ADVERTISEMENT

Indystar Rips Woodson

One of Woodson's standard lines is "next man up" I don't see him making excuses any more than most other coaches do.

Here's the Doyle piece, with the concerning quote about injuries at the very end.

What bothers me is not that he's publicly blamed the collapse on injuries---you're right, he hasn't said much about it publicly. But that very recent quote shows that in his opinion "Go win anyway" is too much to ask for under the present circumstances.


IU fans seem to be done with Mike Woodson after loss to Penn State, and they have a point​

Gregg Doyel, Indianapolis Star
Sat, Feb 3, 2024, 7:56 PM EST·8 min read

1

IU basketball stinks, but say this for coach Mike Woodson: He isn’t about to make excuses or single out his own players or attack the media.
Just kidding. That’s exactly what he’s going to do.
We’ll get to the excuses and finger-pointing and media attack later. It’s ugly, coming from someone with this much experience in the public eye — how did he survive two full seasons coaching the New York Knicks? — but first let’s get to the ugliest thing IU fans have seen all season, this 85-71 loss Saturday to a Penn State team that came into the game with a losing record … and without its leading scorer.
The game was at Assembly Hall, where fans were leaving with almost five minutes left. Normally it’s the older fans who leave early while the students stick it out, but on this day it was everybody. Well, almost everybody. A handful of IU fans hung around to boo the Hoosiers after the final horn.
Insider: IU can kiss NCAA tournament hopes goodbye after Penn State's loss
What was happening on social media was even worse. Good luck wading through #iubb Twitter without seeing some combination of the words Woodson and fired.
Should he be fired? Let me be as clear as I can, because a few weeks ago — after a lousy loss at Rutgers — I wasn’t clear enough, and that’s on me. That day I wrote “the clock should start ticking on Mike Woodson.” What I meant, all I meant, was this:
Some coaches leave when they want to leave, the rest leave when someone tells them to go, and Mike Woodson is obviously in that second group. He’ll leave whenever the IU administration gets tired of his program and pushes him out — meaning, the clock is ticking. Would it happen after Year 3? I can’t imagine that, no. Wasn’t thinking that after the Rutgers loss, and not thinking that after this Penn State loss. Three years is not enough time to give anyone, much less an IU alum who played for Bob Knight.
Good news, Mike Woodson: You’ll almost surely be back next season.
Bad news, #iubb fans: He’ll almost surely be back next season.
Indiana Head Coach Mike Woodson questions a call during the second half of the Indiana versus Penn State men's basketball game at Simon Skjodt Assembly Hall on Saturday, Feb. 3, 2024.

Indiana Head Coach Mike Woodson questions a call during the second half of the Indiana versus Penn State men's basketball game at Simon Skjodt Assembly Hall on Saturday, Feb. 3, 2024.

