Damning Chart
- Thread starter limestonecowboy
- Start date
anyone who's watched this season should find this as no surprise.
All started up in Madison in early Dec and has not been fixed. What is the cause? Halftime coaching adjustments? Player conditioning? Mental focus? lineup/rotation management?
All started up in Madison in early Dec and has not been fixed. What is the cause? Halftime coaching adjustments? Player conditioning? Mental focus? lineup/rotation management?
That's what happens when you hire a guy that's been in the NBA for 40 years.
Yeah but he is an IU guy!! That is all Joe Hillman and the old guard of players wanted and they got it. They should be as happy as a pig in s.......
IU basketball alums ‘giddy’ about hire of Mike Woodson
They’ve wanted something like this for a long time, and to varying degrees, they’ve been pretty vocal about saying so. Former Indiana players, particularly those who played during Bob K…
www.thedailyhoosier.com
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They don't have half time in the NBA?
Woodson's energy reserves have been drained, a scientific fact of normal physiology. Think how giddy we would have been if Steve Alford had been hired after his short stint at New Mexico. For all we know he might still be our coach, like Matt Painter is to Purdue today. You can't tell me Alford would have been any worse than Painter, who is pretty good today compared to the multiple shit shows displayed in Bloomington during this same time period.Yeah but he is an IU guy!! That is all Joe Hillman and the old guard of players wanted and they got it. They should be as happy as a pig in s.......
IU basketball alums ‘giddy’ about hire of Mike Woodson
They’ve wanted something like this for a long time, and to varying degrees, they’ve been pretty vocal about saying so. Former Indiana players, particularly those who played during Bob K…
Alford should've been hired in 2001 but the wokesters got their way.
I don't think Alford would have been any better than Crean: his time at UCLA proves it.
If Alford had played for Purdue, he would have been hired there. Purdue's not so full of themselves in Wokness requirements that they can't recognize a good thing when it stares themselves in the face begging to be given a chance. Alford would have killed it here recruiting-wise when he was a recognized household name. With his dad's coaching contacts and summer camps, we would have had an immediate pipeline of talent.
Not all the 2nd half letdowns are created equal. The only common denominator is that they nearly always falter, at some point, in the 2nd half. If there was a trend of when, who, and why the screw ups were happening, then it'd be a lot easier for the staff to fix it, I'm sure.
But we've blown leads right out of the gate. We've lost leads, then built leads, then lost them late. We've played really well for 2/3 of the 2nd half, only to blow them late. We've went back and forth, and lost it late. There isn't really a reliable rhyme or reason to why this is happening.
In the end, I think the answers are at 3 levels, all play into our struggles, some more than others:
1. Foundational issues with Woodson's program regarding accountability. We miss a lot of free throws. We miss a lot of layups. We turn the ball over at times. We have mental lapses defensively in key moments. However he and his staff are managing the day to day accountability, its not working out well. This is not to mention the need for him to suspend kids, for whatever reasons, at various times well into the season. Teams that are all on the same page, that know expectations, that have had them drilled into them, don't make the mistakes on and off the court that our guys do.
2. I do have concerns that Woody getting up to speed on the differences in NCAA versus NBA game management, is having some negative consequences. Subbing patterns. Lack of urgency in taking away other teams star players. NCAA games are very different from NBA. They're shorter. Other teams often don't have 5 guys capable of making winning plays. There are 5 fouls instead of 6.
3. We just don't have reliable perimeter players that can be counted on to control games when we build leads. And/or to make winning plays when the game is in doubt and on the line. In nearly all our close games that we've lost...there's "A guy" that beat us. Johnny Davis both games. Branham. Buddy Boeheim. Boo Bouie and Chase Audige, The Illinois guards. Jaden Ivey almost got us. Hell, if we hadn't had one of our own performances like that against Purdue, we'd have blown that lead too. But Rob stepped up and made plays for us.
I think they're all kind of tied in with each other. Woody isn't running stuff that's putting our current group of guys in the best position to make plays consistently. And finding those strings to pull and plays to run is MUCH harder for Woody and staff because we just don't have the guns that other teams have. Especially in the all important backcourt positions.
Maybe I don’t understand the chart, but how is it that we are only slightly worse than Houston? Everyone around here seems to believe the denim shirt is a world-class coach.
I still can’t believe Alford’s name resurfaces this time EVERY year. The guy is a useless coach in more ways than wins/losses.
Let it go already.
Let it go already.
Lmao on Alford. He had great recruiting classes at UCLA and an easy ass conference too. Lame….duck.
Age certainly is not in Woodsons favor It is not as as big of an issue if you are 64 and have been at a program for twenty years and have it very estblished. I am guessing assistants for cocah K or Jim B do alot of the work at this point and their programs sell themselves. Woodson is really going to have to outwork guys 20 or 25 years younger on the recruiting trail, etc.
The LA "LaLa Land" environment was never meant for him. Alford's name doesn't ring in SoCal like it does throughout the Hoosier state. Basketball went dead in Westwood shortly after Wooden left, much like it is here with Knight's reign now long over. Alford never would have been anther Knight-he doesn't have the personality. Knight had his way of tweaking the best out of players receptive to his unique methodology. No coach since has had that ability, including the entertainment value of his engaging personality, which made IU basketball so much fun. I think Alford would have been more successful than Crean, at least a little, if not more. We'll never know what we missed, if anything. We know what we got from "Slap-happy". I think Alford would have been better prepared for the Syracuse zone defense. To me, that is Crean's biggest black mark. Is it still okay to call it black in a world full of Wokeness warriors?. Perhaps "Crean's biggest discolored mark" is more appropriate.
