Serious question for Pro Life folks
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I just saw this story and was going to post it too.Well, I guess the Star was right and those doubting the story were wrong.
Arrest made in rape of Ohio girl that led to Indiana abortion drawing international attention
The man was arraigned in Ohio. The case has led to national attention in the abortion debate following the Supreme Court decision on Roe v. Wade.www.dispatch.com
It makes the Ohio AG’s statement about the situation very concerning. I wouldn’t figure a state AG would know about a local jurisdiction investigation, but considering it says the mom made the report on June 22nd, the AG was clearly talking out of school there and playing some really shitty politics.
It’s just terribly sad that this kid is going to be outed now.
I will show your side the respect of referring to it as pro-choice. Please do the same for mine, by not labeling it "forced birth". That is childish, school kid behavior that someone responsible for younger people should not be engaged in.
From what I've seen and as has been stated in this thread, public support for abortion really craters after the first trimester. So you are mischaracterizing the position of many of those you would consider pro-life, and if you want to really split hairs true pro-lifers, don't give a rats ass about 3rd trimester.
Some of my friend's religious values consider "pulling out" to be an act of sexual pleasure while violating God's desire to use the life giving seeds of life for procreation and not pleasure.
Pulling out and other forms of contraception violate God's will.
On our planet there are somethign like 3,000 different Gods who are worshipped. Surely we can find one of them that's OK with pulling out, right?
This is just a ridiculous situation , There shouldn't even be questions from anyone about a situation like this being taken care of and should never have even been let out.
You are arguing that the position of Democrats has not been the status quo of Roe and Casey? If so, then you would be incorrect. Roe and Casey has been the position of Democrats and was the law of the land, and these cases permitted abortion restrictions after viability. Thus, a State could totally outlaw abortion after viability other than if the mother's life or health was at risk.
Criminal enforcement would be required to prevent women from getting abortions early in the pregnancy, and a separate thread addressed enforcement issues. Personally, I wouldn't want to prosecute or be on a jury for a doctor or a young woman who received an abortion early on in the pregnancy, and doctors and young women would not normally be invovled in the criminal justice system. Medical records are private, which is evidence of a right to privacy. Normally, a person's sex life and their genitals are private business, and people have their own system of ethics.
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Where did I mischaracterize? I didn’t comment on that… only gave my thoughts. But the number of women who don’t even know they are pregnant until second trimester is fairly significant.
Among many of those faiths are some tenets which are shared. Don't know if these shared beliefs are man made, or come from a higher power, or what.On our planet there are somethign like 3,000 different Gods who are worshipped. Surely we can find one of them that's OK with pulling out, right?
Do know we tend to emphasize the areas where we disagree rather than acknowledge the shared beliefs along with seeing the worthwhile benefits of beliefs which we just don't happen to share.
Have a neighbor who is a Buddhist. Many of her beliefs are completely new to me. Nevertheless, her faith seems to add up to being a beautiful religion with emphasis on caring for others.
Having said that about Buddhism someone will probably come up with some anti Buddhism examples. We just cannot help ourselves.
I’ve always been drawn to Buddhism and its teachings. Sadly, I place way too much worth on worldly goods to be a good Buddhist.
A house down the road from ours is a mens Buddhist retreat. They all dress in their orange garb. I can't say I have had a lot of conversations with them, but when we pass on the street as I walk my dog, they are always super cheerful and invariably say hello with a smile.
The quotes I hear from the Dali Lama are always uplifting. Maybe because they are refreshingly pro-science. such as... “If scientific analysis were conclusively to demonstrate certain claims in Buddhism to be false, then we must accept the findings of science and abandon those claims.”
The quotes I hear from the Dali Lama are always uplifting. Maybe because they are refreshingly pro-science. such as... “If scientific analysis were conclusively to demonstrate certain claims in Buddhism to be false, then we must accept the findings of science and abandon those claims.”
The compromise is abortion for any reason is OK until about 16 weeks, allowed in the second trimester for health of the mother, fetal death or severe health issues, maybe rape and incest even at this stage, and banned in the third with only exceptions being severe physical health danger to the mother, death of the baby, or severe health issues of the baby.
