What Life Changes Might We See When Things Get Back To Normal?

hookyIU1990

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Google and Facebook are both planning on having their employees work remotely for a very long time. Every other tech company that we work with has been rolling along with nearly the same amount of productivity as before. We're opening up our US office next week, but India and Canada aren't opening any time soon and quite frankly, we haven't missed a beat. As our customers have gotten used to remote teams, their productivity is approaching previous levels. Travel (all modes, not just air) and office environments are going to drastically change.
 

Sope Creek

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Some industries I see with diminished demand permanently:

5. As McNutt stated, any business that targets corporate offices
On the flip side, which of those businesses translate into WFH-focused businesses? Think anything related to information that used to be at the office - shredders, printers/ink, networking, networking security . . . just as many customers, but with lower per sale numbers.
 

i'vegotwinners

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most jobs can't be done from home, and never could.

that said, "the" biggest wfh tech advancements are the telephone, the home computer, email, fax machines, and home printer/scanners, and all have been around for a generation or more, and over 100 yrs for the phone.

they didn't kill the office.

a video call is a 0.000005% advancement over the voice call other than for tv or medicine.

that said, activist investors, private equity, and tech, will be far more responsible for any long term corp travel drop off than covid.

as for the office, employers and bosses are control freaks by nature, and i think the return to the physical office will be greater than some think.

and there is a social aspect in physical presence both bosses and many workers like, and won't want to give up.

that said, if your job can be done from home, it can just as easily be done from China or India or anywhere else on earth.

just sayin.
 
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Krafty97grad

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On the flip side, which of those businesses translate into WFH-focused businesses? Think anything related to information that used to be at the office - shredders, printers/ink, networking, networking security . . . just as many customers, but with lower per sale numbers.

Sadly, I don’t think it creates any jobs. If employees are required to procure those items themselves, they will source via eCommerce (Amazon, etc) for the printers, ink, ergonomic stands, etc. Whoever at HP (ink/printers) that currently manages the Amazon account, just sees more volume. If companies were procuring on behalf of their employees and then shipping to employees’ homes, they likely have existing agreements with companies like CDW (so the CDW rep will benefit from the volume, but no job creation). Networking, etc will still likely be managed within an organization’s IT function. These are great examples to highlight that the necessity for many jobs will be diminished/eliminated without a corresponding lift in opportunities elsewhere. It will be similar to people in the oil / combustion engine related industries as cars / trucks go to electric (the gains to perform maintenance on electrical cars won’t make up for all the jobs lost by mechanics performing oil changes and combustion engine related maintenance, let alone those associated with consumer oil/gas distribution). The difference is the conversion to electric is happening gradually, so the changes are manageable (education, technical training, etc can be modified to meet emerging and diminishing demand).
 

Krafty97grad

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most jobs can't be done from home, and never could.

that said, "the" biggest wfh tech advancements are the telephone, the home computer, email, fax machines, and home printer/scanners, and all have been around for a generation or more, and over 100 yrs for the phone.

they didn't kill the office.

Yet, it was coming, now it is much closer

a video call is a 0.000005% advancement over the voice call other than for tv or medicine.

I think you are in the minority with this opinion. It was enlightening for me to watch a teacher via video teach a class to 20 1st graders (including my son) and have the class discuss topics she raised leveraging Zoom. There is not a chance that could have been accomplished via a phone-only conference call. As an adult, the ability to share content, visibly see other participants so that no one talks over one another and be able to read expressions, etc is light years ahead of a conference call (especially if a participant takes a phone only call from the car).

that said, activist investors, private equity, and tech, will be far more responsible for any long term corp travel drop off than covid.

Absolutely agree. All covid did was force the world to try out remote working as normal vs exception for 4 months, and the world discovered it works really well.

as for the office, employers and bosses are control freaks by nature, and i think the return to the physical office will be greater than some think.

I’m 45, I think your perspective is for the 50+ Demographic. I myself prefer in person, however for those 40 and younger that are used to (good bandwidth, wi-fi, texting, FaceTime, Facebook, match.com, and all the other technology changes that have reduced direct, in-person interaction) they see this as a natural evolution.

Plus messenger apps now make “presence” known to all bosses/managers, I would argue it gives them more control and access. All the platforms trace availability, etc, so a micro-manager can have all types of insight to effort / productivity of their employees.



and there is a social aspect in physical presence both bosses and many workers like, and won't want to give up.

