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Harvard Offers

Hoosier_Hack

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Sep 25, 2011
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okay, not to be counter recruiting our prospects but if you had a kid that was offered a full ride to Harvard to play football would you not point in that direction? I mean unless you were a highly rated guy that thought Sunday play was a real possibility, you could be a top player in the business world for life not just 5 years....

I saw a few guys with Harvard offers and all I could think about was Law School and the wish I had gone.... I had a chance to go to Law School at IU but my wife was worn out after 3 years on my undergrad..... it would be hard to not jump on that immediately....
 
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No athletic schollys in Ivy League, but they do find "merit or financial aid" packages to athletes that sometimes are the equivalent. (And there are some upper middle & above kids who get in b/c they are good athletes that gets them in to school there too.)

If NOT even thinking about going pro, then would think anyone would want to check out the best options academically. But one consideration is how good a student is the student athlete? You'd hate to go somewhere and really struggle and maybe not do as well in a way that could later hurt you for grad school admissions. Or go to a place you just didn't naturally fit in or gel culturally.

Harvard still has great cache, but can be a little "PC" for some. Yale/Brown/Columbia might be in that same category. Princeton/Dartmouth/Cornell/Penn probably considered a bit more "mainstream" more "well rounded" students vs. same level of "activists" in some albeit stereotypical overview of the schools.

If I had my druthers for a child of mine who could hang academically anywhere, I'd love for them to go to Stanford. But that is "real D1" not Ivy League D1.
 
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Nope, Ivy Coaches are a different breed, plus do you really think the liberal left that run these schools would condone illegal money for a football player
No athletic schollys in Ivy League, but they do find "merit or financial aid" packages to athletes that sometimes are the equivalent. (And there are some upper middle & above kids who get in b/c they are good athletes that gets them in to school there too.)

If NOT even thinking about going pro, then would think anyone would want to check out the best options academically. But one consideration is how good a student is the student athlete? You'd hate to go somewhere and really struggle and maybe not do as well in a way that could later hurt you for grad school admissions. Or go to a place you just didn't naturally fit in or gel culturally.

Harvard still has great cache, but can be a little "PC" for some. Yale/Brown/Columbia might be in that same category. Princeton/Dartmouth/Cornell/Penn probably considered a bit more "mainstream" more "well rounded" students vs. same level of "activists" in some albeit stereotypical overview of the schools.

If I had my druthers for a child of mine who could hang academically anywhere, I'd love for them to go to Stanford. But that is "real D1" not Ivy League D1.

Don't kid yourself. They don't call them that, but there's money somewhere.
 
Sure did, that had nothing to do with what I was talking about, that was an underpaid coach trying to grease his pocket
Liberal Left? LMAO. Guess you didn't have time to read about Yale's soccer coach and Harvard Fencing coach. Money has no political affiliation.
 
okay, not to be counter recruiting our prospects but if you had a kid that was offered a full ride to Harvard to play football would you not point in that direction? I mean unless you were a highly rated guy that thought Sunday play was a real possibility, you could be a top player in the business world for life not just 5 years....

I saw a few guys with Harvard offers and all I could think about was Law School and the wish I had gone.... I had a chance to go to Law School at IU but my wife was worn out after 3 years on my undergrad..... it would be hard to not jump on that immediately....
I don't know. A Kelley School of Business degree doesn't seem to have held back Mark Cuban ...
 
Nope, Ivy Coaches are a different breed, plus do you really think the liberal left that run these schools would condone illegal money for a football player
I don't mean the coaches are cheating. I'm saying the university finds money for the player somehow.

Harvard, from my understanding from my son-in-law who applied but didn't get accepted (he did get accepted by MIT, however), Harvard has a 'sliding scale' for tuition, based on a student's ability to pay, considering family finances.

I'd bet there is some manipulation going on to get the players as much as possible, without calling it athletic scholarships.

And my guess is, there are some pretty nice summer jobs available for athletes that wouldn't be available to the normal student.
 
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You're right there is a sliding scale but Ivy coaches pretty much govern themselves. Take Harvard Yale and Princeton for instance. They are all recruiting the same players and they all know how much aid a kid can qualify for. It is very difficult to bend the numbers and if someone does, they blow the whistle very quickly if the numbers don't add up.
I don't mean the coaches are cheating. I'm saying the university finds money for the player somehow.

Harvard, from my understanding from my son-in-law who applied but didn't get accepted (he did get accepted by MIT, however), Harvard has a 'sliding scale' for tuition, based on a student's ability to pay, considering family finances.

I'd bet there is some manipulation going on to get the players as much as possible, without calling it athletic scholarships.

And my guess is, there are some pretty nice summer jobs available for athletes that wouldn't be available to the normal student.
 
I don't know. A Kelley School of Business degree doesn't seem to have held back Mark Cuban ...
My understanding is Mark Cuban created Real Audio while in School at IU...or at least the concept.

I love my Kelly School degree but come’on....it isn’t Harvard
 
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My understanding is Mark Cuban created Real Audio while in School at IU...or at least the concept.

I love my Kelly School degree but come’on....it isn’t Harvard
Supposedly he and some other guys created it when he moved to Dallas after school and couldn't listen to IU games.