Mike Woodson takes credit for Kel'el Ware​

Let’s be clear: Mike Woodson didn’t miss a shot, foul a 3-point shooter or dribble a ball off his foot and out of bounds. But his players did those things, over and over Saturday — and Woodson picked these players, and Woodson coaches them.
Players rarely get better here, unless we count Kel’el Ware, and why should Woodson get credit for Kel’el Ware? It’s true, Ware didn’t do much last season at Oregon, where coach Dana Altman felt his motor revved too low. Ware, a 7-foot NBA talent, entered the transfer portal and chose IU and has become the player he should’ve become, and believe me when I say:
Mike Woodson has taken the credit for that.
Listen to his media conferences or read the transcripts, and he’s always patting himself on the back for getting Ware to play hard. Could that be the case? Sure. Is it just as likely that Ware did some serious soul-searching after his disastrous year at Oregon and decided, for the good of himself and future generations of his family, that he should play harder? Sure.
Woodson loves to think he made Kel’el Ware, though, while taking no responsibility for the back-sliding of almost every other player on roster, Malik Reneau excluded. No one has gotten worse, at least from a shooting standpoint, than Trey Galloway. The senior from Culver is playing a much better floor game and has become the Hoosiers’ de facto point guard — even when Xavier Johnson is healthy — but Galloway’s shooting from 3-point distance has dropped from 46.2% last season (30-for-65) to 27.3% this season (21-for-77).
My bad, says Mike Woodson?
No. His bad, says Mike Woodson.
“Gallo is down from last year,” Woodson volunteered Friday, when asked about the prehistoric offense — IU is 355th of 351 teams nationally in 3-point attempts, and no, that’s not a typo — the Hoosiers play. “Gallo shot it I thought extremely well for us last year. He's not shooting it that well this year.”
Woodson kept going, singling out one of the best shooters on roster, freshman Mackenzie Mgbako, who had missed nine of his 11 last attempts from distance before Saturday. Did Woodson cut him some slack, noting Mgbako had gone 16-for-32 in the previous seven games? Nope.
“Mack has had his struggles,” Woodson said, “and you can go on and on.”
Yeah, Mike, but why would you?
Here’s one thing he did say, seconds later, while riffing on the same topic of IU’s 1980s offense.
“Listen,” he said, so here I’ll ask you to lean closer and hear him out, “in the NBA I led the league in taking 3s with the Knicks and made 3s.”
He’s referring to those two seasons — 2012-14 — when he coached the Knicks.
To recap: When guys don’t take enough or make enough 3-pointers, that’s on them. Gallo’s not shooting that well, you know, and Mack has had his struggles, too.
But when the team is shooting well? Mike Woodson did that.
In the NBA I led the league in taking 3s with the Knicks.

Mike Woodson blames media, throws team under bus​

Penn State reported to Assembly Hall without leading scorer Kanye Cleary and his 18.4 ppg, and posted its third-highest points total of the season, two more than the Nittany Lions managed against St. Francis — the one in Pennsylvania, I think. Maybe it’s the one from New York. Like it matters.
Penn State destroyed the IU from Indiana, because the IU from Indiana can’t shoot from 3 or stop opponents from doing the same. Penn State entered the game 318th in the country at 30.5% from distance, but went 12-for-22 on 3-pointers.
As for IU, remember how I said the Hoosiers were 355th out of 351 Division I teams in 3-point attempts, at 15.4 per game? Here’s how that math works: There are 351 teams currently eligible for the 2024 NCAA tournament, but 10 more are transitioning into D-I and playing a D-I schedule and therefore counting in the statistics. Technically IU is No. 355 out of 361 Division I teams, but 355 out of 351 feels more accurate.
Everything else feels impossible, doesn’t it? What we’re seeing from this IU basketball program? Now, granted, the Hoosiers have had their moments. They’re coming off a victory against Iowa, one of the top feel-good moments of the season, and nearly beat then-No. 2 Kansas earlier this season, also at Assembly Hall. The Hoosiers are 13-9 overall, and 5-6 in the Big Ten, so it’s not like they’re terrible.
Then again, if they can be 361st out of 355 teams in 3-point attempts, well, they can have a winning record and still be terrible. The math checks out.
As for Woodson, he’s checking out of responsibility and pointing fingers at his players. After this loss, he talked out of both sides of his mouth when he said:
"I'm not gonna throw my guys under the bus," he said, then started revving the engine like it was Kel'el Ware or something, "but they just didn't perform the second half. They were flat as hell."
Also:
"They didn't fight the second half," he said, apparently believing there is no "I" in this team. "That's kind of disappointing."
Woodson has saved some of his most passive-aggressive ammunition for the media. First, he talks repeatedly about the injuries IU has suffered this season, and no, IU’s health has not been perfect. But just two regulars have missed a game, and one, Ware, has still played 19 of 22 games.
The other, Xavier Johnson, missed his eighth game Saturday. Can we be honest, without enjoying it? My heart goes out to Johnson, whose final season on campus has not gone well, but his absence could be addition by subtraction. He’s struggled that much, with career-low numbers across the board in a career that spans six years.
Or, put another way: Without Trace Jackson-Davis around to make things easier, Johnson has regressed that much under Mike Woodson.
Doyel last month: Xavier Johnson is struggling, and the outside world is just piling on
Woodson doesn’t see it that way, of course. He sees this whole thing — all the negative attention, the complaints on social media, the booing from fans — as the media’s fault. Here’s another thing he said Friday:
“We haven't had a full team since November,” he’d said, “and nobody has even printed that. It's like: ‘Go win anyway.’”
Yeah, Mike. Go win anyway.
If not?
Tick, tick, tick, tick.
Find IndyStar columnist Gregg Doyel on Twitter at @GreggDoyelStar or at www.facebook.com/greggdoyelstar.
More: Join the text conversation with sports columnist Gregg Doyel for insights, reader questions and Doyel's peeks behind the curtain.
This article originally appeared on Indianapolis Star: IU basketball stinks as coach Mike Woodson blames everyone but himself
 
