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Indiana ranked #21...

Well, IU did finish 9th in the league with that lineup this year (w/o JHS), so ...
Wisconsin
Purdue
Michigan St.
Iowa (expected)
Rutgers
Illinois (expected)
Ohio St.

That's the list of schools that finished ahead of us that either have or likely will have lost at least their best player and likely more than that, via graduation or turning pro.

So if we would return all of our important players and add a player like Hood-Schifino, then I'd definitely expect upward movement. Significant upward movement.
 
Galloway isn’t a scorer though. He’s a high energy guy which is perfect for a bench role.
Doesn't need to be a scorer to start. Galloway's per 40 minutes were better than both Kopp and Stewart's last year and shot 10% better from the field. And that's just in the scoring department. Galloway is so much more versatile and a better two way player than Kopp. Don't really care if he starts or not but should be playing twice the minutes Kopp does.

In all honesty there's 1 returning perimeter player that has earned bonafide starters minutes and that's Xavier Johnson assuming he's allowed back on the team. Galloway has made a decent case for his two way play but the other guard position should be open competition with both freshman in play.
 
Doesn't need to be a scorer to start. Galloway's per 40 minutes were better than both Kopp and Stewart's last year and shot 10% better from the field. And that's just in the scoring department. Galloway is so much more versatile and a better two way player than Kopp. Don't really care if he starts or not but should be playing twice the minutes Kopp does.

In all honesty there's 1 returning perimeter player that has earned bonafide starters minutes and that's Xavier Johnson assuming he's allowed back on the team. Galloway has made a decent case for his two way play but the other guard position should be open competition with both freshman in play.
You will be very disappointed. Galloway is 20% worse in 3pt percentage. This team needs shooting more than anything. Galloway is a perfect off the bench guy. He shouldn’t be a starter at the B1G level.
 
You will be very disappointed. Galloway is 20% worse in 3pt percentage. This team needs shooting more than anything. Galloway is a perfect off the bench guy. He shouldn’t be a starter at the B1G level.
Who cares?

Kopp can't put the ball on the floor or create his own shot to save his life. Give me the guy who can drive/penetrate/pass/attack the rim over the set shooter in the corner who doesn't even hunt his shot. It kills the offense. Too many people are infatuated with 3 point %.
 
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Who cares?

Kopp can't put the ball on the floor or create his own shot to save his life. Give me the guy who can drive/penetrate/pass/attack the rim over the set shooter in the corner who doesn't even hunt his shot. It kills the offense. Too many people are infatuated with 3 point %.
Who cares? Woodson apparently considering he brought Kopp back. He will start him yet again. I wish more than anything they would get an actual B1G level starter for 3, but that doesn’t appear to be happening for whatever reason.

The opponent packing the paint due to non shooting actually kills the offense. We saw it in the last 10 minutes of games all season.
 
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Who cares?

Kopp can't put the ball on the floor or create his own shot to save his life. Give me the guy who can drive/penetrate/pass/attack the rim over the set shooter in the corner who doesn't even hunt his shot. It kills the offense. Too many people are infatuated with 3 point %.
It’s Woody’s offense, though. Kopp is doing exactly what MW wants him to do. He’s just not a consistent shooter.
 
Wisconsin
Purdue
Michigan St.
Iowa (expected)
Rutgers
Illinois (expected)
Ohio St.

That's the list of schools that finished ahead of us that either have or likely will have lost at least their best player and likely more than that, via graduation or turning pro.

So if we would return all of our important players and add a player like Hood-Schifino, then I'd definitely expect upward movement. Significant upward movement.
Hearing Kofi will be back. Finding serious money to throw his way.
 
Who cares? Woodson apparently considering he brought Kopp back. He will start him yet again. I wish more than anything they would get an actual B1G level starter for 3, but that doesn’t appear to be happening for whatever reason.

The opponent packing the paint due to non shooting actually kills the offense. We saw it in the last 10 minutes of games all season.
Miller Kopp didn't score a literal point in the last two games of the season and played 20+ min in each of those games. And you're worried about Galloway's 3pt% and teams packing the lane?

