Kelly (and Mattis, for that matter) have more character in his little finger than Trump has in total.
General John Kelly
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I just heard James Carville on Bill Maher's Club Random podcast talk about this. He said if the Democrats got serious about running what he considers a good candidate under 55-60 years old, they would win 55% of the vote in the 2024 presidential election. He actually thinks Josh Shapiro and Andy Bashear could be viable candidates. I don't know enough about either guy to agree/disagree, but he seemed to think they're 'talented' politicians who could make a serious run at the presidency.
Can see how the list of remarks made by Trump concerning members of the military can be taken as offensively disrespectful.
However, which is more important for a Commander in Chief and his military, his tendency to make flippant remarks, or his decision making process concerning putting our military in harms way ?
John Bolton's book In The Room Where it Happened gave me some insight in Trump's decision making process. My take after reading the book gave me the impression Trump makes snap decisions, but is inclined to change his mind depending on whom he last talked with. Flippant remarks can also reveal a quick to judge decision making process.
Having said that, Bolton may simply be at odds with the way Trump makes decisions along with not always following Bolton's advice.
Granted the age and mental state of a CIC is a big factor in attempting to assess his capacity to make war decisions. The question which is important to me is whom does a president consult and how much does he rely on his advisers ? On this question, simply don't know for sure in trying to rate Trump and Biden. Would guess Biden is more likely to accept advice, but could be wrong.
However, which is more important for a Commander in Chief and his military, his tendency to make flippant remarks, or his decision making process concerning putting our military in harms way ?
John Bolton's book In The Room Where it Happened gave me some insight in Trump's decision making process. My take after reading the book gave me the impression Trump makes snap decisions, but is inclined to change his mind depending on whom he last talked with. Flippant remarks can also reveal a quick to judge decision making process.
Having said that, Bolton may simply be at odds with the way Trump makes decisions along with not always following Bolton's advice.
Granted the age and mental state of a CIC is a big factor in attempting to assess his capacity to make war decisions. The question which is important to me is whom does a president consult and how much does he rely on his advisers ? On this question, simply don't know for sure in trying to rate Trump and Biden. Would guess Biden is more likely to accept advice, but could be wrong.
Nope. Seeing clearly. If the Democrats weren't such a dog shit party it might be a little different story. I got a view of your "norms" the past 3 years. Hard pass.
They are still way up. That you’re as bad at math as poly sci isn’t surprising
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anon_mya1phvcpf5x4
Guest
Bless your heart and have a nice day.
I obviously don’t know any of them, but I hafta say this Kelly piece substantially lowers my view of his character. Parroting platitudes and a mindless blistering personal attack on Trump does not give Kelly an ounce of credibility. . He was on station when Trump‘s policies were in effect. I’d like to hear Kelly’s view about how Trumps character flaws really harmed the country. As I keep saying, Trump’s flaws go away when he is gone. He has not changed the GOP. Contrast that with the current president. His contempt for the rule of law is doing immediate and long term harm. Until people like Kelly stand up to those kinds of flaws, God help us.
Giving an honest assessment of Trump is no character flaw. It's practically a duty at this point. Trump has changed the GOP substantially and I don't like it. He's lost Republican support in the military and in law enforcement agencies with his constant disrespect towards them. Trump has contempt for the rule of law. He's called for the execution of General Milley and censorship and prosecution of news organizations. He's vowing retribution for the "witch hunts" against him. No, I do not agree that he's the subject of witch hunts - though the first NY indictments shouldn't have been brought, the others strike me as overwhelmingly warranted and worthy of prosecution. I think he will be prosecuted and he'll be found guilty on a number of charges. What do we do then? Why are we allowing this man to lead among our primary candidates. It's nuts. We might be stuck with a felon as the Republican candidate.
LOL. Trumpism IS the GOP.
The GOP will not abandon Trump even if he is in prison on election day.
Think about that.