I'm sure someone here knows the details.
 
You're right there is a sliding scale but Ivy coaches pretty much govern themselves. Take Harvard Yale and Princeton for instance. They are all recruiting the same players and they all know how much aid a kid can qualify for. It is very difficult to bend the numbers and if someone does, they blow the whistle very quickly if the numbers don't add up.
Except the other coaches didn't turn in the Yale and Harvard coaches who were playing games with admissions.
 
Per the "admissions" part...to me it is NOT in any way tied to the recent Hollywood buy in scandal. The way it's been for awhile is the various athletic coaches basically get a certain # of spots. Ex: Crew = 5, Soccer = 7 FB = 15 BB = 3-4 (and similar allotment for women's teams.) Then the coaches do their recruiting (and students/coaches/families also reach out to pitch themselves too.) The coaches usually "rank" their kids they are interested in (but are often competing against other similar schools for) and then can tell the admissions office here are the ones I'd like. Most all of those kids have "pretty good" grades, but very possibly wouldn't get in on grades/essay alone, but rather the "sports" gets them the extra nod in. I don't think that's "cheating" in any way, their talent in sports got them a notch up and into the school, but they still have to be good students at this level.

As per the $/tuition piece, I'm not 100% sure of granular details. I do know that many of the athletes do qualify for financial need packages that can be a "de facto" scholarship. But that can be anyone too. Ex: If accepted to Princeton and believe if family income is under $100K (maybe $80K) tuition is free for any student. Clearly there are some kids from wealthy families whose kids are good enough to do say soccer/crew, who may not get any financial aid, but the families are able to pay the tuition and the sports simply helped get them in. But it's a legit player/athlete on the team, not the "fake photos in a crew boat" like the USC scandal.

Yes the Ivy's have started to send a few guys to the NFL and there have been a few who've had a shot at NBA, but by and large, the Ivy sports are almost more like D-2 level. The Duke, Stanford, Northwestern & Vanderbilt's are all so popular that they've become almost as hard as the Ivy's to get into now, but those are still real D-1 level programs as evidence of course by Duke in BB and Stanford in FB. I'd probably throw Notre Dame in the second group of prestigious schools hard to get into with top level D-1 athletic programs too.

The B10 has great schools that are becoming more and more popular with East/West coast kids, and the schools love the out of state tuition they get from those families too! I don't think anyone should hold their nose up at a B10 or ACC school and the education one can get if they really apply themselves and seek out all the opportunities one can find there. But if you are being truly honest about "market perception" think it's fair to acknowledge that to many the Ivy's are still the tops, the next tier (Stanford/Duke, etc) is pretty high up and then there are some state schools perceived a bit higher than others in the B10/ACC. Would say Michigan, UVA, North Carolina are examples of those. But then from there, most of the remaining schools are all considered really good with great campuses, student life, niche programs of expertise (i.e. Kelly, Purdue Engineering) etc.

Lastly, given how important grad school degrees have become, if someone were taking the long view they'd say "take the full ride at a great B10 school, do well and then have a great shot to get into a good grad school (who don't just want a class full of Ivy League undergrads!) and money saved from college scholly to put towards a future graduate degree program.
 
That was for pure money, the kids they got in were no good it was all a sham
Except the other coaches didn't turn in the Yale and Harvard coaches who were playing games with admissions.
 
My understanding is Mark Cuban created Real Audio while in School at IU...or at least the concept.

I love my Kelly School degree but come’on....it isn’t Harvard
I didn't say it was. I meant to make the point that one can do well in the business world with an IU business degree. And he is, by no means, the only one who has done remarkably well.
I'm really not trying to equate the two degrees nor pooh-pooh a Harvard degree.
 
That was for pure money, the kids they got in were no good it was all a sham
So? Is it not showing these coaches and administrators are capable of cheating and fraud?

They're human. Just because they're Ivy League doesn't mean they don't bend the rules.
 
Lets say I am a Harvard football coach and is recruiting John Doe and so is Yale and Princeton. We all three have the same exact information on him from his grades which could give him merit money to mom and dads tax returns to see how much financial aid he qualifies for. Can't explain it any simpler. Am sure as you say there are Ivy crooks but it is near impossible when everyone are crunching the same numbers
So? Is it not showing these coaches and administrators are capable of cheating and fraud?

They're human. Just because they're Ivy League doesn't mean they don't bend the rules.
 
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okay, not to be counter recruiting our prospects but if you had a kid that was offered a full ride to Harvard to play football would you not point in that direction? I mean unless you were a highly rated guy that thought Sunday play was a real possibility, you could be a top player in the business world for life not just 5 years....

I saw a few guys with Harvard offers and all I could think about was Law School and the wish I had gone.... I had a chance to go to Law School at IU but my wife was worn out after 3 years on my undergrad..... it would be hard to not jump on that immediately....
i think you hit the nail on the head re whether or not playing on sundays was realistic. absent that, with the knowledge that cfb would likely be the end of the road, i'd definitely take the harvard scholly. superior academics and reputation are huge, but so too are the people you meet - who you get to know at place like that open so many doors down the road.

as for iu law bit. speaking as an iu law grad, be glad you didn't. practicing law is hell and more than half my friends i graduated with do things other than practice law now. i would have rather gotten an mba.
 
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i think you hit the nail on the head re whether or not playing on sundays was realistic. absent that, with the knowledge that cfb would likely be the end of the road, i'd definitely take the harvard scholly. superior academics and reputation are huge, but so too are the people you meet - who you get to know at place like that open so many doors down the road.

as for iu law bit. speaking as an iu law grad, be glad you didn't. practicing law is hell and more than half my friends i graduated with do things other than practice law now. i would have rather gotten an mba.

My former career out of school was Commercial Banking. I made several friends in the legal world because of my career. I finally left Banking after almost 20 years and now running a business that allows me to do work for attorneys. Sometimes the career you choose isn’t the one that floats your boat. I’m happy right now and enjoying myself. Thanks for sharing ...
 
Good grief there are no football scholarships at Harvard!!
i think you hit the nail on the head re whether or not playing on sundays was realistic. absent that, with the knowledge that cfb would likely be the end of the road, i'd definitely take the harvard scholly. superior academics and reputation are huge, but so too are the people you meet - who you get to know at place like that open so many doors down the road.

as for iu law bit. speaking as an iu law grad, be glad you didn't. practicing law is hell and more than half my friends i graduated with do things other than practice law now. i would have rather gotten an mba.
 
Good grief there are no football scholarships at Harvard!!
LOL that's complete nonsense. the notion of a "scholarship" is simply semantics. they manipulate financial aid packages for athletes via grants etc that are the equivalent of scholarships. there are non ivy league schools that have been doing the same thing for years "without scholarships." Davidson for one. So yes if I was "invited" to play football at harvard and not going to be in the nfl i would jump on it.
 
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Lets say I am a Harvard football coach and is recruiting John Doe and so is Yale and Princeton. We all three have the same exact information on him from his grades which could give him merit money to mom and dads tax returns to see how much financial aid he qualifies for. Can't explain it any simpler. Am sure as you say there are Ivy crooks but it is near impossible when everyone are crunching the same numbers
It's pretty naive to think it's impossible.
 
Good grief there are no football scholarships at Harvard!!
There are no "scholarships" (academic or athletic) at Ivy League schools, but I think we're getting bogged down in semantics here. Ivy schools have enormous endowments and are generous with financial aid, including grants, for middle income families as well as low income families. Most students are not paying anything close to the sticker price.
 
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Lets say I am a Harvard football coach and is recruiting John Doe and so is Yale and Princeton. We all three have the same exact information on him from his grades which could give him merit money to mom and dads tax returns to see how much financial aid he qualifies for. Can't explain it any simpler. Am sure as you say there are Ivy crooks but it is near impossible when everyone are crunching the same numbers
Euro, you clearly are not a rules-breaker or a crook.
 
Last post for me on the subject, I operated under the aid based on need basis and merit money awards for 6 years before moving to a higher level. My above posts are from personal experience but believe what you want as you spread "fake news" LOL Out
 
Last post for me on the subject, I operated under the aid based on need basis and merit money awards for 6 years before moving to a higher level. My above posts are from personal experience but believe what you want as you spread "fake news" LOL Out
Are you referring to me? Because I intended my comment as a compliment.
 
schools can do quite a bit outside of traditional schollys. i played a D1 sport in college. we only had 9.9 scholarships. it was a public school so one of the things they did to help was immediately make all athletes in-state residents. so even though our scholarships were partial that coupled with in-state tuition made it the equivalent of a larger scholarship that a private school may have had to provide. anyway, like everything it's all become a mess.
 
Just to keep things in perspective there have been 21 Harvard football players drafted since 1942.
 
okay, not to be counter recruiting our prospects but if you had a kid that was offered a full ride to Harvard to play football would you not point in that direction? I mean unless you were a highly rated guy that thought Sunday play was a real possibility, you could be a top player in the business world for life not just 5 years....

I saw a few guys with Harvard offers and all I could think about was Law School and the wish I had gone.... I had a chance to go to Law School at IU but my wife was worn out after 3 years on my undergrad..... it would be hard to not jump on that immediately....

Plenty of top players in the business world coming out of Kelley. Save your money
 
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Nope, Ivy Coaches are a different breed, plus do you really think the liberal left that run these schools would condone illegal money for a football player
Unfortuneatly, stupid, inflammatory terms like "liberal left" have the consequence of revealing your conservative ignorance and identifies you with a group of people you really don't want to be identified with...unless you do. If nothing else...it pulls your pants down around your ankles.

Please...keep politics off the forum. This is FB...and if you think Harvard is liberal...omg...
 
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FWIW - Harvard had 6 players on NFL rosters in 2018, IU had 9 per pro-football-reference.com. So not like there's a huge disparity in number of players who go pro.

Also FWIW - five of the last five presidents have Ivy League degrees: Bush 1 (Yale), Clinton (JD from Harvard), Bush 2 (Yale undergrad, MBA Harvard), Obama (undergrad Columbia, JD Harvard), DJT (Penn).
 
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