ADVERTISEMENT

Indiana backing up

Around the nation, it appears to be the ER/ICU system that is straining the most. That even though those numbers are down a little from the spring. But in the spring it was confined to fewer states so reserves could be sent to them. Today, the reserves are deployed everywhere so we get ER doctors begging for help https://www.khq.com/lifestyles/heal...cle_f1f4d1e1-a627-5c54-a31f-a29396a2d9f1.html

Basketball season is about to start, I don't want a shutdown at all. But if the carrot of voluntarily wearing masks and social distancing continues to fail, the government will need to come up with sticks.
agreed. i don't understand why it's voluntary. ridiculous. we have fantastic mask compliance in my county, and it's mandatory, and cases are still going up like crazy. no mask mandate is stupid.

yeah as for the remainder of your post that stuff gets tricky on several fronts. only so many docs/nurses trained to render that care and the hovering potential for med neg.
 
and it's apples to oranges. number of ventilators etc. number of doctors/nurses trained for that kind of care

I was talking about cancelling elective surgeries. That would really hurt the hospitals. Just like it did in the spring.
 
Virtual learning might be in a lot of kids’ wheelhouse if it’s engaging. Years ago one of the “dumbest” kids in my son’s class had every detail of every pokemon card down pat. It was phenomenal.

Nonsense. Virtual "learning " is a total joke, but particularly for elementary school. Again, the county has now shut down our school when we've had basically zero infections. And going to send my kid home for at least 2 months. It's all a total joke.. and isn't going to do shit to contain a virus being spread by careless adults.
 
Nonsense. Virtual "learning " is a total joke, but particularly for elementary school. Again, the county has now shut down our school when we've had basically zero infections. And going to send my kid home for at least 2 months. It's all a total joke.. and isn't going to do shit to contain a virus being spread by careless adults.
So home schooling is a total joke too?

I’m not commenting the viral aspect and decision.
 
Nonsense. Virtual "learning " is a total joke, but particularly for elementary school. Again, the county has now shut down our school when we've had basically zero infections. And going to send my kid home for at least 2 months. It's all a total joke.. and isn't going to do shit to contain a virus being spread by careless adults.

While I empathize with your plight, I'd respectfully disagree that it wouldn't do shit to contain a virus being spread by careless adults. Careless adults carelessly spread the virus to everyone, including their and other people's kids, who unfortunately spread it to other people's kids in some in-person elementary school settings. Then those kids spread it to other adults, who many not even be careless adults, and the vicious cycle continues.

A lot of colleges were trying to do a semester/finals break by Thanksgiving in anticipation of this time. I just hope that we are able to figure out how to get kids back to school in the new year. If people can figure out how to stop being selfish, we have a shot. If everyone adopts a Len stance, we don't.
 
While I empathize with your plight, I'd respectfully disagree that it wouldn't do shit to contain a virus being spread by careless adults. Careless adults carelessly spread the virus to everyone, including their and other people's kids, who unfortunately spread it to other people's kids in some in-person elementary school settings. Then those kids spread it to other adults, who many not even be careless adults, and the vicious cycle continues.

A lot of colleges were trying to do a semester/finals break by Thanksgiving in anticipation of this time. I just hope that we are able to figure out how to get kids back to school in the new year. If people can figure out how to stop being selfish, we have a shot. If everyone adopts a Len stance, we don't.
The pandemic is the perfect example of left and right actually wanting the exact same outcome but arguing because political actors on one side create a false narrative about what the other side wants.

We all want a normal life and a roaring economy. Ds aren’t wishing upon us all a lockdown. Wise countries have essentially contained covid without severe lockdowns. It’s doable. It requires buy-in across the boards. That’s all.
 
While I empathize with your plight, I'd respectfully disagree that it wouldn't do shit to contain a virus being spread by careless adults. Careless adults carelessly spread the virus to everyone, including their and other people's kids, who unfortunately spread it to other people's kids in some in-person elementary school settings. Then those kids spread it to other adults, who many not even be careless adults, and the vicious cycle continues.

