Will IU create a GM role for basketball?

[PhyloeBedoe]

Since college basketball has become a pro league of its own, will the next IU basketball coaching regime include a GM? We see this happening already, w Stanford creating a GM position for their football program and hiring Andrew Luck.

I can definitely see it happening if they end up going with a younger coach. In fact, Dolson already made a somewhat similar move when he hired Matta along with Woodson, although that had more to do with transitioning Woodson’s recruiting, as Woodson was new to the NCAA and recruiting. I can envision an older established coach (Pearl, for instance) who is accustomed to running every single aspect of his program, and won’t want to relinquish control there. But for me, this is less about recruiting, and more NIL $$ management.

NIL money is increasing by the day, and while it’s currently manageable, it can easily get out of control. Some may think it already is out of control. Nevertheless I see the whole mess needing its own leadership and management, especially when you consider that if left unmanned, you are allowing clowns like the Hoosier hysterics knuckleheads being de facto NIL leaders in this area. (As an aside, HHs created a significant conflict of interest this season, as they were signing and negotiating contracts with players, while openly advocating for Woody’s firing. So who’s their boss? Woody or the HHs? I just don’t understand how the guys signing checks for players can be out there openly rooting for the firing of the coach, even if firing woody was justified.)

Moving forward, I see guys like HHs being marginalized, and a GM position being created that handles NIL money, and who negotiate, signs and manages the contracts. In fact, I see it as an inevitability. How will this impact the next hire?

 

[Tammany Hall]

I don’t think we have a GM for football, and football is bigger and more complex than bball. Sort of leads me to believe a GM isn’t needed yet?

Btw the HH conflict is absurd, and given their lack of disclosures I bet they skim from the donations. Everyone who wants to give should go to Hoosiers Connect.

 

[ams66]

I don’t think we have a GM for football, and football is bigger and more complex than bball. Sort of leads me to believe a GM isn’t needed yet?

Btw the HH conflict is absurd, and given their lack of disclosures I bet they skim from the donations. Everyone who wants to give should go to Hoosiers Connect.

Or just give to the players directly. Surprised they don't all have their venmo addresses listed, or that there isn't something like a Patreon for athletes. Any kind of NIL "collective" is going to be paying themselves too.

 

[kmathum]

Since college basketball has become a pro league of its own, will the next IU basketball coaching regime include a GM? We see this happening already, w Stanford creating a GM position for their football program and hiring Andrew Luck.

I can definitely see it happening if they end up going with a younger coach. In fact, Dolson already made a somewhat similar move when he hired Matta along with Woodson, although that had more to do with transitioning Woodson’s recruiting, as Woodson was new to the NCAA and recruiting. I can envision an older established coach (Pearl, for instance) who is accustomed to running every single aspect of his program, and won’t want to relinquish control there. But for me, this is less about recruiting, and more NIL $$ management.

NIL money is increasing by the day, and while it’s currently manageable, it can easily get out of control. Some may think it already is out of control. Nevertheless I see the whole mess needing its own leadership and management, especially when you consider that if left unmanned, you are allowing clowns like the Hoosier hysterics knuckleheads being de facto NIL leaders in this area. (As an aside, HHs created a significant conflict of interest this season, as they were signing and negotiating contracts with players, while openly advocating for Woody’s firing. So who’s their boss? Woody or the HHs? I just don’t understand how the guys signing checks for players can be out there openly rooting for the firing of the coach, even if firing woody was justified.)

Moving forward, I see guys like HHs being marginalized, and a GM position being created that handles NIL money, and who negotiate, signs and manages the contracts. In fact, I see it as an inevitability. How will this impact the next hire?

I thought we already had one.

 

[Bucket Getter]

I thought we already had one.

Is it the statue that sits next to Woody every game?

 

[kmathum]

Is it the statue that sits next to Woody every game?

No. I think he works for football also. Can't recall his name.

 

[kkott]

Since college basketball has become a pro league of its own, will the next IU basketball coaching regime include a GM? We see this happening already, w Stanford creating a GM position for their football program and hiring Andrew Luck.

I can definitely see it happening if they end up going with a younger coach. In fact, Dolson already made a somewhat similar move when he hired Matta along with Woodson, although that had more to do with transitioning Woodson’s recruiting, as Woodson was new to the NCAA and recruiting. I can envision an older established coach (Pearl, for instance) who is accustomed to running every single aspect of his program, and won’t want to relinquish control there. But for me, this is less about recruiting, and more NIL $$ management.