  • Like
Reactions: .Gerdis
One of Woodson's standard lines is "next man up" I don't see him making excuses any more than most other coaches do.
After the Penn State loss, Woodson said IU just didn’t come out of the locker room with any intensity like they showed in the first half. After a pre-season poor performance against a weaker team, Woodson told Fischer, “We just didn’t come out of the locker room with any “juice.” This sounds to me like he lacks the ability to motivate others, maybe because at this stage of life he lacks self-motivation.

Woodson likes to use the NBA lingo, “the three ball”. Well, Woody, “the three ball” ain’t fall’n in the Hall!
 
After the Penn State loss, Woodson said IU just didn’t come out of the locker room with any intensity like they showed in the first half. After a pre-season poor performance against a weaker team, Woodson told Fischer, “We just didn’t come out of the locker room with any “juice.” This sounds to me like he lacks the ability to motivate others, maybe because at this stage of life he lacks self-motivation.

Woodson likes to use the NBA lingo, “the three ball”. Well, Woody, “the three ball” ain’t fall’n in the Hall!
Galloway said basically the same thing after the PSU game. Almost like he was a bystander just making an observation.
 
Did Beard say that? Or did Dakich say that Beard said it? Big difference.

Coaching searches, or as in this case, premature discussions on coaching searches, are always filled with Top Level Guys who For Sure would come to IU in a hot minute. Or, would have come here last time if only (fill in dumb AD here) would have called. And yet, none of them ever did, or will.

Many on this board have an over-inflated opinion on how attractive the IU job is in 2023. Maybe there's a reason we end up with Miller, or Woodson.
 
  • Wow
Reactions: Bucket Getter
Galloway said basically the same thing after the PSU game. Almost like he was a bystander just making an observation.
This IU team manages to lose their "juice" rather quickly. What's up with that? These players are soft. Good teams maintain intensity, that is, they keep their edge, despite the differing circumstances.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bucket Getter
Coaching searches, or as in this case, premature discussions on coaching searches, are always filled with Top Level Guys who For Sure would come to IU in a hot minute. Or, would have come here last time if only (fill in dumb AD here) would have called. And yet, none of them ever did, or will.

Many on this board have an over-inflated opinion on how attractive the IU job is in 2023. Maybe there's a reason we end up with Miller, or Woodson.
Miller was widely considered a great hire. I think we could have had Matta but chose not to. Splain that.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Willdog7 and ams66
I don’t think a 65 year old former nba coach needs his daughter calling reasonably outraged fans names. Fact is, family members of players and coaches need to stfu on social media.
That’s a sign of the times with social media. I think our problem is Woodson‘s strategy to pull reject 5 star recruits from good programs and give them one more chance to hit the NBA jackpot is simply not a recipe for championship college basketball. I hate what Doyle is writing about us these days but he is just being a writer. I don’t like what he writes about Purdue either but unfortunately he is right in both cases. That just makes our lives that much more miserable.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bucket Getter
Miller was widely considered a great hire. I think we could have had Matta but chose not to. Splain that.
How could I explain anything? I'm not in the Athletic Department, and neither is anyone else here. I keep hearing "we could have had coach X," yet other than endless repetition on boards like this, where does this info come from? The same "insider" who assured us that Pitino, Stevens, and Donovan were all done deals at various times?

People on this board who claim to know, probably don't.
 