Of course the social aspect is nice, but in exchange for no commute, more time with family/friends, etc, I think the list of who wants to return back to 4-5 days in the office is shorter than you think.


that said, if your job can be done from home, it can just as easily be done from China or India or anywhere else on earth.

-Agree, your proximity to your corporate headquarters or office becomes less critical/restricting. The ramifications on this are a whole different conversation.


just sayin.
 
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All4You

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most jobs can't be done from home, and never could.

that said, "the" biggest wfh tech advancements are the telephone, the home computer, email, fax machines, and home printer/scanners, and all have been around for a generation or more, and over 100 yrs for the phone.

they didn't kill the office.

a video call is a 0.000005% advancement over the voice call other than for tv or medicine.

that said, activist investors, private equity, and tech, will be far more responsible for any long term corp travel drop off than covid.

as for the office, employers and bosses are control freaks by nature, and i think the return to the physical office will be greater than some think.

and there is a social aspect in physical presence both bosses and many workers like, and won't want to give up.

that said, if your job can be done from home, it can just as easily be done from China or India or anywhere else on earth.

just sayin.

I agree with Krafty97 on this. I think this 4 month preview of what telecommuting and e-learning could be like has really opened some eyes of both employees and employers. I am as guilty of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" stubbornness both from the perspective of employee and employer, producer as well as management. While your points about technology thats been around for a generation or more not killing the office are true for now, the advances made this past decade or so from both a hardware and software standpoint have been in leaps and bounds and the only things in my estimation that stands (stood?) in the way was the stubborn traditionalists like myself.

Both my wife and my daughter work in an office environment and many to most of their job duties have been done remotely these past few months and their production hasn't skipped a beat. All my daughter's meetings and home office duties have been done remotely and will be for the foreseeable future. As for my wife, she is an office manager of a counseling office, so while she still works some from the office (it's convenient for her, less than a mile from where we live), around 75% of her duties can be done remotely and she can do so if she wishes. This wasn't the case for either of them prior to the pandemic, and I believe going forward the pandemic definately hastened the process. The benefits for both employee and employer are too large to ignore.
 

i'vegotwinners

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I agree with Krafty97 on this. I think this 4 month preview of what telecommuting and e-learning could be like has really opened some eyes of both employees and employers. I am as guilty of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" stubbornness both from the perspective of employee and employer, producer as well as management. While your points about technology thats been around for a generation or more not killing the office are true for now, the advances made this past decade or so from both a hardware and software standpoint have been in leaps and bounds and the only things in my estimation that stands (stood?) in the way was the stubborn traditionalists like myself.

Both my wife and my daughter work in an office environment and many to most of their job duties have been done remotely these past few months and their production hasn't skipped a beat. All my daughter's meetings and home office duties have been done remotely and will be for the foreseeable future. As for my wife, she is an office manager of a counseling office, so while she still works some from the office (it's convenient for her, less than a mile from where we live), around 75% of her duties can be done remotely and she can do so if she wishes. This wasn't the case for either of them prior to the pandemic, and I believe going forward the pandemic definately hastened the process. The benefits for both employee and employer are too large to ignore.

be careful what you wish for.
 
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sglowrider

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Its funny... I was just talking to a friend of mine over dinner last night. She runs an HR team at one of the major hospital clusters here.

Post-Covid or at least going forward, they have been instructed to keep a lot of the business continuity processes/measures that were implemented in Feb. So, working remotely, separation of teams and locations etc.

Either the authorities here think there is no end in sight or that its prep for the next possible pandemic which is equally scary.

Then she was bitching about her boss who is ol' skool and may struggle to work in that context. He needs people around and may struggle to manage people who work remotely as he ain't the manage by objectives type. More the let the structure drive it.
 

hookyIU1990

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Its funny... I was just talking to a friend of mine over dinner last night. She runs an HR team at one of the major hospital clusters here.

Post-Covid or at least going forward, they have been instructed to keep a lot of the business continuity processes/measures that were implemented in Feb. So, working remotely, separation of teams and locations etc.

Either the authorities here think there is no end in sight or that its prep for the next possible pandemic which is equally scary.

Then she was bitching about her boss who is ol' skool and may struggle to work in that context. He needs people around and may struggle to manage people who work remotely as he ain't the manage by objectives type. More the let the structure drive it.
At the beginning of all of this, we sat down and went through clients and prospects to try to put together plans for those we thought would have a difficult time adapting to this. Leadership style/company culture was the first or second item on every list. I'm not sure if it was a self fulfilling prophecy or not, but everyone that we had concerns about have struggled. A few of them have adapted and turned the corner, but most are mired in it and can't make the necessary changes.
 

sglowrider

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At the beginning of all of this, we sat down and went through clients and prospects to try to put together plans for those we thought would have a difficult time adapting to this. Leadership style/company culture was the first or second item on every list. I'm not sure if it was a self fulfilling prophecy or not, but everyone that we had concerns about have struggled. A few of them have adapted and turned the corner, but most are mired in it and can't make the necessary changes.

Yeap. I have worked from home as well as do regional work. So its no big deal for me, managing remotely. Its all about objective setting. Plus I do startups -- so its about conceptualisation to, funding to product development and then go to market. Luckily I don't need a huge team yet.
My friend's boss is struggling as he thinks management is having his soldiers around and barking things out.
 

All4You

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Yeap. I have worked from home as well as do regional work. So its no big deal for me, managing remotely. Its all about objective setting. Plus I do startups -- so its about conceptualisation to, funding to product development and then go to market. Luckily I don't need a huge team yet.
My friend's boss is struggling as he thinks management is having his soldiers around and barking things out.

At the beginning of all of this, we sat down and went through clients and prospects to try to put together plans for those we thought would have a difficult time adapting to this. Leadership style/company culture was the first or second item on every list. I'm not sure if it was a self fulfilling prophecy or not, but everyone that we had concerns about have struggled. A few of them have adapted and turned the corner, but most are mired in it and can't make the necessary changes.

Traditional, old school management styles won't like it primarily because they don't feel they have control of it. From middle to executive management in the twilight age range, these people are used to leading teams that reside in a sea of cubicles that they can literally oversee and manage. They can be converted, but they have to be shown that productivity and workflow can be tracked and controlled remotely and they need to be provided the means with which to easily do it.

Now, the micromanager is another story altogether...that management style is prevalent and needs to be reconditioned or fall by the wayside.
 

SoccerSammy

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In the end, humanity still craves socialization. We will have a vaccine and then COVID will be just her another seasonal virus that we will deal with permanently. If Golden Corral and the cruise ships disappear forever I will not cry, but people still want to be around other people, shake hands, hug, etc.....kids need to be IN SCHOOL around other kids, learning and socializing. In the end the new world will look a whole lot like the old world, in my fairly useless opinion of course
 

VanPastorMan

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In the end, humanity still craves socialization. We will have a vaccine and then COVID will be just her another seasonal virus that we will deal with permanently. If Golden Corral and the cruise ships disappear forever I will not cry, but people still want to be around other people, shake hands, hug, etc.....kids need to be IN SCHOOL around other kids, learning and socializing. In the end the new world will look a whole lot like the old world, in my fairly useless opinion of course
I have never been on a cruise,but another poster spoke negatively about them. Why do you dislike them?
 

SoccerSammy

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I have never been on a cruise,but another poster spoke negatively about them. Why do you dislike them?
I dislike them personally because for whatever reason I feel claustrophobic on them. Something about not being able to get off the boat when I choose. Silly but have tried a couple and just didn’t care for. The other reason is as stated above... what the massive cruise populations have done to previously serene destinations. I don’t fault the cruise lines for capitalizing and I don’t criticize the locales for welcoming the cruisers’ money.... but I just personally don’t have any use for them
 
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Krafty97grad

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In the end, humanity still craves socialization. We will have a vaccine and then COVID will be just her another seasonal virus that we will deal with permanently. If Golden Corral and the cruise ships disappear forever I will not cry, but people still want to be around other people, shake hands, hug, etc.....kids need to be IN SCHOOL around other kids, learning and socializing. In the end the new world will look a whole lot like the old world, in my fairly useless opinion of course

I want to be clear, I don’t think these changes are happening due to Covid the disease. It was just the catalyst that set the change in motion. These changes were coming with or without the pandemic, just over a much longer/more subtle timeframe. Kids need to go to school in person, the necessary infrastructure for most school districts/families is not in place to support remote learning (more importantly is the social/emotional learning in person school provides).

I think remote working shifts the socialization from the office to more family, neighbors and friends. Also, I anticipate certain meetings / projects etc occasionally requiring in person meetings in the office, leading to a day or two a week, which will accomplish work socialization.
 