A lot of colleges were trying to do a semester/finals break by Thanksgiving in anticipation of this time. I just hope that we are able to figure out how to get kids back to school in the new year. If people can figure out how to stop being selfish, we have a shot. If everyone adopts a Len stance, we don't.


Then shut down schools that have outbreaks. If our school had any signs of high positivity rates showing up, I'd agree with closing it. Having 4 cases in 3 months across 600+students shows our population has been vigilant. But we're lumped in with the rest of the giant public schools. A one size fits all approach is ridiculous. I supported this blanket approach back in the spring. It's crap policy today.
 
So home schooling is a total joke too?

I’m not commenting the viral aspect and decision.

If people want to home school their family, then good for them, it's a free country. I think it's a joke, personally. Besides that....I'm not a teacher, and we have a full time jobs to attend to. So kids get shafted. Is what it is.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mcmurtry66
Then shut down schools that have outbreaks. If our school had any signs of high positivity rates showing up, I'd agree with closing it. Having 4 cases in 3 months across 600+students shows our population has been vigilant. But we're lumped in with the rest of the giant public schools. A one size fits all approach is ridiculous. I supported this blanket approach back in the spring. It's crap policy today.

When the larger community spread reaches a certain point, it becomes about trying to get ahead of things before schools have outbreaks. When community spread is bad enough, it's only a matter of time and it appears that community spread is tracking to be substantially worse than it was in the spring. That you had four cases and were able to control them and not have them spread across the school population is a huge feather in your school community's cap. I hate zero tolerance/once size fits all policies, but we don't have great surgical tools in this particular fight, so schools like yours are punished for the selfishness of others.
 
If people want to home school their family, then good for them, it's a free country. I think it's a joke, personally. Besides that....I'm not a teacher, and we have a full time jobs to attend to. So kids get shafted. Is what it is.
Missing my point. First, home schooling is marvelously effective when done right. That’s demonstrably indisputable despite your unaware attitude. My point is virtual learning guided by a good teacher can parallel the quality of home schooling.

It’s not perfect but it can be effective in these times. I’m not arguing, just informing you. Whether or not your children’s teachers can do it is another question. Maybe they should take a gap year. Send them to Wuhan as exchange pupils!
 
Nonsense. Virtual "learning " is a total joke, but particularly for elementary school. Again, the county has now shut down our school when we've had basically zero infections. And going to send my kid home for at least 2 months. It's all a total joke.. and isn't going to do shit to contain a virus being spread by careless adults.

Bloomberg radio mentioned a study where college graduation rates would permanently dip ~2.6% and high school drop out rate would increase 4.2% as a result of moving to virtual learning. I'm not finding it easily, the there are long-term economic implications of this, for more than the current cohort of young adults.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mcmurtry66
Around the nation, it appears to be the ER/ICU system that is straining the most. That even though those numbers are down a little from the spring. But in the spring it was confined to fewer states so reserves could be sent to them. Today, the reserves are deployed everywhere so we get ER doctors begging for help https://www.khq.com/lifestyles/heal...cle_f1f4d1e1-a627-5c54-a31f-a29396a2d9f1.html

Basketball season is about to start, I don't want a shutdown at all. But if the carrot of voluntarily wearing masks and social distancing continues to fail, the government will need to come up with sticks.
This is the real issue - and I'm leaving the financial aspects aside here, just talking about infrastructure - just like it was in the spring. If we let this get out of hand to the point where hospitals can't keep up, we're screwed. Not only will the economy collapse, but so will healthcare, and lots of people will get sick and die.