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Ohio AG was talking out his ass. They have arrested the guy who raped her.It appears Biden told this story with no proof. Today Ohio AG cannot find any evidence this happened. The folks with mops will be out cleaning up for Biden again soon.
If the WH knew this was true why weren’t they actively helping the 10 yearold instead using her for politics?
White House won’t say if Biden’s story about 10-year-old rape victim was verified
The White House has refused to offer proof to support President Biden’s claim that a 10-year-old rape victim was denied an abortion in Ohio and had to travel to Indiana for the procedure.amp.washingtontimes.com
Ohio man charged in rape of 10-year-old that led to Indiana abortion
Caitlin Bernard, an Indianapolis OB-GYN, told IndyStar a 10-year-old came to Indiana for abortion access. A man was charged in Franklin County court.
www.indystar.com
So you don’t believe in any obligation to treating a fetus humanely.
You need remedial biology…
How so, or are you just engaging in name calling? If so, looks like I may have found another zero value poster that would rather call names and attack their "enemies" than debate an issue. The ignore button very well may have found another candidate not worth my time.
During the time somebody is exercising their right to privacy, it is up to them to decide their own moral destiny.
I guess it depends what you mean by humanely. As I said, my concern is with third trimester and possibly after 20 weeks.
The democrats in DC putting up a law that couldn't get enough votes but most democrats did vote for it; abortion including if a child was born and offering no care until death occurred. I don't think it is the position of most democrats across the country, it is for the politicians in DC and the big organizations like PP and other groups for women.
I believe abortion should never be done unless the physical life of the mother is a serious question. I would say that with modern technology they can take the baby at around 20 wks which is 5 months. So the mother doesn't have to carry the child full term. In cases of incest and rape, though tragic is punishing the wrong person. If an adult in the family rapes a child then they should have the full force of the law against them. Also if a person is raped by a non family member then the penalty should be very severe. Yet people want the babies to pay with their lives. What did they do wrong? The Evangelist James Robison was a product of rape. His mother was raped on a date and decided when she was pregnant to go ahead and have the baby. Well James has children and grandchildren. If she had aborted him then look at how many generations of people would not exist? James didn't do anything to deserve death so why kill him? If we are gonna kill somebody then kill the rapist.
No, you would be incorrect. When Democrats vote on abortion restrictions in second and third trimester they overwhelmingly vote against. They celebrated passing an abortion law in New York that allowed abortion for any reason up to 24 weeks and restrictions after that were so loosely defined that it amounted to essentially no restrictions even in the third trimester. The majority of Democrats in Congress aren't going to support, and haven't ever in the past three decades, any total ban on abortion after viability. Some in some states might, but not a lot.
Whenever you define this about a woman's sex life or genitals rather than the life of an unborn child you mischaracterize the motivations of those that oppose abortion. I don't in the first trimester, but I understand abortion opponents.
I hope he spends the rest of his life in prison.Ohio AG was talking out his ass. They have arrested the guy who raped her.
Ohio man charged in rape of 10-year-old that led to Indiana abortion
Caitlin Bernard, an Indianapolis OB-GYN, told IndyStar a 10-year-old came to Indiana for abortion access. A man was charged in Franklin County court.www.indystar.com
I also hope something bad happens to the people playing politics with the 10-year old victim.
Go for it man!!!! No one cares, the best thing would be to just go away as you aren't worth anyone's time. Not sure what crusade and rant you are on but no one cares! Go on a hunger strike , do whatever , just go do it. NO ONE CARES!!!!
There is a silver lining in the abortion kerfuffle, liberals have rediscovered the definition of "woman" and "women."
Did you ever see Democrats try to overrule Roe v. Wade? I have seen Republicans try to do that.
There is a right to privacy and a right to life: I recognize both, and I understand both sides of the argument. I'm in the middle. It sounds like maybe you don't recognize the right to privacy.
A fetus is not part of a woman’s genitals. That’s A trope you’re using to misdirect the discussion from the fetus.
Not really. And just another Republican way to whip up the masses with their silly non-issues.
Of course, they have. The Supreme Court created a law and that's generally a bad thing. It should have happened in Congress or each state. I've made my position clear, and I'd be good with Congress passing a version of that for the nation.
Good deal.Ohio AG was talking out his ass. They have arrested the guy who raped her.
Ohio man charged in rape of 10-year-old that led to Indiana abortion
Caitlin Bernard, an Indianapolis OB-GYN, told IndyStar a 10-year-old came to Indiana for abortion access. A man was charged in Franklin County court.www.indystar.com
“Ohio Man” is an interesting new term for illegal alien.Ohio AG was talking out his ass. They have arrested the guy who raped her.
Ohio man charged in rape of 10-year-old that led to Indiana abortion
Caitlin Bernard, an Indianapolis OB-GYN, told IndyStar a 10-year-old came to Indiana for abortion access. A man was charged in Franklin County court.www.indystar.com
I somewhat agree with all of this, but there are a couple of things to bear in mind (and I could be wrong about this, please correct me if incorrect. Most of the info here is stuff I gleaned from my wife 20 years ago.)
The definition of the time of pregnancy is from a woman's last period. So, the first two weeks are prep for ovulation, then ovulation, and then implantation. A period would normally happen at 4 weeks. Women's cycles can be somewhat erratic though, so most women don't even have an inclination to get a pregnancy test until the 5th or 6th week (and some women even have longer cycles already, cycles can range anywhere from 21 to 40 days, so it is possible that a woman wouldn't even check until the 8th week). It is also possible that a woman can skip a period due to excessive exercise or high stress.
It is also not totally uncommon for women to have "implantation blood", meaning that they have a release of blood from when an ovum connects to the uterus lining. There have been cases where women have believed that implantation blood was just a lighter-than-average period.
False negatives on pregnancy tests are rare, but do happen.
Bottom line, there are several reasons why many women don't even suspect they were pregnant until 10 weeks in. Despite the rhetoric, most women do not discover that they are pregnant and then drive right over to the doctor's office. They usually discuss things with the father, their family, or their friends. It's an incredibly stressful time, especially when it is unplanned and / or if the mother and father have different views on immediate future plans (ie. she may want to abort but the father does not, etc.). From there, while there certainly are same day appointments in various states, it is usually recommended that the women have a consult with their doctor before receiving an abortion, which takes scheduling and time for both the doctor and for the mother (and time off from work if she has a full time job). Or as the situation stands now, if it is going to be a state-to-state issue, planning for travel to a different state.
The whole point to this long-winded post is that 12 weeks is probably on the low side in many cases. The 15 weeks would seem alot more reasonable to me.
We either totally or basically agree.
Judicial interpretation, including interpreting the Constitution, is a big part of a SCOTUS justice's job. It is ok to interpret what liberty is.
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It is inside of a woman's genitals, and genitals tend to be private matters. I don't walk around like Porky Pig or tell somebody what they should do with their sex life or crotch. There are two rights: the right to privacy and the right to life. A big part of conservative politics is freedom from the government and privacy.
If we left everything regarding liberty to be left to the states or congress we’d be living in a country we would not be proud of. Some of the cornerstone SCOTUS rulings were in contravention of duly passed laws.
And you could at least make a plausible argument as to the unconstitutionality of those laws.
There’s nothing plausible about the constitutionality of Roe. It’s complete garbage, crafted out of whole cloth.
Is an abortion a medical procedure? Yes.
Can abortion be performed safely on a pregnant woman in a medical setting?
Are there any other safe medical procedures that are banned? Not that I know of.
Is there such a thing in the Constitution as a right to privacy? Implicitly yes.
Would a ban of a safe medical procedure in any other context be considered a breach of the right to privacy? Yes.
That’s the reasoning. It’s plausible and not illogical. The complaint is the (a) rights of an unborn human, which frankly they have never had rights and (b) the interest of the state in protecting potential life. Roe & Casey understood that.
Beyond all of that, if you want to lay out your substantive due process, equal protection, or otherwise constitutional argument then have at it. Otherwise stay in your lane and don’t make broad pronouncements if you don’t know what you’re talking about.
You can interpret the right to privacy to be part of liberty, even under textualism/strict construction. iPods and motor vehicles were not in the Constitution, but there are certainly constitutional cases that involve them.
