ADVERTISEMENT

Coaching Hotboard - Winning at Places that are Hard to Win

MMcCormick

Sophomore
Dec 7, 2004
759
1,970
93
My criteria is head coaching experience, success over an extended period of time, built one if not several successful programs, and probably most importantly, the big differentiator, has won at a place that is hard (if not impossible to win.)

1. Troy Calhoun - 57 years old Air Force - He's not on anybody's board except mine. He's the ultimate win at a hard place to win coach. He's had 13 winning seasons and four losing ones at a place that is really hard to win at. He's got an unconventional run heavy offense that is hard to defend and his defenses are always good. One of the most underrated coaches in college football. Averaged 9 wins a year over the last three years. At 57 he's still probably got a decade of good coaching left. His unconventional option offense probably eliminates him from most coaching searches which is exactly why Indiana might be able to get him.

2. Curt Cignetti - JMU - 63 years old - Would be hard to find a more seasoned successful coach. He's built programs multiple times, won everywhere he's gone, and just went undefeated with the worst talent in his conference while transitioning to D1. He's 63 and that's the downside. If he were 50 he'd be looking for a bigger job, but he's probably got five years left and Indiana would be a good spot to spend it. Does not seem to have suitors now likely do to his age.

3. Bob Chesney - 46 years old Holy Cross - Knock on Chesney will be his lack of power 5 experience but this guy is a really good coach who has now taken three programs that were terrible and turned them into high-level winners. When someone keeps repeating the process it means they are good and have a formula. He's won 70% of his games which is hard to do at any level. Syracuse is likely to beat Indiana to the punch.

4. Gary Patterson - 63 - Former TCU Coach - Hard to find a hall-of-fame coach that may have gas left in the tank and Patterson fits that bill. He had a small school competing for national championship for almost a decade. Had a few rough years that got him fired, and he was not happy about that and I suspect it's renewed his fire. TCU is not an easy place to win and he won big there.

5. Will Fritz - 63 years old - Tulane - Fritz has won everywhere he's been and he's been to a lot of places. Had the hardest time winning at Tulane which is very hard to win at yet he has now pulled that off going 11-1 and 12-2 in the last two years. Guy knows football.

6. Jason Candle - 44 years old - Candle is probably #1 on most lists and I think he could win at Indiana. He makes really good coaching hires including Brian Wright of Pittsburgh State who should be a candidate in his own right. My concern with with Candle is Toledo is not a hard place to win. It's probably the easiest school in the MAC to win at. That being said he's done at least as well as Matt Campbell and Campbell is exactly what Indiana needs. One other concern is he has an excellent DC and I suspect Vince Koehres would take over Toledo when he left. That would be a big hit to Candle's formula as Candle is an offensive guy and relies heavily on Koehres who he has had a relationship with for decades.

7. Chris Creighton - It's hard to win at Eastern Michigan. Creighton has not won as big as the other coaches on this list. He's a good coach, but he's down the list for me. Would be much better than Allen, but I would not be as excited as the guys at the top of the list.

Other that might be able to get to .500 at Indiana

Paul Chryst - 58 - Former Wisconsin - People are too down on Chryst. He's a high caliber coach. But Wisconsin in the Big Ten West has been an easy place for a good coach to win for the last decade. That being said, he did a great job there. He also would likely keep Bostad and maybe even Rod Carey as OC. Maybe Jim Leonard would even join him. His 19-19 record at Pitt is what I would expect if he coached Indiana not his numbers at Wisconsin.
 
Last edited:
1. Jamey Chadwell
2. Jon Sumrall
3. Jim Leonhard
4. Willie Fritz
5. Curt Cignetti
6. Sean Lewis
7. Ryan Grubb

Clawson and Fisch top the list but incredibly slim chances. Fritz and Cignetti are down because of their age. Frye is the wildcard hire if we want to hire in the family though I would love to see ARE brought in on some WR/co-OC capacity.
 
1. Jamey Chadwell
2. Jon Sumrall
3. Jim Leonhard
4. Willie Fritz
5. Curt Cignetti
6. Sean Lewis
7. Ryan Grubb

Clawson and Fisch top the list but incredibly slim chances. Fritz and Cignetti are down because of their age. Frye is the wildcard hire if we want to hire in the family though I would love to see ARE brought in on some WR/co-OC capacity.
What has Justin Frye done to be worthy of a Big Ten HC job? I'm baffled by his presence on these lists people are putting together.
 
1. Jamey Chadwell
2. Jon Sumrall
3. Jim Leonhard
4. Willie Fritz
5. Curt Cignetti
6. Sean Lewis
7. Ryan Grubb

Clawson and Fisch top the list but incredibly slim chances. Fritz and Cignetti are down because of their age. Frye is the wildcard hire if we want to hire in the family though I would love to see ARE brought in on some WR/co-OC capacity.
This is a good list. I did not list Chadwell because I don't think he'd come, but he'd top my list if he would come. Sumrall is also a really good candidate although not as long on head coaching experience. I'd be excited about Leonhard too. Can't see a Ryan Grubb without coaching experience being the guy. His offenses under Kalen Debeoer have been great. But I believe Nick Sheridan's would be too. That offense is all Deboer.
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
What has Justin Frye done to be worthy of a Big Ten HC job? I'm baffled by his presence on these lists people are putting together.
Just the keep it in the family option, I didn't list him for a reason. He was with Day at Temple and BC and worked as Chip Kelly's OC before reuniting with Day in Columbus as the assistant head coach. Offenses under him have done well although OSU fans have seemingly expressed approval to the Frye-to-Indiana rumors.
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
1. Jamey Chadwell
2. Jon Sumrall
3. Jim Leonhard
4. Willie Fritz
5. Curt Cignetti
6. Sean Lewis
7. Ryan Grubb

Clawson and Fisch top the list but incredibly slim chances. Fritz and Cignetti are down because of their age. Frye is the wildcard hire if we want to hire in the family though I would love to see ARE brought in on some WR/co-OC capacity.
Hard to believe Clawson would leave Wake, but that's definitely a hard place to win at. Maybe more so than even Indiana. Indiana is likely going to have a lot more money to spend than ACC teams the way things are headed.
 
Hard to believe Clawson would leave Wake, but that's definitely a hard place to win at. Maybe more so than even Indiana. Indiana is likely going to have a lot more money to spend than ACC teams the way things are headed.
That's where I lay the minuscule chance of grabbing him or Fisch
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
UMO he should— he’s making about a million less per year than Allen was, and I have to think he’s probably maxed out whatever he can accomplish at Wake. Maybe he’s looking for a new challenge.
His best players keep getting stolen at Wake which has to be hard to handle as a coach. If Indiana created a big NIL bank they could get a guy like Clawson, but I don't think that exists yet. Schools with big alumni networks are going to have an advantage over the Wake's of the world.
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
So the culture made all the stupid in game decisions for Tom Allen and it hired Walt Bell and it kept Hiller around for way too long etc etc? A good coach will create his own culture. Stupid post. IU keeps losing because we keep hiring bad coaches.
The guy's an Iowa troll just looking to get under Hoosier fans' skin. Ignore him.
 
So the culture made all the stupid in game decisions for Tom Allen and it hired Walt Bell and it kept Hiller around for way too long etc etc? A good coach will create his own culture. Stupid post. IU keeps losing because we keep hiring bad coaches.
It amazes me how some people deny that the institutional and fan culture have anything to do with the state of the program.

I’m sure it’s more likely that IU has just hired bad coaches for its entire history than it is that the problem is deeper than that, right? Give me a freaking break. If all that has changed is Allen not being here, we’ll be right back in this spot by 2030 no matter who the new guy is.
 
So the culture made all the stupid in game decisions for Tom Allen and it hired Walt Bell and it kept Hiller around for way too long etc etc? A good coach will create his own culture. Stupid post. IU keeps losing because we keep hiring bad coaches.
What else would you expect from that spit for brains?
 
Lots of great names on this list.

Chadwell is making 4 mil per year…guessing he might be too spendy for this search. Also guessing he’d be a guy that would require some assurances on heavy investments, and NIL improvements. Would love for IU to make all of these investments with him. But it’s hard for me to see it. The mere act of firing Allen implies a higher level of give a crap…so I think we will be able to assure many coaches that we’re in it to win it…I just get a feel Chadwell will be one that is very, very picky on his next job.

Whoever it is, I hope they take some steps forward on their budget for the entire staff…they do announce some sort of plan to improve or replace Mellencamp…and that Dolson states new expectations for a successful football program.

IU is one of the southern most schools in what will be one of the top 2 conferences. The overall athletics have national recognition. Winning at IU should be possible. The school just needs to make it a priority, and fund it accordingly.
 
Coach won’t make any difference unless the culture changes including the fan base.
As in any sport, college or professional, WINNING can change a culture in an instant. My first IU game I attended that I can remember as a child was the first game at Memorial Stadium. I still have the medallion. So not to brag but I have seen a lot of IU football in person and on tv, on the road and home. Living in different parts of the USA I have attended San Diego St games when Brian Sipe was a QB, I have attend UDub games in Seattle when I lived in that area and even flew out to see IU play them when DiNardo was the HC.

I have been to USC games in LA (doesn't count). IU's fanbase has a huge wall to bang its head against and MANY THINGS make it very very hard to create a IU Football culture. From the traffic control, to downtown, a 1,000 year history of being a basketball state, a smaller stadium than most B1G stadiums, blah blah blah.

The one thing that is consistent that I have seen over the years and it doesn't matter who the HC was .... A coach comes in spends his first few years to build a roster to become decent. Starts the season 3-0, the fans are excited, the town is excited, traffic flow is better, the hot dogs and brats are now hot not cold ... everything is right where it should be to take the "culture train" out of the depot.

With a fill stadium IU lays a HUGE DUD against that first B1G team they were expected to either win or upset a ranked opponent. After that one game that seems to happen every year they are undefeated with a promising team ... they lose that one game.

The fans don't come back, the season excitement is lost and everything sucks from the hot dogs to the university president.

I have no answers about how to build a culture like other schools that have it. I have no answer about facilities and am sick that IU now has to BUY their roster. IU's stadium looks like they have tried or are trying everything from the largest flag ever, to the patio tents in the end zone, IMO Memorial Stadium looks more like a circus tent than a football stadium.

Hard to build a culture when IU Football has the worst fans in the nation. They don't stand every kickoff, they leave at halftime and never come back even in a close game, the band can't stop playing the same songs they did when I was at school and CHEERS FOR BASKETBALL DO NOT WORK FOR FOOTBALL GAMES!!! Nationwide on tv or in person will you see very many fans wearing basketball jerseys of their school at football games, you just don't.

So yes a culture needs to be built but it's a two way street and a very very hard one to stay on.
 
I think IU's problem is they have an almost perfect record of hiring bad coaches. I mean which IU coaches failed at IU and then went off and succeeded fabulously somewhere else? They generally hire assistants which is very risky. Pick a guy who has won in a tough place to win and you will probably have found a successful coach.
 
Bring in a coach that has a track record of winning....winning changes culture! Losing consistently creates culture too which is what IU has had. I doubt a new practice facility equates to better culture and more wins. Higher a good damn coach for once!
 
My criteria is head coaching experience, success over an extended period of time, built one if not several successful programs, and probably most importantly, the big differentiator, has won at a place that is hard (if not impossible to win.)

1. Troy Calhoun - 57 years old Air Force - He's not on anybody's board except mine. He's the ultimate win at a hard place to win coach. He's had 13 winning seasons and four losing ones at a place that is really hard to win at. He's got an unconventional run heavy offense that is hard to defend and his defenses are always good. One of the most underrated coaches in college football. Averaged 9 wins a year over the last three years. At 57 he's still probably got a decade of good coaching left. His unconventional option offense probably eliminates him from most coaching searches which is exactly why Indiana might be able to get him.

2. Curt Cignetti - JMU - 63 years old - Would be hard to find a more seasoned successful coach. He's built programs multiple times, won everywhere he's gone, and just went undefeated with the worst talent in his conference while transitioning to D1. He's 63 and that's the downside. If he were 50 he'd be looking for a bigger job, but he's probably got five years left and Indiana would be a good spot to spend it. Does not seem to have suitors now likely do to his age.

3. Bob Chesney - 46 years old Holy Cross - Knock on Chesney will be his lack of power 5 experience but this guy is a really good coach who has now taken three programs that were terrible and turned them into high-level winners. When someone keeps repeating the process it means they are good and have a formula. He's won 70% of his games which is hard to do at any level. Syracuse is likely to beat Indiana to the punch.

4. Gary Patterson - 63 - Former TCU Coach - Hard to find a hall-of-fame coach that may have gas left in the tank and Patterson fits that bill. He had a small school competing for national championship for almost a decade. Had a few rough years that got him fired, and he was not happy about that and I suspect it's renewed his fire. TCU is not an easy place to win and he won big there.

5. Will Fritz - 63 years old - Tulane - Fritz has won everywhere he's been and he's been to a lot of places. Had the hardest time winning at Tulane which is very hard to win at yet he has now pulled that off going 11-1 and 12-2 in the last two years. Guy knows football.

6. Jason Candle - 44 years old - Candle is probably #1 on most lists and I think he could win at Indiana. He makes really good coaching hires including Brian Wright of Pittsburgh State who should be a candidate in his own right. My concern with with Candle is Toledo is not a hard place to win. It's probably the easiest school in the MAC to win at. That being said he's done at least as well as Matt Campbell and Campbell is exactly what Indiana needs. One other concern is he has an excellent DC and I suspect Vince Koehres would take over Toledo when he left. That would be a big hit to Candle's formula as Candle is an offensive guy and relies heavily on Koehres who he has had a relationship with for decades.

7. Chris Creighton - It's hard to win at Eastern Michigan. Creighton has not won as big as the other coaches on this list. He's a good coach, but he's down the list for me. Would be much better than Allen, but I would not be as excited as the guys at the top of the list.

Other that might be able to get to .500 at Indiana

Paul Chryst - 58 - Former Wisconsin - People are too down on Chryst. He's a high caliber coach. But Wisconsin in the Big Ten West has been an easy place for a good coach to win for the last decade. That being said, he did a great job there. He also would likely keep Bostad and maybe even Rod Carey as OC. Maybe Jim Leonard would even join him. His 19-19 record at Pitt is what I would expect if he coached Indiana not his numbers at Wisconsin.
Why isn't Matt Campbell on your list?
 
Lots of great names on this list.

Chadwell is making 4 mil per year…guessing he might be too spendy for this search. Also guessing he’d be a guy that would require some assurances on heavy investments, and NIL improvements. Would love for IU to make all of these investments with him. But it’s hard for me to see it. The mere act of firing Allen implies a higher level of give a crap…so I think we will be able to assure many coaches that we’re in it to win it…I just get a feel Chadwell will be one that is very, very picky on his next job.

Whoever it is, I hope they take some steps forward on their budget for the entire staff…they do announce some sort of plan to improve or replace Mellencamp…and that Dolson states new expectations for a successful football program.

IU is one of the southern most schools in what will be one of the top 2 conferences. The overall athletics have national recognition. Winning at IU should be possible. The school just needs to make it a priority, and fund it accordingly.

Chadwell is too spendy?? Wasn't Allen making 5?

I would think ANY coach worth a spit will make it part of his contract or at least demand what you stated in your second paragraph.
 
1. Jamey Chadwell
2. Jon Sumrall
3. Jim Leonhard
4. Willie Fritz
5. Curt Cignetti
6. Sean Lewis
7. Ryan Grubb

Clawson and Fisch top the list but incredibly slim chances. Fritz and Cignetti are down because of their age. Frye is the wildcard hire if we want to hire in the family though I would love to see ARE brought in on some WR/co-OC capacity.
4 and 5. That's my list.
 
Chadwell is too spendy?? Wasn't Allen making 5?

I would think ANY coach worth a spit will make it part of his contract or at least demand what you stated in your second paragraph.
Just meaning Chadwell is making 4 already, at Liberty...He might ask for more than 5 to come to IU...and not sure what the budget will be with the buyout chunk already spent??

I think IU likely is, and will give assurances that they're moving in a positive direction on facilities, staff funding... and then the NIL people will make their pitch too... I just have a feeling Chadwell will be looking for more concrete examples of proof, than IU is maybe willing or able to give.

All of this is wild conjecture...just a feeling I get from how Chadwell handled the Liberty change...and what his likely demand gives him in terms of leverage with a P5 school like IU.

Like I said though, I hope we can make things work with a guy like Chadwell, or Chadwell himself...itd be a sign of major commitments made by Dolson and the Admin.
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
Just meaning Chadwell is making 4 already, at Liberty...He might ask for more than 5 to come to IU...and not sure what the budget will be with the buyout chunk already spent??

I think IU likely is, and will give assurances that they're moving in a positive direction on facilities, staff funding... and then the NIL people will make their pitch too... I just have a feeling Chadwell will be looking for more concrete examples of proof, than IU is maybe willing or able to give.

All of this is wild conjecture...just a feeling I get from how Chadwell handled the Liberty change...and what his likely demand gives him in terms of leverage with a P5 school like IU.

Like I said though, I hope we can make things work with a guy like Chadwell, or Chadwell himself...itd be a sign of major commitments made by Dolson and the Admin.

Wasn't the buy out from private donors?
If indeed it was, then that could affect the NIL but not what IU's budget is for a new coach.
 
Wasn't the buy out from private donors?
If indeed it was, then that could affect the NIL but not what IU's budget is for a new coach.
Also presumes these donors would otherwise have contributed to NIL (probably not a given), or that money that was given to a NIL collective was instead used for the buyout (would that even be allowed?)
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
Wasn't the buy out from private donors?
If indeed it was, then that could affect the NIL but not what IU's budget is for a new coach.
Honestly not sure. And I kind of view the entire things as IU Footballs capacity to fund/pay for all of it. The buyout certainly has an effect on our overall capacity to spend money on other things. Those same donors could have been hit up for facility improvements, and/or funding for new coaches.
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
Just reading some tea leaves from some people I know that post. It appears a prominent donor or some of their people are behind Pat Fitzgerald. His son is a junior QB who just won a state title in Illinois Saturday I believe.
 
Just reading some tea leaves from some people I know that post. It appears a prominent donor or some of their people are behind Pat Fitzgerald. His son is a junior QB who just won a state title in Illinois Saturday I believe.
If it is Fitz, he'd have to assemble a new staff, right?
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
Just reading some tea leaves from some people I know that post. It appears a prominent donor or some of their people are behind Pat Fitzgerald. His son is a junior QB who just won a state title in Illinois Saturday I believe.
Ugh... That would be even dumber than taking a flyer on ARE... If they want to dry up recruiting faster than you can say weirdo that's the route to take...

People seem quick to forget that Fitz went 3-9 and 1-11 in his last two seasons and the guy that has replaced him has turned that around to 7 wins in just one season...

If we go with fat Fitz that would rank up there as one of the all time worst hires ever for IU Football...
 
Last edited:
Ugh... That would be even dumber than taking a flyer on ARE... If they want to dry up recruiting faster than you can say weirdo that's the route to take...
It would be an outstanding hire. That's why it will probably never happen.
 
It would be an outstanding hire. That's why it will probably never happen.
11 bowl games in 17 years. Would you sue your employer if you were guilty? He would have easier entrance requirements at IU than NU. I'm not saying I support it but some money people do.
 
  • Like
Reactions: vesuvius13
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT