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So was it okay for Biden,

OK, fine....I'll bite.

What evidence do you have that government operatives are paying people like Jake Tapper, or people that he reports to, in order to drive a narrative?
I don't have time to look up my sources until later....but I would direct you to Operation Mockingbird and the Church Committee of nefarious activities of government agencies dating back to the '60s and USAID activities in current era manipulation of narratives.
 
I think Jill Abramson's explanation makes sense. Would they have been more inquisitive had Biden's opponent been, say, Mitt Romney? Maybe. All we can do is speculate about that.

Tapper's main theme was that it was known among the Biden staff and Dem politicos, but that no one was willing to talk about it to the press -- even off the record or on background -- until after it was too late
 
It's a step in the right direction for him. But the rubber won't really meet the road until they confront the most important question: "Why?"

I think Jill Abramson's explanation makes sense. Would they have been more inquisitive had Biden's opponent been, say, Mitt Romney? Maybe. All we can do is speculate about that.

But my feeling is that they're more like Fox News (etal) are with Republicans than any of them would ever admit. They're not going to do much, if anything, to hurt their own team or to help the other team.
Have any of the other mainstream media outlets been fined for lying to their viewers?

Bias by omission or on what you choose to report is bad. Lying is far worse
 
Again, I'm fine with any journalist being biased towards a view. They're humans, not automatons. But is it too much to ask that they acknowledge their preferences...so their viewers/readers will have the appropriate filter on their lens?

You know what you're getting with Fox and MSNBC. CNN, ABC, CBS, and NBC should do better.

That said (and I may be mistaken) I don't believe any of those outlets denied that Biden's cognition was waning. If nothing else, they may have downplayed the extent, if in fact they actually knew what that extent was.
 
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What foreign meddling scandal? What investigation?
Your questioning shows us just how out of touch with reality your liberal/anti-Trump news sources have you hoodwinked. Watch Bill O’Reilly’s nightly show for one week. I dare you! It’s time your ostrich head withdrew from the sands of ignorance. You probably think Biden is still sharp as a tack.
 
Your questioning shows us just how out of touch with reality your liberal/anti-Trump news sources have you hoodwinked. Watch Bill O’Reilly’s nightly show for one week. I dare you! It’s time your ostrich head withdrew from the sands of ignorance. You probably think Biden is still sharp as a tack.
Notice how you didn't answer his question.
 
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Your questioning shows us just how out of touch with reality your liberal/anti-Trump news sources have you hoodwinked. Watch Bill O’Reilly’s nightly show for one week. I dare you! It’s time your ostrich head withdrew from the sands of ignorance. You probably think Biden is still sharp as a tack.
Don't do that. How about this? **** you! You want to come on here and be disrespectful, I'll be disrespectful back at you. Just answer the damn questions or move the **** along.

Another **** you for calling me a liberal. I've done battle against the liberals here and on the predecessor boards for 30 years. I don't like Trump but that sure as rain doesn't make me a liberal.
 
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OK, fine....I'll bite.

What evidence do you have that government operatives are paying people like Jake Tapper, or people that he reports to, in order to drive a narrative?
He has none. He claimed DOGE cut Politico and I believe it was CNN off, and they were going under. This didn't happen.
 
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Tapper's main theme was that it was known among the Biden staff and Dem politicos, but that no one was willing to talk about it to the press -- even off the record or on background -- until after it was too late

That strikes me as a really lame defense.

Not that he was one of the worst offenders, mind you. He's taking a lot of the flak, because he had the audacity to co-write a book about it...which kind of suggests that he was just a neutral observer to things other people did or didn't do.

I've always like Jake Tapper, really. I still do. But I'd have more respect for him if he'd go forth and cross the bridge the way that Abramson did. It's not like their faces are going to melt off if they admit that their biases affect their reporting more than they let on.

But I'd guess he won't do that for the same reason Abramson thinks they held back on Biden: they fear a professional backlash.
 
Don't do that. How about this? **** you! You want to come on here and be disrespectful, I'll be disrespectful back at you. Just answer the damn question or move the **** along.

Another **** you for calling me a liberal. I've done battle against the liberals here for and the predecessor boards for 30 years. I don't like Trump but that sure as rain doesn't make me a liberal.
Easy, Tiger, calm down. It’s just a social media message board, not meant to get under your skin, sending blood pressure into a stroke-inducing frenzy.

I didn’t say you were a (gasp) liberal. I accused you of following the one-sided liberal/anti-Trump media sources. If you have to ask what foreign meddling and investigation, you obviously haven’t been following O’Reilly’s unbiased reporting. Last night he didn’t explain the specifics of the foreign meddling or investigation either. It’s because he didn’t have to. Do you still think Trump colluded with Russia, too? The truth of the Biden’s crime family underhanded personal business dealings will all come out. Biden is the second worst US President in history, second only to James Buchanan, Lincoln’s predecessor.
 
No. Most aren’t saying it was “likely,” they’re saying he had cancer, without a doubt, and it was covered up. They do not know that, but they are certain they know it. You can throw in another MAGA trait on display - cruelty. MAGA culture is ugly and corrosive and it needs to be 86’d.
Prostate cancer with mets to the bone…it didn’t happen overnight.
 
Easy, Tiger, calm down. It’s just a social media message board, not meant to get under your skin, sending blood pressure into a stroke-inducing frenzy.

I didn’t say you were a (gasp) liberal. I accused you of following the one-sided liberal/anti-Trump media sources. If you have to ask what foreign meddling and investigation, you obviously haven’t been following O’Reilly’s unbiased reporting. Last night he didn’t explain the specifics of the foreign meddling or investigation either. It’s because he didn’t have to. Do you still think Trump colluded with Russia, too? The truth of the Biden’s crime family underhanded personal business dealings will all come out. Biden is the second worst US President in history, second only to James Buchanan, Lincoln’s predecessor.
That no good jill wanted him to keep going. WORK!!!! now look. Retired a month and dying.

Get ready for her glow up. Who is she gonna go after
 
Easy, Tiger, calm down. It’s just a social media message board, not meant to get under your skin, sending blood pressure into a stroke-inducing frenzy.

I didn’t say you were a (gasp) liberal. I accused you of following the one-sided liberal/anti-Trump media sources. If you have to ask what foreign meddling and investigation, you obviously haven’t been following O’Reilly’s unbiased reporting. Last night he didn’t explain the specifics of the foreign meddling or investigation either. It’s because he didn’t have to. Do you still think Trump colluded with Russia, too? The truth of the Biden’s crime family underhanded personal business dealings will all come out. Biden is the second worst US President in history, second only to James Buchanan, Lincoln’s predecessor.

Ahh, forgot about Buchanan... Thought we had a clear cut winner in Joe...

Now I'll have to go back and brush up on my pre- Civil War history...

I checked... Looks like a split decision... One nearly destroyed the country out of benign neglect, the other intentionally attempted to destroy the country by fast tracking the entry of every international criminal they could find so as to pad the future voting rolls and retain power for the foreseeable future...

I'm giving Joe the edge (or whoever his puppeteer actually was)...
 
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Easy, Tiger, calm down. It’s just a social media message board, not meant to get under your skin, sending blood pressure into a stroke-inducing frenzy.

I didn’t say you were a (gasp) liberal. I accused you of following the one-sided liberal/anti-Trump media sources. If you have to ask what foreign meddling and investigation, you obviously haven’t been following O’Reilly’s unbiased reporting. Last night he didn’t explain the specifics of the foreign meddling or investigation either. It’s because he didn’t have to. Do you still think Trump colluded with Russia, too? The truth of the Biden’s crime family underhanded personal business dealings will all come out. Biden is the second worst US President in history, second only to James Buchanan, Lincoln’s predecessor.
And Jill’s going to have a ton of money to get herself goin.

Hunter
Hi mom. I wanted to ask you
Message not delivered

Mom?
Message not delivered
 
Easy, Tiger, calm down. It’s just a social media message board, not meant to get under your skin, sending blood pressure into a stroke-inducing frenzy.

I didn’t say you were a (gasp) liberal. I accused you of following the one-sided liberal/anti-Trump media sources. If you have to ask what foreign meddling and investigation, you obviously haven’t been following O’Reilly’s unbiased reporting. Last night he didn’t explain the specifics of the foreign meddling or investigation either. It’s because he didn’t have to. Do you still think Trump colluded with Russia, too? The truth of the Biden’s crime family underhanded personal business dealings will all come out. Biden is the second worst US President in history, second only to James Buchanan, Lincoln’s predecessor.
I've lost all patience for disrespectful posts and posters. I'd say sorry, but I'm not. ;) Don't worry, my blood pressure didn't elevate at all.

I used to watch O'Reilly often when he was on Fox. He's entertaining. I don't even know where his show is now, so I don't watch it. So, we're to believe that the foreign meddling and investigation are known only to him? Who was doing the meddling? Who is being investigated? Who's doing the investigation? How could any potential bombshell investigation not be known about? Surely, he gave you some hints at the answers to these obvious questions.

I've never said that Trump was engaged in a conspiracy with Russia to influence the election and that is what Mueller found. I don't know why some of you MAGAs get so fixated on that. The fact is, as found by our intelligence services, Mueller and a Republican led Senate committee investigation, Russia did try to influence the 2016 election in Trump's favor. What is unknown is how successful it was. It's not quantifiable. Russian influence isn't a crime committed by Trump, which should be what you care about. Some Russians were indicted for committing crimes though. That's also not a Trump crime.

We'll see what happens with Biden, but you can't be too confident they're going to find anything really serious given that the House Republicans spent four years investigating Hunter and Joe Biden and never came up with a single crime to refer to the DOJ. However, you can keep hope alive. If they ever find any actual crimes, I've always been for prosecuting the perpetrators. At this point though, it seems unlikely, and Biden should just fade away. Trump supporters probably owe Biden a debt of gratitude for not dropping out before the primaries. Democrats might actually have found a reasonable candidate to face Trump. Stranger things have happened.
 
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That no good jill wanted him to keep going. WORK!!!! now look. Retired a month and dying.

Get ready for her glow up. Who is she gonna go after

Jill, "friends" and family and "insiders" have used ole' Joe as a prop and worked him like a rented mule...

If I had to pick two serious villains in this saga it would be Jill and Ron Klain (his chief of staff)...
 
Prostate cancer with mets to the bone…it didn’t happen overnight.
That's not the point. What is not known is when it was discovered he had cancer. Many doctors are on the record saying it's very possible that it was not detected while he was President and that symptoms may have presented themselves since he left office that led to its discovery. Frankly, I don't care when he developed cancer or when they found out about it because cancer doesn't affect his mental fitness at all. My beef is with those that are certain they know what they can't possibly know at this point.
 
Your
That's not the point. What is not known is when it was discovered he had cancer. Many doctors are on the record saying it's very possible that it was not detected while he was President and that symptoms may have presented themselves since he left office that led to its discovery. Frankly, I don't care when they found out about it because cancer doesn't affect his mental fitness at all. My beef is with those that are certain they know what they can't possibly know at this point.
That's not the point. What is not known is when it was discovered he had cancer. Many doctors are on the record saying it's very possible that it was not detected while he was President and that symptoms may have presented themselves since he left office that led to its discovery. Frankly, I don't care when he developed cancer or when they found out about it because cancer doesn't affect his mental fitness at all. My beef is with those that are certain they know what they can't possibly know at this point.
Your beef should be why was his mental state concealed and who is going down over it
 
Your


Your beef should be why was his mental state concealed and who is going down over it
We can guess the motivation behind that. They wanted Biden to win if he stayed in the race, right? That the President was physically and mentally declining was becoming more obvious and that's not exactly a positive factor for winning an election. If they also thought he was still capable despite the decline I don't think limiting his exposure to more scrutiny was exactly nefarious. If he truly was incapacitated that would be different. However, for us who didn't actually know him or spend any time with him, whether he we think he was incapacitated or not is only an opinion. I don't think he was, I think he was on his way though and would be at some point during the second term. You think he already was. Both of us are entitled to our opinion and to have an opinion on who was more right with that opinion, but that's all they are. I'd suggest reading the Tapper - (don't remember the other author) book to get some more insight. I think it could be a good read.
 
I've lost all patience for disrespectful posts and posters. I'd say sorry, but I'm not. ;) Don't worry, my blood pressure didn't elevate at all.

I used to watch O'Reilly often when he was on Fox. He's entertaining. I don't even know where his show is now, so I don't watch it. So, we're to believe that the foreign meddling and investigation are known only to him? Who was doing the meddling? Who is being investigated? Who's doing the investigation? How could any potential bombshell investigation not be known about? Surely, he gave you some hints at the answers to these obvious questions.

I've never said that Trump was engaged in a conspiracy with Russia to influence the election and that is what Mueller found. I don't know why some of you MAGAs get so fixated on that. The fact is, as found by our intelligence services, Mueller and a Republican led Senate committee investigation, Russia did try to influence the 2016 election in Trump's favor. What is unknown is how successful it was. It's not quantifiable. Russian influence isn't a crime committed by Trump, which should be what you care about. Some Russians were indicted for committing crimes though. That's also not a Trump crime.

We'll see what happens with Biden, but you can't be too confident they're going to find anything really serious given that the House Republicans spent four years investigating Hunter and Joe Biden and never came up with a single crime to refer to the DOJ. However, you can keep hope alive. If they ever find any actual crimes, I've always been for prosecuting the perpetrators. At this point though, it seems unlikely, and Biden should just fade away. Trump supporters probably owe Biden a debt of gratitude for not dropping out before the primaries. Democrats might actually have found a reasonable candidate to face Trump. Stranger things have happened.
Reilly can be found a lot of places since leaving Fox. I watch him on YouTube. He has a weekday night short segment and a 20-30 min long show which starts with his talking points memo feature. That’s often all I watch. He included a question and answer portion with his followers. Have you read his book “Confronting the Presidents”? Bill is a knowledgeable historian who does his homework, or has his people do it for him. He claims to be an independent, but favors more conservative views. He thinks the progressive left has left the Democratic Party in shambles. He expects a long run of Republican power, much like we saw after Reagan. Vance will slide in there greaseless.
 
That's not the point. What is not known is when it was discovered he had cancer. Many doctors are on the record saying it's very possible that it was not detected while he was President and that symptoms may have presented themselves since he left office that led to its discovery. Frankly, I don't care when he developed cancer or when they found out about it because cancer doesn't affect his mental fitness at all. My beef is with those that are certain they know what they can't possibly know at this point.
“Most aren’t saying it was likely, they are saying he had cancer”

If he has prostate cancer with mets to the bone then he had cancer. Also….he was not capable of making important decisions and understanding basic concepts.

It’s not hard…it doesn’t make Trump a better person. It is ok to admit he had cancer and he was cognitively impaired to the point that he could not understand simple things let alone making the decisions for our country.
 
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Reilly can be found a lot of places since leaving Fox. I watch him on YouTube. He has a weekday night short segment and a 20-30 min long show which starts with his talking points memo feature. That’s often all I watch. He included a question and answer portion with his followers. Have you read his book “Confronting the Presidents”? Bill is a knowledgeable historian who does his homework, or has his people do it for him. He claims to be an independent, but favors more conservative views. He thinks the progressive left has left the Democratic Party in shambles. He expects a long run of Republican power, much like we saw after Reagan. Vance will slide in there greaseless.
I have a couple of his "Killing" series books. I've only read the "Killing Lincoln" book and it was a good read, but I don't believe I learned anything I didn't know already. I have read at least a half dozen books on Lincoln. The other one I have is "Killing Patton" and I haven't gotten to that one yet. I watched O'Reilly most during the GWB years and liked the show, but occasionally I'd really disagree with his point of view. And that's OK.

Since I want MAGA purged (not every single policy), I'm not a Vance fan for the next President. I favor one of the very popular Republican Governors for the next President.
 
I've lost all patience for disrespectful posts and posters. I'd say sorry, but I'm not. ;) Don't worry, my blood pressure didn't elevate at all.

I used to watch O'Reilly often when he was on Fox. He's entertaining. I don't even know where his show is now, so I don't watch it. So, we're to believe that the foreign meddling and investigation are known only to him? Who was doing the meddling? Who is being investigated? Who's doing the investigation? How could any potential bombshell investigation not be known about? Surely, he gave you some hints at the answers to these obvious questions.

I've never said that Trump was engaged in a conspiracy with Russia to influence the election and that is what Mueller found. I don't know why some of you MAGAs get so fixated on that. The fact is, as found by our intelligence services, Mueller and a Republican led Senate committee investigation, Russia did try to influence the 2016 election in Trump's favor. What is unknown is how successful it was. It's not quantifiable. Russian influence isn't a crime committed by Trump, which should be what you care about. Some Russians were indicted for committing crimes though. That's also not a Trump crime.

We'll see what happens with Biden, but you can't be too confident they're going to find anything really serious given that the House Republicans spent four years investigating Hunter and Joe Biden and never came up with a single crime to refer to the DOJ. However, you can keep hope alive. If they ever find any actual crimes, I've always been for prosecuting the perpetrators. At this point though, it seems unlikely, and Biden should just fade away. Trump supporters probably owe Biden a debt of gratitude for not dropping out before the primaries. Democrats might actually have found a reasonable candidate to face Trump. Stranger things have happened.
It may be a generation or two before the Annals of Presidential History are set straight regarding Biden’s crimes while in office. It’s too hot of a topic to touch while the people involved are still alive. There are too many other political distractions at the moment.

Information today is overwhelming, coming at too fast of pace to keep up, hence sound bites often taken out of context for the sake of persuasion. We used to accuse Communist Russia of spreading false propaganda to its citizens. Today we’re doing it, too.
 
I have a couple of his "Killing" series books. I've only read the "Killing Lincoln" book and it was a good read, but I don't believe I learned anything I didn't know already. I have read at least a half dozen books on Lincoln. The other one I have is "Killing Patton" and I haven't gotten to that one yet. I watched O'Reilly most during the GWB years and liked the show, but occasionally I'd really disagree with his point of view. And that's OK.

Since I want MAGA purged (not every single policy), I'm not a Vance fan for the next President. I favor one of the very popular Republican Governors for the next President.
Vance isn’t as reserved as he appears next to Trump. He has some fight in him. He comes across well in interviews and debates as a smooth, intelligent thinker, more so than Trump. I’d be surprised if he’s not “next man up.”
 
He claims to be an independent, but favors more conservative views. He thinks the progressive left has left the Democratic Party in shambles. He expects a long run of Republican power, much like we saw after Reagan.

So, four years is a long run?
 
No one is claiming the cancer just happened since he left office. What is questionable is the immediate assumption people are making that he knew he had cancer and still chose to run again.
Aloha said nothing about knew. He said “most aren’t saying it was likely, they are saying he had cancer”….well he had cancer.

I am one of those that thinks once you get to Biden’s age there is no reason to get a psa without symptoms. I see the prostate cancer as “normal” for someone his age. I do find it hard to believe that he wasn’t having symptoms since the report was that it had spread to his bones.

It’s like some are having a hard time saying he was cognitively impaired back in 2019….he was cognitively impaired in 2019. That is the reason he didn’t campaign much at all
 
Aloha said nothing about knew. He said “most aren’t saying it was likely, they are saying he had cancer”….well he had cancer.

I am one of those that thinks once you get to Biden’s age there is no reason to get a psa without symptoms. I see the prostate cancer as “normal” for someone his age. I do find it hard to believe that he wasn’t having symptoms since the report was that it had spread to his bones.

It’s like some are having a hard time saying he was cognitively impaired back in 2019….he was cognitively impaired in 2019. That is the reason he didn’t campaign much at all
You left out the rest of the sentence and I left out a couple words which made the sentence not to be as clear as I thought it was. I was on my phone and busy today. Here’s the entire sentence:

Most aren’t saying it was “likely,” they’re saying he had cancer, without a doubt, and it was covered up.

The certainty I was complaining about was those saying Biden and the WH knew he had cancer and covered it up. My sentence wasn’t clear on that now that I look at it again. We don’t know that Biden and WH knew he had cancer before he left office, but several here say they did, without a doubt, and that they covered it up.
 
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Like most people here, I don't really know enough to be adamant (and I'm leaving the cancer diagnosis aside from that statement).

Who knew what when is relevant and I don't know each in and out. Regardless of when it turned out to be knowable, I agree that Biden would not have been fit to serve in office for another four years. I do think a combination of denial, the reality for the prospects of replacing the incumbent Biden late in the game, and the perceived existential threat posed by Trump are likely and plausible contextual explanations for poor decision-making. And I think the people that pushed forward despite doubts about Biden likely to this day perceive Trump's fitness as a greater concern even than Biden's declining state.
I agree with much of this. Those in the admin who helped in the cover up and attacks on those who were talking about should be shut out of govt and media jobs in the future (I doubt that happens).

Moreover, that explanation doesn't justify the "journalists" who carried the water for Biden, didn't push back or ask tough questions, etc. One of the big problems from the Trump phenomena is that a lot of those people bought into the Trump-is-an-existential-threat argument and it affected their jobs. We all suffer from the loss of trust in these institutions--noble lies should not be encouraged.
 
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Tapper was on Fresh Air (Terri Gross) today. I didn't hear all of it, but did hear him say that the "legacy media" didn't do enough to get past the "cocoon" (my word, not his) that Biden had been placed in starting in 2023. I didn't hear her ask or him volunteer if/that he himself was part of the problem.
Here's some stuff:



Biggest media scandal in US history?

 
We can guess the motivation behind that. They wanted Biden to win if he stayed in the race, right? That the President was physically and mentally declining was becoming more obvious and that's not exactly a positive factor for winning an election. If they also thought he was still capable despite the decline I don't think limiting his exposure to more scrutiny was exactly nefarious. If he truly was incapacitated that would be different. However, for us who didn't actually know him or spend any time with him, whether he we think he was incapacitated or not is only an opinion. I don't think he was, I think he was on his way though and would be at some point during the second term. You think he already was. Both of us are entitled to our opinion and to have an opinion on who was more right with that opinion, but that's all they are. I'd suggest reading the Tapper - (don't remember the other author) book to get some more insight. I think it could be a good read.
Are you disagreeing with the notion that the Biden administration covered up the extent of his mental decline while in office or that many members of the media essentially assisted in that cover up?
 
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