America needs a new voice, but it feels like it could be too late

[Thyrsis]

Everyone seems to acknowledge that "the parties" are broken and things are off kilter. But as I've talked about here, here and here, that can probably only be fixed if America reverts to some of its norms AND if there is deep support for some of those foundational norms. Based on the dialogue here and elsewhere, it's not at all evident there is any real desire to aspire to those norms. In the last link above, I shared what some of my preferred norms would be. I don't think all that many people actually agree, though. I think that disagreement flows from a rot in our information flows (free, fake, bad faith, inflammatory and dumb content that is eagerly lapped up due in turn to a degradation in Americans' ability to assess and take in information) and from a rise of anti-social behaviors and beliefs. On the latter point, there's hardly any indication of a strong foundational belief in the greater good and the value of a society that is thriving as much as it can top to bottom. That was generally a norm that has now passed.

A political party needs to oppose that trend (though, again, it may be too late), but it also needs to be clear what it stands FOR. Dysfunction is the rule of the day, sadly.

Making light of it here does indeed bug me. It's not a joke to me.

 

[mcmurtry66]

Everyone seems to acknowledge that "the parties" are broken and things are off kilter. But as I've talked about here, here and here, that can probably only be fixed if America reverts to some of its norms AND if there is deep support for some of those foundational norms. Based on the dialogue here and elsewhere, it's not at all evident there is any real desire to aspire to those norms. In the last link above, I shared what some of my preferred norms would be. I don't think all that many people actually agree, though. I think that disagreement flows from a rot in our information flows (free, fake, bad faith, inflammatory and dumb content that is eagerly lapped up due in turn to a degradation in Americans' ability to assess and take in information) and from a rise of anti-social behaviors and beliefs. On the latter point, there's hardly any indication of a strong foundational belief in the greater good and the value of a society that is thriving as much as it can top to bottom. That was generally a norm that has now passed.

A political party needs to oppose that trend (though, again, it may be too late), but it also needs to be clear what it stands FOR. Dysfunction is the rule of the day, sadly.

Making light of it here does indeed bug me. It's not a joke to me.

i like your links. the optimist in me believes that we can get back to where we were. we didn't have this amplified disdain under obama. that in the grand scheme of things isn't htat long ago. you can go back to rush and newt and bork and see when the rhetoric ignited but for the post part it's been tamped down until trump then embraced by progressives and exacerbated by biased media and social media. so to reiterate it hasn't really been that long. we can go back

the pessimist in me believes that our true colors have finally emerged and we really are two countries and our philososphy and ideology are polar. the old dems are being pushed out and progressives are taking over the party. maga won in a landslide. old guard pubs are dead. so what we have now is and going forward is maga vs progressives. the "norms" of same aren't remotely aligned and with the megaphones of media and social media will only add fuel to this fire

 

[BradStevens]

Everyone seems to acknowledge that "the parties" are broken and things are off kilter. But as I've talked about here, here and here, that can probably only be fixed if America reverts to some of its norms AND if there is deep support for some of those foundational norms. Based on the dialogue here and elsewhere, it's not at all evident there is any real desire to aspire to those norms. In the last link above, I shared what some of my preferred norms would be. I don't think all that many people actually agree, though. I think that disagreement flows from a rot in our information flows (free, fake, bad faith, inflammatory and dumb content that is eagerly lapped up due in turn to a degradation in Americans' ability to assess and take in information) and from a rise of anti-social behaviors and beliefs. On the latter point, there's hardly any indication of a strong foundational belief in the greater good and the value of a society that is thriving as much as it can top to bottom. That was generally a norm that has now passed.

A political party needs to oppose that trend (though, again, it may be too late), but it also needs to be clear what it stands FOR. Dysfunction is the rule of the day, sadly.

Making light of it here does indeed bug me. It's not a joke to me.

Two things:

(1) Although I bemoan the loss of what I consider a more objective media, I do not think that people today have a worse ability to assess and take in information than they did, say, 100 years ago. And the media back then was just as, if not more, biased. Many people in the past didn't even keep up with the news and no doubt voted on matters they knew nothing about and based on the feelz, just as we complain about now. Our era that we grew up in of the news was a bubble that bucked the trend of how news media operated throughout our nation's history.

(2) Re making light of stuff, why does it bother you? People post things on message boards for all sorts of reasons. One might be to lighten their load. Humor can be an escape from dread. And more importantly, no one here can do anything about any of these huge macro shifts in the culture, economy, or politics of our nation.

