calbert has now.
Maybe it will work out, but there is still nothing that gives me confidence the UE administration has any idea what in the hell they're doing.
I agree.
But I’m not sure anybody could be successful in that job. It’s one of the lowest paying HC jobs in D1. The recruiting budget is small. And it’s a school of ~2000 students in a conference with much larger (and richer) schools.
They were lucky to have Crews as long as they did — and I think he did about as well as anybody could there.
Moreover, if they really wanted somebody with Evansville ties, they should’ve waited for Brownell to come available,
UE should go back to D2. They'll never get the players needed to seriously compete for D1 glory. If they luck into a coach who can get D2 talent to win, that coach will be gone in a few years. Crews' last five years there went downhill while Pearl was lighting it up at USI. UE hasn't been the same since.
Yep - Crews burned out, stopped recruiting well, stopped doing a coaches show and basically became invisible in the community his last years. They’ve never recovered and now the university is struggling just to keep their doors open, so they don’t have money to pay anybody decent. They’ve got a lot bigger problems than basketball.
You don't know much about the current situation in Evansville. There were serious discussions of UE going to DIII to avoid scholarships. Attendance at the Ford Center is embarrassing. The women's program was the last ranked (353 I believe) team in D1 with 1 win over a DI team, a win over DII Oakland City and a win over a DIII school. In a closed door scrimmage, USI women beat UE women by 50!
UE has started to move to save the program. Learfield will be brought in to broadcast all UE athletics. They have to attract players, but they have no recruiting budget and no money to pay a coach. UE needs a coach that will work very cheap, bring in fans, and attract players without spending money. I don't know if Calbert will be interested, but he supposedly is willing to listen.
I personally would pick Todd Franklin from VU.
Love Calbert Cheaney, but really has never demonstrated ability to coach. This would be a big gamble for U of E. All in all, Marty did a pretty good job with the Aces. I think U of E should have kept him.
No one cares about the women's program. The men's program pays the bills and gets the press.
The D3 discussions were years ago, before UE built their new practice facility. At one point it may have been considered, but the powers that be at the university realized that it would be an insane idea to close down the only visible marketing tool the university has. That rumor still pops up from time to time, mostly kept alive by UE faculty who resent athletics and wish it were true.
Ford Center attendance is down and isn't great by historical standards, but it's in line with what you see from other bottom of the pack Valley schools. A big problem is a lack of quality opponents. Marty scheduled way too many body bag games, which is probably a large part of why he was let go. And of course the fan base keeps getting older and older. Like it or not, most modern UE students aren't the type of kids who go to basketball games. UE needs to renew its fan base from the broader community, and Marty was crap at community outreach. It's crazy that the UE administration seems to think Evansville ties are so important here. You need a young guy who wants to be on TV, who loves it when people come up to them in the grocery store to talk about the team, who wants to do corporate speaking engagements and go visit all the local high schools.
Winning cures all. What UE needs most of all is a guy who can win, and everything else will take care of itself. I remain convinced that there is no one in the UE athletic department who has any idea how to identify, attract, and retain a quality basketball coach. Hopefully they prove me otherwise.
If I remember correctly UE was in their conference tournament championship just a few years ago and lost on a last second shot. They have competed in that conference and shouldn't go back to D2
The DIII discussions were since the Ford Center opened. The move to hire Learfield is a sign they have made a commitment to build the program back to where it was when they rocked Roberts Stadium.
My son works with both the UE and USI Athletic departments. The new USI stadium was designed with future DI aspirations in mind. They need to upgrade their coaching staff, but I believe that will come when their new president is hired.
There were DIII discussions by more than the UE faculty as late as last year from different levels of their athletic department. Their faculty remains among the biggest supporters of the program. The faculty section is the most heavily populated. There is certainly more faculty and staff than students attending games.
Sadly, UE doesn't care to apply the same standards to the women's program. They likely won't fire their coach despite 3 weak wins. Some of us do care about the women's program. It is a shame they can't support them better.
They would never go back to DII. They dominated that diivision in the 60's and had some really great teams. They would only drop from DI to save recruiting costs and to eliminate scholarships.
I was around here when they dropped football. Many thought the talk of dropping football was a joke. One of my friends is the all-time passing leader for Aces football. Somehow the school started a track and field program this year, but dropped tennis.
I grew up in the 'Ville and believe Crews lost it with his handling of Parish Casebeir. UE looked the other way during all his legal problems and Crews even rented out his basement to Caebeir. That thug is in prison now for human trafficking.
I don't remember Crews taking any flack from Casebeir's off court issues. It certainly hurt the play on court.
Either they cut Crews's recruiting budget or he just got tired of traveling for recruiting. He seemed to be recruiting more from small schools in Illinois and getting players that were easy to get. He still had some good talent, but it wasn't keeping up with the other mid majors.
Michael Lewis had his name mentioned in the paper as a possible candidate. I think he would be a good hire. I would love to see who he would hire for his staff.
I've been at several events where Marty was touted to attend, only to find a surrogate sent in his place.
It was an interesting contrast not only with Jim Crews but also Bruce Pearl -- who was all over town when he was at USI. They should look for somebody like Pearl (sans the casual relationship with NCAA rules and all that, of course).
I'm second to nobody in admiration for Calbert Cheaney. But, honestly, I don't think that's a good fit either for him or UE.
