More free money! It pays to be poor.

[UncleMark]

Did my taxes today. Wasn't expecting anything back, since our income is nothing more than our Social Security and my McDonald's level wages for the part time delivery job (and a smidgen of interest and dividends). In fact, my wages are so low that they don't even deduct any Federal Income Tax.

But lo and behold, Uncle Sam is giving me $1500 just for having a shitty part time job, with the Earned Income Tax Credit. Free fvcking money. Paid none in and get a nice chunk back anyway. What a country.

Seriously, something isn't right. Some might recall my consternation last year at getting all my Federal Income Taxes refunded last year. Now they're freaking paying me. Granted, I'm a poor bastard and can't afford to pay attention, but I'm okay and feel like I should have some skin in the game, even if it's a token amount. Last year paying zero bothered me; now I'm getting paid for breathing.

Just had to get that off my chest. Thanks to all, especially @JamieDimonsBalls and @mcmurtry66 . You guys are the best. Keep up the good work.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Did my taxes today. Wasn't expecting anything back, since our income is nothing more than our Social Security and my McDonald's level wages for the part time delivery job (and a smidgen of interest and dividends). In fact, my wages are so low that they don't even deduct any Federal Income Tax.

But lo and behold, Uncle Sam is giving me $1500 just for having a shitty part time job, with the Earned Income Tax Credit. Free fvcking money. Paid none in and get a nice chunk back anyway. What a country.

Seriously, something isn't right. Some might recall my consternation last year at getting all my Federal Income Taxes refunded last year. Now they're freaking paying me. Granted, I'm a poor bastard and can't afford to pay attention, but I'm okay and feel like I should have some skin in the game, even if it's a token amount. Last year paying zero bothered me; now I'm getting paid for breathing.

Just had to get that off my chest. Thanks to all, especially @JamieDimonsBalls and @mcmurtry66 . You guys are the best. Keep up the good work.

Convert it to crypto. Immediately

 

[UncleMark]

Convert it to crypto. Immediately

I'd ask @Baller23Boogie for advice, but we've been arguing about Xavier Johnson and I'm not sure he'd steer me in the right direction or not.

 

[iuwclurker]

Did my taxes today. Wasn't expecting anything back, since our income is nothing more than our Social Security and my McDonald's level wages for the part time delivery job (and a smidgen of interest and dividends). In fact, my wages are so low that they don't even deduct any Federal Income Tax.

But lo and behold, Uncle Sam is giving me $1500 just for having a shitty part time job, with the Earned Income Tax Credit. Free fvcking money. Paid none in and get a nice chunk back anyway. What a country.

Seriously, something isn't right. Some might recall my consternation last year at getting all my Federal Income Taxes refunded last year. Now they're freaking paying me. Granted, I'm a poor bastard and can't afford to pay attention, but I'm okay and feel like I should have some skin in the game, even if it's a token amount. Last year paying zero bothered me; now I'm getting paid for breathing.

Just had to get that off my chest. Thanks to all, especially @JamieDimonsBalls and @mcmurtry66 . You guys are the best. Keep up the good work.

Give it back.

 

[UncleMark]

Give it back.

No.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

Did my taxes today. Wasn't expecting anything back, since our income is nothing more than our Social Security and my McDonald's level wages for the part time delivery job (and a smidgen of interest and dividends). In fact, my wages are so low that they don't even deduct any Federal Income Tax.

But lo and behold, Uncle Sam is giving me $1500 just for having a shitty part time job, with the Earned Income Tax Credit. Free fvcking money. Paid none in and get a nice chunk back anyway. What a country.

Seriously, something isn't right. Some might recall my consternation last year at getting all my Federal Income Taxes refunded last year. Now they're freaking paying me. Granted, I'm a poor bastard and can't afford to pay attention, but I'm okay and feel like I should have some skin in the game, even if it's a token amount. Last year paying zero bothered me; now I'm getting paid for breathing.

Just had to get that off my chest. Thanks to all, especially @JamieDimonsBalls and @mcmurtry66 . You guys are the best. Keep up the good work.

my taxes more than covered enough for you

 

[iuwclurker]

No.