IU's best offensive lineup all year came during the BTT with XJ/Phinisee/Galloway as guards and Geronimo at the 4 and either Trayce/Race at the 5. No coincidence considering XJ/Galloway/Phin were the teams best ballhandlers and best at attacking the rim from a guard position. As much as I would love for IU to have 3 guards who could all shoot 50%+ from 3, it's not going to happen next year. You can still run a highly efficient offense without a bunch of long range bombers on the court.
 
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Miller Kopp didn't score a literal point in the last two games of the season and played 20+ min in each of those games. And you're worried about Galloway's 3pt% and teams packing the lane?

IU's best offensive lineup all year came during the BTT with XJ/Phinisee/Galloway as guards and Geronimo at the 4 and either Trayce/Race at the 5. No coincidence considering XJ/Galloway/Phin were the teams best ballhandlers and best at attacking the rim from a guard position. As much as I would love for IU to have 3 guards who could all shoot 50%+ from 3, it's not going to happen next year. You can still run a highly efficient offense without a bunch of long range bombers on the court.
Nice 2 game sample size. He played 4 more mpg and scored .5 more points. It’s not like Galloway is clearly a better scorer.

Again, Woodson will start and play Kopp a lot with the current roster. He proved that all year long.

This isn’t a top 5 B1G roster regardless of if Kopp or Galloway start.
 
Nice 2 game sample size. He played 4 more mpg and scored .5 more points. It’s not like Galloway is clearly a better scorer.

Again, Woodson will start and play Kopp a lot with the current roster. He proved that all year long.

This isn’t a top 5 B1G roster regardless of if Kopp or Galloway start.
Why do you think it’s Kopp OR Galloway?
 
Nice 2 game sample size. He played 4 more mpg and scored .5 more points. It’s not like Galloway is clearly a better scorer.
Never said Galloway was clearly a better scorer. But he was clearly a more efficient scorer and delivers so much more on the offensive end that Kopp can't. Kopp is an ok catch and shoot player who doesn't look to shoot. That's literally all he brings to the offensive end. Galloway has shown he's able to drive and attack the basket and has a decent mid-range floater.
 
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Why do you think it’s Kopp OR Galloway?
I don’t, those are the likely options.

They are trying to convince TJD, Race, and JG to all comeback and are telling JG he can play some at the 3, so JG may be the starting 3.

I’d also take XJ, Bates, JHS at the 1-3.
 
Never said Galloway was clearly a better scorer. But he was clearly a more efficient scorer and delivers so much more on the offensive end that Kopp can't. Kopp is an ok catch and shoot player who doesn't look to shoot. That's literally all he brings to the offensive end. Galloway has shown he's able to drive and attack the basket and has a decent mid-range floater.
He is not clearly a more efficient scorer. Galloway had a 94.2 ORtg. Kopp had a 97.8 ORtg. Both numbers are terrible.
 
Based on the current roster with everyone coming back, I would go:

Starters:
XJ (assuming he hasn’t killed anyone)
Bates
Kopp
JG
TJD

Bench:
JHS
Galloway
Race
Banks

End of Bench:
Leal
Gunn
Duncomb
I don't understand the fascination with a deep rotation. If you look at the teams in the FF they all seemed to play 6-7 guys at most. The starters should all be playing around 35 minutes.
 
I don't understand the fascination with a deep rotation. If you look at the teams in the FF they all seemed to play 6-7 guys at most. The starters should all be playing around 35 minutes.
Yup...very nearly always turns out this way.

Depth is not a bad thing, obviously. Injuries happen. Foul troubles happen. You need good competition in practices. But when it comes to winning ball games against good teams, play your most effective 6-7 guys.
 
I don't understand the fascination with a deep rotation. If you look at the teams in the FF they all seemed to play 6-7 guys at most. The starters should all be playing around 35 minutes.
I agree. My lineup is based on what I believe Woodson will do. Ideally, there is 1 backup backcourt player and 1 backup frontcourt player.
 
Never said Galloway was clearly a better scorer. But he was clearly a more efficient scorer and delivers so much more on the offensive end that Kopp can't. Kopp is an ok catch and shoot player who doesn't look to shoot. That's literally all he brings to the offensive end. Galloway has shown he's able to drive and attack the basket and has a decent mid-range floater.
In what quantifiable ways does Galloway deliver “so much more on the offensive end that Kopp can’t?” I think he creates more movement in the offense, but most of us see a player that the defense can largely ignore away from the basket (and they do, with predictable results).
 
I don't understand the fascination with a deep rotation. If you look at the teams in the FF they all seemed to play 6-7 guys at most. The starters should all be playing around 35 minutes.
That’s very difficult to do in a 30+ game season.
 
In what quantifiable ways does Galloway deliver “so much more on the offensive end that Kopp can’t?” I think he creates more movement in the offense, but most of us see a player that the defense can largely ignore away from the basket (and they do, with predictable results).
Go back to GBI, Kern County.
 
In what quantifiable ways does Galloway deliver “so much more on the offensive end that Kopp can’t?” I think he creates more movement in the offense, but most of us see a player that the defense can largely ignore away from the basket (and they do, with predictable results).
He can a) dribble b) pass and c) attack the basket. That's three more things than Kopp isn't capable of doing.
 
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He can a) dribble b) pass and c) attack the basket. That's three more things than Kopp isn't capable of doing.
He’s decent, at best, in those areas, but he presents an obvious liability from the perimeter. He’s also not been a very good defender, another aspect of the game where Kopp has been much better and Woody has valued his contribution much more.
 
He can a) dribble b) pass and c) attack the basket. That's three more things than Kopp isn't capable of doing.
Again, the metrics don’t back you up. Kopp is better in ORtg, Ows%, and OBpm. Kopp is statistically the better offensive player.
 
Miller Kopp didn't score a literal point in the last two games of the season and played 20+ min in each of those games. And you're worried about Galloway's 3pt% and teams packing the lane?

IU's best offensive lineup all year came during the BTT with XJ/Phinisee/Galloway as guards and Geronimo at the 4 and either Trayce/Race at the 5. No coincidence considering XJ/Galloway/Phin were the teams best ballhandlers and best at attacking the rim from a guard position. As much as I would love for IU to have 3 guards who could all shoot 50%+ from 3, it's not going to happen next year. You can still run a highly efficient offense without a bunch of long range bombers on the court.
You sure? Race only played at the 5 for 2-5 min. Very rare Geronimo and race played together. I call bs. We had numerous lineups that were equal. Plus Kopp can create a little. I’m not saying he’s dynamic doing it. I did like XJ and Phin together for stretches. Galloway actually had a bad stretch because of his groin. His defense actually dropped off. Kopp played great D in the Michigan and Illinois games. Like crazy good.
 
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Again, the metrics don’t back you up. Kopp is better in ORtg, Ows%, and OBpm. Kopp is statistically the better offensive player.
I can’t believe people don’t understand the Kopp stuff. Is the answer? No. But he was as steady as a defender as anyone on the team.
 
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I can’t believe people don’t understand the Kopp stuff. Is the answer? No. But he was as steady as a defender as anyone on the team.
Agree. If we are going to start truly competing again, neither one are the answer in the starting lineup if we are being honest.

However, for next year, I believe Kopp is the clear favorite to start the 3. JG and JHS could be sleepers to start there though.
 
Agree. If we are going to start truly competing again, neither one are the answer in the starting lineup if we are being honest.

However, for next year, I believe Kopp is the clear favorite to start the 3. JG and JHS could be sleepers to start there though.
JG has a hard time at the 3. His easy button is the 4. If he wants to play at the next level he needs to work a lot on his defense and handles.
 
JG has a hard time at the 3. His easy button is the 4. If he wants to play at the next level he needs to work a lot on his defense and handles.
I agree, but he wants to play the 3. He has teams reaching out (not officially) telling him if he transfers he will be a starter at the 3.

At the next level he won’t be a 4, so like you said, he has to develop. He would be a very good college 4 right now though.
 
If TJD and Race return (I predict):
X
Galloway
Kopp
Race
Tjd

bates and JHS next in line for minutes, with a realistic chance that JG is elsewhere.
 
Ya, except for JHS, tamar, and JG. All of which you can find on NBA scouting reports.
Tamar and JG on NBA scouting reports.?.?What do the reports say? I didn’t even know they were remotely considered NBA prospects. I’m just hoping they can develop into consistent productive players for IU.
 
If TJD and Race return (I predict):
X
Galloway
Kopp
Race
Tjd

bates and JHS next in line for minutes, with a realistic chance that JG is elsewhere.
Wow, no thank you. Woody is going to need to get a shooter or two in the portal. That lineup will shoot about 28% from 3. Also, I think JG is going to be very unhappy if he’s not in the starting rotation. Along with TJD and X, Geronimo was one of the more productive players down the stretch and the reason we made the tourney.
 
Again, the metrics don’t back you up. Kopp is better in ORtg, Ows%, and OBpm. Kopp is statistically the better offensive player.
If for absolutely no other reason, I just enjoy watching Trey play more than I enjoy watching Miller play. He's more active, he's faster, he creates more energy.

My original point (not that you've countered it), isn't that I think Kopp will or won't play, its that I hope he isn't needed to play.

We have 3 perimeter guys coming in, varying levels of hype and herald, surely one of those guys will be more productive than what Miller has given us??!!

On top of those guys, we have returning guys like Tamar, Trey, and Jordan. I'd say their capacity for improvement is greater than Miller's, at this point. What we've seen from Miller, is likely what would see next year. Surely 1 of these returning guys will have a productive enough off season to put themselves in a position to be more productive overall with their minutes than Miller.

So, if in early November we see Miller starting in our opening game, I'll be incredibly disappointed that there weren't enough improvements or that the incoming guys weren't good enough, to overtake what we know Miller will provide.
 
Again, the metrics don’t back you up. Kopp is better in ORtg, Ows%, and OBpm. Kopp is statistically the better offensive player.
You can cherry pick whatever analytic metric you want, the offense moves and flows better when Galloway is in. Kopp does one thing offensively and doesn't do it particularly well.
 
If for absolutely no other reason, I just enjoy watching Trey play more than I enjoy watching Miller play. He's more active, he's faster, he creates more energy.

My original point (not that you've countered it), isn't that I think Kopp will or won't play, its that I hope he isn't needed to play.

We have 3 perimeter guys coming in, varying levels of hype and herald, surely one of those guys will be more productive than what Miller has given us??!!

On top of those guys, we have returning guys like Tamar, Trey, and Jordan. I'd say their capacity for improvement is greater than Miller's, at this point. What we've seen from Miller, is likely what would see next year. Surely 1 of these returning guys will have a productive enough off season to put themselves in a position to be more productive overall with their minutes than Miller.

So, if in early November we see Miller starting in our opening game, I'll be incredibly disappointed that there weren't enough improvements or that the incoming guys weren't good enough, to overtake what we know Miller will provide.
Bates is the likely starter at the 2, so he won’t be replacing Kopp in the lineup. Gunn and Banks don’t project to be impact players next year, let alone starters. Galloway is better suited to come off the bench.

As I’ve already stated, I could see JHS or JG starting over Kopp. I don’t think it’s likely, but they have the most realistic shot.
 
You can cherry pick whatever analytic metric you want, the offense moves and flows better when Galloway is in. Kopp does one thing offensively and doesn't do it particularly well.
Those aren’t cherry picked lol. Can you name an advanced stat that would better represent a player’s offensive effectiveness? What did I leave out?

Your opinion is that the offense flows better, but the stats don’t back that up.
 
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You can cherry pick whatever analytic metric you want, the offense moves and flows better when Galloway is in. Kopp does one thing offensively and doesn't do it particularly well.
Galloway had a really bad tourney. Was it his injury? Not sure but he was getting burned on D. His offense wasn’t clicking either. Trey won’t start. It’s the shooting that hurts him. He’s not a threat at all. Michigan was his best game. He averaged a whopping 3 points a game. Kopp wasn’t much better but he at least had the outside threat. The D wasn’t sagging off him. If either one starts neither bring big stats to the game. Kopp actually was better defensively down the stretch. I mean Trey was guarding the winning shot against Iowa.
 
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