But I appreciate that it's important to you. Me too. So what are you doing to change things?

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Everyone seems to acknowledge that "the parties" are broken and things are off kilter. But as I've talked about here, here and here, that can probably only be fixed if America reverts to some of its norms AND if there is deep support for some of those foundational norms. Based on the dialogue here and elsewhere, it's not at all evident there is any real desire to aspire to those norms. In the last link above, I shared what some of my preferred norms would be. I don't think all that many people actually agree, though. I think that disagreement flows from a rot in our information flows (free, fake, bad faith, inflammatory and dumb content that is eagerly lapped up due in turn to a degradation in Americans' ability to assess and take in information) and from a rise of anti-social behaviors and beliefs. On the latter point, there's hardly any indication of a strong foundational belief in the greater good and the value of a society that is thriving as much as it can top to bottom. That was generally a norm that has now passed.

A political party needs to oppose that trend (though, again, it may be too late), but it also needs to be clear what it stands FOR. Dysfunction is the rule of the day, sadly.

Making light of it here does indeed bug me. It's not a joke to me.

The problem is systemic.

I don’t have much to add to my May 2017 post in response to your third link except to say that Tesla vandalism shows me the problem is worsening.

I blame educators and education. The young adults burning Teslas were in school in 2017. Fixing things will take a generation or more.

Lawless II: Critical Theory Returns with a Vengeance

Yesterday I laid out my how my personal experience led me to "do the work" and write Lawless. That research uncovered some disturbing differences from

reason.com

 

[bailey777]

Everyone seems to acknowledge that "the parties" are broken and things are off kilter. But as I've talked about here, here and here, that can probably only be fixed if America reverts to some of its norms AND if there is deep support for some of those foundational norms. Based on the dialogue here and elsewhere, it's not at all evident there is any real desire to aspire to those norms. In the last link above, I shared what some of my preferred norms would be. I don't think all that many people actually agree, though. I think that disagreement flows from a rot in our information flows (free, fake, bad faith, inflammatory and dumb content that is eagerly lapped up due in turn to a degradation in Americans' ability to assess and take in information) and from a rise of anti-social behaviors and beliefs. On the latter point, there's hardly any indication of a strong foundational belief in the greater good and the value of a society that is thriving as much as it can top to bottom. That was generally a norm that has now passed.

A political party needs to oppose that trend (though, again, it may be too late), but it also needs to be clear what it stands FOR. Dysfunction is the rule of the day, sadly.

Making light of it here does indeed bug me. It's not a joke to me.

Some of us have called the parties broken for 20 years but there still is no third party. It simply is not going to happen. Bernie tried and the dems put him back in his place. Its a nice dream but it will remain a two party system.

 

[BradStevens]

The problem is systemic.

I don’t have much to add to my May 2017 post in response to your third link except to say that Tesla vandalism shows me the problem is worsening.

I blame educators and education. The young adults burning Teslas were in school in 2017. Fixing things will take a generation or more.

Lawless II: Critical Theory Returns with a Vengeance

Yesterday I laid out my how my personal experience led me to "do the work" and write Lawless. That research uncovered some disturbing differences from

reason.com

We're going to be living with CRT's effects on the law for a long time, as those who bought into it in the 2010s advance through their legal careers.

 

[snarlcakes]

Everyone seems to acknowledge that "the parties" are broken and things are off kilter. But as I've talked about here, here and here, that can probably only be fixed if America reverts to some of its norms AND if there is deep support for some of those foundational norms. Based on the dialogue here and elsewhere, it's not at all evident there is any real desire to aspire to those norms. In the last link above, I shared what some of my preferred norms would be. I don't think all that many people actually agree, though. I think that disagreement flows from a rot in our information flows (free, fake, bad faith, inflammatory and dumb content that is eagerly lapped up due in turn to a degradation in Americans' ability to assess and take in information) and from a rise of anti-social behaviors and beliefs. On the latter point, there's hardly any indication of a strong foundational belief in the greater good and the value of a society that is thriving as much as it can top to bottom. That was generally a norm that has now passed.

A political party needs to oppose that trend (though, again, it may be too late), but it also needs to be clear what it stands FOR. Dysfunction is the rule of the day, sadly.

Making light of it here does indeed bug me. It's not a joke to me.

