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I have to spike this football

Nonsense. For the GOP dominate in the future we need to embrace the likes of Pence, Chaney, Romney, et. al. We are good enough to include all of them. We have substantial agreement on the basics. If Trump really wants to leave a mark, he needs to figure out a way to mend those fences.

If he can pull that off, the Democrats can go wallow in the miserable little identities and their 101 flavors of Trump hate.
So long as Donald John Trump is the supreme leader of the GOP, there is a better chance of you and I buying mega millions tickets in our respective hometowns and simultaneously winning than Mike Pence, Dick (or Liz) Cheney and Mitt Romney ever being let under the GOP big tent.

To be honest, I'm not sure any of those people want to be a part of the MAGA faction of the party.
 
I reckon this video sums up what it must have been like to be a Dem watching the election results roll in...

 
...

I like the cut of JD Vance's jib. He's really grown on me the past couple months. And I was pretty put off by him before all this.
I didn't know a thing about Vance. Just would hear in 'mainstream media' and a little bit on this forum, how horrible he is, far right wing, mean guy. Supposedly even Ohio hated him, lol.

Then I hear him during the campaign, doing interviews, learn more about him. And unlike what most media have been saying, see that he's a normal guy, a decent man who is intelligent and believes in our country and it's people.

Hope he continues to kick ass for us.
,
 
Jesus who the hell said that’s the guy we should go with.
Despite how much you seem to like Shapiro - which I don’t get as I saw an interview of him months ago where he really disparaged conservatives - I don’t understand how Walz was seen by the Democrat campaign as a superior choice as VP. Like picking Tom Allen over Curt Cignetti.
 
As a former liberal I did throughly enjoy watching Democrats get smashed last night after selling their souls for endorsements from people like Liz & Dick Cheney and the never Trumper warmongers club. By the way, please keep them, we don't want them back.
I was a liberal until I lost my first 2 of 4 matches and moved out from home! I did as well!
 
Was it Trump doing the uniting or was it people voting for him in spite of her?
I don't even really think it was in spite of Harris specifically. I think Missouri approved a higher minimum wage and approved the abortion referendum (loosening restrictions) on the ballot. But voted in Trump and Hawley.

That right there tells me that not ALL Dem policies are umpopular but a great many people associate the Dems with identify politics and us vs. them bullshit which, after about 10 years now has become exhausing. Social justice scorecards needs to be wiped from history.
 
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I don’t know about that.

Those bridges have been scorched. Many could have and should have handled their differences in a much different and less public way.
They are allowed back, they just aren't allowed back in leadership. You can't jump ship and actively work for the opposition and then come back like nothing happened and assume the same roles will be waiting for you. Not in the near term at the very least.
 
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They are allowed back, they just aren't allowed back in leadership. You can't jump ship and actively work for the opposition and then come back like nothing happened and assume the same roles will be waiting for you. Not in the near term at the very least.
Not in any term.
 
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I think that was a pretty restrained request from him. Maybe you should practice some self control and honor his request not to correspond with him. To do otherwise only points to you being an internet troll.
Aloha could just as easily choose not to respond to him. But then again he wouldn't be able to pin himself up on his cross of he did that.
 
I think that could prove to be true. How many people from Trump's first term were either disgraced or spoke out against Trump and roundly called and idiot or worse by Trump and his cult? I'd say odds are decent that Vance will be a smarmy VP that will fall out of Trump's favor sooner or later.
I disagree, Guy. I don't think the substance of anything Vance says will piss off Trump. He's wildly ambitious and too smart for that. The problem, I think, is that he's young, well-spoken and very bright - - all the things Trump isn't. Trump doesn't like being upstaged. There were more than a few rumblings that Trump wasn't thrilled about Vance's solid debate performance, and the good reviews he received, after Trump had previously shit the bed when he debated Harris.

Vance runs the risk of being "too good" for Trump. He needs to lay low, avoid the limelight as much as possible and wait his turn - - four years max.
 
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I disagree, Guy. I don't think the substance of anything Vance says will piss off Trump. He's wildly ambitious and too smart for that. The problem, I think, is that he's young, well-spoken and very bright - - all the things Trump isn't. Trump doesn't like being upstaged. There were more than a few rumblings that Trump wasn't thrilled about Vance's solid debate performance, and the good reviews he received, after Trump had previously shit the bed when he debated Harris.

Vance runs the risk of being "too good" for Trump. He needs to lay low, avoid the limelight as much as possible and wait his turn - - four years max.
I think that's a good assessment. If you think about it, it's pretty remarkable how Vance was able to thread the needle here. He went from calling Trump 'America's Hitler' to being his VP elect.

He succeeded where people like Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio and to a lesser degree Chris Christie couldn't.
 
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We got one of them today. See ya.

Buh bye...

tenor.gif
 
So long as Donald John Trump is the supreme leader of the GOP, there is a better chance of you and I buying mega millions tickets in our respective hometowns and simultaneously winning than Mike Pence, Dick (or Liz) Cheney and Mitt Romney ever being let under the GOP big tent.

To be honest, I'm not sure any of those people want to be a part of the MAGA faction of the party.
I’m not sure it really matters.

There’s clearly a realignment going on. It’s not all that uncommon throughout history.
 
I think that's a good assessment. If you think about it, it's pretty remarkable how Vance was able to thread the needle here. He went from calling Trump 'America's Hitler' to being his VP elect.

He succeeded where people like Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio and to a lesser degree Chris Christie couldn't.
Yeah. It's called normal human interaction you Machiavellian weirdo.

Vance didn't like him, now he does. Trump didn't like that Vance didn't like him, now he likes Vance.

Opinions change and people are messy.

More news at 11.
 
I think that's a good assessment. If you think about it, it's pretty remarkable how Vance was able to thread the needle here. He went from calling Trump 'America's Hitler' to being his VP elect.

He succeeded where people like Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio and to a lesser degree Chris Christie couldn't.
He definitely won Trump over. The eyeliner, maybe?😉
 
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I've been crossing swords with you elsewhere. But let me throw up my shield for you on this one.

I totally agree with you. Most (not all) of the protests that Dick and Liz Cheney and the rest of the Never Trumpers have against Trump are entirely principled and valid. Yes, I also think they throw in a lot of bullshit that has never helped their cause (ie, Trump never said Neo-Nazis at Charlottesville were "fine people"...and people repeating that lie over and over again is indefensible). But that doesn't invalidate the valid arguments.

It is certainly true that Dick Cheney has a very different view of America's role in the world than Donald Trump does. And I don't think it's unfair to say that a significant part of their difference involves the use of force. However, saying this makes Cheney (or others with similar views) a "war monger" is a total bastardization of the complexities of foreign policy in today's world and the realities of the threats we face.
There's some truth to this. But there are a lot of people (including me, although I was young then) who feel hook, link and sinker for Dick's and GWB's war on terror and the need to get the WMDs, etc. The failures of the US to do nation building, etc. I'd imagine that's how other generations felt after Vietnam too, at least in terms of what the US should and shouldn't get involved with.
 
There's some truth to this. But there are a lot of people (including me, although I was young then) who feel hook, link and sinker for Dick's and GWB's war on terror and the need to get the WMDs, etc. The failures of the US to do nation building, etc. I'd imagine that's how other generations felt after Vietnam too, at least in terms of what the US should and shouldn't get involved with.
Throw in the shit optics of Halliburton and it’s hard not to look askance
 
I'm more concerned about the repercussions for Vance. After what happened to Pence, he better learn to sleep with his eyes open. And, in 4 years, his political career is over.
To mention Vance and Pence in the same sentence is crazy. Pence is softer than the other side of the pillow, Vance is a beast ask the CNN reporter who interviewed him a week or so.
 
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To mention Vance and Pence in the same sentence is crazy. Pence is softer than the other side of the pillow, Vance is a beast ask the CNN reporter who interviewed him a week or so.
I think the saying is "cooler than the other side of the pillow". (Stuart Scott, RIP)

Vance and Pence have one very important thing in common. Let's see if you can figure it out.
 
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