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Who will be today's surprise Stud Signer?

How does a former commit for Michigan go from 4 star to 2-star without a major injury or drop in performance?
You decommit from a major player and you instantly drop 2 stars?

That makes no sense.

It’s like the Purdue mentality.
“We really would like you to be a Boilermaker. Wait....what’s that? You signed with another school?
You’re trash anyway. We never wanted you. We’ve got walk-on’s better than you.”

You’re aware there’s idiots in every fan base right
 
Bowl: I think the drop is partially due to returning talent and lack of potential early playing time. (I have no facts to support my feeling. Huge Grin!) We' had some kids take a chance on us because they could play right away. Now it's a little different. Let hope 2020 is a killer class. Go Hoosiers!
I completely agree with this. Guys were coming here the past couple of years because we didn't have much depth and they knew they could play as true freshman. Now we are returning a large portion of our team, and I believe we will be red-shirting a lot more players this year then in years past. Which is good for the future because our S&C coaches get an extra year on these guys.
 
That's a fallacy. You know full well that most of these kids committed prior to the start of this season. We have dropped a bit from 2018 and 2019 recruiting levels which is almost certainly a function of the second consecutive 5-7 season in 2018. But we're working on a 9-4 (or, at worst, 8-5) season now and, given Allen's track record, particularly in Florida (did you know we'll be playing a bowl game there in two weeks?), it's reasonable to assume the 2021 recruiting class will be outstanding.


i agree with the first part of that...the early recruiting being a function of 5-7 & 2 straight tough losses to Purdue........the discouraging part is the way we finished....not being able to flip any of our early targets, not closing on any of the higher profile kids who visited at the end or others who had de-committed after the season was concluded..........and, we don't have any '21 recruits yet either so it's not like kids are beating down the doors now. That's a little concerning given all the pub we got the last 1/2 of the year/

Another oddity---no recruits from Florida this year.
 
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I completely agree with this. Guys were coming here the past couple of years because we didn't have much depth and they knew they could play as true freshman. Now we are returning a large portion of our team, and I believe we will be red-shirting a lot more players this year then in years past. Which is good for the future because our S&C coaches get an extra year on these guys.
If this theory that players won't come here because they want to play as freshman how do the top teams get good players to sign? I can see if it is a marginal player but the good ones we should be getting would sign regardless who is in front of them.
 
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I completely agree with this. Guys were coming here the past couple of years because we didn't have much depth and they knew they could play as true freshman. Now we are returning a large portion of our team, and I believe we will be red-shirting a lot more players this year then in years past. Which is good for the future because our S&C coaches get an extra year on these guys.

I'd like to add too that IU already redshirted most of last year's "highest rated class of the rankings era." The only ones that I think burned theirs were James, Mullen, Bedford, Ellis, and Sio. And 2-3 of those (Bedford, Sio, and arguably James) were by necessity more than plan. I still maintain it's a tough sell to get a 4* to come to IU and not have much of a chance to play. They'll sit at Notre Dame or Bama to have their 1 or 2 years in the sun, not here yet.
 
iv'e never put a lot of stock in recruit rankings either. i think it's more insightful to look at their offer lists. however this year i don't think we did too well in that area either did we?

I look at class structure.

I’d rather IU (as a rival) have one spectacular linebacker, one mediocre one and one buster who can’t cover) than three solid linebackers who usually make the basic play but aren’t spectacular.

More games are lost than won.

Michigan is Michigan because if Charbonnet just isn’t making it happen against IU.. they have three other guys they can try until someone has a good day. Injury on the OL? No problem.. two safeties out? Their number four guy is probably a much much much smaller dropoff than IU or Purdue.

Opposing coordinators don’t try to beat your strengths. They may give an extra blocker if some DE is a beast.

But.. you don’t beat Purdue by attacking Karlaftis. You beat Purdue by rolling away from Karlaftis and having quick hitters that are gonna exploit:

CB Kenny major
S/CB Simeon smiley (your last TD.. wtf was smiley doing? I still don’t know)
S Brennan Thienemann
The linebackers

Coordinators expose the bottom of your roster.. they pick on guys.

So I’d be much less worried about Michael Penix doing spectacular things for IU than I would be if someone was like “listen, IU is gonna come out with Peyton Ramsey, and 16+ good solid players on each side of the ball who just aren’t gonna lose games.”

So.. having said that. Evaluating IUs class.. “did you get a game breaker?” Who gives a flying **** lol.. for you, us, Michigan State or wake forest.

Did you, in this class and previous classes (players we haven’t seen yet from previous classes) address your weaknesses!

The success Fitzgerald has enjoyed has been because of this
 
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I don't understand how some have already decided this is a bad recruiting class.It is silly to make sweeping pronouncements before any of the recruits have played a snap. I view recruiting class rankings as a tool - a point of reference - but not something that is permanently etched in stone. Some of the factors used in the rankings are just silly quite frankly.

If you go by average player rating this is the 3rd best class we've had since 2010 and it's very close to 2nd. (If we land Allen 2020 would probably move up to 2nd.) Again I don't want to put too much into that but people who act like the sky is falling are not being reasonable. They are probably the same ones who were griping about LEO after the Ball St game.

I'm not in the business of ripping other people but I think there are some who need to stop acting like they are somehow an authority on the subject of recruiting and scouting. Ignorance doesn't know that it's ignorant I guess.
 
The University of Kentucky just signed “8”, yes, “8”, Four-Star OL/DL. It is absolutely amazing the recruiting job that Stoops and his staff do down there. I’m sick of comparable schools like UK, bringing in guys that can actually recruit (Calipari, Stoops), and landing high end talent and having success. We get excited about top 150 recruits in basketball and anyone better than a 2 star in football.


This kind of acceptance is why we don’t ever win anything meaningful. I’m glad we won 8 games this year. It was a lot of fun. But we didn’t beat 1 good team with a pulse. If the Gator Bowl turns out to be the Insight Bowl 2.0, than everything I just said will be justified.


Their class has:

1 at 6.1
1 at 5.9
7 at 5.8
4 at 5.7
6 at 5.6
1 at 5.5

I don't think IU & UK are a apples & apples comparison due to our low fan attendance and interest. I feel sorry for our coaches when they try to recruit to a 1/2 filled stadium.

That said, I do wish we'd make one major change in our recruiting strategy....hire at least one guy who can recruit the hell out of Ohio. Right now, Cincy & UK are getting loads of players, and schools like NW & Minnesota are getting more than us. I know we're recruiting Michigan some now.....I'd rather have the Ohio connection.

Looking at their class, 3 of their 5.8 guys were from Kentucky.
 
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I don't understand how some have already decided this is a bad recruiting class.It is silly to make sweeping pronouncements before any of the recruits have played a snap. I view recruiting class rankings as a tool - a point of reference - but not something that is permanently etched in stone. Some of the factors used in the rankings are just silly quite frankly.

If you go by average player rating this is the 3rd best class we've had since 2010 and it's very close to 2nd. (If we land Allen 2020 would probably move up to 2nd.) Again I don't want to put too much into that but people who act like the sky is falling are not being reasonable. They are probably the same ones who were griping about LEO after the Ball St game.

I'm not in the business of ripping other people but I think there are some who need to stop acting like they are somehow an authority on the subject of recruiting and scouting. Ignorance doesn't know that it's ignorant I guess.


Well.....there are only 65 P5 teams + ND and right now we're 49th in recruiting, and the class still includes two guys we're not going to get. That's not encouraging, whatever the reasons.

If we waited for 3 years to talk about recruits we wouldn't talk much about recruits. You're just being silly. We have to go with what we know & what we believe to be the case.
 
Overall many on this board are expecting a far to large jump in recruiting ranking based on one 8 win season. It's helps but we need to demonstrate this type of success over a span of a few years. Our recruiting will continue to develop and grow given the consistent leadership CTA & staff provide. Because of our history player development will always be the key to our on field success. Keep the faith folks...
 
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I'd like to add too that IU already redshirted most of last year's "highest rated class of the rankings era." The only ones that I think burned theirs were James, Mullen, Bedford, Ellis, and Sio. And 2-3 of those (Bedford, Sio, and arguably James) were by necessity more than plan. I still maintain it's a tough sell to get a 4* to come to IU and not have much of a chance to play. They'll sit at Notre Dame or Bama to have their 1 or 2 years in the sun, not here yet.
I've been thinking about this. We aren't the only team that fielded a young team in 2019. I would like to stack talent on top of talent and foster competition rather than subscribe to the notion that the 2019 class played early or redshirted and therefore we can't convince more talented kids to try to beat them out. Otherwise, the '20 class is just a good depth class, which it is.
 
If this theory that players won't come here because they want to play as freshman how do the top teams get good players to sign? I can see if it is a marginal player but the good ones we should be getting would sign regardless who is in front of them.
Is IU a top team?
 
Is IU a top team?
Absolutely not but if you accept the notion that good players wont come to IU because they cant play as we'll have to continue taking the 2 and 3 star players and hope to coach them up. Might get lucky sometimes but never catch up to the better teams.
 
i agree with the first part of that...the early recruiting being a function of 5-7 & 2 straight tough losses to Purdue........the discouraging part is the way we finished....not being able to flip any of our early targets, not closing on any of the higher profile kids who visited at the end or others who had de-committed after the season was concluded..........and, we don't have any '21 recruits yet either so it's not like kids are beating down the doors now. That's a little concerning given all the pub we got the last 1/2 of the year/

Another oddity---no recruits from Florida this year.
Absolutely agree that the fact we were 0 for Florida is puzzling and even a bit concerning. Lovie did well in the Tampa Bay area with a couple of guys who might have looked good in cream and crimson. CTA and staff absolutely have to keep that Florida pipeline going.
 
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Absolutely agree that the fact we were 0 for Florida is puzzling and even a bit concerning. Lovie did well in the Tampa Bay area with a couple of guys who might have looked good in cream and crimson. CTA and staff absolutely have to keep that Florida pipeline going.

It's really pretty bizarre--

'17-----9 Florida guys
'18-----8 Florida guys
'19-----7 Florida guys
'20-----0 Florida guys

I just feel that this was an ill-fated class from the start......we looked like we would get Craig, and Kyle King of New Pal to MSU early was also a bad surprise. Then we're in on 3-4 really nice prospects at the end and goose egg. And the Florida results.....
 
I've been thinking about this. We aren't the only team that fielded a young team in 2019. I would like to stack talent on top of talent and foster competition rather than subscribe to the notion that the 2019 class played early or redshirted and therefore we can't convince more talented kids to try to beat them out. Otherwise, the '20 class is just a good depth class, which it is.

I can't argue with any of that. I think what others have said about this class's die being cast before the season started makes a lot of sense insomuch as it being hard to break in on recruits. Wish they'd have landed more higher ranked kids at the end, but I guess thems the breaks.

But CTA really needs to roll into Columbus next year at least 6-2 to demonstrate to recruits that 2019 wasn't a fluke.
 
Their class has:

1 at 6.1
1 at 5.9
7 at 5.8
4 at 5.7
6 at 5.6
1 at 5.5

I don't think IU & UK are a apples & apples comparison due to our low fan attendance and interest. I feel sorry for our coaches when they try to recruit to a 1/2 filled stadium.

That said, I do wish we'd make one major change in our recruiting strategy....hire at least one guy who can recruit the hell out of Ohio. Right now, Cincy & UK are getting loads of players, and schools like NW & Minnesota are getting more than us. I know we're recruiting Michigan some now.....I'd rather have the Ohio connection.

Looking at their class, 3 of their 5.8 guys were from Kentucky.

Commonwealth Stadium has ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS had great attendance throughout the years.

They had great attendance when they were 2-10 and 3-9. A large city like Lexington is going to pack a stadium because they have a lot of residents (the metro area alone has over 500,000 people). It’s easier to pack a 60k stadium drawing from 500k in the immediate area than it is to fill 50k from 90k locals.

B-town is very small in comparison to these schools in very large metro areas.

It’s not an excuse but you’ve got a better chance of getting crowds being smack dab in the middle of a big city.

Camp Randall was another place that drew good crowds even when they stunk. The immediate area around Madison has 650,000 residents.
 
That’s a direct result of the horribly lopsided divisions where they get to avoid O$U, UM, PSU, and MSU regularly. Never having to play more than 2 of them in the regular season.

Anybody who knows Big Ten history realizes that Iowa under Fry and Ferentz (1978-present) and Wisconsin under Alvarez and his hand picked successors (1990-present) were major players long before the creation of divisions in the Big Ten football (2011)
 
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Jalen Williams is still a Verbal but he is from Florida. It's still a big drop off from previous years. Hopefully this is just an anomaly because obviously Florida is loaded with good players.

If we waited for 3 years to talk about recruits we wouldn't talk much about recruits. You're just being silly. We have to go with what we know & what we believe to be the case.

I'm not saying not to talk about recruiting classes as they come in, you are putting words in my mouth. I am imploring people to bring some perspective to such discussions.

I think we can all agree that class rankings and individual ratings are not an exact science. Whether we are talking about individual players or incoming classes collectively there will be those who under-perform, those who perform about as expected, and those who over-achieve (relative to the initial numbers that we get). Obviously we can evaluate what is coming in based on ratings and rankings and compare to other schools and other classes and develop some expectations. But to act like we know what is going to happen at this point, that is just not the case. I stand by my assertion that you can't fully judge a class until things play out on the field. I think any informed commentator would agree with this and to suggest that an initial snap judgement somehow carries more weight in the final analysis, that is what is silly.

I know people would like to see that 49 national class ranking be more like 29 and the 12th in the Big Ten be more like 6th. I get it, obviously I would too. But 1) this is a smaller class and 2) we just went 8-4 so I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt rather than flipping out and saying the class is horrible and Allen sucks and all of that crap.
 
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