Offering $5K to women who have kids is an absolutely fantastic idea!

[Baller23Boogie]

Wrong. In the wealthiest society in the history of the world you want to tell us all with a straight face that people don’t have kids because they can’t afford it.

That dog sure won’t hunt.

Don’t blow smoke up my ass and tell me it’s raining.

Almost 1 in 4 millennials and Gen Z-ers say they won't have kids due to finances

Raising a child in the U.S. costs hundreds of thousands of dollars. Many younger Americans say they can't afford it.

www.cbsnews.com

You're wrong

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Almost 1 in 4 millennials and Gen Z-ers say they won't have kids due to finances

Raising a child in the U.S. costs hundreds of thousands of dollars. Many younger Americans say they can't afford it.

www.cbsnews.com

You're wrong

If you and OS had read the thread, specifically post #4, it could have prevented you from venturing down this nonsensical line of argumentation.

As it stands today, the more money you make in America, the less kids you have.

Millennials. Are prioritizing a comfortable lifestyle over children because they are devoid of proper values.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

If you and OS had read the thread, specifically post #4, it could have prevented you from venturing down this nonsensical line of argumentation.

As it stands today, the more money you make in America, the less kids you have.

Millennials. Are prioritizing a comfortable lifestyle over children because they are devoid of proper values.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

You don’t know what moving the goal posts means. Your own article backs me up.

About 23% of these adults, ranging from 18- to 43-years-old, said their financial motivation to remain childless boils down to two issues: valuing the financial freedom that comes from not having kids, as well as concerns about their ability to foot the bill for raising children, according to a new surveyfrom MassMutual.

Ie. they don’t want to sacrifice their lifestyle. Every parent ever has had concerns about how they will provide for their kids. Only with millenials has this become sort of revelation.

The question is. Why are millennials in the U.S. and the West more broadly deciding not to take the leap? And the answer has absolutely, positively nothing to do with money and suggesting as much makes you look foolish.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

You don’t know what moving the goal posts means. Your own article backs me up.

About 23% of these adults, ranging from 18- to 43-years-old, said their financial motivation to remain childless boils down to two issues: valuing the financial freedom that comes from not having kids, as well as concerns about their ability to foot the bill for raising children, according to a new surveyfrom MassMutual.

Ie. they don’t want to sacrifice their lifestyle. Every parent ever has had concerns about how they will provide for their kids. Only with millenials has this become sort of revelation.

The question is. Why are millennials in the U.S. and the West more broadly deciding not to take the leap? And the answer has absolutely, positively nothing to do with money and suggesting as much makes you look foolish.

Why didn't you finish that bolding that sentence that you did?

Doesn't fit your narrative, huh?

 

[outside shooter]

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

For the people who said they had or expected to have fewer children than they considered ideal, here’s the reasons cited as a factor, from most cited to least cited. Bolded are the financial concerns

Child care is too expensive
Want more time for the children I have
Worried about the economy
Can’t afford more children
Waited because of financial instability
Want more leisure time
Not enough paid family leave
No paid family leave
Worried about global instability
Struggle with work-life balance
Worried about domestic politics
Met a partner too late
Worried about climate change
Responsible for other family care
Worried about population growth
Prioritized my education and career
Split from my partner
Partner doesn't want children
Don't think I'm a good parent

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. (Published 2018)

Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

www.nytimes.com

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Why didn't you finish that bolding that sentence that you did?

Doesn't fit your narrative, huh?

As I said, their generation is not unique in that respect. Only with the self-centered millennial generation and those who enable them would that possibly be entertained as a plausible argument.

Take your cranium, remove it from your rectum.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

As I said, their generation is not unique in that respect. Only with the self-centered millennial generation and those who enable them would that possibly be entertained as a plausible argument.

Take your cranium, remove it from your rectum.

They have different values then you... doesn't negate the fact they aren't having kids because they don't think they can afford them.