Last edited:
Miller was widely considered a great hire. I think we could have had Matta but chose not to. Splain that.
I’m surprised our hiring committee didn’t reach out to Dayton regarding any known negatives like his inability to communicate with the public and overall sullen nature. One would think if Dayton was afraid of losing their good coach, they would have gladly shared this information. Miller never elicited a feeling of being comfortable in the brighter lights of the major division.
 
That’s a sign of the times with social media. I think our problem is Woodson‘s strategy to pull reject 5 star recruits from good programs and give them one more chance to hit the NBA jackpot is simply not a recipe for championship college basketball. I hate what Doyle is writing about us these days but he is just being a writer. I don’t like what he writes about Purdue either but unfortunately he is right in both cases. That just makes our lives that much more miserable.
Back in Knight’s day, Bob Kravitz used to love piling on Bob when the grumblings started. To say something negative towards Bob Knight was initially consider blasphemy. It drew him notice as a writer. What one writes repeatedly eventually becomes ingrained as fact in the triggered minds of less discerning readers, both spoiled IU fans and others who were always jealous of his success here. Disparaging Knight drew attention nationally. Think Juan de Silva here when Knight was sentenced to six months in prison and fined $500 for “assaulting” a Puerto Rican police officer, despite the only witnesses, the entire IU team and assistant coaches, claiming it didn’t happen.

Doyle knows what he’s doing for his own self preservation. He’s sucking up to Purdue fans while kicking us when we’re down.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bucket Getter
Back in Knight’s day, Bob Kravitz used to love piling on Bob when the grumblings started. To say something negative towards Bob Knight was initially consider blasphemy. It drew him notice as a writer. What one writes repeatedly eventually becomes ingrained as fact in the triggered minds of less discerning readers, both spoiled IU fans and others who were always jealous of his success here. Disparaging Knight drew attention nationally. Think Juan de Silva here when Knight was sentenced to six months in prison and fined $500 for “assaulting” a Puerto Rican police officer, despite the only witnesses, the entire IU team and assistant coaches, claiming it didn’t happen.

Doyle knows what he’s doing for his own self preservation. He’s sucking up to Purdue fans while kicking us when we’re down.
Word wh$$es
 
I’m surprised our hiring committee didn’t reach out to Dayton regarding any known negatives like his inability to communicate with the public and overall sullen nature. One would think if Dayton was afraid of losing their good coach, they would have gladly shared this information. Miller never elicited a feeling of being comfortable in the brighter lights of the major division.
This is where I blame Dull Son on the Archie hire. He had an opportunity to interview the guy, none of us did. Are you telling me he had a lengthy interview with the guy and no red flags went up? Then a day or two later the PC occurs and he looks like a deer in the headlights? And every time after that he looks nervous and/or pissed off?
 
Grab all the one-and-done guys you want, and as history has shown, especially as of late, there are no quick fixes to building a program. I grew up a huge fan of Mike Woodson, the player, and I am sorry if I am being negative. Three years into the Woodson culture, it looks like a complete failure. Could that change? Possibly, but it’s a long shot, and to change it, he would have to do everything completely different, and he has shown he is unwilling to do anything different.

I know what the people with their heads in the ground say: you must give him time. Time for what? We are three years in, and the team is progressively getting worse by the game. When you watch his post-game press conferences, it’s the same answers all the time; we played flat, and I need to get these guys over the hump etc… Yet he has not found a way to get them even to play hard!
 
Many of us said that from day one but were called haters.
And many of those same haters from day one called those who were skeptical of Archie Miller haters just the coaching hire before the Woody wagon rolled into town, all stiff of gait and move'n kinda slow.
 