We have grown accustomed to living in a world where getting sick is usually no big deal. Yeah, bad diseases happen, but usually, when you get sick, you go see a doctor and you get better. That only happens in a world where doctors are available. We don't keep thousands of extra doctors sitting around doing nothing, waiting for patients, because that's not profitable. So if this gets out of hand - and every indication is that it will - we are screwed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Marvin the Martian
My hope is that having at least a rough timeline, a vision of the light at the end of the tunnel already coming into sight, will make it more politically feasible to pass the cash stimulus that will be necessary to keep people afloat.
Will the moderate Dems put enough pressure on Pelosi to accomplish this. I think so but, I think, Mark said there was no way a Pelosi would let the two Georgia Senators have the opportunity to vote yes.
 
This is the real issue - and I'm leaving the financial aspects aside here, just talking about infrastructure - just like it was in the spring. If we let this get out of hand to the point where hospitals can't keep up, we're screwed. Not only will the economy collapse, but so will healthcare, and lots of people will get sick and die.

We have grown accustomed to living in a world where getting sick is usually no big deal. Yeah, bad diseases happen, but usually, when you get sick, you go see a doctor and you get better. That only happens in a world where doctors are available. We don't keep thousands of extra doctors sitting around doing nothing, waiting for patients, because that's not profitable. So if this gets out of hand - and every indication is that it will - we are screwed.

I talk to people who think being hospitalized with covid isn’t a bid deal because of the better treatments now. What they fail to realize is being admitted to an ICU is expensive (really expensive). Unless you have top notch insurance, you’re looking at a expensive bill. And hospital beds being taken up with covid patients leaves fewer beds for heart attacks, strokes, and other issues people need to be admitted for. The hospital system being overwhelmed will likely lead to more deaths not related to covid.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Marvin the Martian
This is the real issue - and I'm leaving the financial aspects aside here, just talking about infrastructure - just like it was in the spring. If we let this get out of hand to the point where hospitals can't keep up, we're screwed. Not only will the economy collapse, but so will healthcare, and lots of people will get sick and die.

We have grown accustomed to living in a world where getting sick is usually no big deal. Yeah, bad diseases happen, but usually, when you get sick, you go see a doctor and you get better. That only happens in a world where doctors are available. We don't keep thousands of extra doctors sitting around doing nothing, waiting for patients, because that's not profitable. So if this gets out of hand - and every indication is that it will - we are screwed.

Yes, people in car wrecks will not getting the treatment they need. Some of these "elective" surgeries being cancelled are cancer or heart. I don't think I linked it, a person went to an ER in Idaho or somewhere like that with a heart attack and they told her they could not take her.

It is only going to get worse. Even if we went into total lockdown today, it would be 10-14 days before we start back down. And we are not locking down.
 
Yes, people in car wrecks will not getting the treatment they need. Some of these "elective" surgeries being cancelled are cancer or heart. I don't think I linked it, a person went to an ER in Idaho or somewhere like that with a heart attack and they told her they could not take her.

It is only going to get worse. Even if we went into total lockdown today, it would be 10-14 days before we start back down. And we are not locking down.

This is an enormous underlying issue. People are delaying treatment for serious conditions (not judging them as being right or wrong, just acknowledging) and that is likely to result in excess morbidity and costs and worse outcomes for many years to come.
 
Yes, people in car wrecks will not getting the treatment they need. Some of these "elective" surgeries being cancelled are cancer or heart. I don't think I linked it, a person went to an ER in Idaho or somewhere like that with a heart attack and they told her they could not take her.

It is only going to get worse. Even if we went into total lockdown today, it would be 10-14 days before we start back down. And we are not locking down.
It's going to get a lot worse. I wish people would have some vision and get ready for it. Maybe they are in the cities, but up in these parts, I don't see it. I see a train wreck coming down the tracks, and everyone is standing in the crossing holding a party.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Marvin the Martian
It's going to get a lot worse. I wish people would have some vision and get ready for it. Maybe they are in the cities, but up in these parts, I don't see it. I see a train wreck coming down the tracks, and everyone is standing in the crossing holding a party.
And the holidays hitting when they do are going to make it so much worse.
 