First, I thought a mod had offended you, you left the Cooler and deleted your account. Surprised to see you here again. Welcome back.I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish here. Venting? I get it; today's political climate is frustrating and I don't think many in the country want Trump v. Biden: The Rematch.
But if you're attempting to persuade people on the board, while I wish you well, I would caution you against referring to Trump as "sub-human." He is not, and that is dangerous language. Trump is human, all too human. Using that language will automatically turn off many of the people you might be trying to reach with the rest of your message.
As for how millions will vote for Trump (or Biden, for that matter), I suggest you read Democracy for Realists. It's theory explains this phenomenon pretty well, I think--even though I fall into the trap of thinking voters are rationally thinking about all these issues and are involved in a complex calculus to determine who to vote for all the time, as your question implies:
"Democracy for Realists assails the romantic folk-theory at the heart of contemporary thinking about democratic politics and government, and offers a provocative alternative view grounded in the actual human nature of democratic citizens. . . .
[The authors] demonstrate that voters—even those who are well informed and politically engaged—mostly choose parties and candidates on the basis of social identities and partisan loyalties, not political issues. They also show that voters adjust their policy views and even their perceptions of basic matters of fact to match those loyalties. When parties are roughly evenly matched, elections often turn on irrelevant or misleading considerations such as economic spurts or downturns beyond the incumbents’ control; the outcomes are essentially random. Thus, voters do not control the course of public policy, even indirectly."
Democracy for Realists
Why our belief in government by the people is unrealistic—and what we can do about itpress.princeton.edu
I'm not trying to accomplish anything. What are you trying to accomplish? You wrote a long post without addressing the topic.
I've identified a news story and highlighted several reprehensible, outrageous and unprecedented comments about the military by a former Commander-in-Chief. I was genuinely curious if anyone perceived this as defensible.
As far as my description of him as sub-human, he's been called a lot worse and he himself has called others far worse.
I'm not trying to persuade anyone here. I provide opinions, usually supported with facts. Isn't this a forum for providing opinions? What am I missing?
Just a hunch of course, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was Trump's recent suggestion that Milley should have been executed that prompted Kelly to speak out.
Trump has endangered the lives of a distinguished retired army general and his family. This was probably the last straw for Kelly.
I have little doubt that some deranged Trumpster out there might be thinking about carrying out the execution order. This kind of stuff cannot possibly be defended, yet it will be defended by the usual suspects.
without question. carville said any non woke normal dem would wipe the floor with trump - heard the other day
Of course the execution comment is beyond the pale. But what do you think of Milley communicating with his ChiCom counterpart, without the presidents knowledge about Trump and matters of national security? I don’t get that.
I guess we just disagree about how big a ripple Trump makes in the Republican pond. Not much for me and regardless, ripples go away.
I have thought about it. Trump has no enduring impact. He is all personality, toxic or otherwise.
It was not that unusual the Chairman of the JCS talks to counterparts in other countries from time to time. He says it was an authorized call and I believe him. At this point I don't believe anything that Trump and his closest cronies say about much of anything. Definitely not this. He's destroyed all his credibility and only he says it was unauthorized. Remember that he said Milley developed plans to attack Iran? That was NONSENSE on steroids because the Joint Chiefs don't develop war plans. They're not in the operational chain of command. I'm sure we do have plans, but they'd be developed by the Combatant Commander (CENTCOM in this case) and not the Joint Chiefs.
There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Trump has damaged support for Republicans in previously overwhelmingly Republican groups like the military. I've seen it and I've heard it. It might be permanent if the MAGA wing becomes the dominate wing of the party. It's almost there now in that otherwise standard Republicans pay lip service to it and try to court the MAGA republican portion of the party.
Yes. Kelly alluded to that: "A person [Trump] who cavalierly suggests that a selfless warrior who has served his country for 40 years in peacetime and war should lose his life for treason — in expectation that someone will take action.”
