Are any decent or good bigs
- Thread starter bwcoach
- Start date
C-PF
#62 - Ante Brzovic SR 6-10 225 SR, C (94.88) (eligibility?)
#77 - James Scott JR 6-11 210 PF-C (94.36)
#91 - Justin Vander Baan SR 7-0 215 (93.96)
#97 - Enoch Boakye SR 6-10 240 PF-C (93.90)
#121 - Efton Reid SR 7-0 240 C (93.44)
#275 - Josh Gray SR 7-0 255 C (91.36)
#62 - Ante Brzovic SR 6-10 225 SR, C (94.88) (eligibility?)
#77 - James Scott JR 6-11 210 PF-C (94.36)
#91 - Justin Vander Baan SR 7-0 215 (93.96)
#97 - Enoch Boakye SR 6-10 240 PF-C (93.90)
#121 - Efton Reid SR 7-0 240 C (93.44)
#275 - Josh Gray SR 7-0 255 C (91.36)
Nothing against either of them but no college player should get 6 years I don’t care what circumstances.
It took me 6 years. I blame alcohol, pot, and girls. Wasn’t my fault.
I share some of the doubt about how this roster handles the bully ball of the conference. At the same time those teams are going to have to guard our guys away from the hoop. It seems to be the roster type coach wants to go with. He wants Goode and Leal back. That’s good enough for me. Let’s see what happens.
Absolutely need five more fouls up front and a banger in practice.
it's a shortcoming for sure. One of the risks of having to assemble a full roster with a gun to your head. But, not having another frontcourt guy or 2 is a problem/failure I would think.
I wouldn’t call it a failure. Will it be a problem in some games next year? I think so. But at the same time our roster is going to create some mismatches as well.
You keep saying that, and I have 1 word for you to contemplate: injury. We have 1 player over 6'9" and only 3 over 6'7". I've always said a well-constructed has 3 position depth everywhere: starter, backup, development. What if Bailey gets hurt?
You can only select from the players available and the ones who will consider your school and I appreciate that CDD wants players to fit his system, but if this is the roster we roll with, I think any bball person would say it's lacking depth in the frontcourt. There were frontcourt guys available and for whatever reason, we didn't get them. I woudln't call that a success.
A couple of thoughts.
I don’t wasn’t to quibble about an inch or so. how tall was Barkley, versus Lindeman?
With that being said, I am skeptical that we have enough front court depth for conference play. I will admit that I’m skeptical in general. I’ve seen post after post mentioning their trust in DD. “If player X is good enough for the coach, I trust him and it’s good enough for me”.
I am in the opposite boat. I don’t trust the IU basketball program. I am in a wait and see mentality. For many people it seems that there is a level of confidence with this hire because of the Cig. hire. I’m not there. I’m staring at decades of incompetence, and I’m not convinced that the issue isn’t deeper than the head coach.
Given our track record the past 25 years, I reckon we have a few tricks up our sleeve...
Introducing the "Air Hoosier"
And if that's not enough there's always...
Introducing the "Air Hoosier"
And if that's not enough there's always...
completely fair after the last 25 years of IU bball. I think DeVries is the best we've had since Crean, and he's not as nutty as Crean and will get along better with IN HS coaches, but not confident that's enough. I did love hearing the podcast thing some WVU broadcasters did and their glowing words about CDD, so I'd say I'm cautiously optimistic.
Only thing we can do is guess... as is often the case on here. MY guess is that DeVries likely knows he's thin up front. But given how he intends to play, the cost/benefit/value of nearly all the bigs that have been available, haven't been there for him to throw huge NIL, and/or playing time or role promises, to get any more of them yet.
I appreciate his approach, thus far. He's spending and focusing on what I feel are the most important positions and types of players, to be successful in today's game. Our last coach focused on bigs, in just about every way, and despite having some REALLY good ones, he was never able to put forward any sort of consistently good team. So I'm glad CDD is focusing on perimeter players, shooting, versatility, etc...
Still a lot of time, I suspect all this Goode/Leal talk is BS. He'll get a big of some sort yet, I'm sure. If for no other purpose than depth and practice help.
IF... somehow... Leal and Goode both get another year, and they are the last 2 roster spots... THEN I'd say CDD likely made a mistake bringing both of them back and not getting another big. But even having said that, I'm glad he didn't overpay for a big that didn't fit his system. We can win a lot of games without another big.
I see a lot of people on here point to Florida as DD's player construction model, but Florida had a 6'-9", 6'-10", two 6'-11" dudes and a 7'-1" dude, foul trouble had a backup, IU has no backup! It is hard to be one dimensional in the BT!
Imagine bringing back both of those 24 year olds for a fifth or sixth year when you already have a ton of guards and need big. Even the biggest DD defenders would have to question that move.
I'm concerned. I think we need one more true "big". He could be 6-9 with a great wingspan or 6-9/10 with some good strength/wide body, but I think we need one more dude on the roster. Fouls, injury, is Bailey an inside player or more of a stretch-4???? That said, I'm also in the "in coach we trust" camp. I think we will be able to play some really good team D, especially on the perimeter, with the amount of wings/tall guards we have. Hopefully that will carry the day if need be.
The only references I've seen on here, with regards to Florida, are mentions that Golden had a couple of average years before breaking through and winning a Natty. And that they did it with a good blend of returning talent, and portal guys.
Florida, Houston, Auburn, Duke, they all had good depth with big, long, athletic guys.
I suspect those guys aren't overly easy to find for a coach entering in to his first year, who is quite obviously focusing on shooting, passing, perimeter play to build his program and roster. And the last thing we IU fans want CDD to do, is fill his bench with guys like Berg, Furst, Burgess, etc...
Indiana will be fine if they don't sign another big this offseason. It'll force CDD to play Tucker at the 4, pretty much all the time. But the good thing is, we have a lot of accomplished, versatile, good perimeter players to play...around a rotation of Bailey, Alexis, and Harris at the 5.
It would be a puzzling decision, for sure. I actually think Leal might fill a need, more than Goode does. On paper, we have a full stable of guys that are good and capable shooters. That's Goode's main contribution, or has been. He hasn't really been much of any help rebounding wise, and he is a below average defender. Leal, obviously wouldn't bring much offensively to the table, but he would be a guy you could throw in from time to time to stop/slow down a perimeter scorer/playmaker that's hurting you. To me, that would be Leal's role. Shelstead gets going early, put Leal in for 4-5 minutes to slow him down... There'd probably be a decent amount of games where he wouldn't be needed.
I don't think that need is big enough though, that they should bring him/them back. There has to be a big of some sort, that fits well enough, that CDD could get between now and end of June or so. And then...its all moot anyways... no way all of the needed things happen that would lead to Leal having another year.
Goode is a solid player and will be better under CDD. Does that equate to more playing time maybe 10 mins a game is all he gets. I like Leal but his time should be over. I think the team as assembled will be refreshing and be able to shoot. Not worried about more Bigs that clog the middle. This is the type of team CDD wanted. "My team is on the floor"
I think the 3 deep at every position is the thing of the past. 6'4 to 6'8 guys that can shoot and play man to man D wins in college basketball. The right system with the right players. My team is on the floor. Now I would take Goode and still use last scholarship on a big but do not reach.
It's really not when you watch the teams that advance deep. They all have depth. Having guys that can play multiple positions only adds to that, it's not different. I'm just saying you need to have a starting PG, backup PG and one for depth/development. The backup could well be a shooting guard who can run your offense, or a PF who can defend a 5/post. I think you'd be hardpressed to find a recent champ that wasn't 3 deep at each position. I'm not sure we even have 1 guy who can defend a solid low-post style 5, Alexis would probably be my guess at the best at this point.
Which is why I'd rather have had Dallas James come back over Leal.
We really needed to sign Bidunga.
Probably didn't realize yet how high the market was going on everyone, and so we passed on the big number for a guy who has a lot of developing to do. Or, he just decided to play for the love of his school. (Or, maybe he agrees with a couple posters that Adams is a tool.
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Probably didn't realize yet how high the market was going on everyone, and so we passed on the big number for a guy who has a lot of developing to do. Or, he just decided to play for the love of his school. (Or, maybe he agrees with a couple posters that Adams is a tool.
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If this ends up coming back to bite DD in the behind mid season he has nobody to blame but himself. If you are going to construct a roster of small ball you better hope like heck not any of your three guys 6'8 - 6'10 get hurt.
First of all how reliable is 247’s Portal? I just browsed through it and there was still over 20 eligible players registered as Centers all the way from 5* to 3* with quite a few 4*s. Not really sure how good most of them are but several play P5 schools. How many are still looking is questionable as things change very quickly. Huntley-Hatfield NCS, Scott Louisville, Miller FAU, Ojianwuna BC, Njoku Villanova to name a few. Surely CDD will get one or two of these players.
I think we're in a better spot than it might seem. Even using your 3 layers per position.
PG/Lead guard: Starter-Conerway, Backup-Enright, multi year/depth guy Drake.
Guard/Wings: Starters - Wilkerson and Dorn, Backups - Miles, Drake (both those guys are also multi year guys, as is Dorn).
"4" Man - Starter - DeVries, Backup - Harris and/or Alexis, Depth/Development -Sisley
Post/Big - Starter - Bailey, Backup - Alexis, Depth/Development - Harris
An argument could be made that we actually need some more depth at the guard/wing positions. If DeVries plays 30 minutes per game, and 25 of those are as the "4" man. We've got 115 ish minutes to cover in the 1-3 spots, with 6 guys... And then 55 minutes of play to cover depth behind DeVries at the 4, the few minutes he's playing the 3, and then the 5 man spot... and we have 4 guys to cover those minutes.
We become just as thin with an injury to a guard, as we do with an injury to one of Bailey, Alexis, or Harris...in my opinion.
I do agree we would benefit from another big, either main rotation capable or not. But unless he gets an impactful one, I'm not sure another much big would be more important than another playmaking guard would be.
If he's starting DeVries at the "4", and playing him 30 minutes per game... then I'd say Bailey, Alexis, and Harris is quite a lot of depth for that 5 man role, and the few minutes where 2 of them would play at the same time. Not to mention Sisley being a little bit more of a "big" oriented wing himself...he could add to the depth in that 4-5 rotation as well.
Since they are all getting paid thus professionals, I say Cody Zeller should apply to get his final two seasons of eligibility.
Only two more years? Alot of these guys are getting six years so Zeller would get four more.
I can tell what type of day I've had by what my opinion of this roster is.
Under the circumstances he's done ok. But he's created the circumstances and the majority of the roster is a hodge-podge of defensive challenged low level talent that you overpay when you don't have a staff of merit to pursue portal talent with. Is it better to win 19 games if you only have the talent to win 15, or win 19 when you have the talent to win 25? My answer is,,, the new coach have your sh7t together when you show up and go get your version of the 25 win talent and win 25 games.
Nic Norton and Drew Adams built most of this. That kinda negates "he's been through roster construction and nil before" bs. Staff builds rosters.
Under the circumstances he's done ok. But he's created the circumstances and the majority of the roster is a hodge-podge of defensive challenged low level talent that you overpay when you don't have a staff of merit to pursue portal talent with. Is it better to win 19 games if you only have the talent to win 15, or win 19 when you have the talent to win 25? My answer is,,, the new coach have your sh7t together when you show up and go get your version of the 25 win talent and win 25 games.
Nic Norton and Drew Adams built most of this. That kinda negates "he's been through roster construction and nil before" bs. Staff builds rosters.
He has established a roster of proven, advanced offensive players. Smaller conference POY and all conference level players. I don’t know if he’ll win 25 games or not? He’s playing potentially 3 top 10 teams in the pre conf, and our B10 schedule doesn’t seem very favorable. But his history suggests it’s more likely he’ll win 25 games than it is 18-19.
Is it "small ball" if the team has good size at every position except the 5?
Small ball doesn't win championships. When a team has to guard the interior against players who can score, they get into foul trouble. This missing element will be exploited. I do hope that we are still recruiting.
Interesting question.
my short answer: If the results are identical I prefer a well coached overachieving team.