When the larger community spread reaches a certain point, it becomes about trying to get ahead of things before schools have outbreaks. When community spread is bad enough, it's only a matter of time and it appears that community spread is tracking to be substantially worse than it was in the spring. That you had four cases and were able to control them and not have them spread across the school population is a huge feather in your school community's cap. I hate zero tolerance/once size fits all policies, but we don't have great surgical tools in this particular fight, so schools like yours are punished for the selfishness of others.


Just frustrating all the (successful) precautions and procedures put into place by both dedicated staff and parents.... all a total waste.
 
Just frustrating all the (successful) precautions and procedures put into place by both dedicated staff and parents.... all a total waste.
It’s a shame it has to be a one size fits all .
 
It’s a shame it has to be a one size fits all .

It's bullshit in that there's no data for ANYWHERE around the world that schools are significant sources of transmission. So we're going to send kids home for months to achieve not a damn thing. There's also limited data that shows businesses (including restaurants) are sources of spread. Instead it's almost entirely social gatherings in private homes, where people let their guard down and feel "safe".

Hogsett is the biggest empty suit this city has had as a mayor in my 20 years being here. And Dr Caine is a world class moron, per everyone I've talked to (all other doctors) that have interacted with her directly during this pandemic.
 
It's bullshit in that there's no data for ANYWHERE around the world that schools are significant sources of transmission. So we're going to send kids home for months to achieve not a damn thing. There's also limited data that shows businesses (including restaurants) are sources of spread. Instead it's almost entirely social gatherings in private homes, where people let their guard down and feel "safe".

Hogsett is the biggest empty suit this city has had as a mayor in my 20 years being here. And Dr Caine is a world class moron, per everyone I've talked to (all other doctors) that have interacted with her directly during this pandemic.

agree on schools but it’s the teachers that are most of the problem. At my kids’ day care, teacher infections dwarf student infections, though one child has a croup like cough and tested positive.

as for venues...

 
agree on schools but it’s the teachers that are most of the problem. At my kids’ day care, teacher infections dwarf student infections, though one child has a croup like cough and tested positive.

as for venues...

Thank god for the vaccine. No one has any new ideas; plans.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mas-sa-suta
agree on schools but it’s the teachers that are most of the problem. At my kids’ day care, teacher infections dwarf student infections, though one child has a croup like cough and tested positive.

as for venues...



We had 1 teacher and 3 students test postive in 3+ months. Other area schools such as ours have similar numbers. High schools have much higher rates around here. Again, I'd be all for closing the school if you were seeing infections pop up.... doing it when there is basically zero is dumbassery. Again schools (particularly primary schools) have not been shown to be a significant transmission issue anywhere around the world.

As to restaurants, etc. ... obviously lower capacity levels are necessary. Don't think that's really arguable....as well as no bars.
 
We had 1 teacher and 3 students test postive in 3+ months. Other area schools such as ours have similar numbers. High schools have much higher rates around here. Again, I'd be all for closing the school if you were seeing infections pop up.... doing it when there is basically zero is dumbassery. Again schools (particularly primary schools) have not been shown to be a significant transmission issue anywhere around the world.

As to restaurants, etc. ... obviously lower capacity levels are necessary. Don't think that's really arguable....as well as no bars.

gym are a tough one. I miss that access and I’m sure that I’m not alone
 
Thank god for the vaccine. No one has any new ideas; plans.
Problem us we are looking late 2021 before the real benefits of the vaccine are realized. Lot of storage and transportation challenges to overcome due to temperature requirements.
 