USI to the OVC once Murray State jumps to the Valley? That idea probably terrifies UE, which isn't all bad. A cross-town D-I rivalry would inject some juice into both fanbases.
The GLVC isn't what it once was. I know people at USI that continue to insist they have no interest in D-I, but they're the type who would worry more about the associated expenses than the massive upside. Look at NKU!
I'd probably prefer Lewis to Cheaney, I guess.
But I still think they need to get beyond this "local ties" thing. Jim Crews had no local ties to Evansville prior to coming to UE, and he was clearly the best coach they've had in the D1 era.
If I had to guess, they're probably doing that to buttress their budget constraints....recruit somebody who has an interest beyond money. Because nobody worth a crap who doesn't have an interest in "the community" is going to take a job that pays less than many, many D1 assistant gigs.
In fact, I bet Lewis is making more now at Nebraska than he'd make as HC at Evansville.
I've long thought that UE, if they're committed to remaining D1, ought to consider a conference like the OVC.
They used to be one of the better teams in the Horizon (nee, MCC) -- Xavier was their chief rival (and is now a #1 seed). But they've been a perennial doormat in the Valley.
And they're not going to draw bigger crowds until they win more games.
UE to the OVC picked up some mention from a few media people with the OVC using Evansville as the location of their conference tournament. The OVC would make sense for USI as well.
USI has a lot of land and room to grow and are continuing to add programs. They will go to D1 eventually. There is already a rivalry between the two schools. It reminds me of the local east side - west side rivalry that has existed between residents.
USI might have once been reluctant to go D1 with UE being across town, but I believe they could quickly get to UE's level and pass them by.
The loss of KWC took away a quality team and a big conference rivalry with USI. I remermber watching Bruce Pearl coach against Ray Harper at Roberts Stadium. There were some intense games in that period.
I can't think of any examples of a program voluntarily dropping down to a smaller conference and achieving success.
With the Ford Center and their recent practice facility, UE looks like a legitimate Missouri Valley basketball program. That's where they should be, particularly now that Valpo--and hopefully Murray State soon--are in the Valley.
UE is capable of winning games in the Missouri Valley. It's not like Marty was eking out three and four win seasons year after year. He had teams capable of grinding out wins against "pretty good" opponents, the problem was that you knew UE could never get "up" for big games. When the lights shined brightest, there was no next gear the Aces could go to.
Marty was underpaid relative to other Valley coaches, but not for the level of effort and results he achieved. In firing him, I hope the UE AD realizes that such a level was not producing results and decides to step up the resources that they're willing to spend on salaries. If they aren't willing to open up the checkbook, they should have kept Marty.
This is the time the Aces need to make their run, and I think they recognize that. Wichita is gone to the AAC, and the conference is wide open. This year, the Valley had the smallest gap from its best team to its worst team of any conference in America. There are ten (maybe 11 if you add Murray) programs who feel like they have a plausible shot at sitting atop the Valley in five years. Hell, Loyola just won the league, and they were in no way up to speed when they joined a few years ago. Anybody can rise up. Evansville has a decent-sized community and a large arena. That's a fuel tank that's full enough to keep them in the upper half of the league. They just need to figure out how to tap into it.
You wrote,”really has never demonstrated ability to coach”
Well, since this would be Cheaney’s first job as head coach, I am compelled to agree.
I always laugh ever time I heard some old E'villian talk about going back to D2. D2 is not the same as it was back in the "College Division" days. Despite UE's lack of winning in recent years, the money generated from their basketball team is too great to consider going back to D2. If that is the case, they should just quit scholarship athletics and go to D3. Or remove varsity athletics all together.
The TV and conference money share from the Valley is much greater than what added attendance due to wins in the OVC would generate.
Except for the Kentucky Wesleyan Panthers of 66, 67, 68 and 69. Selective memory. Plus The Bruce could not beat Wesleyan and Harper. I find myself rooting for them despite the history. There is no reason they can't win the MVC.
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Especially since most of the better teams have exited the league. Crowds were better when they played Tulsa, Creighton, Xavier, St. Louis, etc.
Selective memory? No. Evansville had NCAA titles in '59, '60,'64, '65, and '71. Between '58 - 71, Evansville was in the final 4 six times.
Harper was the better bench coach. Pearl was a good recruiter and salesman. He was good enough to win a D2 title for USI.
I didn't know they had football. My sister was there in the 70s and I don't remember it then.
I don't remember what division the played in and never went to a game. I wish I had gone before they quit.
Pearl won some games over Harper and KWC. I remember one particularly great game at the Sportscenter in Owensboro where USI won a close one. The crowd was brutal to Pearl and USI.
Ray Harper and Bruce Pearl are both really good coaches -- and both have a casual relationship with the rules.
Those two really brought a lot of excitement to the KWC/USI rivalry back in that era. And while USI certainly enjoyed some success, KWC was downright dominant for most of the Harper era.
College Division until 75. Then D3 until the NCAA required all D1 schools to play D1 in all sports. Then they created the D1AAA divisions for schools like UE.
I actually preferred the MCC/Horizon League. They had some spirited games with Xavier, Dayton and other teams in the league. About the time we came to town, the Aces were doing very well in the league and going to post-season play. They really haven't been very competitive in the MVC
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