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Israel under attack from Hamas

Personally, I think relocation but that would never fly because war crimes and stuff. So since that is off the board, you basically have periods of relative calm while the weaker side builds itself up and then spasms of violence to break them back down and then pray for a miracle.

Or, if you have a religious bent, you wait for the Messiah/Jesus to come sort it out (or for the Muslims, their version of that). Frankly, I am more on the religious side, I don't think we are sorting it out and my good book says I should be really weary of the guy who says we got a 7 year peace deal. That gets you criticized around here so I tend to stick to that which is humanly possible even though w.r.t. this topic I don't think anything humanly is likely to fix it.

Some would say that is likely part of the problem and perhaps there is some truth to that. However, I think even without the religious context that the land dispute alone would be enough to keep this going. When two groups claim the same land, the only past solution was to let them duke it out. The winner got the land and the loser had to go somewhere else. And if there was nowhere else to go, the loser was beaten and killed by the winner until they were so small of a threat that it didn't matter anymore. And then they would somewhat assimilate into the governing structure of the winner. Modern western ethics and morals do not allow for that anymore so we end up with forever conflicts. Those low intensity issues that carry on for centuries are viewed as a better outcome than a mass casualty war. So someone who says, "You know, we should probably basically ethnically cleanse them out of the Israel controlled borders and force them into Egypt and Jordan" is seen as an evil extremist while the alternative of, nah, force them to live together until they figure out "peace" is the statesman like approach. The deaths along the way on that road are just the toll to be paid.

The Palestinians in that interview are correct on one thing. There is no 2 state solution, only one. Which is why I have advocated letting Israel annihilate them to the point where they realize that the one state is never going to be Palestine. Like ever.
I agree with a lot of this.

I do wonder if we (or at least I) as an American don’t appreciate well enough some cultures’ deep ties to their ancestral land.

Are you thinking of other prolonged conflicts too when you refer to forever wars? Palestine/Israel seems unique.
 
I agree with a lot of this.

I do wonder if we (or at least I) as an American don’t appreciate well enough some cultures’ deep ties to their ancestral land.

Are you thinking of other prolonged conflicts too when you refer to forever wars? Palestine/Israel seems unique.
Yes, the other prolonged conflicts I would throw in there too like Azerbaijan and Armenia. Myanmar has had an almost 80 year civil war which varies in intensity.
 
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This spring some were predicting Gaza was on the verge of famine as early as May and likely by July.

Has that occurred?
 
Is there a technical definition of famine? Because if it's subjective, I'm guessing quite a few would say they are already there.
Are people dying of starvation?

I asked, because I was reading this article fact checking Netenyahu's address to Congress:


He says Israel is shipping in enough food for every Palestinian to have 3000 calories a day, far above what is needed. UN says that's not enough because of distribution concerns, etc. It sparked in me a memory of the prediction a few months ago and the fact that there has been no reporting of mass starvation in Gaza. I'm not sure there is a clear answer here.
 
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Are people dying of starvation?

I asked, because I was reading this article fact checking Netenyahu's address to Congress:


He says Israel is shipping in enough food for every Palestinian to have 3000 calories a day, far above what is needed. UN says that's not enough because of distribution concerns, etc. It sparked in me a memory of the prediction a few months ago and the fact that there has been no reporting of mass starvation in Gaza. I'm not sure there is a clear answer here.
This report looks slanted, but it cites the UN report and quotes it:


There is currently no famine in Gaza, a new report by the key Integrated Food Security Phase Classification (IPC) organization has found, despite predicting in March that a full-blown famine would break out in the territory between March and July 2024.

The new study says that assumptions about the amount of food that would enter the territory turned out to be wrong, and that the supply of food to Gaza increased instead of decreasing during recent months.

“In this context, the available evidence does not indicate that famine is currently occurring,” the report finds.
 
JDB, it’s not just her. It’s the nation. I find it bizarre.

I fear the reason might be because those hostages are also Israeli/strongly Jewish and so there is an unsaid “they aren’t REAL Americans” sentiment here. I hope not.

MSM really abandoned the American hostage angle quite quickly. So, to your point, some don't care. Plenty others are probably oblivious to the fact that US citizens are still being held, many of which won't be coming back.
 
Are we discussing the broader conflict now in this thread? What’s the plan with Hezbollah? Do they have the media savvy of Hamas?
 
Are we discussing the broader conflict now in this thread? What’s the plan with Hezbollah? Do they have the media savvy of Hamas?

They're dropping like flies



Israel today:

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JDB, it’s not just her. It’s the nation. I find it bizarre.

I fear the reason might be because those hostages are also Israeli/strongly Jewish and so there is an unsaid “they aren’t REAL Americans” sentiment here. I hope not.
She named every one of the American Israeli hostages in a statement a couple days ago.
 
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I fear the reason might be because those hostages are also Israeli/strongly Jewish and so there is an unsaid “they aren’t REAL Americans” sentiment here. I hope not.

I'm curious where you are getting this vibe? twitter? that's not America.

biden, as expected, acknowledged the US hostages immediately and often, contrary to reports here. Harris has now done the same as the Dem nominee, also as expected.

this is kinda like the goofball reports that Trump didn't reach out to the other shooting victims and families.
 
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