Become a Bitcoiner and help fix the world. We accept everyone.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

We're going to be living with CRT's effects on the law for a long time, as those who bought into it in the 2010s advance through their legal careers.

It’s not just legal education and it’s not just critical race theory. Critical theory is all over education. Coddled minds have hair triggers, don’t really think for themselves, have anxieties and look to others (government) to provide comforts and freedom from anxiety. When this doesn’t happen, the response is what the OP I describes; hate, name calling—and they end up burning Teslas for no rational reason.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I have been on the mailing list for the Forward Party since it was created. The problem is simple though. First Past the Post leaves no room for a third party. I agree with them on primaries without parties and ranked choice voting. But other than that, their mantra seems to be, "we ain't the other guys." I really don't know where they will actually stand on the issues. The problem is that the enthusiasm is at the extremes. "No abortion" and "unlimited abortion" have many more converts than say 19-week abortions. That group gets stuck with some saying "20 or I'm with unlimited" or "18 or I am with total ban." The middle is a more difficult position to hold.

 

[The Original Happy Goat]

It’s not just legal education and it’s not just critical race theory. Critical theory is all over education. Coddled minds have hair triggers, don’t really think for themselves, have anxieties and look to others (government) to provide comforts and freedom from anxiety. When this doesn’t happen, the response is what the OP I describes; hate, name calling—and they end up burning Teslas for no rational reason.

Critical theory has been all over education for the better part of a century. It isn't the problem.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Critical theory has been all over education for the better part of a century. It isn't the problem.

Primary emphases only for the last 40 years or so, after Zinn’s Peoples History.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

It’s not just legal education and it’s not just critical race theory. Critical theory is all over education. Coddled minds have hair triggers, don’t really think for themselves, have anxieties and look to others (government) to provide comforts and freedom from anxiety. When this doesn’t happen, the response is what the OP I describes; hate, name calling—and they end up burning Teslas for no rational reason.

Destruction of other people's property is wrong, full stop. It was wrong when it was Priuses

Priuses Vandalized in Tire-Slashing Spree | ARLnow.com

Sixteen vehicles, mostly Toyota Prius hybrids, had their tires slashed in Arlington overnight. Tires were slashed on 10 vehicles in the Waverly Hills and Cherrydale areas, on we're told. Most were Toyota Priuses, though at least one was a smart car, which is another gas-sipping vehicle popular...

www.arlnow.com

Prius, 4 less environmentally friendly vehicles targeted in Springfield vandalism spree

Brandon Jimenez, who had two magazines with pellets in his pocket, eventually admitted throwing the gun away as police approached, the report said.

www.masslive.com

Someone Painted 'Go Back to California' on a Prius in Portland

What would you do if you woke up to this vandalism?

www.thedrive.com

 

[The Original Happy Goat]

Primary emphases only for the last 40 years or so, after Zinn’s Peoples History.

I don't think that's true. I think critical theory has been at the core of postmodern academic studies since at least the middle of the 20th C. Guys like Foucault and Marcuse were engaging in critical theory in the decades before Zinn published, and their work had an outsized effect on the direction of modern social studies.

 

[BradStevens]

I don't think that's true. I think critical theory has been at the core of postmodern academic studies since at least the middle of the 20th C. Guys like Foucault and Marcuse were engaging in critical theory in the decades before Zinn published, and their work had an outsized effect on the direction of modern social studies.

Post modernism is incoherent nonsense.

There, I said it.

 

[The Original Happy Goat]

Post modernism is incoherent nonsense.

There, I said it.

"Incoherent nonsense" is a bit much, but I do think intellectual thought would be improved by a stronger response to pomo failings than what is currently being offered by so-called neomodernists. The problem is, with very few exceptions (Habermas?), modernists have done a poor job engaging/integrating Marxist techniques compared to how postmodernists have. And the value of Marxism in an academic setting substantially extends far beyond the confines of postmodernism.

I'm really probably not qualified to draw hard conclusions on this, but I think the biggest problem is that we've conflated critique of social structures and power hierarchies with both moral and epistemological relativism, and I don't think that's necessary. I think it's possible to address the things Marx addressed while still holding that truth does exist, and can be accessed by human inquiry.

YMMV on how much any of that makes sense.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Post modernism is incoherent nonsense.

There, I said it.

Post modernism is a product of sloppy, lazy, and imprecise thinking. Yeah, it’s nonsense and also incoherent. No form. No substance. Mush takes the place of values, principles and clarity.