This is where I blame Dull Son on the Archie hire. He had an opportunity to interview the guy, none of us did. Are you telling me he had a lengthy interview with the guy and no red flags went up? Then a day or two later the PC occurs and he looks like a deer in the headlights? And every time after that he looks nervous and/or pissed off?
Some anonymous person should have mailed Archie a book at Christmas time...Dale Carnegie's "How To Win Friends And Influence People". Include in the package a spray bottle of Listerine just to make him really have to think.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tammany Hall
That’s a sign of the times with social media. I think our problem is Woodson‘s strategy to pull reject 5 star recruits from good programs and give them one more chance to hit the NBA jackpot is simply not a recipe for championship college basketball. I hate what Doyle is writing about us these days but he is just being a writer. I don’t like what he writes about Purdue either but unfortunately he is right in both cases. That just makes our lives that much more miserable.
How about some of the fans STFU. Let the coach coach. If he can good ,if not he will be fired its as simple as that. OH by the way family can talk but outsiders is a different story. Good 4 her.
 
The writing is so poor in that article, it's little better than a message board post.

Not that it makes it wrong. Just harder to interpret.
 
The writing is so poor in that article, it's little better than a message board post.

Not that it makes it wrong. Just harder to interpret.
Its tough when everybody is against you and wanting you to fail.
 
Its tough when everybody is against you and wanting you to fail.
Come on man!! I don’t know one IU fan that has been rooting against Woodson. People are sick of the product. Thats on Woodson and his long bench of coaches and advisors. They’ve done a piss poor job.
 
Come on man!! I don’t know one IU fan that has been rooting against Woodson. People are sick of the product. Thats on Woodson and his long bench of coaches and advisors. They’ve done a piss poor job.
I agree ,it just seems like it. Fired the coach every 3 words
 
Keep wearing the candy stripes my friend...

Scott isn't leaving Baylor to coach at a school he has no hard ties to other than it being located in the state he lived in 30 years ago. Silly that this is a discussion. Is IU a better job than Bama? NIL money is the same (or damn close), pressure to win big is a lot less, warmer weather, nicer campus, better practice facilities, decent game crowds.. might not get 17k a night but they get 12k. The SEC is an easier league than the B10 and the last four IU coaches were run out of town. One of them (Crean) two years after winning a B10 championship.
You have clearly never visited either campus.

or practice facility.
 
How about some of the fans STFU. Let the coach coach. If he can good ,if not he will be fired its as simple as that. OH by the way family can talk but outsiders is a different story. Good 4 her.
Are you concerned that the coach cannot coach because of people entertaining themselves on a message board?

GO IU. We have the best team in the country. There, I’ve done my part, let the banners pile up!
 
You have clearly never visited either campus.

or practice facility.
Lol, what a stupid PU post. That guy must have his “defense lives here” or Paint Crew shirt on.

Tuscaloosa isn’t nice and IUBB has Bama beat in every metric except recent success. Same goes for Baylor.

Any outside coach will understand why previous coaches were fired. They will say wow, they had bad records, I could do better.

As much as PU fans hate it, if you can win at IU, it’s about as good as it gets for a coach. The big games at AH are amazing. You get a lot of national exposure and play big games. You are the king of the campus. Our fans will give you home court in NYC, pre conf tourneys, or whatever NCAA venue we go to. If you make a tourney run the whole state follows it. Coaches all have egos and they like all the aforementioned things. They want to be great at a place that appreciates it.

Now, we keep botching our coaching hires because our athletic dept/admin/politics is really bad, but if we ever get it right again, it will really fun.
 
Lol, what a stupid PU post. That guy must have his “defense lives here” or Paint Crew shirt on.

Tuscaloosa isn’t nice and IUBB has Bama beat in every metric except recent success. Same goes for Baylor.

Any outside coach will understand why previous coaches were fired. They will say wow, they had bad records, I could do better.

As much as PU fans hate it, if you can win at IU, it’s about as good as it gets for a coach. The big games at AH are amazing. You get a lot of national exposure and play big games. You are the king of the campus. Our fans will give you home court in NYC, pre conf tourneys, or whatever NCAA venue we go to. If you make a tourney run the whole state follows it. Coaches all have egos and they like all the aforementioned things. They want to be great at a place that appreciates it.

Now, we keep botching our coaching hires because our athletic dept/admin/politics is really bad, but if we ever get it right again, it will really fun.
Just had to laugh at the absurdity of the troll.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tammany Hall
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT