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Ukraine and NATO(US) Are Done.

Mas-sa-suta

Mas-sa-suta

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Oct 23, 2003
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All of the jingoist talkers are now facing the grim reality that the Ukrainian misadventure has failed in every conceivable way.

Russia is much stronger today than in February '22, and continues to surge the industrial war materiel production capability far beyond the NATO group's ability to respond. Ukrainian population estimates range as low as 20 million remaining, out of 35 million before the Russian SMO, with 3-5 million internally displaced.
Ukrainian infrastructure is in ruins, the military is decimated, and morale is at rock bottom.
Ukrainian sources are revealing the massive corruption and theft of $Billions of American taxpayer funds by the connected Ukrainian elites..Kharkiv's outer defensive fortification ring barely existed...the money to build them stolen.
There is an expectation that Turkey will be the next domino to fall....out of NATO and into alignment with the Arab bloc and the Yuan/Ruble reserve currency movement.
The United States is in serious trouble. The Big Lie has been exposed.
 
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Mas-sa-suta said:
All of the jingoist talkers are now facing the grim reality that the Ukrainian misadventure has failed in every conceivable way.

Russia is much stronger today than in February '22, and continues to surge the industrial war materiel production capability far beyond the NATO group's ability to respond. Ukrainian population estimates range as low as 20 million remaining, out of 35 million before the Russian SMO, with 3-5 million internally displaced.
Ukrainian infrastructure is in ruins, the military is decimated, and morale is at rock bottom.
Ukrainian sources are revealing the massive corruption and theft of $Billions of American taxpayer funds by the connected Ukrainian elites..Kharkiv's outer defensive fortification ring barely existed...the money to build them stolen.
There is an expectation that Turkey will be the next domino to fall....out of NATO and into alignment with the Arab bloc and the Yuan/Ruble reserve currency movement.
The United States is in serious trouble. The Big Lie has been exposed.
Click to expand...
Couldn't have done it without the hard right in Congress blathering on about the US/Mexico border, which is completely irrelevant to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

Congratulations Vlad, on proving how weak the US is in its resolve to stop villainy around the world.
 
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I suspect very similar words were written during Dunkirk. Ukraine falling in no way is the "end of the US". Russia's production isn't sustainable. You ever notice countries don't stay on full war footing for years and years? Ukraiian troops, poorly trained with NATO weapons, extracted a very heavy cost to the Russians. How do you think a Marine division would do? Newer versions of the same weapons, much better trained and led? Russia hasn't come close to losing all the tanks, airplanes, ships she lost. She is just building tons or artillery shells.
 
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LOL, the only thing Russia and Putin have proven these past 2 and a half years is that conventionally speaking, they can barely project their military might beyond their own borders. They spent more than a decade fomenting rebellion inside Ukraine leading up to it's invasion in 2022. Kharkiv is less than 20 miles west of the Russian border FFS. It would be like Marion County deciding to invade Hendricks County, and getting bogged down halfway between Raceway Road and 267 for 2 years.
 
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Mas-sa-suta said:
All of the jingoist talkers are now facing the grim reality that the Ukrainian misadventure has failed in every conceivable way.

Russia is much stronger today than in February '22, and continues to surge the industrial war materiel production capability far beyond the NATO group's ability to respond. Ukrainian population estimates range as low as 20 million remaining, out of 35 million before the Russian SMO, with 3-5 million internally displaced.
Ukrainian infrastructure is in ruins, the military is decimated, and morale is at rock bottom.
Ukrainian sources are revealing the massive corruption and theft of $Billions of American taxpayer funds by the connected Ukrainian elites..Kharkiv's outer defensive fortification ring barely existed...the money to build them stolen.
There is an expectation that Turkey will be the next domino to fall....out of NATO and into alignment with the Arab bloc and the Yuan/Ruble reserve currency movement.
The United States is in serious trouble. The Big Lie has been exposed.
Click to expand...
Trying to convince Americans overnight to suddenly give shit about "Ukrainian sovereignty" by using using the Cold War jingoism that you mention was always doomed to fail. The leviathan bit off more than it could chew this time.
 
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Mas-sa-suta said:
All of the jingoist talkers are now facing the grim reality that the Ukrainian misadventure has failed in every conceivable way.

Russia is much stronger today than in February '22, and continues to surge the industrial war materiel production capability far beyond the NATO group's ability to respond. Ukrainian population estimates range as low as 20 million remaining, out of 35 million before the Russian SMO, with 3-5 million internally displaced.
Ukrainian infrastructure is in ruins, the military is decimated, and morale is at rock bottom.
Ukrainian sources are revealing the massive corruption and theft of $Billions of American taxpayer funds by the connected Ukrainian elites..Kharkiv's outer defensive fortification ring barely existed...the money to build them stolen.
There is an expectation that Turkey will be the next domino to fall....out of NATO and into alignment with the Arab bloc and the Yuan/Ruble reserve currency movement.
The United States is in serious trouble. The Big Lie has been exposed.
Click to expand...
Thanks for that propaganda Comrade.
 
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All well and good..but not one word of your blather addresses the reality that Ukraine is done.
NATO is severely challenged , and the Rus continues to industrialize it's weapons production, while $Billions of American taxpayer dollars(borrowed) are washed and portioned among the kleptocrat elite .
 
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Mas-sa-suta said:
Russia is much stronger today than in February '22
Click to expand...

200w.gif
 
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Mas-sa-suta said:
All well and good..but not one word of your blather addresses the reality that Ukraine is done.
NATO is severely challenged , and the Rus continues to industrialize it's weapons production, while $Billions of American taxpayer dollars(borrowed) are washed and portioned among the kleptocrat elite .
Click to expand...
But Zelensky got a whole pallet full of white powder along with a few yachts so it was all worth it.
 
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Bill4411 said:
Couldn't have done it without the hard right in Congress blathering on about the US/Mexico border, which is completely irrelevant to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

Congratulations Vlad, on proving how weak the US is in its resolve to stop villainy around the world.
Click to expand...
Yeah! We know the border is about America jackass. You have tons of illegals coming in daily, bringing in fentanyl and other crap, but we spend trillions for other countries. If the senile **** that’s in office wasn’t in office this shit wouldn’t have happened. There isn’t a country that’s afraid of sleepy Joe Biden. You leftist scum is the reason Russia invaded Ukraine and China is ****ing with Taiwan.
 
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The orc copium is strong in this one.
In other news, AFU shot down the second fighter today.
 
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Hoosier_Phenom said:
Yeah! We know the border is about America jackass. You have tons of illegals coming in daily, bringing in fentanyl and other crap, but we spend trillions for other countries. If the senile **** that’s in office wasn’t in office this shit wouldn’t have happened. There isn’t a country that’s afraid of sleepy Joe Biden. You leftist scum is the reason Russia invaded Ukraine and China is ****ing with Taiwan.
Click to expand...
It’s all a smokescreen for what should be happening with Ukraine. Why do you think
Mike Johnson did a complete 180 on his position? Why does the border have anything to do with Ukraine? We’ll pay dearly in the future for pulling our support from Ukraine. BTW, I thought leftist scum supported Russia, my how times have changed.
 
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Bill4411 said:
It’s all a smokescreen for what should be happening with Ukraine. Why do you think
Mike Johnson did a complete 180 on his position. Why does the border have anything to do with Ukraine. We’ll pay dearly in the future for pulling our support from Ukraine. BTW, I thought leftist scum supported Russia, my how times have changed.
Click to expand...
He's being blackmailed. Has a lot of skeletons in his closet.
 
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Hoosier_Phenom said:
Yeah! We know the border is about America jackass. You have tons of illegals coming in daily, bringing in fentanyl and other crap, but we spend trillions for other countries. If the senile **** that’s in office wasn’t in office this shit wouldn’t have happened. There isn’t a country that’s afraid of sleepy Joe Biden. You leftist scum is the reason Russia invaded Ukraine and China is ****ing with Taiwan.
Click to expand...
giphy.gif
 
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Mas-sa-suta said:
All of the jingoist talkers are now facing the grim reality that the Ukrainian misadventure has failed in every conceivable way.

Russia is much stronger today than in February '22, and continues to surge the industrial war materiel production capability far beyond the NATO group's ability to respond. Ukrainian population estimates range as low as 20 million remaining, out of 35 million before the Russian SMO, with 3-5 million internally displaced.
Ukrainian infrastructure is in ruins, the military is decimated, and morale is at rock bottom.
Ukrainian sources are revealing the massive corruption and theft of $Billions of American taxpayer funds by the connected Ukrainian elites..Kharkiv's outer defensive fortification ring barely existed...the money to build them stolen.
There is an expectation that Turkey will be the next domino to fall....out of NATO and into alignment with the Arab bloc and the Yuan/Ruble reserve currency movement.
The United States is in serious trouble. The Big Lie has been exposed.
Click to expand...
What nonsense. The invasion was clearly a huge blunder for the Puter.
You say, aaagain, that Ukraine is done. Yet Russian soldiers keep dying each day, and will be for the foreseeable future.
Russia, on the whole, is also far worse off due to Putin's' blunder. Wars are EXPENSIVE and Russia has fired off millions of shells in Ukraine. They've also lost tens of thousands of pieces of military equipment and will be pay for the aftercare of their thousands wounded soldiers for decades to come.
Puter's blunder caused a huge "brain drain" with many of its highest educated citizens fleeing abroad to avoid his ego-based war. This, in a country with a significant long-term decline in population.
Puter's blunder has seriously undermined foreign investment, except for the Chinese--as they become increasingly dependent upon the whims of Xi Jinping.
Puter's blunder led directly to the addition of Sweden and Finland into NATO, expanding its NATO border by over 800 miles. It has also led to increased spending by many NATO members.
Based on Russia's pathetic performance in Ukraine I highly doubt any NATO defense minister is losing any sleep. No American should either.
 
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Klaus 7196 said:
What nonsense. The invasion was clearly a huge blunder for the Puter.
You say, aaagain, that Ukraine is done. Yet Russian soldiers keep dying each day, and will be for the foreseeable future.
Russia, on the whole, is also far worse off due to Putin's' blunder. Wars are EXPENSIVE and Russia has fired off millions of shells in Ukraine. They've also lost tens of thousands of pieces of military equipment and will be pay for the aftercare of their thousands wounded soldiers for decades to come.
Puter's blunder caused a huge "brain drain" with many of its highest educated citizens fleeing abroad to avoid his ego-based war. This, in a country with a significant long-term decline in population.
Puter's blunder has seriously undermined foreign investment, except for the Chinese--as they become increasingly dependent upon the whims of Xi Jinping.
Puter's blunder led directly to the addition of Sweden and Finland into NATO, expanding its NATO border by over 800 miles. It has also led to increased spending by many NATO members.
Based on Russia's pathetic performance in Ukraine I highly doubt any NATO defense minister is losing any sleep. No American should either.
Click to expand...

To follow up, a quick look shows Russia has 7% inflation but they also have a 16% interest rate to combat inflation. Both are far worse than here. You mention their decline in population, and now even more are needed in the military. In addition, after the recent terrorist attack people from the Muslim areas aren't as welcome in western Russia. So their unemployment is 2%. That is a serious driver of inflation and will limit expansion. They are building artillery shells, and rebuilding destroyed tanks. They aren't able to build new/better infrastructure or even equipment. They are spending tremendous amounts to keep very old systems going. It is probably enough to beat a small country that had a very weak military.

And they will be paying out military pensions to wounded soldiers for a very long time.

The main thing keeping them afloat has been their hold on Saudi Arabia, whose decision to lower production significantly has helped create a huge market for Russian oil.
 
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Bill4411 said:
Couldn't have done it without the hard right in Congress blathering on about the US/Mexico border, which is completely irrelevant to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

Congratulations Vlad, on proving how weak the US is in its resolve to stop villainy around the world.
Click to expand...
That argument is for rubes. Russia was in control long before that.
 
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Marvin the Martian said:
To follow up, a quick look shows Russia has 7% inflation but they also have a 16% interest rate to combat inflation. Both are far worse than here. You mention their decline in population, and now even more are needed in the military. In addition, after the recent terrorist attack people from the Muslim areas aren't as welcome in western Russia. So their unemployment is 2%. That is a serious driver of inflation and will limit expansion. They are building artillery shells, and rebuilding destroyed tanks. They aren't able to build new/better infrastructure or even equipment. They are spending tremendous amounts to keep very old systems going. It is probably enough to beat a small country that had a very weak military.

And they will be paying out military pensions to wounded soldiers for a very long time.

The main thing keeping them afloat has been their hold on Saudi Arabia, whose decision to lower production significantly has helped create a huge market for Russian oil.
Click to expand...
Your last paragraph is important. Energy is the currency of foreign policy. Biden’s headlong rush to green while tamping down our future fossil fuel development green-lighted Putins war plans.

The war has been over for months. The last gasp Ukraine offensive in 2023 failed. We are now throwing away resources we don’t have so that Biden and the Dems can avoid a total disaster until after the election.

The west had a chance before the war began or in the first few months after, when Ukraine had manpower and infrastructure. but we FUBARED it with feckless, clueless, and incompetent leadership that turned the fighting into a war of attrition which only favors Russia. Why couldn’t we see this coming?

With the current Russian offensive, we are quickly losing negotiating leverage.
 
I don't think our policy with how we approached Ukraine has been 100% effective and think we missed a couple of potential exits, BUT, the Russians suck an entire bag of dicks. I will never understand the glee in which some of the people here and elsewhere are gloating over an expected loss of Ukraine to Russia. It is f---ing weird.
 
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IUCrazy2 said:
I don't think our policy with how we approached Ukraine has been 100% effective and think we missed a couple of potential exits, BUT, the Russians suck an entire bag of dicks. I will never understand the glee in which some of the people here and elsewhere are gloating over an expected loss of Ukraine to Russia. It is f---ing weird.
Click to expand...
Weird and very wrong.
 
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IUCrazy2 said:
I don't think our policy with how we approached Ukraine has been 100% effective and think we missed a couple of potential exits, BUT, the Russians suck an entire bag of dicks. I will never understand the glee in which some of the people here and elsewhere are gloating over an expected loss of Ukraine to Russia. It is f---ing weird.
Click to expand...
In thinking about Russia and Ukraine, I keep flashing to the scene in Enemy at the Gates where Russian strategy was to just keep sending in the troops and losses didn’t matter. Russia had more bodies to lose than the Germans. Same with Ukraine.
 
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CO. Hoosier said:
That argument is for rubes. Russia was in control long before that.
Click to expand...
Yeah, once they could see the weakness that our government showed in its support of Ukraine, and no there is not excuse available to Russia that they had a right to go into Ukraine and kill thousands and thousands of innocent people. Russia is POS country, always has been and probably always will be.
 
Mas-sa-suta said:
All of the jingoist talkers are now facing the grim reality that the Ukrainian misadventure has failed in every conceivable way.

Russia is much stronger today than in February '22, and continues to surge the industrial war materiel ...
Click to expand...

