2017 Projections: IU comes in at #39

[Bobsnotbucks]

There is more returning talent, more depth and more coaching staff continuity now than during any of the other IU coaching changes you site.

I agree with that, but it's not likely there's nearly enough talent there to offset the player and coach turnover. Transitions nearly always require patience and a few doses of reality mixed with the unbridled enthusiasm we generally see here. Should be interesting.

 

[td75]

I wish IU was competing in the Big Ten West division. There's plenty of talent to be a top three team in that division. Of course competing in the East is a totally different animal.

Recruiting is obviously going to have to get much better for IU to realistically win the East division. The need for a dynamic QB will be there EVERY year as well. If you want to beat PSU and Michigan, you better have very good QB play.

I think this year's team has a chance to be a very good football team. There's a lot of talent coming back, that is huge. Lagow needs to play considerably better this season, that's a fact.

 

[Bowlmania]

I wish IU was competing in the Big Ten West division. There's plenty of talent to be a top three team in that division. Of course competing in the East is a totally different animal.

Recruiting is obviously going to have to get much better for IU to realistically win the East division. The need for a dynamic QB will be there EVERY year as well. If you want to beat PSU and Michigan, you better have very good QB play.

I think this year's team has a chance to be a very good football team. There's a lot of talent coming back, that is huge. Lagow needs to play considerably better this season, that's a fact.

Our worst conference matchup over the last 12 years or so has been Wisconsin. And since the league went to the East/West alignment a few years back, the only West team we've been able to beat is Purdue, so I'm not sure being in the West would do us any favors.

Sagarin's final division rankings showed the East to be only fractionally better than the West in 2016-2017. In any event, we're competing in the East. We blew the Michigan game in 2015, and played them close at their place this past season. We were first and goal against OSU in 2015 with a chance to tie or take the lead in the closing minute. We beat Michigan State, Rutgers and Maryland this past season. We can win in the East and, while I'm not predicting a division championship anytime soon, I think we'll be fine.

 

[rcaulfie]

The offensive losses are significant, as much as you and others want to down play them. They start up front, where four guys who played a ton of ball over the last four years are gone.

In just about every post I have mentioned how the OL is losing a bunch. So, I guess you just disregard that. But even that, you are exaggerating. You say 4 when in fact it is only 3 - Feeney, Bailey and Rogers. Did I miss anyone else? You can't count Camiel because he was out practically the entire year. His loss would count towards the 2015 season. In fact, him being out this year only gives added experience for next year.

But all that aside, I can give you your argument the offense could be worse. But the defense will be better - it will improve more than the offense will decline. Certainly enough to expect overall improvement of the team, and certainly enough to expect we can be 7-6 instead of 6-7. That right there is what is "brutally honest". Just because you say your argument is does not make it so. And making up all of this immense optimism on my part, again, is just not accurate in the least.

 

[Bobsnotbucks]

In just about every post I have mentioned how the OL is losing a bunch. So, I guess you just disregard that. But even that, you are exaggerating. You say 4 when in fact it is only 3 - Feeney, Bailey and Rogers. Did I miss anyone else? You can't count Camiel because he was out practically the entire year. His loss would count towards the 2015 season. In fact, him being out this year only gives added experience for next year.

But all that aside, I can give you your argument the offense could be worse. But the defense will be better - it will improve more than the offense will decline. Certainly enough to expect overall improvement of the team, and certainly enough to expect we can be 7-6 instead of 6-7. That right there is what is "brutally honest". Just because you say your argument is does not make it so. And making up all of this immense optimism on my part, again, is just not accurate in the least.

I can't count Camiel? Wow.

And the defense may be better in spite of the fact that they lose their two best players, but that's not a given. And coaching changes nearly always mean a step back.

Once again, I love breezy optimism, I just like facts, too.

 

[YOTHN]

In just about every post I have mentioned how the OL is losing a bunch. So, I guess you just disregard that. But even that, you are exaggerating. You say 4 when in fact it is only 3 - Feeney, Bailey and Rogers. Did I miss anyone else? You can't count Camiel because he was out practically the entire year. His loss would count towards the 2015 season. In fact, him being out this year only gives added experience for next year.

But all that aside, I can give you your argument the offense could be worse. But the defense will be better - it will improve more than the offense will decline. Certainly enough to expect overall improvement of the team, and certainly enough to expect we can be 7-6 instead of 6-7. That right there is what is "brutally honest". Just because you say your argument is does not make it so. And making up all of this immense optimism on my part, again, is just not accurate in the least.

And even Bailey wasn't the starter all year long. He replaced Dan and helped fill gaps so I won't say he shouldn't be counted but.....

 

[rcaulfie]

I can't count Camiel? Wow.

And the defense may be better in spite of the fact that they lose their two best players, but that's not a given. And coaching changes nearly always mean a step back.

Once again, I love breezy optimism, I just like facts, too.

Why would you count a guy that played in only the first 2 of our 13 games? Wow, is absolutely right. And there you go again, talking of facts. The only fact is, Camiel did not play in the last 11 games. FACT, you want to count him. You are giving only alternative facts. And again "breezy optimism"....for a 1 game improvement, after losing a lot of games we had a chance to win?

 

[rcaulfie]

And even Bailey wasn't the starter all year long. He replaced Dan and helped fill gaps so I won't say he shouldn't be counted but.....

Come on now, those aren't FACTS!!!

 

[rcaulfie]

I can't count Camiel? Wow.

And the defense may be better in spite of the fact that they lose their two best players, but that's not a given. And coaching changes nearly always mean a step back.

Once again, I love breezy optimism, I just like facts, too.

AND our 2 best players on D are Scales and Fant - they are both back. Anything else you want me to disprove for you?

 

[Bobsnotbucks]

Why would you count a guy that played in only the first 2 of our 13 games? Wow, is absolutely right. And there you go again, talking of facts. The only fact is, Camiel did not play in the last 11 games. FACT, you want to count him. You are giving only alternative facts. And again "breezy optimism"....for a 1 game improvement, after losing a lot of games we had a chance to win?

Camiel counts because he clearly was one of the best offensive linemen on the team. They hoped he could get a 6th year. I'll assume you don't count Feeney as a loss either, like another poster did, because he missed considerable time, too.

Again, I like breezy optimism, but facts are important, too. And counting on improvement with the satisfaction that IU has been close isn't really a very factual position to take, as is being dismissive of the coaching moves and defensive losses.

I guess we'll see in the Fall.

 

[Bobsnotbucks]

AND our 2 best players on D are Scales and Fant - they are both back. Anything else you want me to disprove for you?

Oliver wasn't one of the two best in defense? And Green, because of where he played, was as important as any player on defense last year.

 

[YOTHN]

AND our 2 best players on D are Scales and Fant - they are both back. Anything else you want me to disprove for you?

Oh boy, I am going to guess you're arguing with the newest version of Ord? Ugh. Dude. Block her. It's SOOOO much better.

 

[Bowlmania]

Again, I like breezy optimism, but facts are important, too. And counting on improvement with the satisfaction that IU has been close isn't really a very factual position to take, as is being dismissive of the coaching moves and defensive losses.

It's more than "breezy optimism." There are compelling facts and data (see previous posts in this thread) that suggest IU is poised for improvement (and perhaps significant improvement) this season. You choose to gloss over that, though, because it doesn't fit your negative narrative.

Actually, you don't have a meaningful narrative at all. You prod, provoke, arrogantly disagree and insist on the last word, either because you crave attention or you simply enjoy being a contrarian. You portray yourself as the arbiter of all that is factual, objective and reasonable when, in fact, you are likely the most unreasonable person on this board. Your shtick has become really old and tiresome, as Bobsnot and in previous incarnations.

It is my opinion (and in keeping with your "breezy" theme) that your posts are reflective of a blowhard, exhaling little more than hot air. Or perhaps an overblown bag of wind is a more apt description. In any event, you are going on "ignore." I'm sure I'll see/recognize your posts under a future name, as your writing style (and arrogance) always gives you away. So long.

 

[Bobsnotbucks]

It's more than "breezy optimism." There are compelling facts and data (see previous posts in this thread) that suggest IU is poised for improvement (and perhaps significant improvement) this season. You choose to gloss over that, though, because it doesn't fit your negative narrative.

Actually, you don't have a meaningful narrative at all. You prod, provoke, arrogantly disagree and insist on the last word, either because you crave attention or you simply enjoy being a contrarian. You portray yourself as the arbiter of all that is factual, objective and reasonable when, in fact, you are likely the most unreasonable person on this board. Your shtick has become really old and tiresome, as Bobsnot and in previous incarnations.

It is my opinion (and in keeping with your "breezy" theme) that your posts are reflective of a blowhard, exhaling little more than hot air. Or perhaps an overblown bag of wind is a more apt description. In any event, you are going on "ignore." I'm sure I'll see/recognize your posts under a future name, as your writing style (and arrogance) always gives you away. So long.

Wow. I'm sorry that you took a simple disagreement and made it so personal only because it challenges your sunny optimism with some basic facts. Easy to pass on your posts going forward, and ignoring is probably a good course of action for someone like you. But the Ordfan reference is idiotic, even for someone as content free as you seem to be. Have a nice day.

 

[DANC]

Wow. I'm sorry that you took a simple disagreement and made it so personal only because it challenges your sunny optimism with some basic facts. Easy to pass on your posts going forward, and ignoring is probably a good course of action for someone like you. But the Ordfan reference is idiotic, even for someone as content free as you seem to be. Have a nice day.

Every. Single. Time.

 

[Bobsnotbucks]

Every. Single. Time.

Another good effort from you. I guess it's better than you trying to talk football.

 

[codylance]

You really believe losing Bailey, Camiel, Feeney and Rogers off the O line means "We didn't really lose anyone."?

OK - so in addition to Feeney, we really DID lose a lot more on the OL than I realized....and we DID lose kind of a coaching genius (IMHO) in Frey....

However: we DO return Freshman All American (247sports, ESPN.com, BTN.com) Coy Cronk, who started all 13 games. We return Brandon Knight, who played in the first 8 games (starting 6) before getting injured. Wes Martin started all 13 games at Right Guard as a Soph. Stepaniak (great football name) played in twelve games & started 2 as a R-Fr.Delray Baker played in the final 8 games at RT.....plus a lot of guys who either got a lot of game experience or who redshirted because we had so much experience at OL last year: Love, Nworah, Stover, Smith, Littlejohn, etc.

Not to mention three decent newbies coming in.

Plus I think having more of a DT QB threat to run (either allowing Lagow - who is capable - or whoever wins the job - to run more) will make a HUGE difference...!!! (not talking ARE here, but even 5-7 times a game - or - heck - 3-5 - would open up running/passing a LOT!). Seems as tho Tenn last year & at Ark St. when Hiller & Allen were both there had some success that way.

So even tho I agree we lose a lot on the OL & some key guys on D, I come down on the side that this is NOT a rebuilding year...but we will see...

 

[YOTHN]

OK - so in addition to Feeney, we really DID lose a lot more on the OL than I realized....and we DID lose kind of a coaching genius (IMHO) in Frey....

However: we DO return Freshman All American (247sports, ESPN.com, BTN.com) Coy Cronk, who started all 13 games. We return Brandon Knight, who played in the first 8 games (starting 6) before getting injured. Wes Martin started all 13 games at Right Guard as a Soph. Stepaniak (great football name) played in twelve games & started 2 as a R-Fr.Delray Baker played in the final 8 games at RT.....plus a lot of guys who either got a lot of game experience or who redshirted because we had so much experience at OL last year: Love, Nworah, Stover, Smith, Littlejohn, etc.

Not to mention three decent newbies coming in.

Plus I think having more of a DT QB threat to run (either allowing Lagow - who is capable - or whoever wins the job - to run more) will make a HUGE difference...!!! (not talking ARE here, but even 5-7 times a game - or - heck - 3-5 - would open up running/passing a LOT!). Seems as tho Tenn last year & at Ark St. when Hiller & Allen were both there had some success that way.

So even tho I agree we lose a lot on the OL & some key guys on D, I come down on the side that this is NOT a rebuilding year...but we will see...

Even the thought of it being a rebuilding year seems crazy to me. This is the most veteran team I remember us ever having. ESPN ranking DB's #3 in the big. WR's #2 in the B1G and LB'ers #1 in the B1G. I feel like nationally people are recognizing where we are. I was telling people all year last year that next year would be our coming out party as long as we returned most of our D talent. We did. Our schedule is tough which is why I am not going out on a limb proclaiming that we'll contend for a BCS bowl but next year we will have a team much better than this year. KW's system was brand new to Lagow last year and he was the most important piece of the puzzle. The system isn't going to change vastly as some may think and again, Allen will be slowing the game down. He will want his D getting lots of rest to help cause havoc and win the field position battle. Putting our offense in great positions to be successful and trying to keep the scores low.

People can downplay next year all they want but IU finally has a team that we won't have to say "can" compete but rather will compete.

 

[IUcolorado]

Every. Single. Time.

What a bunch of childish crap. Dude, for the last 20 yrs youve worked harder than anyone to have the last word...every...single...time. Any intelligent debate has been drained from this thread. Worthless...

 

[DANC]

What a bunch of childish crap. Dude, for the last 20 yrs youve worked harder than anyone to have the last word...every...single...time. Any intelligent debate has been drained from this thread. Worthless...

Have not!