Problem us we are looking late 2021 before the real benefits of the vaccine are realized. Lot of storage and transportation challenges to overcome due to temperature requirements.
I read wide distribution by spring. Who knows but I’m hoping that’s true
 
  • Like
Reactions: BCCHoosier
gym are a tough one. I miss that access and I’m sure that I’m not alone

Thought this story about a gym that had a member who was an infectious disease scientist who helped them design airflow patterns and distancing protocols to keep them safe (and no one was infected when a trainer who tested positive could have exposed more than 50 members).

It shows how applying sensible safety measures sensibly can give us the freedoms we crave. My son and I work out at a gym 3x's a week, but it is all outdoors, everyone wears a face covering, and we all scrupulously disinfect shared equipment. I understand the lowest common denominator approach we have to take to public safety, but that doesn't make it any less frustrating. 🤯
 
It's bullshit in that there's no data for ANYWHERE around the world that schools are significant sources of transmission. So we're going to send kids home for months to achieve not a damn thing. There's also limited data that shows businesses (including restaurants) are sources of spread. Instead it's almost entirely social gatherings in private homes, where people let their guard down and feel "safe".

Hogsett is the biggest empty suit this city has had as a mayor in my 20 years being here. And Dr Caine is a world class moron, per everyone I've talked to (all other doctors) that have interacted with her directly during this pandemic.
I think restaurants have to be more dangerous because you take your mask off to eat. I remember very early on seeing a diagram of a restaurant and how many people got infected from different tables from the one person. I think restaurants should probably be subsidized for awhile in a relief bill. But schools where outbreaks are practically nil should be able to keep going.
 
gym are a tough one. I miss that access and I’m sure that I’m not alone
Ugh I miss my gym like crazy. It’s a double whammy with quarantine eating and no gym to go to. I exercise best when I’m held accountable by meeting people to workout with. Some friends have been going, but I’m not.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JamieDimonsBalls
I think restaurants have to be more dangerous because you take your mask off to eat. I remember very early on seeing a diagram of a restaurant and how many people got infected from different tables from the one person. I think restaurants should probably be subsidized for awhile in a relief bill. But schools where outbreaks are practically nil should be able to keep going.

They need to be 50% or less capacity, but I've been in several sit down restaurants... you don't spend much time around a server. You spend time with the people at your table. If it's my wife and kids that's a nothing. If it's me and 8 friends that showed up that's something.

All year, I've never been sat within 15 ft of another table. It isn't a business problem. It's a people problem.

Restaurants are not big source of transmission if protocols are followed. This is all common sense. How much time do you spend in a server's face?

They'll be situations where it occurs.... but crushing an industry that a lot of working class folks count on is also not a solution.

People not having house parties is the solution.
 
Last edited:
It's bullshit in that there's no data for ANYWHERE around the world that schools are significant sources of transmission. So we're going to send kids home for months to achieve not a damn thing. There's also limited data that shows businesses (including restaurants) are sources of spread. Instead it's almost entirely social gatherings in private homes, where people let their guard down and feel "safe".

Hogsett is the biggest empty suit this city has had as a mayor in my 20 years being here. And Dr Caine is a world class moron, per everyone I've talked to (all other doctors) that have interacted with her directly during this pandemic.

Talking to people back home their local schools are running into an issue with staff getting sick and not enough subs to fill in. They are looking at shutting down due to staff, not students, being sick.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fro
Problem us we are looking late 2021 before the real benefits of the vaccine are realized. Lot of storage and transportation challenges to overcome due to temperature requirements.
Talking to people back home their local schools are running into an issue with staff getting sick and not enough subs to fill in. They are looking at shutting down due to staff, not students, being sick.
Agree. My wife is a teacher and staff illness finally pushed us to remote learning this week. We last in person longer than I thought.

Who would of thought it would be hard to find subs at $90 per day in a pandemic? 😁
 
  • Like
Reactions: zeke4ahs
The pandemic is the perfect example of left and right actually wanting the exact same outcome but arguing because political actors on one side create a false narrative about what the other side wants.

The Pubs have been just as bad about this as they politicized the mask.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BCCHoosier
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT