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OT - Not looking good


Long wished IU had a consistently relevant women's VB Team. Great game and IU has always seemed as good a candidate as any to become a perennial powerhouse in the sport.

very poor journalism.

lots of generalizations, exactly zero specifics.

what exactly was said to the players?

what exactly was done to the players?

the problems if real, can't be addressed without knowing the specifics.
 
very poor journalism.

lots of generalizations, exactly zero specifics.

what exactly was said to the players?

what exactly was done to the players?

the problems if real, can't be addressed without knowing the specifics.
That is what I thought. Facts are required.

Organizations like IU have to manage people out either quickly or with a great deal of due diligence.

Either one requires facts and evidence.
 
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very poor journalism.

lots of generalizations, exactly zero specifics.

what exactly was said to the players?

what exactly was done to the players?

the problems if real, can't be addressed without knowing the specifics.
Its a follow up article. The specifics were in the original article, which you can surely find. As I remember it three months later, Aird was essentially so abusive to some players that they just quit playing.

The original article was full of specifics, and included interviews with several former players.

15 of Aird's 25 recruits are no longer with the team. That practically Creanian. Actually, thats worse than Crean. At least some of Crean's kids left to go pro.
 
Its a follow up article. The specifics were in the original article, which you can surely find. As I remember it three months later, Aird was essentially so abusive to some players that they just quit playing.

The original article was full of specifics, and included interviews with several former players.

15 of Aird's 25 recruits are no longer with the team. That practically Creanian. Actually, thats worse than Crean. At least some of Crean's kids left to go pro.
14 players are returning!
 
14 players are returning!
I will give you...that doesnt make sense. In one paragraph, they say 15 of Aird's 25 players have left, but in another paragraph, the article says 14 players are returning.

Maybe walk-ons aren't being counted in the 25, but are being counted as returning players. That is not clear.
 
very poor journalism.

lots of generalizations, exactly zero specifics.

what exactly was said to the players?

what exactly was done to the players?

the problems if real, can't be addressed without knowing the specifics.
Just post them, don't write them. That being said, and as I said, "not looking good", or sounding like a Program in the ascendant. The fact that such a piece was written at all, rather than one containing any upbeat, positive, promising anecdotes or the like indicates something is amiss.

Seems an awful of smoke for there not to be a fire, which may be why some specifics are withheld since such often only serves to inflame a situation. However, if they weren't before, can be damn sure someone is paying attention...
 
The link to the original article with all the specifics is literally in the first sentence of this latest article.

Over three months ago, the Indiana Daily Student published an investigation on Indiana volleyball head coach Steve Aird, detailing a program built around punishment, rife with mental abuse and where players say mental health concerns were regularly dismissed.
 
Its a follow up article. The specifics were in the original article, which you can surely find. As I remember it three months later, Aird was essentially so abusive to some players that they just quit playing.

The original article was full of specifics, and included interviews with several former players.

15 of Aird's 25 recruits are no longer with the team. That practically Creanian. Actually, thats worse than Crean. At least some of Crean's kids left to go pro.

The link to the original article with all the specifics is literally in the first sentence of this latest article.


i read the linked original article when i read the OP's linked follow up one.

obviously neither of you trolls did.

absolutely zero specifics as to anything the coach in question said or did in either article.

ZERO.

very bad journalism on the part of the IDS and the authors.

nothing but trolling on you 2's part..
 
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i read the linked original article when i read the OP's linked follow up one.

obviously neither of you trolls did.

absolutely zero specifics as to anything the coach in question said or did in either article.

ZERO.

very bad journalism on the part of the IDS and the authors.

nothing but trolling on you 2's part..
Trolling? Doesn’t fit my opinion of either of those 2 posters.
 
i read the linked original article when i read the OP's linked follow up one.

obviously neither of you trolls did.

absolutely zero specifics as to anything the coach in question said or did in either article.

ZERO.

very bad journalism on the part of the IDS and the authors.

nothing but trolling on you 2's part..
What are you talking about? Original article is full of particular incidents and allegations going all the way back to his time at Maryland. Interviews with former players, program alumna, and parents abound. Feel free to put me on ignore if you think I'm trolling.
 
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What are you talking about? Original article is full of particular incidents and allegations going all the way back to his time at Maryland. Interviews with former players and parents abound. Feel free to put me on ignore if you think I'm trolling.


probably why you couldn't quote so much as one specific thing from any of the articles said coach said or did.

do you just not grasp what facts and specifics are, vs generalizations made by others.

the guy could be a total D-bag, but those articles were just terrible journalism.
 
do you just not grasp what facts and specifics are, vs generalizations made by others.
Tell me you didn't read the original article, without saying you didn't read the original article.

Anyone who read it, knows that even after taking the anonymous quotes out, it doesn't paint a pretty picture of the coach and how he treats players.
 
Tell me you didn't read the original article, without saying you didn't read the original article.

Anyone who read it, knows that even after taking the anonymous quotes out, it doesn't paint a pretty picture of the coach and how he treats players.


"Tell me you didn't read the original article, without saying you didn't read the original article".
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WHUT?

and still waiting for those specifics.
 
i read the linked original article when i read the OP's linked follow up one.

obviously neither of you trolls did.

absolutely zero specifics as to anything the coach in question said or did in either article.

ZERO.

very bad journalism on the part of the IDS and the authors.

nothing but trolling on you 2's part..
I read the article 3 months ago when it was originally published. I don't know why I'd have to read it to you again, but okay, here goes:

15 of the 25 girls Aird recruited quit, got cut, or transferred.

He runs practices so hard the girls throw up.

He is verbally abusive, screaming at them, calling them stupid.

He suggested two players were playing badly because they were ****ing the same guy.

He asked to see a player's butt tattoo.

5 of the 6 players they interviewed were in counseling after they played for Aird.

Practice video of at least one of his abusive tirades has disappeared.

IU investigated Aird, but cancelled interviews because they had already decided they weren't firing him.

Aird denies some of these allegations.

Enough facts? Am I still a troll? Or, maybe I have a journalism degree and know that, for a student-written article, this is pretty good journalism.

Either way, your claim that the article contains zero specifics about what the coach said or did is simply false. A blatant lie.
 
I read the article 3 months ago when it was originally published. I don't know why I'd have to read it to you again, but okay, here goes:

15 of the 25 girls Aird recruited quit, got cut, or transferred.

He runs practices so hard the girls throw up.

He is verbally abusive, screaming at them, calling them stupid.

He suggested two players were playing badly because they were ****ing the same guy.

He asked to see a player's butt tattoo.

5 of the 6 players they interviewed were in counseling after they played for Aird.

Practice video of at least one of his abusive tirades has disappeared.

IU investigated Aird, but cancelled interviews because they had already decided they weren't firing him.

Aird denies some of these allegations.

Enough facts? Am I still a troll? Or, maybe I have a journalism degree and know that, for a student-written article, this is pretty good journalism.

Either way, your claim that the article contains zero specifics about what the coach said or did is simply false. A blatant lie.
i have the feeling that if he wins, all will be forgiven.
 
I read the article 3 months ago when it was originally published. I don't know why I'd have to read it to you again, but okay, here goes:

15 of the 25 girls Aird recruited quit, got cut, or transferred.

He runs practices so hard the girls throw up.

He is verbally abusive, screaming at them, calling them stupid.

He suggested two players were playing badly because they were ****ing the same guy.

He asked to see a player's butt tattoo.

5 of the 6 players they interviewed were in counseling after they played for Aird.

Practice video of at least one of his abusive tirades has disappeared.

IU investigated Aird, but cancelled interviews because they had already decided they weren't firing him.

Aird denies some of these allegations.

Enough facts? Am I still a troll? Or, maybe I have a journalism degree and know that, for a student-written article, this is pretty good journalism.

Either way, your claim that the article contains zero specifics about what the coach said or did is simply false. A blatant lie.
He's projecting. If anyone's a troll, it's him. I just put him on ignore and will no longer deal with his tin foil hat takes and dumb comments.
 
For all the finger pointing and accusations of cover up we call MSU and Izzo for, THIS IS THE SAME THING! “If he wins, all will be forgiven “? Really? Abuse comes in many forms
 
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For all the finger pointing and accusations of cover up we call MSU and Izzo for, THIS IS THE SAME THING! “If he wins, all will be forgiven “? Really? Abuse comes in many forms
i didn't say it was right. just the way it is.
 
I read the article 3 months ago when it was originally published. I don't know why I'd have to read it to you again, but okay, here goes:

15 of the 25 girls Aird recruited quit, got cut, or transferred.

He runs practices so hard the girls throw up.

He is verbally abusive, screaming at them, calling them stupid.

He suggested two players were playing badly because they were ****ing the same guy.

He asked to see a player's butt tattoo.

5 of the 6 players they interviewed were in counseling after they played for Aird.

Practice video of at least one of his abusive tirades has disappeared.

IU investigated Aird, but cancelled interviews because they had already decided they weren't firing him.

Aird denies some of these allegations.

Enough facts? Am I still a troll? Or, maybe I have a journalism degree and know that, for a student-written article, this is pretty good journalism.

Either way, your claim that the article contains zero specifics about what the coach said or did is simply false. A blatant lie.

Yeah, but, outside of THOSE, there were no facts in either article.
 
I read the article 3 months ago when it was originally published. I don't know why I'd have to read it to you again, but okay, here goes:

15 of the 25 girls Aird recruited quit, got cut, or transferred.

He runs practices so hard the girls throw up.

He is verbally abusive, screaming at them, calling them stupid.

He suggested two players were playing badly because they were ****ing the same guy.

He asked to see a player's butt tattoo.

5 of the 6 players they interviewed were in counseling after they played for Aird.

Practice video of at least one of his abusive tirades has disappeared.

IU investigated Aird, but cancelled interviews because they had already decided they weren't firing him.

Aird denies some of these allegations.

Enough facts? Am I still a troll? Or, maybe I have a journalism degree and know that, for a student-written article, this is pretty good journalism.

Either way, your claim that the article contains zero specifics about what the coach said or did is simply false. A blatant lie.


you are absolute correct.

while your OP link article did not, the link in the OP article did contain some specifics.

not sure how i missed that on first read, but obviously i did.
 
I will give you...that doesnt make sense. In one paragraph, they say 15 of Aird's 25 players have left, but in another paragraph, the article says 14 players are returning.

Maybe walk-ons aren't being counted in the 25, but are being counted as returning players. That is not clear.
There are still players in the program that predate Aird so I took it to read 15/25 of his own recruits have left. His own recruits likely would be current sophs/juniors by eligibility at this point.

A few points…this stat is totally irrelevant without a comparison ie what is the avg turnover of d1 VB players? and what is the avg after a coaching change ? as I believe both are pretty high at every level of the game.

I don’t really have a fixed opinion but just throwing out a number like that with no context is poor journalism. Just IMO.
 
There are still players in the program that predate Aird so I took it to read 15/25 of his own recruits have left. His own recruits likely would be current sophs/juniors by eligibility at this point.

A few points…this stat is totally irrelevant without a comparison ie what is the avg turnover of d1 VB players? and what is the avg after a coaching change ? as I believe both are pretty high at every level of the game.

I don’t really have a fixed opinion but just throwing out a number like that with no context is poor journalism. Just IMO.

When 60% of your recruits leave, that is indicative of a serious problem whatever the context. In the entire history of IU BB or soccer, would bet there is nothing remotely comparable to a similar percentage of Players abandoning a Program. That's not VB, but as recruits generally commit with the intent to earn degrees at their Institutions of choice, some thing/s has/have to be truly effed to trigger an exodus of that nature.
 
When 60% of your recruits leave, that is indicative of a serious problem whatever the context. In the entire history of IU BB or soccer, would bet there is nothing remotely comparable to a similar percentage of Players abandoning a Program. That's not VB, but as recruits generally commit with the intent to earn degrees at their Institutions of choice, some thing/s has/have to be truly effed to trigger an exodus of that nature.
I believe that would include transfers who were pre-portal, when you still had to sit out a year.
 
There are still players in the program that predate Aird so I took it to read 15/25 of his own recruits have left. His own recruits likely would be current sophs/juniors by eligibility at this point.

A few points…this stat is totally irrelevant without a comparison ie what is the avg turnover of d1 VB players? and what is the avg after a coaching change ? as I believe both are pretty high at every level of the game.

I don’t really have a fixed opinion but just throwing out a number like that with no context is poor journalism. Just IMO.
I wouldn't say it's irrelevant. It seems unlikely that 60% of his recruits would leave if they liked playing for Aird. There's no way 3 out of every 5 girls are like "I love coach but I don't need this scholarship so Imma bounce."

I agree that some context might provide additional clarity, but I also wonder if anyone is even tracking that stat for women's d1 volleyball.
 
When 60% of your recruits leave, that is indicative of a serious problem whatever the context. In the entire history of IU BB or soccer, would bet there is nothing remotely comparable to a similar percentage of Players abandoning a Program. That's not VB, but as recruits generally commit with the intent to earn degrees at their Institutions of choice, some thing/s has/have to be truly effed to trigger an exodus of that nature.
You would think so but we also don’t know if they were recruited over or other such context. As a family that’s pretty involved in the club VB scene, it’s become pretty obvious to me that 1) girls move around a lot, for lots of reasons and 2) it’s pretty common for them to dislike their college coach, for different reasons. IU hasn’t won lately and when you lose everybody’s mad at everybody.

But I agree some of the incidents don’t sound good.
 
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