“I’m smart.” - Donald Trump.

Trump doesn’t pay taxes either. You’re in good company. 😉

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Did my taxes today. Wasn't expecting anything back, since our income is nothing more than our Social Security and my McDonald's level wages for the part time delivery job (and a smidgen of interest and dividends). In fact, my wages are so low that they don't even deduct any Federal Income Tax.

But lo and behold, Uncle Sam is giving me $1500 just for having a shitty part time job, with the Earned Income Tax Credit. Free fvcking money. Paid none in and get a nice chunk back anyway. What a country.

Seriously, something isn't right. Some might recall my consternation last year at getting all my Federal Income Taxes refunded last year. Now they're freaking paying me. Granted, I'm a poor bastard and can't afford to pay attention, but I'm okay and feel like I should have some skin in the game, even if it's a token amount. Last year paying zero bothered me; now I'm getting paid for breathing.

Just had to get that off my chest. Thanks to all, especially @JamieDimonsBalls and @mcmurtry66 . You guys are the best. Keep up the good work.

There is something wrong. What's wrong is that the system has you worried that the EITC is somehow giving you something you don't deserve. The total EITC is about 0.3% of the nation's GDP. That's opposed to healthcare, which is about a quarter of the nation's GDP. They give you the EITC to keep you distracted from just how little you have compared to them, and then they make you feel bad about it. They can't afford to keep you healthy, so they give you a tiny little participation trophy instead. With a heavy dose of guilt.

Don't feel bad about it. It's a tiny crumb they've graciously let drop off their table down to you. Take it.

 

[iuwclurker]

They can't afford to keep you healthy,

Wait, what? You think a lack of money for healthcare is keeping people from being healthy?

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Wait, what? You think a lack of money for healthcare is keeping people from being healthy?

Wow, did you miss the point.

 

[iuwclurker]

Wow, did you miss the point.

Not at all. I actually thought it was an excellent post. I cropped out “the point” and focused on this detail, about which I’m curious.

Let me put it this way. Unlike the rest of your post, this detail struck me as hyperbolic or even specious, but I’ll let you convince me otherwise.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Not at all. I actually thought it was an excellent post. I cropped out “the point” and focused on this detail, about which I’m curious.

Let me put it this way. Unlike the rest of your post, this detail struck me as hyperbolic or even specious, but I’ll let you convince me otherwise.

Well, I didn't say the unwillingness of the elite to pay for healthcare was why anyone was unhealthy. That's the kind of thing you can imply if you take things out of context, but it has nothing to do with what I actually wrote.

 

[iuwclurker]

Well, I didn't say the unwillingness of the elite to pay for healthcare was why anyone was unhealthy. That's the kind of thing you can imply if you take things out of context, but it has nothing to do with what I actually wrote.

Whoa nelly. Now you’re changing my wording. I didn’t say anything why people are unhealthy. I was using your wording, keep healthy.

Your wording: “They can't afford to keep you healthy”

I’m not trying to take anything out of context. I’m trying to understand the afford part of afford to keep you healthy. Obamacare exists. People have healthcare if they so choose. Maybe I’m simply misunderstanding what you mean when you say that but I don’t see any truth value in the assertion, they can’t afford to keep you healthy.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Whoa nelly. Now you’re changing my wording. I didn’t say anything why people are unhealthy. I was using your wording, keep healthy.

Your wording: “They can't afford to keep you healthy”

I’m not trying to take anything out of context. I’m trying to understand the afford part of afford to keep you healthy. Obamacare exists. People have healthcare if they so choose. Maybe I’m simply misunderstanding what you mean when you say that but I don’t see any truth value in the assertion, they can’t afford to keep you healthy.

Fine, "keeping people from being healthy." Either way, what you suggested is entirely unrelated to what I actually said, as anyone who takes that half-sentence and puts it in the context of the entire post can see. I'm not sure what you think you're even trying to do here.

 

[iuwclurker]

Fine, "keeping people from being healthy." Either way, what you suggested is entirely unrelated to what I actually said, as anyone who takes that half-sentence and puts it in the context of the entire post can see. I'm not sure what you think you're even trying to do here.

