i went out for beers and those delicious soft pretzels to watch basketball last night. my one buddy is flying to chicago tomorrow to meet our friend in charlotte and drive to the masters. he turned to our buddy who is a high school teacher and said "wish you were coming with us." he goes yeah next year i'll have more time. this is my last year then i get to retire. our jaws dropped. that's not too shabby either. 50 and full retirement from the school district. said he's going to start another career/job only if it's something that truly appeals to him. and his wife works. i did very little right
IU is a middling academic school
- Thread starter BradStevens
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My son-in-law was accepted by MIT and chose to go to IU, where he was a Wells Scholar - mainly because there's where my daughter - now his wife -went because she was an IU sports fan from birth, with her own IU full scholarship. He wasn't even a Kelly gradute - he was a Chemistry major who got some kind of business certificate. He's now working with Harvard grads, so what does that tell you about IU's reputation?
We're not Purdue, who specializes in accepting foreign students because they can pay full tuition.
The right school will get your in the door, but it's up to you to succeed on your own. Your undergrad school won't matter.
And if he’s a good teacher, he made the world a better place.
I’d prefer my kids do something like that over figure out a better way to sell 5% more Budweiser to consumers, or a better place to move money around for a multinational corporation.
Again, not everyone will agree with me. I get it.
My son-in-law has a degree in Chemistry from IU, but got a business 'certificate' for taking a few business classes.
He's now a bond trader for Wells Fargo. You are wise to counsel them to get a double major or minor in some other area.
It still does matter, but you’re right, you can overcome it.
Of course, that’s my point: it is something to overcome.
When I worked at Cummins, they were hiring Yale grads - one was an English major I knew - and put them in Finance.I love ya' RangerBoarder, but think you're wrong. Plenty of people don't major in biz as an undergrad and go onto work great jobs within business. Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc. don't even offer undergrad business degrees. They all unemployable? You don't think a math major has a shot at a finance job? Plus, if you want, you can (and probably should, nowadays) get an MBA. Here's one article of many on this subject:
8 Reasons Not to Get a Business Degree
Want to major in business? Here are 8 great reasons why you should pick another degree.www.cbsnews.com
And the differrence between econ and business is not splitting hairs.
Of course, J Irwin Miller was a Yale man himself, so the company prioritized Yale grads. The CEO(s) when I was there were from Yale.
Couldn’t disagree more. I was paying my way through college and planning history with a political science minor followed by law school. Half way through my first semester I asked a counselor which degree resulted in the highest starting salaries and was told Quantitative Business Analysis. Told it was considered one of the toughest degrees as well I said I was going for it and did. It required some tougher math, statistics, economics, and computer science classes as well as the finance, production and marketing courses. It was challenging. It prepared me well for the real world and for a military career of leading people as well as strategic, operational and tactical thinking and decision making. Isn’t that what college is for - preparing people to succeed and contribute in life?
I wish my daughter had listened to me. Her Bachelor’s in Communications mostly prepared me to be ready to pay for her postgraduate degree. She’s about to finish that.
I think your idea that business degrees don’t challenge students to think or that they don’t learn most is so off the mark it’s laughable. It strikes me as something an elitist person ignorant of the subject would say.
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That article contradicts everything I’ve ever read on most practical undergrad degrees and every bit of my experience in the real world, including my post-military world. Frankly, it’s very difficult to believe it.I love ya' RangerBoarder, but think you're wrong. Plenty of people don't major in biz as an undergrad and go onto work great jobs within business. Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc. don't even offer undergrad business degrees. They all unemployable? You don't think a math major has a shot at a finance job? Plus, if you want, you can (and probably should, nowadays) get an MBA. Here's one article of many on this subject:
8 Reasons Not to Get a Business Degree
Want to major in business? Here are 8 great reasons why you should pick another degree.
And the differrence between econ and business is not splitting hairs.
lmao If you knew my redneck background, you'd be surprised.
My daughter is smart, but she had her mother and I - both MBAs - making sure she got her grades.
My wife and I both are from working class families and neither one of us were all that outstanding academically. But we were both had an internal drive to succeed and I've come to believe you either have that or you don't. I guess we were fortunate to be born with it.
Now, my son-in-law is just a genius. I think when he was in grade school he had the maturity of a 50 year old. Just one of those guys who succeeds in everything. I feel fortunate my daughter didn't choose a tattoo artist.
Trust me - I'm not holding myself out as an example of academic achievement.
These are Big Ten schools, though. You start with a pretty high bar relative to other conferences. I hear you for sure, but Big Ten is pretty strong regardless of where IU lands within that grouping (even if it's declining).
Big Ten schools ranked academically by U.S. News for 2024
Ranking Big Ten schools by most recent academic supremacy!wolverineswire.usatoday.com
To me, this is more disappointing than our decades of irrelevance in athletics.
More importantly, I echo your comments on business school degrees. I respect people who go that route and getting in and doing well is probably a marker, but in my experience a lot of it is irrelevant. If you're going to work in an organization, getting your paper doesn't go so far. Substantive knowledge helps, but basically no college grads have any working knowledge of anything that makes a difference. What will make a difference in the longer sweep is an ability to problem solve, to think, to collaborate, to simplify, to communicate, and more. I'd put more stock in a liberal arts or sciences major to do those things. Pretty sure the proof is in the pudding on that count. The notion that college is wholly transactional doesn't hold up imo. But if you're all about the paper or just doing your own thing, then nothing about the substance of college really matters. I've not been impressed by the abilities of that group for what it's worth.
Who's RangerBoarder?I love ya' RangerBoarder, but think you're wrong. Plenty of people don't major in biz as an undergrad and go onto work great jobs within business. Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc. don't even offer undergrad business degrees. They all unemployable? You don't think a math major has a shot at a finance job? Plus, if you want, you can (and probably should, nowadays) get an MBA. Here's one article of many on this subject:
8 Reasons Not to Get a Business Degree
Want to major in business? Here are 8 great reasons why you should pick another degree.
And the differrence between econ and business is not splitting hairs.
I'm less sure of that than you are and I work in business. Whatever "business" means. I'd factor in also that we don't pay enough attention to who is screening people and if they know what they are doing.
Bad Wakeboarder s former handle was IU Ranger. Mine was Brad Stevens. I’m a simple man.
Did you need college to do your job?
I know that I would have learned more doing a 2 year apprenticeship under a pharmacist. 98% of the school stuff I do not use. And they keep adding years. What started as a 4 year degree is now 6. It’s ignorant and not needed
He’s an excellent teacher and a super guy. But he’s also our age. Not sure how teachers coming up afford cars and homes etc now
It means AB, United Healthcare, Centene? lily etc go to business schools to recruit and interview. Or restrict applicants to certain degrees in the qualifications. So if you majored in art history how do you get in the door
I think competence is quite a bit more rare than people appreciate. I wouldn't assume that UH, Lilly, and others have the corner on wisdom or figuring it out. A lot of folks spend lots of energy on thinking through what their paper will get them in the immediate term. Fast forward 5 or 10 years and that group can't get out of their own way, innovate, lead people, deal with obstacles, or produce outcomes. What is today doesn't mean it's effective or informed or competent. But the type of person involved in that process typically doesn't have the skills to question any of it or to do better. Winning matters. And that's a long-term trek.
50 and full retirement in education? How? Did he start teaching when he was 12?
Okay that’s all great and may be 100 percent true but I’m talking in practice. My ex stoker’s nephew is at Kelley. He was talking about summer internships at corps he was interviewing for that came through iu. Are poly sci majors getting those same opps? English majors? My suspicion is no. I haven’t been on an interview since the 90s so I could be wrong but that’s what I surmise
My guess is that your instincts are correct but companies need easy ways to vet. There’s 14,000 kids at Kelley. One school. How many college kids across the country. 500 Fortune 500…..( and that’s having taken college algebra 11x). I think today studying for edification is a luxury given the cost of college and that you have to major in shit that opens doors with the least obstacles - unfortunately
And I'm suggesting the easy ways to vet lead to poor outcomes. The U.S. doesn't do well with accountability at any level. And again, who's doing that vetting. That's likely not a directive flowing from top leadership.
Why are the lawyers on this site dissing those of us with business undergraduate degrees? 
I have two postgraduate degrees too, and based on what I've seen here I don't think it would be too tough to add a law degree too, just for grins and giggles because I plan to retire-retire (military-civilian) in August.
I have two postgraduate degrees too, and based on what I've seen here I don't think it would be too tough to add a law degree too, just for grins and giggles because I plan to retire-retire (military-civilian) in August.
Just me, but I'm not dissing it. I'm just saying that's hardly the end-all, be-all that people make it out to be and it's not anything like a predictor of success.Why are the lawyers on this site dissing those of us with business undergraduate degrees?
Brad's a lawyer too. I wish my daughter had gotten a business degree instead of majoring in Communications. It would have saved me tons of money! However, she wouldn't listen to Dad. What's new?
She wasn't ready for college and I thought she should take a year off, but instead she basically flunked most of her courses the first year. Took her seven years all together and ended up on the Dean's list her last two years as she finally figured it out. Now she's ABT (All But Thesis) for her Master which has already gotten her job. Should have the Masters before the end of this semester. Finally!
Without even knowing you, I'm pretty sure she listened to you a lot over many years. I'm sure you are (and definitely should be) a proud dad.Brad's a lawyer too. I wish my daughter had gotten a business degree instead of majoring in Communications. It would have saved me tons of money! However, she wouldn't listen to Dad. What's new?
They do. By quality of institution. GPA. Major plays a part. Not the whole part.
I don’t mean to diss it, just think universities should be devoted to something different.Brad's a lawyer too. I wish my daughter had gotten a business degree instead of majoring in Communications. It would have saved me tons of money! However, she wouldn't listen to Dad. What's new?
I’m a purist. It pisses me off that my kid’s high school gives credit for drivers ed.
Thanks. Joking for the most part. She did go from being Daddy's Little Girl and Daddy knew everything, to an alien who thought Dad knew next to nothing overnight and it lasted a few years. She knows she's been blessed and spoiled by never being financially wanting and she is grateful and says thank you a lot.
Law school is not hard. Engineering was far more difficult - by several magnitudes.Why are the lawyers on this site dissing those of us with business undergraduate degrees?
Hey! I got credit for Driver's Ed too. Got an A. My girlfriend who was valedictorian got a B - the only B she got from 1-12! She was Asian-American, so there is that.
She's a MD and about to retire herself. Did undergrad and Medical School in a total of six years.
Had a speaker at a forum in which I attend who was a Kelly Econ major.
His father was a CPA.
The speaker contended an Econ major was like a CPA with a personality
Yeah I’m so confused I’m done participating. I’m being told that you don’t need a business degree to get in to a business role out of college. I’m at my 3rd fortune 200 company, with a distributed team around the world. What do I know? I’m out.Why are the lawyers on this site dissing those of us with business undergraduate degrees?
I’m not at all. I wish I’d have gone to biz schoolWhy are the lawyers on this site dissing those of us with business undergraduate degrees?