NewGuyToTheBoard said:
Trying to convince Americans overnight to suddenly give shit about "Ukrainian sovereignty" by using using the Cold War jingoism that you mention was always doomed to fail. The leviathan bit off more than it could chew this time.
Click to expand...
The topic of the OP regards Ukraine and NATO.
One sentence including the Rus.
But the responses are 'Rus this and Rus that'...
Like FJB, who no one on this board will defend, the Ukes have no defenders, only dissemblers and propagandists.
Ukraine has lost 40% of its' population...no dissent..
Ukraine's infrastructure is in ruins...no dissent..
The multi-$Billions Ukrainian military, under construction for a decade, paid for by American taxpayers money(borrowed/stolen)..is effectively destroyed.
NATO is wracked by internal conflicts involving a number of member states who understand the US past practice of just walking away from crap they start, when their attention wanders.
Reality has bitten the Neverending War bunch on their ass.
 
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Mas-sa-suta said:
The topic of the OP regards Ukraine and NATO.
One sentence including the Rus.
But the responses are 'Rus this and Rus that'...
Like FJB, who no one on this board will defend, the Ukes have no defenders, only dissemblers and propagandists.
Ukraine has lost 40% of its' population...no dissent..
Ukraine's infrastructure is in ruins...no dissent..
The multi-$Billions Ukrainian military, under construction for a decade, paid for by American taxpayers money(borrowed/stolen)..is effectively destroyed.
NATO is wracked by internal conflicts involving a number of member states who understand the US past practice of just walking away from crap they start, when their attention wanders.
Reality has bitten the Neverending War bunch on their ass.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the additional propaganda, Comrade.
 
CO. Hoosier said:
Your last paragraph is important. Energy is the currency of foreign policy. Biden’s headlong rush to green while tamping down our future fossil fuel development green-lighted Putins war plans.

The war has been over for months. The last gasp Ukraine offensive in 2023 failed. We are now throwing away resources we don’t have so that Biden and the Dems can avoid a total disaster until after the election.

The west had a chance before the war began or in the first few months after, when Ukraine had manpower and infrastructure. but we FUBARED it with feckless, clueless, and incompetent leadership that turned the fighting into a war of attrition which only favors Russia. Why couldn’t we see this coming?

With the current Russian offensive, we are quickly losing negotiating leverage.
Click to expand...
2019 we produced 12.3 million barrels per day, today we are at 14. He clearly has destroyed production.
 
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IUCrazy2 said:
I don't think our policy with how we approached Ukraine has been 100% effective and think we missed a couple of potential exits, BUT, the Russians suck an entire bag of dicks. I will never understand the glee in which some of the people here and elsewhere are gloating over an expected loss of Ukraine to Russia. It is f---ing weird.
Click to expand...

A decade + of Russian propaganda has gotten through to many and rotted their brains.
 
twenty02 said:
In control of what?
Click to expand...
Russia controls the place of fighting
Russia controls the pace of fighting
Russia controls the intensity of fighting

Ukrain can only react and and succeed with occasional pin-pricks of drones and missiles. Ukraine’s ability to dictate things with a meaningful counteroffensive failed. They can’t do it again without NATO boots on the ground.
 
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Marvin the Martian said:
2019 we produced 12.3 million barrels per day, today we are at 14. He clearly has destroyed production.
Click to expand...
Sigh.

Production doesn’t go on and off like a valve. Today’s production is a result of Trumps energy policies that are now on line. We won’t see the results of Biden policy for a few more years. . But we know what’s coming.
 
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CO. Hoosier said:
Russia controls the place of fighting
Russia controls the pace of fighting
Russia controls the intensity of fighting

Ukrain can only react and and succeed with occasional pin-pricks of drones and missiles. Ukraine’s ability to dictate things with a meaningful counteroffensive failed. They can’t do it again without NATO boots on the ground.
Click to expand...

Russia can't really do much either. If they could they would have managed to move more than a handful of miles in the matter of two years. Instead they have 250k casualties.

Due to Congressional dithering Ukraine has a serious deficit of artillery. What did the GOP gain by delaying the supplemental by 6 months? Nothing.
 
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