Someday you'll realize that admitting you're wrong is okay.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

For the people who said they had or expected to have fewer children than they considered ideal, here’s the reasons cited as a factor, from most cited to least cited. Bolded are the financial concerns

Child care is too expensive
Want more time for the children I have
Worried about the economy
Can’t afford more children
Waited because of financial instability
Want more leisure time
Not enough paid family leave
No paid family leave
Worried about global instability
Struggle with work-life balance
Worried about domestic politics
Met a partner too late
Worried about climate change
Responsible for other family care
Worried about population growth
Prioritized my education and career
Split from my partner
Partner doesn't want children
Don't think I'm a good parent

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. (Published 2018)

Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

www.nytimes.com

I’m uninterested in their self professed reasons. Everyone believes they have it harder than anyone else ever. Were your hypothesis true it would be true writ large across all young people.

As it stands there are clear criteria that indicate one’s likelihood of having more kids. Chief among them being how religious the couple is.

Family and children have been devalued.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

They have different values then you... doesn't negate the fact they aren't having kids because they don't think they can afford them.

Someday you'll realize that admitting you're wrong is okay.

Then why is there a negative correlation between income and having kids? You can’t wrestle with that fact because it stops your BS argument in its tracks.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

Then why is there a negative correlation between income and having kids? You can’t wrestle with that fact because it stops your BS argument in its tracks.

Jesus dude, this isn't in absolutes.

There are polls out there with people saying they don't want kids because they are expensive. Is that true of everyone, absolutely not. But thats a valid reason for a lot of people.

You don't like the answer so you think it's not valid. It's absolutely a valid reason, to those people.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Jesus dude, this isn't in absolutes.

There are polls out there with people saying they don't want kids because they are expensive. Is that true of everyone, absolutely not. But thats a valid reason for a lot of people.

You don't like the answer so you think it's not valid. It's absolutely a valid reason, to those people.

We’re speaking in the aggregate are we not? In that aggregate, that explanation makes no sense for the reasons I’ve explained and that you can’t refute.

You’re going to need to come up with a real argument soon or I’m going to lose interest.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Jesus dude, this isn't in absolutes.

There are polls out there with people saying they don't want kids because they are expensive. Is that true of everyone, absolutely not. But thats a valid reason for a lot of people.

You don't like the answer so you think it's not valid. It's absolutely a valid reason, to those people.

So let’s rephrase the question. Why have do so many young people mistakenly believe that they can’t afford children?

 

[Baller23Boogie]

We’re speaking in the aggregate are we not? In that aggregate, that explanation makes no sense for the reasons I’ve explained and that you can’t refute.

You’re going to need to come up with a real argument soon or I’m going to lose interest.

I replied to your statement that you didn't believe people weren't having kids because they couldn't afford it.

I responded with a poll that showed people gave that very reason for not having children.

You don't like their reasoning so you dismiss it.

You're wrong. I'm bored with you and will let you have the last word. Have a good rest of your day.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

I replied to your statement that you didn't believe people weren't having kids because they couldn't afford it.

I responded with a poll that showed people gave that very reason for not having children.

You don't like their reasoning so you dismiss it.

You're wrong. I'm bored with you and will let you have the last word. Have a good rest of your day.

Dig deeper. When the data show that their belief is irrational either one or both things are true.

A. They’ve somehow picked up a mistaken belief

B. They’ve deprioritized children

Which do you believe it is?

 

[outside shooter]

Why have do so many young people mistakenly believe that they can’t afford children?

For SOME, for the same reason they'd prefer that their mortgage payment not DOUBLE. It's a financial burden that can be easily avoided. Would they be left homeless if they had kids? No. Would they have to do without a lot of things that they have come to depend on never being without? Yes.

Indeed, maybe some could or should reconfigure their priorities, but that is not something that is easily legislated. Lessening by a least a little the financial burden of child rearing, though, is feasible.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

For SOME, for the same reason they'd prefer that their mortgage payment not DOUBLE. It's a financial burden that can be easily avoided. Would they be left homeless if they had kids? No. Would they have to do without a lot of things that they have come to depend on never being without? Yes.

Indeed, maybe some could or should reconfigure their priorities, but that is not something that is easily legislated. Lessening by a least a little the financial burden of child rearing, though, is feasible.

Thank you. That’s all I wanted to hear. An admission it’s been deprioritized in the name of creature comforts.

It should be noted, Western European countries that have the childcare safety net that American progressives dream about are also struggling with their birth rates. More so than the U.S. in fact.

It’s a spiritual problem. Not a financial one.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

If you need a financial incentive to have kids just don't.

That's an unsustainable solution. We need to incentivize behavior to replace the population. Otherwise, this entire system (economy broadly, SS, Medicare) comes crashing down.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

It’s a cultural problem. Not a financial one.

FIFY. What did people expect when they pushed women out of the household and into the workforce? This is a direct byproduct of female empowerment. As someone with a daughter and working wife, I have no problem with that conceptually.

But, it's as if nobody was smart enough to realize the consequences of such societal changes.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

FIFY. What did people expect when they pushed women out of the household and into the workforce? This is a direct byproduct of female empowerment. As someone with a daughter and working wife, I have no problem with that conceptually.

But, it's as if nobody was smart enough to realize the consequences of such societal changes.

At the same time, two working parents ought to be an extreme weight lifted on the financial burden we’re discussing.

So what gives?

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

At the same time, two working parents ought to be an extreme weight lifted on the financial burden we’re discussing.

So what gives?

And I would say spiritual as faith informs culture. As a member of the tribe, I would think you’d agree.

 

[HurryingHoosiers]

FIFY. What did people expect when they pushed women out of the household and into the workforce? This is a direct byproduct of female empowerment. As someone with a daughter and working wife, I have no problem with that conceptually.

But, it's as if nobody was smart enough to realize the consequences of such societal changes.

I think the issue would have come even without women empowerment. With inflation and expenses far outpacing wages, 2 incomes often becomes a necessity to support a family with kids.

 

[snarlcakes]

At the same time, two working parents ought to be an extreme weight lifted on the financial burden we’re discussing.

So what gives?

Once again, the money is broken. Fix the money and you will fix the issue. Until that happens, the government should cut all income taxes up to 200-300k for all parents who have 2 or more kids. And look into increasing the child tax credit if needed.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

I think the issue would have come even without women empowerment. With inflation and expenses far outpacing wages, 2 incomes often becomes a necessity to support a family with kids.

You think wrong.

Now. The Biden admin. did really do a number on real wages, that much is true. But purchasing power has been remarkably stable since the 60’s. And the birth rate problem pre-dates Biden.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

I think the issue would have come even without women empowerment. With inflation and expenses far outpacing wages, 2 incomes often becomes a necessity to support a family with kids.

Inflation could not have been as high as it was if there were still primarily single-family incomes. It wouldn't allow for adequate demand.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

Once again, the money is broken. Fix the money and you will fix the issue. Until that happens, the government should cut all income taxes up to 200-300k for all parents who have 2 or more kids. And look into increasing the child tax credit if needed.

As much as I usually agree with your sound money theses, humans cutting off the biological imperative to procreate speaks to something deeper.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

At the same time, two working parents ought to be an extreme weight lifted on the financial burden we’re discussing.

I suppose it depends on the cost of a kid.

You read headlines like this and think that is costs a crazy amount to raise a kid. But on a per annum basis, it isn't any different than it was, assuming these stats are right (I have not tried to tie out).

The Cost of Raising a Child

Raising kids is expensive. As an economist, we’re used to thinking about cost very broadly, including the opportunity cost of your time. Indeed, a post I wrote a few weeks ago focused on the …

economistwritingeveryday.com

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

I think the issue would have come even without women empowerment. With inflation and expenses far outpacing wages, 2 incomes often becomes a necessity to support a family with kids.

See my post right above this one

 

[HurryingHoosiers]

Inflation could not have been as high as it was if there were still primarily single-family incomes. It wouldn't allow for adequate demand.

True, inflation would be reduced with lower demand. Think it would be enough to make single incomes doable still or just delayed it?

 

[outside shooter]

There are studies correlating religious beliefs with childbirth rates, and more religious persons do tend to have more kids. Some studies show that the highest birth rates are Muslims, and immigrants tend to have more kids than native born residents.

So I guess you think we need more Muslim immigrants, right Favra?

 

[snarlcakes]

As much as I usually agree with your sound money theses, humans cutting off the biological imperative to procreate speaks to something deeper.

It's most likely several things causing it, but I think the biggest driver is money.

 

[GooglyMooglyWooglyBoogly]

There are studies correlating religious beliefs with childbirth rates, and more religious persons do tend to have more kids. Some studies show that the highest birth rates are Muslims, and immigrants tend to have more kids than native born residents.

So I guess you think we need more Muslim immigrants, right Favra?

Go build your straw men somewhere else. And if you’d like to address me, you can quote my post and cut the passive aggressive, bitch shit.

 

[outside shooter]

Go build your straw men somewhere else. And if you’d like to address me, you can quote my post and cut the passive aggressive, bitch shit.

Review the thread and look who was the asshole who first replied with bitchiness like "Don’t blow smoke up my ass and tell me it’s raining".

 

[BadWakeboarder]

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

For the people who said they had or expected to have fewer children than they considered ideal, here’s the reasons cited as a factor, from most cited to least cited. Bolded are the financial concerns

Child care is too expensive
Want more time for the children I have
Worried about the economy
Can’t afford more children
Waited because of financial instability
Want more leisure time
Not enough paid family leave
No paid family leave
Worried about global instability
Struggle with work-life balance
Worried about domestic politics
Met a partner too late
Worried about climate change
Responsible for other family care
Worried about population growth
Prioritized my education and career
Split from my partner
Partner doesn't want children
Don't think I'm a good parent

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. (Published 2018)

Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

www.nytimes.com

Plus TRUMP, right?

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

For the people who said they had or expected to have fewer children than they considered ideal, here’s the reasons cited as a factor, from most cited to least cited. Bolded are the financial concerns

Child care is too expensive
Want more time for the children I have
Worried about the economy
Can’t afford more children
Waited because of financial instability
Want more leisure time
Not enough paid family leave
No paid family leave
Worried about global instability
Struggle with work-life balance
Worried about domestic politics
Met a partner too late
Worried about climate change
Responsible for other family care
Worried about population growth
Prioritized my education and career
Split from my partner
Partner doesn't want children
Don't think I'm a good parent

Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why. (Published 2018)

Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices.

www.nytimes.com

What a sad list of excuses, sans the final one

 

[larsIU]

it definitely sucks but it is a problme with a shelf life. they get to school where it can be largely free

Diapers and daycare. It’s like getting a raise.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

Maybe a better idea would be an immigration system that makes more sense and easier to navigate. More than one way to increase population

The immigration issue has been cultural of late. See Europe.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Diapers and daycare. It’s like getting a raise.

Yup. Kids can be expensive or not. Much of it is up to you. I have friends with kids at $25k a year grade school and high school then go to Miami etc for $90k a year . Don’t have to. Can go public k through 12 then FSU or stay home FAU etc. you have control over much of it

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

You don’t know what moving the goal posts means. Your own article backs me up.

About 23% of these adults, ranging from 18- to 43-years-old, said their financial motivation to remain childless boils down to two issues: valuing the financial freedom that comes from not having kids, as well as concerns about their ability to foot the bill for raising children, according to a new surveyfrom MassMutual.

Ie. they don’t want to sacrifice their lifestyle. Every parent ever has had concerns about how they will provide for their kids. Only with millenials has this become sort of revelation.

The question is. Why are millennials in the U.S. and the West more broadly deciding not to take the leap? And the answer has absolutely, positively nothing to do with money and suggesting as much makes you look foolish.

They have different values then you... doesn't negate the fact they aren't having kids because they don't think they can afford them.

Someday you'll realize that admitting you're wrong is okay.

I think you both are somewhat right. More people don't want the financial or time commitment required for a child because they prioritize their own needs.

But, the stratification is somewhat interesting in that the wealthy still have kids above replacement value.

 

[WhyisIUBBcursed]

I read this whole thread expecting a link to buy a sex robot. Cmon people!!!!