Comparing last year to this year----BT only

[mushroomgod_1]

Offense:

--2 pt FG% up from .459 to .507; 3 pt% up from .320 to .358; FT % down from .673 to .663; ORBs down from 11.1/game to 7.2/game; DRBs down from 25.3/game to 24.8/game; TRBs down from 36.4/game to 32.0/game; assists up from 11.8/game to 13.4/game; TOs down from 12.2/game to 10.8/game

Defense:

--2 pt% up from .494 to .511; 3 pt% up from .333 to .378; TRBs up from 33.1/game to 35.2 game; assists up from 12.6/game to 13.7/game; TOs up from 10.7/game to 11.4/game.

So.......as much as outside shooting and guard play have been criticized this year, the glaring stat that jumps out is we were 3.3+ on the boards last year and are 3.2-this year. And the largest part of that is on the offensive boards.

A/TO has actually gotten better, going from .97 to 1.24. Shooting is up a fair amount for both 2s & 3s.

While opponents' shooting %s are up a fair amount as well, that could be explained by the opposition being better.

 

[Coach Geez]

Offense:

--2 pt FG% up from .459 to .507; 3 pt% up from .320 to .358; FT % down from .673 to .663; ORBs down from 11.1/game to 7.2/game; DRBs down from 25.3/game to 24.8/game; TRBs down from 36.4/game to 32.0/game; assists up from 11.8/game to 13.4/game; TOs down from 12.2/game to 10.8/game

Defense:

--2 pt% up from .494 to .511; 3 pt% up from .333 to .378; TRBs up from 33.1/game to 35.2 game; assists up from 12.6/game to 13.7/game; TOs up from 10.7/game to 11.4/game.

So.......as much as outside shooting and guard play have been criticized this year, the glaring stat that jumps out is we were 3.3+ on the boards last year and are 3.2-this year. And the largest part of that is on the offensive boards.

A/TO has actually gotten better, going from .97 to 1.24. Shooting is up a fair amount for both 2s & 3s.

While opponents' shooting %s are up a fair amount as well, that could be explained by the opposition being better.

Tougher conference this year (somehow) so margin for error is even slimmer. Brunk's absence hurts more than we think.

 

[.Gerdis]

While opponents' shooting %s are up a fair amount as well, that could be explained by the opposition being better.

I am somewhat surprised that we have been shooting it so much better this year, and against “better opposition “.

This team needs better mental toughness more than anything.

 

[TR32]

If you go 12/24 from 3 one game and win, then go 3/12 and 3/12 the next two games and lose, that doesn't make 0.375 look like a good percentage overall. It still means you can't shoot but occasionally find some range.
Another way to look at it is that when teams make you shoot over the top of the defense because you are known as a poor outside shooting team, it gives defensive rebounder an advantage.

 

[aajohn2000]

Tougher conference this year (somehow) so margin for error is even slimmer. Brunk's absence hurts more than we think.

Justin Smith

 

[Coach Geez]

Justin Smith

True, although he’s not on the roster.

 

[aajohn2000]

True, although he’s not on the roster.

Correct. Was just adding him to the list like you pointed out with Brunk. While Brunk is on the roster, just like Justin, he’s not played a minute. While I do not miss Justin as I think he didn’t help with team chemistry, he was a heck of a defender and was strong in the glass.

 

[wi_hoosier]

Offense:

--2 pt FG% up from .459 to .507; 3 pt% up from .320 to .358; FT % down from .673 to .663; ORBs down from 11.1/game to 7.2/game; DRBs down from 25.3/game to 24.8/game; TRBs down from 36.4/game to 32.0/game; assists up from 11.8/game to 13.4/game; TOs down from 12.2/game to 10.8/game

Defense:

--2 pt% up from .494 to .511; 3 pt% up from .333 to .378; TRBs up from 33.1/game to 35.2 game; assists up from 12.6/game to 13.7/game; TOs up from 10.7/game to 11.4/game.

So.......as much as outside shooting and guard play have been criticized this year, the glaring stat that jumps out is we were 3.3+ on the boards last year and are 3.2-this year. And the largest part of that is on the offensive boards.

A/TO has actually gotten better, going from .97 to 1.24. Shooting is up a fair amount for both 2s & 3s.

While opponents' shooting %s are up a fair amount as well, that could be explained by the opposition being better.

And the lost of IU's best defender and a top rebounder. As much as I didn't like JS attitude, I knew his transfer was going to hurt. Compound that with Brunk being out and there you have it.

 

[Radio Zero]

Justin Smith was a Crean cancer. One more lump to excise (AD) and we’re in remission.

Year Zero beckons!

 

[Cavanagh.13]

Correct. Was just adding him to the list like you pointed out with Brunk. While Brunk is on the roster, just like Justin, he’s not played a minute. While I do not miss Justin as I think he didn’t help with team chemistry, he was a heck of a defender and was strong in the glass.

justin would have played over race. Race has done very well defensively this year. Justin was a bit better defender, not as good at blocks tho, a better rebounder, but worse on offense.

all in all I think we are still better with out him.

 

[SoccerSammy]

Justin Smith was a Crean cancer. One more lump to excise (AD) and we’re in remission.

Year Zero beckons!

AD Barely has any Crean mojo.. please don’t be delusional. Unless we pick up some serious players in the transfer “market” next year could be spectacularly awful. This is CAM’s team now. 100%. This year is ALL on him

 

[kkott]

justin would have played over race. Race has done very well defensively this year. Justin was a bit better defender, not as good at blocks tho, a better rebounder, but worse on offense.

all in all I think we are still better with out him.

I think overall Race is an upgrade, if nothing else by being a better teammate. Neither are big offensive threats, I think Justin was probably better at scoring off the offensive glass, on the break and maybe driving. For all the defense people talk about, I thought Justin still got lost a lot or didn't provide help on D. I think Race is a better teammate with help and better on the block. Maybe Justin was a better perimeter defender. I give Race (and Jordan) lots of credit for the way they battled Garza in the Iowa game. I don't think Justin could have or would have been asked to do that... jmo.

 

[Jg48]

The only statistics that will matter at the end of the season are:

1. Our won-loss record;
2. Our final position in the regular season BT standings;
3. Our finish position in the BT Tourney;
4. Our seed in the NCAA Tourney; and
5. Our finish in the NCAA Tourney.

 

[Champs1976]

The only statistics that will matter at the end of the season are:

1. Our won-loss record;
2. Our final position in the regular season BT standings;
3. Our finish position in the BT Tourney;
4. Our seed in the NCAA Tourney; and
5. Our finish in the NCAA Tourney.

Spot on! The rest of the stats are for losers!

 

[Falky22]

I think overall Race is an upgrade, if nothing else by being a better teammate. Neither are big offensive threats, I think Justin was probably better at scoring off the offensive glass, on the break and maybe driving. For all the defense people talk about, I thought Justin still got lost a lot or didn't provide help on D. I think Race is a better teammate with help and better on the block. Maybe Justin was a better perimeter defender. I give Race (and Jordan) lots of credit for the way they battled Garza in the Iowa game. I don't think Justin could have or would have been asked to do that... jmo.

Race is definitely better than Justin. Race knows his limitations and he has a motor that won’t quit.

We simply miss having some inside depth and Justin would have helped with that.

 

[Chicago-bound Hoosier]

this team would look entirely different with two tweaks:
1. healthy Brunk to eat minutes inside, saving TJD and Race (I believe TJD is playing somewhat timid at times to limit his fouls)
2. landing Garcia.

Garcia's numbers at Marq presently (against a pretty respectable schedule):
12.7 ppg. 7.2 reb
shooting: 47%. (41% 3pt). 78% FTs

How would Garcia's numbers look on our squad this year? A wing nearly 7 feet tall who rebounds, hits 3s...stretches the defense....and hits his damn free throws. Missing on Garcia was a huge swing and miss for CAM.

If TJD and Brunk do not return next year...I don't know what the hell CAM is going to do. He has to score big in the transfer market. Otherwise, we would be screwed.

 

[kkott]

this team would look entirely different with two tweaks:
1. healthy Brunk to eat minutes inside, saving TJD and Race (I believe TJD is playing somewhat timid at times to limit his fouls)
2. landing Garcia.

Garcia's numbers at Marq presently (against a pretty respectable schedule):
12.7 ppg. 7.2 reb
shooting: 47%. (41% 3pt). 78% FTs

How would Garcia's numbers look on our squad this year? A wing nearly 7 feet tall who rebounds, hits 3s...stretches the defense....and hits his damn free throws. Missing on Garcia was a huge swing and miss for CAM.

If TJD and Brunk do not return next year...I don't know what the hell CAM is going to do. He has to score big in the transfer market. Otherwise, we would be screwed.

If my Aunt had balls...

 

[TR32]

this team would look entirely different with two tweaks:
1. healthy Brunk to eat minutes inside, saving TJD and Race (I believe TJD is playing somewhat timid at times to limit his fouls)
2. landing Garcia.

Garcia's numbers at Marq presently (against a pretty respectable schedule):
12.7 ppg. 7.2 reb
shooting: 47%. (41% 3pt). 78% FTs

How would Garcia's numbers look on our squad this year? A wing nearly 7 feet tall who rebounds, hits 3s...stretches the defense....and hits his damn free throws. Missing on Garcia was a huge swing and miss for CAM.

If TJD and Brunk do not return next year...I don't know what the hell CAM is going to do. He has to score big in the transfer market. Otherwise, we would be screwed.

I agree with your post, but also want to add that losing on Furst and Kaufman is even worse because they will be there helping Purdue beat Indiana again next year.

Also, it is worth noting that last time Miller went after a 6'10" transfer things didn't work out so well.

It seems IU's future and Miller's tenure comes down to TJDs decision and the hope that some very good transfers will sign with IU in the spring.

 

[Chicago-bound Hoosier]

I agree with your post, but also want to add that losing on Furst and Kaufman is even worse because they will be there helping Purdue beat Indiana again next year.

Also, it is worth noting that last time Miller went after a 6'10" transfer things didn't work out so well.

It seems IU's future and Miller's tenure comes down to TJDs decision and the hope that some very good transfers will sign with IU in the spring.

oh yeah...I'm just talking about this season. More pain is coming. And FItzer was a tall lanky outside shooter...who couldn't shoot. We need some true Bigs. Not more freakishly tall betas.

 

[Chicago-bound Hoosier]

If my Aunt had balls...

seems like we've always got an excuse...If Romeo wasn't hurt....If Brunk wasn't hurt...if xyz had just committed....if he just had "his" players.....help is on the way....blah blah blah....

 

[fkfootball]

seems like we've always got an excuse...If Romeo wasn't hurt....If Brunk wasn't hurt...if xyz had just committed....if he just had "his" players.....help is on the way....blah blah blah....

“If” we just hired a good coach.

 

[aajohn2000]

justin would have played over race. Race has done very well defensively this year. Justin was a bit better defender, not as good at blocks tho, a better rebounder, but worse on offense.

all in all I think we are still better with out him.

How many accounts do you have and why? It appears you are on version 1.3

 

[Cavanagh.13]

How many accounts do you have and why? It appears you are on version 1.3

Endless. They tried to sensor me on a feee board. No need to ban PU trolls, no no, I was out of control and needed to be dealt with!!!

 

[aajohn2000]

Endless. They tried to sensor me on a feee board. No need to ban PU trolls, no no, I was out of control and needed to be dealt with!!!

Gotcha. Hilarious. I can only wonder the content that got you kicked off.

 

[kkott]

seems like we've always got an excuse...If Romeo wasn't hurt....If Brunk wasn't hurt...if xyz had just committed....if he just had "his" players.....help is on the way....blah blah blah....

Yeah, that's the thing. I'd have loved to have Garcia (or Kaufman) but the bottom line is we should've had a post player in this year's class, even with Smith, and that's Archie's job. Yes, Smith would give an extra bailout, but I still don't believe he's a true post player/defender. And, if he has NBA aspirations (and I'm sure he does) then he needed to play out on the wing. Just like Kaufman wants to... just like Trayce really needs to. I guess it's just systematic like it was with Crean and they don't want more than 1-2 roster spots tied up on post defenders, but it sure hurts us when virtually every other B10 team and Power5 team does. UVA supposedly plays the same defense we do and they have 4 guys on their roster 6'9" or taller, including 2 7'ers and then 3 more that are 6'7 or 6'8.

 

[Chicago-bound Hoosier]

Yeah, that's the thing. I'd have loved to have Garcia (or Kaufman) but the bottom line is we should've had a post player in this year's class, even with Smith, and that's Archie's job. Yes, Smith would give an extra bailout, but I still don't believe he's a true post player/defender. And, if he has NBA aspirations (and I'm sure he does) then he needed to play out on the wing. Just like Kaufman wants to... just like Trayce really needs to. I guess it's just systematic like it was with Crean and they don't want more than 1-2 roster spots tied up on post defenders, but it sure hurts us when virtually every other B10 team and Power5 team does. UVA supposedly plays the same defense we do and they have 4 guys on their roster 6'9" or taller, including 2 7'ers and then 3 more that are 6'7 or 6'8.

going thin on your bigs might work if you're loaded with wings and true guards that are deadeyes from deep (ie Iowa...except when they played us) , or can take it to the rim and score/draw fouls (ala Yogi). But our wings are shaky (at best) shooters and our guards are at risk of physical harm every time they drive to the hole (bless Durham's heart...he is willing to do it, but looks like he's about to get snapped in two every time he tries). And yes, Smith is not a good post defender. And he's always been a horrible 3pt shooter. Not sure what NBA future he might be dreaming of....he'll have an MBA to fall back on so not too worried about Justin's future. My biggest concern is that there seems to be no plan to develop TJD's game beyond what we already saw last year.

 

[T.M.P.]

And the lost of IU's best defender and a top rebounder.

lol ....

Smith wasn't either. He was the worst rebounder among the frontline. Even Demezi had better per 40, per 100 and a better percentage.

Quit making up dumb shit.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2020.html

 

[kmathum]

And the lost of IU's best defender and a top rebounder. As much as I didn't like JS attitude, I knew his transfer was going to hurt. Compound that with Brunk being out and there you have it.

if only we had justin and joey. are you people serious?

 

[T.M.P.]

My biggest concern is that there seems to be no plan to develop TJD's game beyond what we already saw last year.

How long does skills development generally take?

 

[Crossblock]

If you go 12/24 from 3 one game and win, then go 3/12 and 3/12 the next two games and lose, that doesn't make 0.375 look like a good percentage overall. It still means you can't shoot but occasionally find some range.
Another way to look at it is that when teams make you shoot over the top of the defense because you are known as a poor outside shooting team, it gives defensive rebounder an advantage.

It's that old story. If I tie you to a Tree and put one of your feet in a bucket of boiling hot water, and the other one in Cold Water with Ice pack, on average, you should fell Comfortable. And then that old Saying, There are Lies, Damn Lies, and Statistics.

 

[wi_hoosier]

if only we had justin and joey. are you people serious?

Serious about what? And what the F do you mean by, "you people?"

I was just stating that maybe the defensive and rebounding numbers the OP posted are down not just because the competition is better this year, but also because IU lost it's best defender from last year and a true post player with size. How is that controversial to you?

 

[wi_hoosier]

lol ....

Smith wasn't either. He was the worst rebounder among the frontline. Even Demezi had better per 40, per 100 and a better percentage.

Quit making up dumb shit.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2020.html

Brunk was one of the top rebounders on the team last year, was he not? He's 5.2rpg was tied for second with actually, Smith. So really, IU lost two top rebounders, by your own link that's not making shit up.

Smith being the best defender last year may be subjective, but many people said he was. I really don't care if he was or not. My only point was that losing Smith and Brunk may have been part of the reason that IU's numbers defensively are down compared to last year as well as playing tougher competition. Not sure why some of you guys are losing your sh!t about that.

 

[Chicago-bound Hoosier]

How long does skills development generally take?

cannot offer a quantitative answer since it depends on many factors. And, preface- I'm a big TJD fan, he's obviously our key player, and I hope he stays 4 yrs and is an AA and final 4 contender before he leaves.

That said, I thought he needed to address 3 areas over the offseason to make him a more versatile player (helping both our team this year, and his future draft status): 1. develop his right hand around the basket, 2. work on taking, and making, 12-17' midrange jumpers facing the basket, and 3. Get to 70% at the FT line.

The third is an arbitrary number, but considering he takes as many free throws as anyone in the nation, it would benefit the team (and his future) to make some improvements at the line. Yet, his FT% shooting is actually down a click from last year. I'm by no means a shot doctor, but his FT form seems very flat, knees locked, leaning backwards on his shot. He does not get many 'shooter's rolls' with his FTs.

I see no evidence of any development of using the off-hand around the basket. This is why he tends to get his shots blocked without drawing fouls- not going up with his right hand and shielding himself with his left.

As for a midrange shot, if for no other reason than to draw guys like Kofi, Garza and such out of the lane because they know he's willing to take it (and occasionally make it)- I see nothing.

His rebounding is pretty much where it was last season. He is scoring a few more points, but also taking nearly 5 more shots a game (FG% actually down a few, albeit still well over 50%). So the scoring increase makes mathematical sense.

Look, he's our best player, by a wide margin. But he was really good when he got here, and the stats- and the eye test- lead me to feel he's pretty much the same player as when he arrived. Sure he hasn't been here 2 full yrs yet. But for these 5/high 4 stars who dream of being at the next level early, lack of development deep into yr 2 can be used against us in recruiting- Garcia, Kaufmann. others. Add to that the fact that our guard core seems to be developing at a snail's pace (aside from Franklin who obviously put in some hard work over the summer). I'm just looking for clues as to why CAM's recruiting of certain types of players (bigger swing outside/in types like Garcia/TK- types of players that this team is sorely missing) and I think the clues are right in front of us for those willing to take off the cream and crimson goggles.

 

[Champs1976]

Why come to IU? Archie hasn't demonstrated that he can develop anybody. I can't think of anyone with the possible exception of Armann who might DEVELOP into an NBA player while at IU. Not one. I see little real sustained improvement. Time for Archie to pack up. If Dolson gives him the COVID pas, he is just prolonging the inevitable. Give Tom Allen the job and one thing is for sure, the players would give maximum effort every game, that by itself would be an improvement.

 

[darkhawk returns]

Think Brunk and Smith had anything to do with those (including worse shooting)?

Offense:

--2 pt FG% up from .459 to .507; 3 pt% up from .320 to .358; FT % down from .673 to .663; ORBs down from 11.1/game to 7.2/game; DRBs down from 25.3/game to 24.8/game; TRBs down from 36.4/game to 32.0/game; assists up from 11.8/game to 13.4/game; TOs down from 12.2/game to 10.8/game

Defense:

--2 pt% up from .494 to .511; 3 pt% up from .333 to .378; TRBs up from 33.1/game to 35.2 game; assists up from 12.6/game to 13.7/game; TOs up from 10.7/game to 11.4/game.

So.......as much as outside shooting and guard play have been criticized this year, the glaring stat that jumps out is we were 3.3+ on the boards last year and are 3.2-this year. And the largest part of that is on the offensive boards.

A/TO has actually gotten better, going from .97 to 1.24. Shooting is up a fair amount for both 2s & 3s.

While opponents' shooting %s are up a fair amount as well, that could be explained by the opposition being better.