NIL money is increasing by the day, and while it’s currently manageable, it can easily get out of control. Some may think it already is out of control. Nevertheless I see the whole mess needing its own leadership and management, especially when you consider that if left unmanned, you are allowing clowns like the Hoosier hysterics knuckleheads being de facto NIL leaders in this area. (As an aside, HHs created a significant conflict of interest this season, as they were signing and negotiating contracts with players, while openly advocating for Woody’s firing. So who’s their boss? Woody or the HHs? I just don’t understand how the guys signing checks for players can be out there openly rooting for the firing of the coach, even if firing woody was justified.)

Moving forward, I see guys like HHs being marginalized, and a GM position being created that handles NIL money, and who negotiate, signs and manages the contracts. In fact, I see it as an inevitability. How will this impact the next hire?

What exactly does a Director Of Basketball Operations do, and how would a GM be different? We, and I think most programs, already have the DOBO position. I do think a position overseeing NIL would be wise, sort of like a Salary Cap Mgr/Specialist, but also responsible for securing NIL donors.

 

[kkott]

I don’t think we have a GM for football, and football is bigger and more complex than bball. Sort of leads me to believe a GM isn’t needed yet?

Btw the HH conflict is absurd, and given their lack of disclosures I bet they skim from the donations. Everyone who wants to give should go to Hoosiers Connect.

What's the HH conflict? I think they are already absurd, so no idea why anyone would entrust any $$ to them.

 

[PhyloeBedoe]

What exactly does a Director Of Basketball Operations do, and how would a GM be different? We, and I think most programs, already have the DOBO position. I do think a position overseeing NIL would be wise, sort of like a Salary Cap Mgr/Specialist, but also responsible for securing NIL donors.

My understanding w DOBO is that is a person organizing day to day, like, a scheduling hotel rooms, plane tickets, and meals, and such. Middle manager type stuff, not top line tasks like contacts and what will probably end up being a salary cap.

 

[IUNorth]

Since college basketball has become a pro league of its own, will the next IU basketball coaching regime include a GM? We see this happening already, w Stanford creating a GM position for their football program and hiring Andrew Luck.

I can definitely see it happening if they end up going with a younger coach. In fact, Dolson already made a somewhat similar move when he hired Matta along with Woodson, although that had more to do with transitioning Woodson’s recruiting, as Woodson was new to the NCAA and recruiting. I can envision an older established coach (Pearl, for instance) who is accustomed to running every single aspect of his program, and won’t want to relinquish control there. But for me, this is less about recruiting, and more NIL $$ management.

NIL money is increasing by the day, and while it’s currently manageable, it can easily get out of control. Some may think it already is out of control. Nevertheless I see the whole mess needing its own leadership and management, especially when you consider that if left unmanned, you are allowing clowns like the Hoosier hysterics knuckleheads being de facto NIL leaders in this area. (As an aside, HHs created a significant conflict of interest this season, as they were signing and negotiating contracts with players, while openly advocating for Woody’s firing. So who’s their boss? Woody or the HHs? I just don’t understand how the guys signing checks for players can be out there openly rooting for the firing of the coach, even if firing woody was justified.)

Moving forward, I see guys like HHs being marginalized, and a GM position being created that handles NIL money, and who negotiate, signs and manages the contracts. In fact, I see it as an inevitability. How will this impact the next hire?

All the more reason to just "make Stevens happen". He could accomplish all of the above, and set up our program for this inevitable future of college basketball. And I could easily see Stevens being excited to be a guy that's "revolutionizing" how college bball programs are run.

But outside that happening, yes...I could see something like that coming to fruition. It already is in football. And more and more basketball coaches are starting to refer to assistants in more organizational..."Football" like terms. Offensive coordinator, defensive coordinator, etc...

I say this only half jokingly.

Lawrence Frank - GM 4 years, 4 million per
Ben McCollum - Head Basketball Coach (defensive coordinator) 6 years, 5 million per
Jim Crutchfield - Associate Head Coach (offensive coordinator) 4 years, 2 million per
The rest of McCollum's staff

***all with performance bonuses on top of this.

Stevens and Pearl would likely be in that 10-11 million per year range...This gets you 3 guys for that money.