It really is as simple as crazy intimated. it's basically what do you believe is worse: the biden's america thread with all that's set forth therein or all of the anti trump personality/democracy threads with all that's set forth therein. there are truths in both. reasonable minds can disagree
You're changing the subject or missing the point. That's not what this thread is about. I'm talking about a unique, unprecedented and disgraceful perception of our war heroes by a former Commander-in-Chief who wants that job again.
that's the point. to crazy and many others that's still not as destructive as what the dems have done over three years. they can say yes that's horrible. he's a pos. his view on soldiers is awful. and? he'd still do a better job than biden. can you grasp that?
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anon_mya1phvcpf5x4
Guest
Are you serious?
Gosh, I don’t know, because…
1) an incumbent president wins ~80% of the time
(although Trump screwed that up royally)
2) it would be a horribly bad look for a party to primary an incumbent president
Regarding 2, what’s the reason for the primary?
Do you think republicans will be nice to you?
Because Biden is old?
Just cuz?
Yes, but we have never had a plus 80-year-old ever run before. His polling is crap, and a lot of it is on his age. There aren't policy changes that can improve how people view his age. The answer is for someone to convince Biden to step out. If someone other than Trump wins the Republican nomination, Biden has zero chance.
That's a lot of words to read. Does this mean you are or aren't voting for Trump?
Okay. But the content of Milley’s call was for the ChiComs to disregard the President and look to himself. In some ways, Mlley has narcissistic issues just like Trump.
I’m MAGA. I think MAGA. Is bedrock Republican. The Democrats/media have spun it to mean crazy white maLes. Unless A Republican is notably anti-trump, that Republican will be labeled as a“Extreme MAGA, Republican”. That phrase polls very well for Democrats. “Extreme MAGA Republican” is a Democrat/Media phsy-op.
The content was merely that there was no plan to attack China.
MAGA means incivility, refusal to compromise, and isolationism. Those are all nonstarters for me.
I don't know if I could vote for Trump if he were running against Jared from Subway. Only one of those rapists wants to destroy democracy.
Totally get why you wouldn't want to vote for Biden or any Democrats. I can't imagine a world where you would vote for the Democratic nominee for President, so I would imagine you are focused on the Republican nominee, which is the primary subject of this thread.
Why aren't Republicans working harder to wash themselves of Trump and put forward a candidate that you can get excited about. I see very little work being done by my conservative brethren to talk up and champion someone other that DJT. Why aren't Republicans rallying around someone they feel can carry the positives of the conservative message without all of the unnecessary negative baggage?
Milley may or may not be a narcissist, but I'm sure we can all agree we'd prefer him representing sensitive US interests, even if he violated usual norms. With Trump, the Generals were in a tough spot as the man has no clue to the importance the US plays on in the world stage. Everything is transactional in his world.
To be fair, you are a crazy white male.
quote:
"Not every Republican, not even a majority of Republicans, adhere to the MAGA extremist ideology. I know because I’ve been able to work with Republicans my whole career".
The same thing has been said OVER, and OVER, and OVER again. Wake up.
Remarks by President Biden Honoring the Legacy of Senator John McCain and the Work We Must Do Together to Strengthen Our Democracy | The White House
Tempe Center for the ArtsTempe, Arizona 12:05 P.M. MST THE PRESIDENT: Thank you, thank you. Please -- please, sit down. Thank you. I’m going to put a
Well, good luck with all that.
And there’s literally 3 years difference in their ages, yet I don’t see a constant media blitz regarding Trump’s age. Maybe in 3 years Trump will suddenly be too old for office.
I wouldn't be too upset if Biden made an announcement that he's stepping down and gave a similar speech Mitt Romney gave a few weeks ago.
If he's running against Trump, I'd vote for Biden, but if there are palatable/electable Democrats - and there seems to be people who know about this stuff who think there are - I'd be happy to see the proverbial mantle passed.
