Is it time to extend Coach Wilson's contract? (Long post)

[82hoosier]

IU needs stability and Coach Wilson provides that. But I find it very troubling that the QB situation is the same as last year. I really don't get that. I would have thought getting a star QB recruit or two was the highest priority of the team. Each time Sudfeld drops back to pass this year the season will be on the line.

 

[YOTHN]

IU needs stability and Coach Wilson provides that. But I find it very troubling that the QB situation is the same as last year. I really don't get that. I would have thought getting a star QB recruit or two was the highest priority of the team. Each time Sudfeld drops back to pass this year the season will be on the line.

Austin King out of Georgia was pretty highly touted. He chose IU over some good scholarship offers so I think Wilson did good at getting someone in place to be a step up from where we were last year. Plus Xander had a year under the helm as a starter so we aren't quite in the same spot as we were last year. Outside of landing an absolute stud recruit with an incumbent starter in place, I don't know what else coach really would've done. I know what you're trying to say though.

 

[FL33]

If you don't think Glass is a good AD, fine, but you realize that it's not uncommon for someone with his background to be an AD, right? A lot of ADs aren't former football players from the glory years or whatever. There's more to it than that.

Like who?

Just off the top of my head it seems to me that most of the successful AD's have quite a bit of previous experience, or they were a coach or player at the level they are currently presiding over.

 

[JohnsyRick]

He's not going to get an extension right now. You are beating a dead horse arguing with me to try to prove a point that doesn't exist. Move on!

Not beating a dead horse, simply responding to you talking out both sides of your mouth. I am aware , at this point, that an extension won't be given prior to the season. That doesn't preclude me from having an opinion on what "should" be done and why.

 

[Oxford Collapse]

If IU is serious about building a football program, now might be the time for an extension of coach Wilson's contract. While some fans may thing he belongs on the hot seat, he has moved the program in the right direction and has created a good base for a solid program. Here is why...

IU football legacy- The Hoosiers have been playing football since 1887, over this period of 127 years they have won 2 B10 titles (the most recent a 4 way tie in 1967). They have lost the most games of any BCS school, 651. They have the 9th worst winning percentage of the 128 BCS schools- .419. Their all time record ranks dead last in the B10 at 15th (behind Rutgers, Maryland and the University of Chicago). No coach since WWII has a winning percentage during his tenure at IU. Bill Mallory set the high water mark at .473. Thank goodness most youth don't know or care about history.

IU's recent football history- I will be using 2002 as the basis for this analysis. The Hoosiers have won 19 B10 games over the last 13 seasons (Thank God for Illinois which provided 6 of those 19 wins) . That is an average of 1.46 B10 wins a season. The best total B10 wins in a season were 3 (2006, 2007, and 2013). Here are the coaches and their seasons (I have listed total record, B10 record and B10 teams they defeated).

DiNardo-
2002- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Wisconsin.
2003- 2-10 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2004- 3-8 (1-7) Win over Minn. (and a nice win over Oregon).

Hoeppner-
2005- 4-7 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2006- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Iowa, Mich St. and Illinois

Lynch-
2007- 7-6 (3-5) Wins over Purdue, Iowa, and Minn.
2008- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Northwestern
2009- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Illinois
2010- 5-7 (1-7) Win over Purdue.

Wilson-
2011- 1-11 (0-8)
2012- 4-8 (2-6) Wins over Illinois and Iowa.
2013- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Penn St., Illinois and Purdue.
2014- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Purdue (and a nice win over Mizzou)

Here are the coaches and their recruiting. All rankings and information are from Rivals.

DiNardo-
Year 3 star
2002- B10 rank 14, National rank 82, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2003- B10 rank 11, National rank 59, Star average 2.3, 4 star 0, 3 star 8
2004- B10 rank 13, National rank 87, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Hoeppner-
Year
2005- B10 rank 14, National rank 73, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2006- B10 rank 14, National rank 85, Star average 2.24, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Lynch-
Year
2007- B10 rank 14, National rank 98, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0 , 3 star 5
2008- B10 rank 14, National rank 78, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0, 3 star 5
2009- B10 rank 12 , National rank 59, Star average 2.68, 4 star 0, 3 star 13
2010- B10 rank 14, National rank 93, Star average 2.4, 4 star 0, 3 star 11

Wilson-
Year
2011- B10 rank 12, National rank 60, Star average 2.67 , 4 star 1, 3 star 12
2012- B10 rank 13, National rank 67, Star average 2.7, 4 star 0, 3 star 18
2013- B10 rank 5, National rank 38, Star average 3.0, 4 star 5, 3 star 13
2014- B10 rank 7, National rank 38, Star average 2.77, 4 star 2, 3 star 16
2015- B10 rank 7, National rank 49, Star average 2.8 , 4 star 0, 3 star 18

Wilson and his staff have clearly improved the talent level at Indiana, and recruiting is greatly helped by relationships with high school coaches which his staff has developed over the last five years, especially outside of the state of Indiana and Midwest. To lose him will ruin many of the contacts he has made in the southeast (such as here in Florida where I live).

The Wilson era-
Coach Wilson came to IU as a top offensive coordinator from a winning program (Oklahoma). He had a record of developing talent and winning. He stated that IU needed a winning culture and he has moved it in the right direction. He stated as one of his short term goals to improve the talent level so that there was competition on the team for playing time and starts. He has clearly done this, this will be evident this year on the offensive line, receivers and linebackers. It has also improved the depth at almost every position. That competition has produced better players and play on the field. His tenures high points are:
Great recruiting.
Quality assistant coaches.
Back-to-back wins over Purdue (first time in 20 years).
First ever win over Penn State.
Road win over SEC east champ Mizzou.
Tevin Coleman- 3rd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him)
Cody Latimer- 2nd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him).