Well I’m surely not trying to make you defensive. I highly admire your ability to construct arguments and articulate yourself. This post was a perfect example.

Ignore everything else I said up till now. Please explain what you mean by they can’t afford to keep you healthy. In the context of your post.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

There is something wrong. What's wrong is that the system has you worried that the EITC is somehow giving you something you don't deserve. The total EITC is about 0.3% of the nation's GDP. That's opposed to healthcare, which is about a quarter of the nation's GDP. They give you the EITC to keep you distracted from just how little you have compared to them, and then they make you feel bad about it. They can't afford to keep you healthy, so they give you a tiny little participation trophy instead. With a heavy dose of guilt.

Don't feel bad about it. It's a tiny crumb they've graciously let drop off their table down to you. Take it.

waste is waste, why does it matter what category it falls into?

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

@TheOriginalHappyGoat if you still have any loans, no need to pay them any longer. Despite the highest GDP and wage growth rate in decades, borrowers don’t have to pay while Dems push for permanent forgiveness.

this is about as pathetic and disgusting as it gets, for a so-called “moderate”. I hope the fall is an even bigger onslaught.

Biden extends payment pause on federal student loans until September

President Joe Biden announced that federal student loan borrowers won't have to resume their payments until at least September.

www.cnbc.com

 

[IU_Hickory]

@TheOriginalHappyGoat if you still have any loans, no need to pay them any longer. Despite the highest GDP and wage growth rate in decades, borrowers don’t have to pay while Dems push for permanent forgiveness.

this is about as pathetic and disgusting as it gets, for a so-called “moderate”. I hope the fall is an ever bigger onslaught.

Biden extends payment pause on federal student loans until September

President Joe Biden announced that federal student loan borrowers won't have to resume their payments until at least September.

www.cnbc.com

So I am guessing you had no issue with the ever increasing costs of higher education and then the high interest rates on loans.

People pay thousands of dollars on their loan and only tread water because of the high rates. Some have paid back more than they originally borrowed without much headway.

Personally I would forgive all of the interest that had been tacked on since the beginning of the loan and have people pay back what they actually borrowed.

 

[Cortez88]

So I am guessing you had no issue with the ever increasing costs of higher education and then the high interest rates on loans.

People pay thousands of dollars on their loan and only tread water because of the high rates. Some have paid back more than they originally borrowed without much headway.

Personally I would forgive all of the interest that had been tacked on since the beginning of the loan and have people pay back what they actually borrowed.

I take no issue with maintaining the 0% interest path. However, total deferment is not the answer and will lead to people kicking the can down the road.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I take no issue with maintaining the 0% interest path. However, total deferment is not the answer and will lead to people kicking the can down the road.

I think the 0% is the path. Forgiveness creates other issues, people should pay back exactly what they received. But if people fall behind, interest can be added in as a penalty.

 

[iuwclurker]

@TheOriginalHappyGoat if you still have any loans, no need to pay them any longer. Despite the highest GDP and wage growth rate in decades, borrowers don’t have to pay while Dems push for permanent forgiveness.

this is about as pathetic and disgusting as it gets, for a so-called “moderate”. I hope the fall is an ever bigger onslaught.

Biden extends payment pause on federal student loans until September

President Joe Biden announced that federal student loan borrowers won't have to resume their payments until at least September.

www.cnbc.com

A new definition of 1%ers?

“Nearly all borrowers eligible for the pause have used it, with just around 1% of them continuing to pay, according to an analysis by higher education expert Mark Kantrowitz.”

Biden’s campaign promise was to forgive $10,000. He is extending the deferment until September. Sounds like the strategy here is to make any official forgiveness shortly before the election.

 

[UncleMark]

There is something wrong. What's wrong is that the system has you worried that the EITC is somehow giving you something you don't deserve.
[...]
Don't feel bad about it. It's a tiny crumb they've graciously let drop off their table down to you. Take it.

It's like finding a $20 bill lying on the ground. I didn't earn it and I don't deserve it and I sure wasn't expecting it... but I'll take it. In fact, I'm going to savor it a bit, since it will never be the same sort of wonderful surprise as it was yesterday. From here on out, I'll be expecting it, planning on it, and justifying it if necessary.

Thanks again to all you makers and creators and all 'round paragons of virtue, especially @JamieDimonsBalls .

 

[mcmurtry66]

It's like finding a $20 bill lying on the ground. I didn't earn it and I don't deserve it and I sure wasn't expecting it... but I'll take it. In fact, I'm going to savor it a bit, since it will never be the same sort of wonderful surprise as it was yesterday. From here on out, I'll be expecting it, planning on it, and justifying it if necessary.

Thanks again to all you makers and creators and all 'round paragons of virtue, especially @JamieDimonsBalls .

I read the other day that some Dem voters are pissed and flipping on the Dems and voting Repub because of the end of Tax Credit checks. Think how F'd up that logic is. The Dems gave them something but through no fault of their own couldn't keep giving it to them and now they're are pissed at the Dems.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

It's like finding a $20 bill lying on the ground. I didn't earn it and I don't deserve it and I sure wasn't expecting it... but I'll take it. In fact, I'm going to savor it a bit, since it will never be the same sort of wonderful surprise as it was yesterday. From here on out, I'll be expecting it, planning on it, and justifying it if necessary.

Thanks again to all you makers and creators and all 'round paragons of virtue, especially @JamieDimonsBalls .

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

I read the other day that some Dem voters are pissed and flipping on the Dems and voting Repub because of the end of Tax Credit checks. Think how F'd up that logic is. The Dems gave them something but through no fault of their own couldn't keep giving it to them and now they're are pissed at the Dems.

I'll believe that when I see it. They're just threatening and whining to get more.

 

[mcmurtry66]

I'll believe that when I see it. They're just threatening and whining to get more.

For sure. But that's certainly a mentality we have. Like when my daughter used to tell me if she didn't get a new LOL she was going to go home and throw every one of her LOLs away. Strange logic ha

 

[CO. Hoosier]

A new definition of 1%ers?

“Nearly all borrowers eligible for the pause have used it, with just around 1% of them continuing to pay, according to an analysis by higher education expert Mark Kantrowitz.”

Biden’s campaign promise was to forgive $10,000. He is extending the deferment until September. Sounds like the strategy here is to make any official forgiveness shortly before the election.

Thanks Obama.

His “healthcare reform” included federalizing students loans. Otherwise POTUS would have no authority over repayment. Part of Obama’s purpose was exactly what we see, using student loans as a political gimmick for votes instead of a meaningful way to finance higher ed. Obama also wanted to glom onto the interest from the student loan business to help pay for healthcare subsidies so he could brag that Obamacare would “pay for itself!” Now if we cut interest to zero, that is yet another failure of Obamacare.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Did my taxes today. Wasn't expecting anything back, since our income is nothing more than our Social Security and my McDonald's level wages for the part time delivery job (and a smidgen of interest and dividends). In fact, my wages are so low that they don't even deduct any Federal Income Tax.

But lo and behold, Uncle Sam is giving me $1500 just for having a shitty part time job, with the Earned Income Tax Credit. Free fvcking money. Paid none in and get a nice chunk back anyway. What a country.

Seriously, something isn't right. Some might recall my consternation last year at getting all my Federal Income Taxes refunded last year. Now they're freaking paying me. Granted, I'm a poor bastard and can't afford to pay attention, but I'm okay and feel like I should have some skin in the game, even if it's a token amount. Last year paying zero bothered me; now I'm getting paid for breathing.

Just had to get that off my chest. Thanks to all, especially @JamieDimonsBalls and @mcmurtry66 . You guys are the best. Keep up the good work.

I got a “recovery rebate credit” on my return. I have no clue WTF that is, but I’ll take it because TurboTax made me keep it. We don’t need it, but you know . . . . Pelosi! The amount was surprisingly high.

I bought some IBonds late last year so I guess that is what you call pissing in your own soup.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Thanks Obama.

His “healthcare reform” included federalizing students loans. Otherwise POTUS would have no authority over repayment. Part of Obama’s purpose was exactly what we see, using student loans as a political gimmick for votes instead of a meaningful way to finance higher ed. Obama also wanted to glom onto the interest from the student loan business to help pay for healthcare subsidies so he could brag that Obamacare would “pay for itself!” Now if we cut interest to zero, that is yet another failure of Obamacare.

All Obamacare has to be is 1) better than what it replaced and 2) better than anything the GOP has passed. The answer to both is an indisputable YES.

 

[UncleMark]

I got a “recovery rebate credit” on my return. I have no clue WTF that is, but I’ll take it because TurboTax made me keep it. We don’t need it, but you know . . . . Pelosi! The amount was surprisingly high.

IIUC, you shouldn't get that unless you did NOT receive a $1400 stimulus check last year.

 

[Ohio Guy]

So I am guessing you had no issue with the ever increasing costs of higher education and then the high interest rates on loans.

People pay thousands of dollars on their loan and only tread water because of the high rates. Some have paid back more than they originally borrowed without much headway.

Personally I would forgive all of the interest that had been tacked on since the beginning of the loan and have people pay back what they actually borrowed.

I'll be honest - the idea of forgiving student loan debt is lost on me. I'm all for fixing the problems you mentioned (skyrocketing cost of higher ed, high loan interest rates), but the idea of just wiping everyone's debt off the collective ledger doesn't make sense to me.

All that to say, I agree with your last sentence. Forgive the interest, have them pay back what they actually borrowed.

 

[IU_Hickory]

All Obamacare has to be is 1) better than what it replaced and 2) better than anything the GOP has passed. The answer to both is an indisputable YES.

They conveniently leave out how much Republicans gutted Obamacare in their attempts to stop it and then later in their attempts to repeal it.

The GOP did everything in their power to get it to fail. Thus, we will never know how good Obamacare could have been if it had been left unhindered. It's better than what we had before Obamacare and we have yet to hear any alternative options from the GOP. Their stance has just been get rid of Obamacare at all costs and nothing more. They wanted to make sure the Dems didn't score a political win with healthcare but if it was a real issue with obamacare then they could have actually had details of what was wrong with it and actually came up with an alternative plan. Still waiting on that alternative plan.

 

[mcmurtry66]

All Obamacare has to be is 1) better than what it replaced and 2) better than anything the GOP has passed. The answer to both is an indisputable YES.

Anecdotal but post Obamacare my premiums skyrocketed. I haven't looked into it but I suspect Obamacare gave rise to a substantial increase in the cost of healthcare coverage. That said I still support it - if only for its coverage of those with pre-existing conditions

 

[CO. Hoosier]

All Obamacare has to be is 1) better than what it replaced and 2) better than anything the GOP has passed. The answer to both is an indisputable YES.

You have weird metrics for “better”. Obamacare has been an abject failure by every important metric.

US outspends on health care but has lower life expectancy

America has the highest suicide rate and the lowest life expectancy of wealthy nations.

thehill.com

 

[mcmurtry66]

You have weird metrics for “better”. Obamacare has been an abject failure by every important metric.

US outspends on health care but has lower life expectancy

America has the highest suicide rate and the lowest life expectancy of wealthy nations.

thehill.com

You can't discount the importance of covering those with pre-existing conditions. It's literally been a lifesaver for so many people, and I don't know that it would have ever gotten done absent Obamacare.

As for aging. Thad Matta on the front cover looks old as hell for 54. Damn

 

[Marvin the Martian]

You have weird metrics for “better”. Obamacare has been an abject failure by every important metric.

US outspends on health care but has lower life expectancy

America has the highest suicide rate and the lowest life expectancy of wealthy nations.

thehill.com

So how much do you want to bet I can find the same "more cost, worse outcomes" from before ACA? How much, name the amount.

More people are covered, more people have access. There are far fewer bankruptcies than before ACA.

Google Image Result for https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2017/05/03/Photos/NS/MW-FL692_person_20170503082903_NS.jpg?uuid=17efccd0-2ffc-11e7-a381-001cc448aede

We could have as good or better system than those countries your article mentions but you steadfastly refuse to allow us to use the systems they use as our base. When I point out other countries do better for less you say we cannot do what they do. That is where we differ, I believe in Americans and I think we are smart enough to figure out how.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

I'll be honest - the idea of forgiving student loan debt is lost on me. I'm all for fixing the problems you mentioned (skyrocketing cost of higher ed, high loan interest rates), but the idea of just wiping everyone's debt off the collective ledger doesn't make sense to me.

All that to say, I agree with your last sentence. Forgive the interest, have them pay back what they actually borrowed.

The skyrocketing cost of education is directly related to the easy money the student loan system provides. When you pump extraordinary amounts of money into an already messed up system, costs will go up.

Higher ed fat cats llive high on the hog because of increasing uncontrolled foreign money and crushing debt foisted in the average American student. The product is pitiful as Yale Law showed all of us a few weeks ago. The same crap is creeping into medicine and many other undergrad disciplines .

 

[CO. Hoosier]

You can't discount the importance of covering those with pre-existing conditions. It's literally been a lifesaver for so many people, and I don't know that it would have ever gotten done absent Obamacare.

As for aging. Thad Matta on the front cover looks old as hell for 54. Damn

First, many already had pre-existing coverage under group plans. Second, state subsidized assigned risk pools would have been better, faster, and cheaper coverage for the others. I don’t think the Obamacare objective was so much to cover pre-existing but to centralize the health care industry in Washington. The grifters and rent-seekers in the system hate decentralized services.

 

[mcmurtry66]

So how much do you want to bet I can find the same "more cost, worse outcomes" from before ACA? How much, name the amount.

More people are covered, more people have access. There are far fewer bankruptcies than before ACA.

Google Image Result for https://ei.marketwatch.com/Multimedia/2017/05/03/Photos/NS/MW-FL692_person_20170503082903_NS.jpg?uuid=17efccd0-2ffc-11e7-a381-001cc448aede

We could have as good or better system than those countries your article mentions but you steadfastly refuse to allow us to use the systems they use as our base. When I point out other countries do better for less you say we cannot do what they do. That is where we differ, I believe in Americans and I think we are smart enough to figure out how.

I'm not sure that's true re bankruptcies. There are numerous studies that indicate otherwise, or at least that the percentage has remained constant. In my only semi informed opinion the endless attention to coverage misses the boat in that it fails to address the COST of medical care. What's more Obamacare may be "universal" but it's not comprehensive. The latter still takes a toll on lower income folks and others who may end up in a 7. Lastly I don't believe we could ever do what many other countries do - for numerous reasons, including the insurance industry, and the income expectations of doctors in the US, on and on

 

[Marvin the Martian]

Anecdotal but post Obamacare my premiums skyrocketed. I haven't looked into it but I suspect Obamacare gave rise to a substantial increase in the cost of healthcare coverage. That said I still support it - if only for its coverage of those with pre-existing conditions

Covering pre-existing is big, and difficult. The debates here as ACA was debated centered around the idea you cannot have a system where someone can call from the back of an ambulance to get their heart attack covered. They need to pay in before, and after.

ACA has problems. The entire system does. IU Health just gave a $4 million plus donation to IU Medicine. IU Health is "not for profit".

The same people who argue drug companies are ripping us off with vaccines refuse to believe the rest of the medical industry is. Single payer would give the people a hell of a lot (alot ) of power in rates for services, medicine, everything. The power would shift from "you will pay what we want because we know you do not want to die (or whatever)".

I had to have a kidney stone blasted in January. The pre-insurance price was $24,000. My OOP with insurance was $5200. I was on the thing for 45 minutes, tops.

Now I could have elected to pass the thing and hope it passes, given it's size there was doubt. But anyone who has had stones knows that is not a good answer. But that amount seems absurd. I could hire both you and CO as attorneys for 45 minutes (barely) for my $5200. That doesn't include the amount my insurance paid.

But any attempt to discuss ways to improve this is totally stymied.