The uncertainty in length of Woodson's tenure will most certainly be used as a talking point of IU's coaching adversaries. I hate to keep referencing PUke, but with the stability of their coaches, recruits know it will likely remain a solid, proven program periodically on the cusp of breaking through to higher greatness. I hope like hell it isn't this season. Our coaching instability is just the opposite of what they offer, as our last red banner fades in vibrancy with each passing year. It will be interesting to see how active Woody will be on the offseason recruiting trail against coaches with a little more bounce to their steps. Matta has been awfully quiet this season. Does his back still hurt? Is something else the matter with Matta? I hope Fife has been taking good notes. I would like to see him conduct a post season press conference. It's important to see how a coach relates to the press with no prep time to speak of. How quickly does he think on his feet, or is it something he'll have to decide after watching the tape with a cold beer in his hand.
Recruiting hasn't been IU's issue the last 20 years. There's been numerous talented players to come and go the last two decades. Alford can't coach a lick and would have had the same issues as someone like Tom Crean.
It could be said that truly talented players overcome the shortcomings of a coach. I think talented players make a coach look good easier than a good coach makes a player look talented. Does that make sense?
That could be skewed by one team, Houston, usually being up double figures by halftime. The tendency is to let off the gas in that situation. IU is never in any position to let off the gas.
It's always amusing to see the experts on this board praise every coaching hire and denigrate Alford.
Then, when their chosen one gets fired, they still denigrate Alford.
It's wokeness on display. They will cut off their noses to spite their faces.
Ughhh. Alford isn’t good enough for the whole argument of wokeness to stand.
Well, yes, the NBA has a halftime, but the players don't have to follow the adjustments the coach directs.
I'm not some big Alford cheerleader but I am big believer that certain coaches just fit certain jobs. Alford might have had big success here but nowhere else. We'll never know.
Steve' window has closed. He'll be pushing 60 soon. He's coaching a sub .500 team out in dry sinus country at a school with zero bball legacy of its own. Steve is an IU legacy, one of the greatest ever. But he won't ever be part of the staff in Bloomington.
The 800 lb. gorilla in hiring Alford is single fold. He struggled in Iowa City, so if he underachieved the lofty expectations we all hold who on who wants to see an IUBB hero fired. I for sure don't.
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| rall | totals | 861 | 556 | 305 | .646 | 11.08 | 5.96 | ||||||
| Missouri State | 126 | 78 | 48 | .619 | 8.04 | 3.56 | |||||||
| Iowa | 258 | 152 | 106 | .589 | 11.38 | 8.12 | |||||||
| New Mexico | 207 | 155 | 52 | .749 | 12.83 | 4.00 | |||||||
| UCLA | 187 | 124 | 63 | .663 | 13.48 | 7.60 | |||||||
| Nevada | 83 | 47 | 36 | .566 | 6.03 | 4.09 |
556 wins, 11 NCAA tourney appearances.
"Can't coach a lick", LOLO
Alford at IU would have been interesting...whenever it may have happened.
Pretty much at every stop, he elevated the product versus how he inherited it. UCLA might be the main exception. But at Manchester, SWMS, Iowa, New Mexico...the programs got better when he got there.
I think he would have had early success at IU, whenever it would have happened. I wonder if it would have been lasting success though? He's jumped around quite a lot. One would think he'd have landed/stuck at a place by now. Obviously there's something about his style/personality that's causing the shorter stints. And Indiana isn't a very forgiving place to coach when there are those types of issues.
I agree that his time has now come and gone, but once upon a time it was here for the taking as if gift wrapped upon silver platter. The anti-anything Knight sentiment was still strong, an unfortunate era for Steve's timing. Davis, Sampson, Crean, Miller, Woodson...the changing list of names all too quickly, thrown out as if against a wall with nothing sticking.
I don't think there there can be any question that at one point in time, from when RMK was fired...to when Woody was hired...that there wasn't a time, maybe many times...that hiring Steve Alford was a better decision than the one that was made.
Alford would have been a better decision than Davis.
Firing Davis a year or two earlier than they did, and hiring Alford would have been better than keeping him.
Hiring Alford instead of Sampson would have been a better decision.
Hiring Alford instead of Crean would have been a better decision (he might not have wanted it at that point)
Firing Crean earlier than they did, and hiring Alford would have been better than holding on to Crean.
Hiring Alford instead of Archie would have been a better decision.
The problem with all that is its purely hindsight. I never once thought that hiring Alford was a good idea during any of the times listed above. The uneven and/or mediocre results the last 20 years make the case much stronger for Alford that his case ever was in real time.
What has Steve Alford done that warrants the Indiana job other than playing at Indiana?
He had one good stint at New Mexico and has flopped everywhere else. Was fired at Iowa, underachieved wildly at UCLA (predecessor took Bruins to 3 consecutive Final 4 years and his successor already took them to one), and he's already run a solid Nevada program built by Eric Musselman into the ground.
Great player, average at best coach. Sue me for thinking he deserves the Indiana job.
If you're wrong that many times about Alford, shouldn't that tell you something?
He's been fired from two jobs and working on #3.
Did he flop at Missouri State, taking them to the SW16?
How did he 'flop' anywhere else? He's won a couple Big Ten Tournament championships - we've won none.
Compared to who we hired, it's a no-brainer he'd have done better here.
He had one good year at SW Missouri St that netted a decent tourney run that he parlayed into the Iowa job that he was subsequently fired from. He did well at New Mexico although flamed out early in every tournament but did reignite a program that was once stellar under Dave Bliss in the 90's.
Mick Cronin has already surpassed Alford in two years at UCLA and alford inherited a Nevada program that won 28+ games the 3 years prior and is on the verge of leading them to a losing record this year.
Tell me again how good a coach Steve Alford is?