The program has clearly shown progress, so why not more wins to date? Three reasons
1. Wilson has stated the Hoosiers will need exceptional QB play to be a winner. In his second year (2012) he lost his starting quarterback for the season during the second game. In his fourth year (2014) he lost his starter in the 6th game with no real replacement. Outside of OSU, no program can take hits like that and win.
2. Defense. He kept a Mallory which was the right thing to do but it did not work out.
3. Last season in addition to the quarterback injuries he was breaking in both a new offensive coordinator (Seth Lettrell was greater of co-equals with Kevin Johns the previous seasons)and defensive coordinator.

Wilson's contract should be extended. He will be able to go to recruits and say "I will be here for your career, I will play you even as a freshman if you compete (look at my track record), all your games will be on TV, you will play in a big time league, and I develop NFL players".

Hoosiers fans will be rewarded in the long run.

Just seeing this original post.

Wilson needs to actually show us something this fall. If we don't make a bowl, I don't know how even the most optimistic of fans can say he's the long term solution on any other basis than just "hope".

 

[S.O.B.1983]

If IU is serious about building a football program, now might be the time for an extension of coach Wilson's contract. While some fans may thing he belongs on the hot seat, he has moved the program in the right direction and has created a good base for a solid program. Here is why...

IU football legacy- The Hoosiers have been playing football since 1887, over this period of 127 years they have won 2 B10 titles (the most recent a 4 way tie in 1967). They have lost the most games of any BCS school, 651. They have the 9th worst winning percentage of the 128 BCS schools- .419. Their all time record ranks dead last in the B10 at 15th (behind Rutgers, Maryland and the University of Chicago). No coach since WWII has a winning percentage during his tenure at IU. Bill Mallory set the high water mark at .473. Thank goodness most youth don't know or care about history.

IU's recent football history- I will be using 2002 as the basis for this analysis. The Hoosiers have won 19 B10 games over the last 13 seasons (Thank God for Illinois which provided 6 of those 19 wins) . That is an average of 1.46 B10 wins a season. The best total B10 wins in a season were 3 (2006, 2007, and 2013). Here are the coaches and their seasons (I have listed total record, B10 record and B10 teams they defeated).

DiNardo-
2002- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Wisconsin.
2003- 2-10 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2004- 3-8 (1-7) Win over Minn. (and a nice win over Oregon).

Hoeppner-
2005- 4-7 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2006- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Iowa, Mich St. and Illinois

Lynch-
2007- 7-6 (3-5) Wins over Purdue, Iowa, and Minn.
2008- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Northwestern
2009- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Illinois
2010- 5-7 (1-7) Win over Purdue.

Wilson-
2011- 1-11 (0-8)
2012- 4-8 (2-6) Wins over Illinois and Iowa.
2013- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Penn St., Illinois and Purdue.
2014- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Purdue (and a nice win over Mizzou)

Here are the coaches and their recruiting. All rankings and information are from Rivals.

DiNardo-
Year 3 star
2002- B10 rank 14, National rank 82, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2003- B10 rank 11, National rank 59, Star average 2.3, 4 star 0, 3 star 8
2004- B10 rank 13, National rank 87, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Hoeppner-
Year
2005- B10 rank 14, National rank 73, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2006- B10 rank 14, National rank 85, Star average 2.24, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Lynch-
Year
2007- B10 rank 14, National rank 98, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0 , 3 star 5
2008- B10 rank 14, National rank 78, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0, 3 star 5
2009- B10 rank 12 , National rank 59, Star average 2.68, 4 star 0, 3 star 13
2010- B10 rank 14, National rank 93, Star average 2.4, 4 star 0, 3 star 11

Wilson-
Year
2011- B10 rank 12, National rank 60, Star average 2.67 , 4 star 1, 3 star 12
2012- B10 rank 13, National rank 67, Star average 2.7, 4 star 0, 3 star 18
2013- B10 rank 5, National rank 38, Star average 3.0, 4 star 5, 3 star 13
2014- B10 rank 7, National rank 38, Star average 2.77, 4 star 2, 3 star 16
2015- B10 rank 7, National rank 49, Star average 2.8 , 4 star 0, 3 star 18

Wilson and his staff have clearly improved the talent level at Indiana, and recruiting is greatly helped by relationships with high school coaches which his staff has developed over the last five years, especially outside of the state of Indiana and Midwest. To lose him will ruin many of the contacts he has made in the southeast (such as here in Florida where I live).

The Wilson era-
Coach Wilson came to IU as a top offensive coordinator from a winning program (Oklahoma). He had a record of developing talent and winning. He stated that IU needed a winning culture and he has moved it in the right direction. He stated as one of his short term goals to improve the talent level so that there was competition on the team for playing time and starts. He has clearly done this, this will be evident this year on the offensive line, receivers and linebackers. It has also improved the depth at almost every position. That competition has produced better players and play on the field. His tenures high points are:
Great recruiting.
Quality assistant coaches.
Back-to-back wins over Purdue (first time in 20 years).
First ever win over Penn State.
Road win over SEC east champ Mizzou.
Tevin Coleman- 3rd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him)
Cody Latimer- 2nd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him).

The program has clearly shown progress, so why not more wins to date? Three reasons
1. Wilson has stated the Hoosiers will need exceptional QB play to be a winner. In his second year (2012) he lost his starting quarterback for the season during the second game. In his fourth year (2014) he lost his starter in the 6th game with no real replacement. Outside of OSU, no program can take hits like that and win.
2. Defense. He kept a Mallory which was the right thing to do but it did not work out.
3. Last season in addition to the quarterback injuries he was breaking in both a new offensive coordinator (Seth Lettrell was greater of co-equals with Kevin Johns the previous seasons)and defensive coordinator.

Wilson's contract should be extended. He will be able to go to recruits and say "I will be here for your career, I will play you even as a freshman if you compete (look at my track record), all your games will be on TV, you will play in a big time league, and I develop NFL players".

Hoosiers fans will be rewarded in the long run.

I like the research and assume it is accurate. I only disagree with one thing. He deserves an extension when he gets to 6 wins this year. At that point, there will be meaning to the extension, momentum for the program and an opportunity to really sell recruits on the fact that the program is headed in the right direction.

 

[kmathum]

Give him this season. If he gets us to bowl, then extend him with a raise. If he doesn't, barring catastrophic injuries, I let him go. This won't be the popular choice here, but he's had his chances. Recruiting instate has really slipped this season. There's a big reason we are going out of state to get our verbals. Pretty soon, out of state kids will not be interested the more we keep losing. At some point you have to win.....period.

that's not a solution, that's a reaction. what do you do once you fire him?

 

[TheSpa]

IU needs stability and Coach Wilson provides that. But I find it very troubling that the QB situation is the same as last year. I really don't get that. I would have thought getting a star QB recruit or two was the highest priority of the team. Each time Sudfeld drops back to pass this year the season will be on the line.

It is a head scratcher that Wilson has been unable to recruit even one highly rated quarterback in his time at IU, and the current quarterback situation isn't much better than this time last year. Hope Sudfeld can remain healthy.

 

[Big Red Crimson Buffalo]

It is a head scratcher that Wilson has been unable to recruit even one highly rated quarterback in his time at IU

In all fairness, Tre Roberson was a good pickup. He was fairly well ranked in the state. Tre leaving killed us. He had Tommy Stevens as the heir apparent but the kid flipped at the end. However, the kid we have now decommitted from NC State.
Wilson has gotten a lot of "bites" but cannot necessarily hold on to them (Keil and Roberson).

 

[welshman#]

Tre Roberson was indeed a good pickup--for Bill Lynch, who recruited him (& Latimer) to IU before he was fired.

 

[crossfire74]

that's not a solution, that's a reaction. what do you do once you fire him?

If Wilson is let go, you find someone else with experience in turning programs around. 5 years is a long time to turn something around and it still not be where it needs to be. If that happened in any business situation, the manager would be fired. Wilson is 14 and 34 heading into this season. While he's turned around some things, eventually, you have to win on the field, as well as off it. Wilson is a likeable rah rah type of guy, so it's easy to like him and get behind him. But he still needs to win, even at Indiana.

I've long clamoured to bring in a guy that has a history of taking downtrodden programs and turning them around. They are out there. IF that were to happen, that would be the profile I'd look into. But with Glass at the helm, I honestly think I'd rather keep CKW than trust Fred to make a good hire.

 

[Orbit7958]

if you're not willing to pay the next guy $3M per year, just go find a D-1AA or D-2 staff with a winning track record.

not only are we cheap, but we waste time on guys trying to build staffs. at least eliminate the staff-build time

 

[kmathum]

If Wilson is let go, you find someone else with experience in turning programs around. 5 years is a long time to turn something around and it still not be where it needs to be. If that happened in any business situation, the manager would be fired. Wilson is 14 and 34 heading into this season. While he's turned around some things, eventually, you have to win on the field, as well as off it. Wilson is a likeable rah rah type of guy, so it's easy to like him and get behind him. But he still needs to win, even at Indiana.

I've long clamoured to bring in a guy that has a history of taking downtrodden programs and turning them around. They are out there. IF that were to happen, that would be the profile I'd look into. But with Glass at the helm, I honestly think I'd rather keep CKW than trust Fred to make a good hire.

with all due respect, i don't think it's that simple

 

[MJE]

If Wilson is let go, you find someone else with experience in turning programs around.

Who has experience turning around a program like Indiana? Other than Snyder at Kansas State or Hayden Fry at Iowa, I can't think of anyone.

I'm as tired as everyone else waiting to see a bowl team, a pretty low standard for most of the 120+ FBS teams. But every year we play Michigan (about a 20 game losing streak), Ohio State (0-20-1 since our last win 27 years ago), Penn State (exactly 1 win in 18 games), and Michigan State who we've had only two wins against in the last two decades.

I don't concede any of those games, and more importantly, the program doesn't. But that's a tough schedule year after year. Next year we go to an extra conference game, as well as having to stop scheduling FCS teams, losing one and possibly two chances for a gimme vs a lower level school, so it's only going to get tougher.

Yes, there have been more blown games than I would like (any number above zero is too many). If we don't blow games in 2013 vs either Navy or Minnesota (or vs Navy and Ball State the year before), Wilson almost certainly would already have his extension.

I'm not for making excuses and if Wilson doesn't get over the hump in a year or two, he should go, but I sense things are still building, not backsliding.

You have to evaluate the time it takes Indiana to build the program in Indiana's context, not in someone else's context.

After inching closer to a bowl in Cam's last year, and in Lynch's last year, I'm not confident that, had they been retained, they would have broken through the following year. But I do know that the program regressed significantly for at least another couple years each time. We've patiently waited (okay, suffered) for two decades to get to where the program currently is, with talent and depth. If we fire Wilson without a really good reason after this year, I'll check back in around the year 2020 to see how things are going with the next guy (or heck, the guy after that).

I think a year (or two) extension gets you more than it costs you.

 

[newIUfan]

I understand the frustration of the lack of a bowl game. But the problem is primarily a "program problem", not a "coaching problem" (it may be coaching but it can't be determined because it is so secondary). It would appear that coach Wilson is developing a solid program that if given time will outperform IU's past results. He has clearly recruited better than past coaches, and he has done very well with developing players. He will need two or three more years to see on field results of these program building efforts.