Obviously I have NO CLUE if those 3 would get a long. If any of them would want to be in a situation like that, etc... But each of them could probalby get raises, McCollum and Crutchfield significant raises, and be a part of something pretty special and groundbreaking. Out of the box approach and thinking...obviously unlikely...but if we are hurtling towards College BBall being ran like professional franchises...lets get out in front of that with 3 really great and successful people leading the charge.

You could obviously do this same thing without Crutchfield. I just was thinking about how much he could add to any program as an assistant...and teaching his offensive style and principles. A Frank/McCollum combination would be incredible.

 

[Tammany Hall]

What's the HH conflict? I think they are already absurd, so no idea why anyone would entrust any $$ to them.

They aren’t much of our NIL, but they are some of it. It’s awkward to be working closely with IU and paying players to come to here and also being openly critical of those same people on a podcast. This led to the blow up with the bball program.

They should have to pick — NIL or opinionated podcast, but not both.

 

[kkott]

They aren’t much of our NIL, but they are some of it. It’s awkward to be working closely with IU and paying players to come to here and also being openly critical of those same people on a podcast. This led to the blow up with the bball program.

They should have to pick — NIL or opinionated podcast, but not both.

"working closely with IU"? I hope anyone at IU is smarter than that. You can't stop someone from starting a podcast, and I doubt you can stop anyone from starting an NIL fund. I guess players could opt not to take it, but I think you or I could start an NIL fund anytime. Hopefully everyone at IU has done all they can to distance themselves from HH and to encourage them to shut their NIL and donate to HFG or any other "established" NIL collective.

 

[kmathum]

My understanding w DOBO is that is a person organizing day to day, like, a scheduling hotel rooms, plane tickets, and meals, and such. Middle manager type stuff, not top line tasks like contacts and what will probably end up being a salary cap.

Kinda like the assistant to the traveling secretary.

 

[ams66]

They aren’t much of our NIL, but they are some of it. It’s awkward to be working closely with IU and paying players to come to here and also being openly critical of those same people on a podcast. This led to the blow up with the bball program.

They should have to pick — NIL or opinionated podcast, but not both.

As I understand it, the courts have decided you can't prevent anyone from giving a player money. Except maybe the school itself, but that may just be a consequence of their own/NCAA rules.

 

[Tammany Hall]

"working closely with IU"? I hope anyone at IU is smarter than that. You can't stop someone from starting a podcast, and I doubt you can stop anyone from starting an NIL fund. I guess players could opt not to take it, but I think you or I could start an NIL fund anytime. Hopefully everyone at IU has done all they can to distance themselves from HH and to encourage them to shut their NIL and donate to HFG or any other "established" NIL collective.

When IU provides an NIL offer to a recruit they have to organize the funding on the backend, which sometimes includes dealing with the HH. They suck, I would guess best case IU continues to minimize them as a funding source.

 

[Pazhoosier85]

I don’t think we have a GM for football, and football is bigger and more complex than bball. Sort of leads me to believe a GM isn’t needed yet?

Btw the HH conflict is absurd, and given their lack of disclosures I bet they skim from the donations. Everyone who wants to give should go to Hoosiers Connect.

Football does have a GM it it just under a different title. Assistant athletic director for player personnel sounds a lot like a GM. Doesn't basketball have a a similar role?

Matt Wilson - Assistant Athletic Director for Player Personnel - Football Support Staff - Indiana University Athletics

Matt Wilson was hired as the assistant athletic director for player personnel by Indiana head football coach Curt Cignetti on Jan. 10, 2024. Wilson joins the...

iuhoosiers.com

 

[Tammany Hall]

Football does have a GM it it just under a different title. Assistant athletic director for player personnel sounds a lot like a GM. Doesn't basketball have a a similar role?

Matt Wilson - Assistant Athletic Director for Player Personnel - Football Support Staff - Indiana University Athletics

Matt Wilson was hired as the assistant athletic director for player personnel by Indiana head football coach Curt Cignetti on Jan. 10, 2024. Wilson joins the...

iuhoosiers.com

Thanks. Not sure I don’t know the inner workings well enough.

 

[Pazhoosier85]

Armond Hill - Men's Basketball Coach - Indiana University Athletics

Hill is in his fourth seasons as the program’s Assistant Athletic Director of Basketball Administration after being hired on June 9, 2021. Hill offers over 5...

iuhoosiers.com

Isn't this guy essentially the current GM for basketball?

 

[IUNorth]

When IU provides an NIL offer to a recruit they have to organize the funding on the backend, which sometimes includes dealing with the HH. They suck, I would guess best case IU continues to minimize them as a funding source.

At some point in the near future, Rev Sharing will be shaking all this up yet again. I strongly believe, from common sense, but also some limited "inside knowledge", that once Rev Sharing is fully in play...that the NCAA will look to get "stronger" and actually start enforcing NIL, so its back to what its original intent was.

I would think even mid major programs would benefit from a "GM" type role for their athletic departments. Some would argue that's the AD's role...but knowing ALL the various hats an AD has to wear... most of them would need someone else to take on managing Rev Share, NIL, etc...

 

[Tammany Hall]

At some point in the near future, Rev Sharing will be shaking all this up yet again. I strongly believe, from common sense, but also some limited "inside knowledge", that once Rev Sharing is fully in play...that the NCAA will look to get "stronger" and actually start enforcing NIL, so its back to what its original intent was.

I would think even mid major programs would benefit from a "GM" type role for their athletic departments. Some would argue that's the AD's role...but knowing ALL the various hats an AD has to wear... most of them would need someone else to take on managing Rev Share, NIL, etc...

Yea. For discussions sake, I’m skeptical of the NIL Clearinghouse concept. When mega program OSU, Texas, Michigan, etc. wants to pay a player a few million in NIL, good luck stopping that and not having the school and player upset and probably suing. I could also see it violating labor laws and alumni lawmakers getting involved too. It’s just hard to stop players from getting paid.

 

[MichaelRR]

At some point in the near future, Rev Sharing will be shaking all this up yet again. I strongly believe, from common sense, but also some limited "inside knowledge", that once Rev Sharing is fully in play...that the NCAA will look to get "stronger" and actually start enforcing NIL, so its back to what its original intent was.

I would think even mid major programs would benefit from a "GM" type role for their athletic departments. Some would argue that's the AD's role...but knowing ALL the various hats an AD has to wear... most of them would need someone else to take on managing Rev Share, NIL, etc...

Mid-Majors are already hemorrhaging money from their athletic departments BEFORE the order that they have to start paying players. They cannot afford another high 6 or 7 figure salary in their athletic departments while drowning in red ink. Other than the SEC and Big Ten, every other conference and university is going to struggle very hard with their finances and I will not be surprised to start seeing lower conference teams to start dropping athletics entirely.

 

[ams66]

Mid-Majors are already hemorrhaging money from their athletic departments BEFORE the order that they have to start paying players. They cannot afford another high 6 or 7 figure salary in their athletic departments while drowning in red ink. Other than the SEC and Big Ten, every other conference and university is going to struggle very hard with their finances and I will not be surprised to start seeing lower conference teams to start dropping athletics entirely.

Or they will just play on as before, they won't be able to recruit the same calibre of player but there are still lots of kids who would love to be able to go to college on a scholarship and play a sport that they love.

 

[kkott]

When IU provides an NIL offer to a recruit they have to organize the funding on the backend, which sometimes includes dealing with the HH. They suck, I would guess best case IU continues to minimize them as a funding source.

well, again, the smart move for the school is to distance themselves as much as possible from HH and encourage them not to have any involvement with the university beyond "press". The school should be promoting which NIL's they have good working relationships with and I think even auditing the NILs to insure collected funds are going to the athletes (may already be a requirement for a collective). If the school isn't promoting them as a "sanctioned" NIL I would guess their funding would take enough of a hit to minimize their influence.

 

[MichaelRR]

Or they will just play on as before, they won't be able to recruit the same calibre of player but there are still lots of kids who would love to be able to go to college on a scholarship and play a sport that they love.

Until the next lawsuit MANDATES the schools paying out the 20.5 million per year across all sports, including even split between men's and women's sports per title 9 lawsuits already in the courts.

 

[Tammany Hall]

Until the next lawsuit MANDATES the schools paying out the 20.5 million per year across all sports, including even split between men's and women's sports per title 9 lawsuits already in the courts.

Title 9 split was rescinded today.

 

[Tammany Hall]

well, again, the smart move for the school is to distance themselves as much as possible from HH and encourage them not to have any involvement with the university beyond "press". The school should be promoting which NIL's they have good working relationships with and I think even auditing the NILs to insure collected funds are going to the athletes (may already be a requirement for a collective). If the school isn't promoting them as a "sanctioned" NIL I would guess their funding would take enough of a hit to minimize their influence.

That’s what I would do. Especially the audits and just requiring best practice financial controls.

 

[wi_hoosier]

Since college basketball has become a pro league of its own, will the next IU basketball coaching regime include a GM? We see this happening already, w Stanford creating a GM position for their football program and hiring Andrew Luck.

I can definitely see it happening if they end up going with a younger coach. In fact, Dolson already made a somewhat similar move when he hired Matta along with Woodson, although that had more to do with transitioning Woodson’s recruiting, as Woodson was new to the NCAA and recruiting. I can envision an older established coach (Pearl, for instance) who is accustomed to running every single aspect of his program, and won’t want to relinquish control there. But for me, this is less about recruiting, and more NIL $$ management.

NIL money is increasing by the day, and while it’s currently manageable, it can easily get out of control. Some may think it already is out of control. Nevertheless I see the whole mess needing its own leadership and management, especially when you consider that if left unmanned, you are allowing clowns like the Hoosier hysterics knuckleheads being de facto NIL leaders in this area. (As an aside, HHs created a significant conflict of interest this season, as they were signing and negotiating contracts with players, while openly advocating for Woody’s firing. So who’s their boss? Woody or the HHs? I just don’t understand how the guys signing checks for players can be out there openly rooting for the firing of the coach, even if firing woody was justified.)

Moving forward, I see guys like HHs being marginalized, and a GM position being created that handles NIL money, and who negotiate, signs and manages the contracts. In fact, I see it as an inevitability. How will this impact the next hire?

I brought this up almost two years ago when NIL became a thing, and people here thought I was crazy. Now schools are doing it for football.

Yes, I think IU should get ahead of the curve and have a GM for basketball. Besides just NIL responsibilities, there is also the idea of a GM led scouting department is ready and ahead of the game with portal transfers. THough it is not exactly like, but the concept is not unlike trades. Pro teams have profile on players, minor leaguers too for MLB teams, that they can poince on with transaction opportunities. A portal entry is a transaction opportunity. And in some cases one that needs to be looked at very quickly.

 

[IUNorth]

I brought this up almost two years ago when NIL became a thing, and people here thought I was crazy. Now schools are doing it for football.

Yes, I think IU should get ahead of the curve and have a GM for basketball. Besides just NIL responsibilities, there is also the idea of a GM led scouting department is ready and ahead of the game with portal transfers. THough it is not exactly like, but the concept is not unlike trades. Pro teams have profile on players, minor leaguers too for MLB teams, that they can poince on with transaction opportunities. A portal entry is a transaction opportunity. And in some cases one that needs to be looked at very quickly.

Also...someone that could manage foreign scouts. With the NIL/Rev sharing now involved, I would think American colleges will be more and more attractive to teenage foreign stars that have opted to stay overseas and develop with their own pro leagues. The teams that already have those pipelines established, are thriving with key foreign recruits most years.

 

[kkott]

Also...someone that could manage foreign scouts. With the NIL/Rev sharing now involved, I would think American colleges will be more and more attractive to teenage foreign stars that have opted to stay overseas and develop with their own pro leagues. The teams that already have those pipelines established, are thriving with key foreign recruits most years.

Attractive foreign athletes? Hmmmm................. anything in a 2 piece?

 

[PhyloeBedoe]

I brought this up almost two years ago when NIL became a thing, and people here thought I was crazy. Now schools are doing it for football.

Yes, I think IU should get ahead of the curve and have a GM for basketball. Besides just NIL responsibilities, there is also the idea of a GM led scouting department is ready and ahead of the game with portal transfers. THough it is not exactly like, but the concept is not unlike trades. Pro teams have profile on players, minor leaguers too for MLB teams, that they can poince on with transaction opportunities. A portal entry is a transaction opportunity. And in some cases one that needs to be looked at very quickly.

My thoughts exactly. Additionally, these players are now being repped by agents. I’d like to have a guy in charge that will be experienced in dealing and negotiating with agents/reps. Should that be the coach? Probably not. The tried and true organizational makeup of the existing pro leagues will likely be coming to IU in the near future, including a GM.

 

[kmathum]

Or they will just play on as before, they won't be able to recruit the same calibre of player but there are still lots of kids who would love to be able to go to college on a scholarship and play a sport that they love.

Maybe something along the lines of ivy league schools.

 

[ulrey]

Is it the statue that sits next to Woody every game?

It’s a mannequin!