A helpfull example of the difference between a "coaching problem" and a "program problem" is Univ. of Fl. The Gators have great program ( and I am an FSU grad and Seminole fan). They have won 3 national titles (and played for a 4th) in the last 20 years. They had great teams under Steve Spurrier, six SEC titles in 11 years and one national title. He left and Ron Zook took over. Zook could recruit, but not coach. He had two 5 loss seasons and was gone after 3 years- that was a coaching problem (same when he went to Ill), Meyers took over and they won two national titles in 5 seasons. Will Muschamp took over after Meyers. He was fired because he could not coach (especially offense) or recruit going 4-8 (losing to Ga. Southern at home and Vanderbilt), then 7-5 before he was fired.

Here is IU's coaching hisory since 1958. I have listed the coach- years at IU, total winning percentage and head coaching positions after IU.

1958-64- Phil Dickens- .333, fired and career ended at IU.

1965-72- John Pont- .380, left (or fired) IU and was head coach of Northwestern 1973-77 posting a 12-43 record.

1973-82- Lee Corso- .378, fired, coached one year- 1984 at N. Ill. going 4-6-1.

1983- Sam Wyche- .273. Left IU for long NFL head coaching career.

1984-96 Bill Mallory- .473. Fired and ended his career at IU.

1997-01 Cam Cameron- .327, fired, head coach of Miami Dolphins 2007 going 1-15.

2002-04 Gary DiNardo- .229, fired and ended coaching career.

2005-06 Terry Hoeppner- .391, sad and untimely death.

2007-10- Bill Lynch- .388, fired now head coach for Depauw.

2011-present Kevin Wilson- .278

IU historically has been a dead end coaching job, because there has not been a program in place. The Hoosiers best coach in the last 50+ years posted a losing record. For years IU football has been underfunded and poorly supported. In recent years with B10 network money and a solid commitment by the school, the facilities have been upgraded to match most other Power 5 schools. The school cannot afford to keep firing coaches every 3 or 4 years. The school needs to send a message that they are willing to give a coach a significant time to build a program. This is why they need to extend Wilson's contract now. It will deliver a message to Wilson, recruits, potential assistant coaches and future head coaches that IU football is a program on the rise.

 

[FL33]

I understand the frustration of the lack of a bowl game. But the problem is primarily a "program problem", not a "coaching problem" (it may be coaching but it can't be determined because it is so secondary). It would appear that coach Wilson is developing a solid program that if given time will outperform IU's past results. He has clearly recruited better than past coaches, and he has done very well with developing players. He will need two or three more years to see on field results of these program building efforts.

A helpfull example of the difference between a "coaching problem" and a "program problem" is Univ. of Fl. The Gators have great program ( and I am an FSU grad and Seminole fan). They have won 3 national titles (and played for a 4th) in the last 20 years. They had great teams under Steve Spurrier, six SEC titles in 11 years and one national title. He left and Ron Zook took over. Zook could recruit, but not coach. He had two 5 loss seasons and was gone after 3 years- that was a coaching problem (same when he went to Ill), Meyers took over and they won two national titles in 5 seasons. Will Muschamp took over after Meyers. He was fired because he could not coach (especially offense) or recruit going 4-8 (losing to Ga. Southern at home and Vanderbilt), then 7-5 before he was fired.

Here is IU's coaching hisory since 1958. I have listed the coach- years at IU, total winning percentage and head coaching positions after IU.

1958-64- Phil Dickens- .333, fired and career ended at IU.

1965-72- John Pont- .380, left (or fired) IU and was head coach of Northwestern 1973-77 posting a 12-43 record.

1973-82- Lee Corso- .378, fired, coached one year- 1984 at N. Ill. going 4-6-1.

1983- Sam Wyche- .273. Left IU for long NFL head coaching career.

1984-96 Bill Mallory- .473. Fired and ended his career at IU.

1997-01 Cam Cameron- .327, fired, head coach of Miami Dolphins 2007 going 1-15.

2002-04 Gary DiNardo- .229, fired and ended coaching career.

2005-06 Terry Hoeppner- .391, sad and untimely death.

2007-10- Bill Lynch- .388, fired now head coach for Depauw.

2011-present Kevin Wilson- .278

IU historically has been a dead end coaching job, because there has not been a program in place. The Hoosiers best coach in the last 50+ years posted a losing record. For years IU football has been underfunded and poorly supported. In recent years with B10 network money and a solid commitment by the school, the facilities have been upgraded to match most other Power 5 schools. The school cannot afford to keep firing coaches every 3 or 4 years. The school needs to send a message that they are willing to give a coach a significant time to build a program. This is why they need to extend Wilson's contract now. It will deliver a message to Wilson, recruits, potential assistant coaches and future head coaches that IU football is a program on the rise.

This post makes almost no sense. Your example of Florida proves exactly the opposite of what you are trying to claim.

When Florida has had good coaches they were good. When they have had bad coaches they were poor. Great coaches have made them great. It's easy to look at their list and see the difference.

A program may have an ultimate ceiling due to some factors (e.g. money, recruiting base, etc...), but you can compare the coaches from that school to each other and look at their time away from a certain school. IU will never be UF, but they can be much better with the right coach.

You list IU's coaches. There really isn't a great football coach on that list with the possible exception of Wych, who stayed for only a season. But even on that pedestrian list, Wilson's winning percentage is 3rd to last. Hell, just getting above .400 would put you 2nd on IU's list! Think about that for a second.

Outside of Mallory, I tend to think Hoeppner might be the best on that list, but it is hard to tell with his limited B1G history. Even then, Hep had beat a ranked team and won 3 conference games by his second year. Mallory was in a bowl by his 3rd year, and won 8 games and got IU ranked in the polls by his 4th year.

Even at IU, it really does not take that long to have a modicum of success.

A competent AD should probably already know if Wilson is the right fit, but in any event, they would not need to see anything more after this year.

 

[iueyedoc99]

Tre Roberson was indeed a good pickup--for Bill Lynch, who recruited him (& Latimer) to IU before he was fired.

Correct on Tre, but I believe Cody was a last second signing, as Shane was.

 

[TheSpa]

If Wilson is let go, you find someone else with experience in turning programs around. 5 years is a long time to turn something around and it still not be where it needs to be. If that happened in any business situation, the manager would be fired. Wilson is 14 and 34 heading into this season. While he's turned around some things, eventually, you have to win on the field, as well as off it. Wilson is a likeable rah rah type of guy, so it's easy to like him and get behind him. But he still needs to win, even at Indiana.

I've long clamoured to bring in a guy that has a history of taking downtrodden programs and turning them around. They are out there. IF that were to happen, that would be the profile I'd look into. But with Glass at the helm, I honestly think I'd rather keep CKW than trust Fred to make a good hire.

Yet you're not even able to offer one single name. Not one.

 

[WisslerIII]

not related. just a long suffering iu fan who believes we're finally beginning to turn the corner. don't wimp out now.

It won't make one whit of difference for recruiting whether he signs and extension now or after the Bucket game.

Accepting mediocrity is truly wimping out.

 

[Hoosiers Rising]

Established, winning programs can look at win/loss and make decisions on coaching changes. IU has been neither of those. What we have to look at is are we building towards that. If a few things had broke our way I think the win/loss would reflect that we are building. Yes, Wilson and his staff have to better in a few areas. End of game decision making, and not being caught as we were last year with a unit made up almost entirely of freshman. (WR). I think Sud getting hurt was a direct result of that. Tre and Cody leaving hurt us and we weren't ready for that at all. I don't think it makes much difference if Wilson is extended now or after the season but I think it should happen unless something catastrophic happens.

 

[Cougar1]

Not yet, let's see if we have any more arrests..........Green is still with program??????

 

[BayernFan]

yes (short post)

 

[Euro]

Brady Hoke is available, turned around BSU and SDSU, and of course the argument will be he failed at Michigan but so did Rich Rod to a much bigger degree and now he is thriving at Arizona

 

[Orbit7958]

yes (short post)

tl; dr

 

[Big Red Crimson Buffalo]

IU did not turn any focus to football until the Hep era. Before that, it was woeful and the administration was dumb not capitalizing on Mallory's bowl runs with heavy facility investment for football.

 

[kmathum]

Brady Hoke is available, turned around BSU and SDSU, and of course the argument will be he failed at Michigan but so did Rich Rod to a much bigger degree and now he is thriving at Arizona

if you can't win at michigan, how the hell do you win at iu?

 

[Euro]

Not calling for Kevin ouster just giving an awfully good experienced option what is out there if it happens, hoke beat us at BSU and turned around as big a loser as us at sdsu. Has been national coach of year twice. Knows how to coach defense, that wasn't his problem at Mich, he had an awful OL that couldn't protect QB. Knows how to recruit.

 

[toastedbread]

This post makes almost no sense. Your example of Florida proves exactly the opposite of what you are trying to claim.

When Florida has had good coaches they were good. When they have had bad coaches they were poor. Great coaches have made them great. It's easy to look at their list and see the difference.

A program may have an ultimate ceiling due to some factors (e.g. money, recruiting base, etc...), but you can compare the coaches from that school to each other and look at their time away from a certain school. IU will never be UF, but they can be much better with the right coach.

You list IU's coaches. There really isn't a great football coach on that list with the possible exception of Wych, who stayed for only a season. But even on that pedestrian list, Wilson's winning percentage is 3rd to last. Hell, just getting above .400 would put you 2nd on IU's list! Think about that for a second.

Outside of Mallory, I tend to think Hoeppner might be the best on that list, but it is hard to tell with his limited B1G history. Even then, Hep had beat a ranked team and won 3 conference games by his second year. Mallory was in a bowl by his 3rd year, and won 8 games and got IU ranked in the polls by his 4th year.

Even at IU, it really does not take that long to have a modicum of success.

A competent AD should probably already know if Wilson is the right fit, but in any event, they would not need to see anything more after this year.

This is 100% correct. Talented people in any field show their talent quickly.

 

[kmathum]

Not calling for Kevin ouster just giving an awfully good experienced option what is out there if it happens, hoke beat us at BSU and turned around as big a loser as us at sdsu. Has been national coach of year twice. Knows how to coach defense, that wasn't his problem at Mich, he had an awful OL that couldn't protect QB. Knows how to recruit.

didn't we score something like 50 points on him a couple of years ago?

 

[Euro]

My opinion on Hoke as an overall coach, gave my reasons.

 

[crossfire74]

if you can't win at michigan, how the hell do you win at iu?

if you can't win at michigan, how the hell do you win at iu?

its not rocket science to figure out that there's very little comparision between Michigan and IU in football. I'd kill to have the success Hoke had there and so would 99% of this board.

 

[Euro]

Not getting into a pissing contest with you, its my opinion, he'd be an excellent choice if Kevin fails which I hope he won't. Out!

 

[goody1986]

If IU is serious about building a football program, now might be the time for an extension of coach Wilson's contract. While some fans may thing he belongs on the hot seat, he has moved the program in the right direction and has created a good base for a solid program. Here is why...

IU football legacy- The Hoosiers have been playing football since 1887, over this period of 127 years they have won 2 B10 titles (the most recent a 4 way tie in 1967). They have lost the most games of any BCS school, 651. They have the 9th worst winning percentage of the 128 BCS schools- .419. Their all time record ranks dead last in the B10 at 15th (behind Rutgers, Maryland and the University of Chicago). No coach since WWII has a winning percentage during his tenure at IU. Bill Mallory set the high water mark at .473. Thank goodness most youth don't know or care about history.

IU's recent football history- I will be using 2002 as the basis for this analysis. The Hoosiers have won 19 B10 games over the last 13 seasons (Thank God for Illinois which provided 6 of those 19 wins) . That is an average of 1.46 B10 wins a season. The best total B10 wins in a season were 3 (2006, 2007, and 2013). Here are the coaches and their seasons (I have listed total record, B10 record and B10 teams they defeated).

DiNardo-
2002- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Wisconsin.
2003- 2-10 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2004- 3-8 (1-7) Win over Minn. (and a nice win over Oregon).

Hoeppner-
2005- 4-7 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2006- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Iowa, Mich St. and Illinois

Lynch-
2007- 7-6 (3-5) Wins over Purdue, Iowa, and Minn.
2008- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Northwestern
2009- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Illinois
2010- 5-7 (1-7) Win over Purdue.

Wilson-
2011- 1-11 (0-8)
2012- 4-8 (2-6) Wins over Illinois and Iowa.
2013- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Penn St., Illinois and Purdue.
2014- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Purdue (and a nice win over Mizzou)

Here are the coaches and their recruiting. All rankings and information are from Rivals.

DiNardo-
Year 3 star
2002- B10 rank 14, National rank 82, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2003- B10 rank 11, National rank 59, Star average 2.3, 4 star 0, 3 star 8
2004- B10 rank 13, National rank 87, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Hoeppner-
Year
2005- B10 rank 14, National rank 73, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2006- B10 rank 14, National rank 85, Star average 2.24, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Lynch-
Year
2007- B10 rank 14, National rank 98, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0 , 3 star 5
2008- B10 rank 14, National rank 78, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0, 3 star 5
2009- B10 rank 12 , National rank 59, Star average 2.68, 4 star 0, 3 star 13
2010- B10 rank 14, National rank 93, Star average 2.4, 4 star 0, 3 star 11

Wilson-
Year
2011- B10 rank 12, National rank 60, Star average 2.67 , 4 star 1, 3 star 12
2012- B10 rank 13, National rank 67, Star average 2.7, 4 star 0, 3 star 18
2013- B10 rank 5, National rank 38, Star average 3.0, 4 star 5, 3 star 13
2014- B10 rank 7, National rank 38, Star average 2.77, 4 star 2, 3 star 16
2015- B10 rank 7, National rank 49, Star average 2.8 , 4 star 0, 3 star 18

Wilson and his staff have clearly improved the talent level at Indiana, and recruiting is greatly helped by relationships with high school coaches which his staff has developed over the last five years, especially outside of the state of Indiana and Midwest. To lose him will ruin many of the contacts he has made in the southeast (such as here in Florida where I live).

The Wilson era-
Coach Wilson came to IU as a top offensive coordinator from a winning program (Oklahoma). He had a record of developing talent and winning. He stated that IU needed a winning culture and he has moved it in the right direction. He stated as one of his short term goals to improve the talent level so that there was competition on the team for playing time and starts. He has clearly done this, this will be evident this year on the offensive line, receivers and linebackers. It has also improved the depth at almost every position. That competition has produced better players and play on the field. His tenures high points are:
Great recruiting.
Quality assistant coaches.
Back-to-back wins over Purdue (first time in 20 years).
First ever win over Penn State.
Road win over SEC east champ Mizzou.
Tevin Coleman- 3rd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him)
Cody Latimer- 2nd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him).

The program has clearly shown progress, so why not more wins to date? Three reasons
1. Wilson has stated the Hoosiers will need exceptional QB play to be a winner. In his second year (2012) he lost his starting quarterback for the season during the second game. In his fourth year (2014) he lost his starter in the 6th game with no real replacement. Outside of OSU, no program can take hits like that and win.
2. Defense. He kept a Mallory which was the right thing to do but it did not work out.
3. Last season in addition to the quarterback injuries he was breaking in both a new offensive coordinator (Seth Lettrell was greater of co-equals with Kevin Johns the previous seasons)and defensive coordinator.

Wilson's contract should be extended. He will be able to go to recruits and say "I will be here for your career, I will play you even as a freshman if you compete (look at my track record), all your games will be on TV, you will play in a big time league, and I develop NFL players".

Hoosiers fans will be rewarded in the long run.

All that text and the simple answer is no. No benefit to locking a coach in for more money and more years just before a new season. Get through the season and then decide. Another 5-7 year and no - I wouldn't extend. A bit better and it should be considered.

 

[Walt542]

What's the rush, Mrs. Wilson?

Here is the problem Mr. Glass faces. If he does not extend him now and something odd happens again (typical IU football luck) and he only wins 5 games do you extend him? I think it would set the program back another ten years to let him go, but many people would have a fit if he were extended in that circumstance. Give it to him now and let's ride this horse out.

 

[Sope Creek]

What's the rush, Mrs. Wilson?

What's your agenda?

Seems to me you lack decent judgment about what the status and trend of IU's program is. Otherwise, your negativity here is only fodder for those who want IU's program to fail. Meh.

I think we should extend Wilson now, when he's still doing good things in building the program's talent base and before he shows a breakout season. That way we can hedge the salary requirements to meet the status and trend of the program rather than overpay for a one year of unusual success, at least until that success is sustained.

 

[Sope Creek]

All that text and the simple answer is no. No benefit to locking a coach in for more money and more years just before a new season. Get through the season and then decide. Another 5-7 year and no - I wouldn't extend. A bit better and it should be considered.

Enhh . . . that's just following the crowd. Leadership requires seeing the results that are going to happen in the way the program is being built. You pay for the building process as it's being done . . . and reward the success that it brings after that success is sustained, not first achieved.

iunewfan's post is stellar, and clearly demonstrates how Wilson is different; he's building a program for long-term sustainability at a higher level than IU has had with any coach since Mal. That's something that deserves an extended contract.

 

[HOOSIER JOE]

Here is the problem Mr. Glass faces. If he does not extend him now and something odd happens again (typical IU football luck) and he only wins 5 games do you extend him? I think it would set the program back another ten years to let him go, but many people would have a fit if he were extended in that circumstance. Give it to him now and let's ride this horse out.

I would not trust Fred Glass when it comes to giving coaching contract extensions. Look at what a travesty that he put together for Tom Crean....

Patiently wait 3 plus months to see how things have progressed in the program. What's the rush?

 

[indyclark]

I would not trust Fred Glass when it comes to giving coaching contract extensions. Look at what a travesty that he put together for Tom Crean....

Patiently wait 3 plus months to see how things have progressed in the program. What's the rush?

recruiting

 

[IUGoldWing]

If IU is serious about building a football program, now might be the time for an extension of coach Wilson's contract. While some fans may thing he belongs on the hot seat, he has moved the program in the right direction and has created a good base for a solid program. Here is why...

IU football legacy- The Hoosiers have been playing football since 1887, over this period of 127 years they have won 2 B10 titles (the most recent a 4 way tie in 1967). They have lost the most games of any BCS school, 651. They have the 9th worst winning percentage of the 128 BCS schools- .419. Their all time record ranks dead last in the B10 at 15th (behind Rutgers, Maryland and the University of Chicago). No coach since WWII has a winning percentage during his tenure at IU. Bill Mallory set the high water mark at .473. Thank goodness most youth don't know or care about history.

IU's recent football history- I will be using 2002 as the basis for this analysis. The Hoosiers have won 19 B10 games over the last 13 seasons (Thank God for Illinois which provided 6 of those 19 wins) . That is an average of 1.46 B10 wins a season. The best total B10 wins in a season were 3 (2006, 2007, and 2013). Here are the coaches and their seasons (I have listed total record, B10 record and B10 teams they defeated).

DiNardo-
2002- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Wisconsin.
2003- 2-10 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2004- 3-8 (1-7) Win over Minn. (and a nice win over Oregon).

Hoeppner-
2005- 4-7 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2006- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Iowa, Mich St. and Illinois

Lynch-
2007- 7-6 (3-5) Wins over Purdue, Iowa, and Minn.
2008- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Northwestern
2009- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Illinois
2010- 5-7 (1-7) Win over Purdue.

Wilson-
2011- 1-11 (0-8)
2012- 4-8 (2-6) Wins over Illinois and Iowa.
2013- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Penn St., Illinois and Purdue.
2014- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Purdue (and a nice win over Mizzou)

Here are the coaches and their recruiting. All rankings and information are from Rivals.

DiNardo-
Year 3 star
2002- B10 rank 14, National rank 82, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2003- B10 rank 11, National rank 59, Star average 2.3, 4 star 0, 3 star 8
2004- B10 rank 13, National rank 87, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Hoeppner-
Year
2005- B10 rank 14, National rank 73, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2006- B10 rank 14, National rank 85, Star average 2.24, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Lynch-
Year
2007- B10 rank 14, National rank 98, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0 , 3 star 5
2008- B10 rank 14, National rank 78, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0, 3 star 5
2009- B10 rank 12 , National rank 59, Star average 2.68, 4 star 0, 3 star 13
2010- B10 rank 14, National rank 93, Star average 2.4, 4 star 0, 3 star 11

Wilson-
Year
2011- B10 rank 12, National rank 60, Star average 2.67 , 4 star 1, 3 star 12
2012- B10 rank 13, National rank 67, Star average 2.7, 4 star 0, 3 star 18
2013- B10 rank 5, National rank 38, Star average 3.0, 4 star 5, 3 star 13
2014- B10 rank 7, National rank 38, Star average 2.77, 4 star 2, 3 star 16
2015- B10 rank 7, National rank 49, Star average 2.8 , 4 star 0, 3 star 18

Wilson and his staff have clearly improved the talent level at Indiana, and recruiting is greatly helped by relationships with high school coaches which his staff has developed over the last five years, especially outside of the state of Indiana and Midwest. To lose him will ruin many of the contacts he has made in the southeast (such as here in Florida where I live).

The Wilson era-
Coach Wilson came to IU as a top offensive coordinator from a winning program (Oklahoma). He had a record of developing talent and winning. He stated that IU needed a winning culture and he has moved it in the right direction. He stated as one of his short term goals to improve the talent level so that there was competition on the team for playing time and starts. He has clearly done this, this will be evident this year on the offensive line, receivers and linebackers. It has also improved the depth at almost every position. That competition has produced better players and play on the field. His tenures high points are:
Great recruiting.
Quality assistant coaches.
Back-to-back wins over Purdue (first time in 20 years).
First ever win over Penn State.
Road win over SEC east champ Mizzou.
Tevin Coleman- 3rd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him)
Cody Latimer- 2nd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him).

The program has clearly shown progress, so why not more wins to date? Three reasons
1. Wilson has stated the Hoosiers will need exceptional QB play to be a winner. In his second year (2012) he lost his starting quarterback for the season during the second game. In his fourth year (2014) he lost his starter in the 6th game with no real replacement. Outside of OSU, no program can take hits like that and win.
2. Defense. He kept a Mallory which was the right thing to do but it did not work out.
3. Last season in addition to the quarterback injuries he was breaking in both a new offensive coordinator (Seth Lettrell was greater of co-equals with Kevin Johns the previous seasons)and defensive coordinator.

Wilson's contract should be extended. He will be able to go to recruits and say "I will be here for your career, I will play you even as a freshman if you compete (look at my track record), all your games will be on TV, you will play in a big time league, and I develop NFL players".

Hoosiers fans will be rewarded in the long run.

If IU is serious about building a football program, now might be the time for an extension of coach Wilson's contract. While some fans may thing he belongs on the hot seat, he has moved the program in the right direction and has created a good base for a solid program. Here is why...

IU football legacy- The Hoosiers have been playing football since 1887, over this period of 127 years they have won 2 B10 titles (the most recent a 4 way tie in 1967). They have lost the most games of any BCS school, 651. They have the 9th worst winning percentage of the 128 BCS schools- .419. Their all time record ranks dead last in the B10 at 15th (behind Rutgers, Maryland and the University of Chicago). No coach since WWII has a winning percentage during his tenure at IU. Bill Mallory set the high water mark at .473. Thank goodness most youth don't know or care about history.

IU's recent football history- I will be using 2002 as the basis for this analysis. The Hoosiers have won 19 B10 games over the last 13 seasons (Thank God for Illinois which provided 6 of those 19 wins) . That is an average of 1.46 B10 wins a season. The best total B10 wins in a season were 3 (2006, 2007, and 2013). Here are the coaches and their seasons (I have listed total record, B10 record and B10 teams they defeated).

DiNardo-
2002- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Wisconsin.
2003- 2-10 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2004- 3-8 (1-7) Win over Minn. (and a nice win over Oregon).

Hoeppner-
2005- 4-7 (1-7) Win over Illinois.
2006- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Iowa, Mich St. and Illinois

Lynch-
2007- 7-6 (3-5) Wins over Purdue, Iowa, and Minn.
2008- 3-9 (1-7) Win over Northwestern
2009- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Illinois
2010- 5-7 (1-7) Win over Purdue.

Wilson-
2011- 1-11 (0-8)
2012- 4-8 (2-6) Wins over Illinois and Iowa.
2013- 5-7 (3-5) Wins over Penn St., Illinois and Purdue.
2014- 4-8 (1-7) Win over Purdue (and a nice win over Mizzou)

Here are the coaches and their recruiting. All rankings and information are from Rivals.

DiNardo-
Year 3 star
2002- B10 rank 14, National rank 82, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2003- B10 rank 11, National rank 59, Star average 2.3, 4 star 0, 3 star 8
2004- B10 rank 13, National rank 87, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Hoeppner-
Year
2005- B10 rank 14, National rank 73, Star average 2.1, 4 star 0, 3 star 3
2006- B10 rank 14, National rank 85, Star average 2.24, 4 star 0, 3 star 5

Lynch-
Year
2007- B10 rank 14, National rank 98, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0 , 3 star 5
2008- B10 rank 14, National rank 78, Star average 2.15, 4 star 0, 3 star 5
2009- B10 rank 12 , National rank 59, Star average 2.68, 4 star 0, 3 star 13
2010- B10 rank 14, National rank 93, Star average 2.4, 4 star 0, 3 star 11

Wilson-
Year
2011- B10 rank 12, National rank 60, Star average 2.67 , 4 star 1, 3 star 12
2012- B10 rank 13, National rank 67, Star average 2.7, 4 star 0, 3 star 18
2013- B10 rank 5, National rank 38, Star average 3.0, 4 star 5, 3 star 13
2014- B10 rank 7, National rank 38, Star average 2.77, 4 star 2, 3 star 16
2015- B10 rank 7, National rank 49, Star average 2.8 , 4 star 0, 3 star 18

Wilson and his staff have clearly improved the talent level at Indiana, and recruiting is greatly helped by relationships with high school coaches which his staff has developed over the last five years, especially outside of the state of Indiana and Midwest. To lose him will ruin many of the contacts he has made in the southeast (such as here in Florida where I live).

The Wilson era-
Coach Wilson came to IU as a top offensive coordinator from a winning program (Oklahoma). He had a record of developing talent and winning. He stated that IU needed a winning culture and he has moved it in the right direction. He stated as one of his short term goals to improve the talent level so that there was competition on the team for playing time and starts. He has clearly done this, this will be evident this year on the offensive line, receivers and linebackers. It has also improved the depth at almost every position. That competition has produced better players and play on the field. His tenures high points are:
Great recruiting.
Quality assistant coaches.
Back-to-back wins over Purdue (first time in 20 years).
First ever win over Penn State.
Road win over SEC east champ Mizzou.
Tevin Coleman- 3rd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him)
Cody Latimer- 2nd round NFL pick (he recruited and developed him).

The program has clearly shown progress, so why not more wins to date? Three reasons
1. Wilson has stated the Hoosiers will need exceptional QB play to be a winner. In his second year (2012) he lost his starting quarterback for the season during the second game. In his fourth year (2014) he lost his starter in the 6th game with no real replacement. Outside of OSU, no program can take hits like that and win.
2. Defense. He kept a Mallory which was the right thing to do but it did not work out.
3. Last season in addition to the quarterback injuries he was breaking in both a new offensive coordinator (Seth Lettrell was greater of co-equals with Kevin Johns the previous seasons)and defensive coordinator.

Wilson's contract should be extended. He will be able to go to recruits and say "I will be here for your career, I will play you even as a freshman if you compete (look at my track record), all your games will be on TV, you will play in a big time league, and I develop NFL players".

Hoosiers fans will be rewarded in the long run.

No way we could better ourselves. Give him a LOOONG contract and let him build the program without negative speculation.

 

[RBB89]

didn't we score something like 50 points on him a couple of years ago?

No we haven't beaten BSU since like 2007.