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VanPastorMan

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I dislike them personally because for whatever reason I feel claustrophobic on them. Something about not being able to get off the boat when I choose. Silly but have tried a couple and just didn’t care for. The other reason is as stated above... what the massive cruise populations have done to previously serene destinations. I don’t fault the cruise lines for capitalizing and I don’t criticize the locales for welcoming the cruisers’ money.... but I just personally don’t have any use for them
I always wondered if sea sickness could be an issue. I've never been on a boat in the ocean,but did one of those 1 hr river boat rides.
 

PhishPhan682

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hopefully people stop believing the fairy in the sky will protect them from naturally occurring things
 

SoccerSammy

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hopefully people stop believing the fairy in the sky will protect them from naturally occurring things
Which fairy? If you’re referring to our maker, that has never ever ever been promised. That is a bastardization of scripture
 

SoccerSammy

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is there more than one fairy?
People believe in a lot of things. In case you forgot your history the Greeks and Romans and many other cultures have believed in many many “fairies”. Monotheism recognizes that we have one supreme being who is our creator. Definitely not a “fairy”
 

PhishPhan682

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People believe in a lot of things. In case you forgot your history the Greeks and Romans and many other cultures have believed in many many “fairies”. Monotheism recognizes that we have one supreme being who is our creator. Definitely not a “fairy”
what happens to the other people of the world that don't believe in said supreme being that is the creator?
 

SoccerSammy

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what happens to the other people of the world that don't believe in said supreme being that is the creator?
Haha. Nice try. Trying to start an argument about religion? Not gonna bite on that. We all believe what we believe and I thank God every day that I live in a country where I can be a practicing Christian without negative consequences and you can believe or disbelieve whatever you choose and not be persecuted for those beliefs. Our founders, who are under attack because they were very flawed human beings in many ways, at least had the foresight to write & sign a Constitution that protects those rights. Protestors can topple all the Jefferson monuments they want (and he clearly had some major issues) but nobody can deny he was the principal author of possibly the greatest governmental document throughout history. Going back to the original argument about fairies and the Lord and the billions of people who don’t believe in a single creator, the beauty of my faith is that it doesn’t matter. I know what I believe and how I present myself in my community and world because of those beliefs and I’ll let my creator sort out all the details. We all have faith in something. I just choose to place my faith in God and his son who suffered and died to allow me and all who believe in him to have eternal life
 
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PhishPhan682

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Haha. Nice try. Trying to start an argument about religion? Not gonna bite on that. We all believe what we believe and I thank God every day that I live in a country where I can be a practicing Christian without negative consequences and you can believe or disbelieve whatever you choose and not be persecuted for those beliefs. Our founders, who are under attack because they were very flawed human beings in many ways, at least had the foresight to write & sign a Constitution that protects those rights. Protestors can topple all the Jefferson monuments they want (and he clearly had some major issues) but nobody can deny he was the principal author of possibly the greatest governmental document throughout history. Going back to the original argument about fairies and the Lord and the billions of people who don’t believe in a single creator, the beauty of my faith is that it doesn’t matter. I know what I believe and how I present myself in my community and world because of those beliefs and I’ll let my creator sort out all the details. We all have faith in something. I just choose to place my faith in God and his son who suffered and died to allow me and all who believe in him to have eternal life
ever hear the story about Moses and the burning bush?
 

SoccerSammy

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he was tripping on ayahuasca

you should try it sometime. it will make the bible even more enjoyable for you
Sorry. I invested enough mind altering substances between the ages of 18-22!! I’ve decided having some control of my faculties is more enjoyable at this stage in my life. But thanks for the advice
 

i'vegotwinners

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Haha. Nice try. Trying to start an argument about religion? Not gonna bite on that. We all believe what we believe and I thank God every day that I live in a country where I can be a practicing Christian without negative consequences and you can believe or disbelieve whatever you choose and not be persecuted for those beliefs. Our founders, who are under attack because they were very flawed human beings in many ways, at least had the foresight to write & sign a Constitution that protects those rights. Protestors can topple all the Jefferson monuments they want (and he clearly had some major issues) but nobody can deny he was the principal author of possibly the greatest governmental document throughout history. Going back to the original argument about fairies and the Lord and the billions of people who don’t believe in a single creator, the beauty of my faith is that it doesn’t matter. I know what I believe and how I present myself in my community and world because of those beliefs and I’ll let my creator sort out all the details. We all have faith in something. I just choose to place my faith in God and his son who suffered and died to allow me and all who believe in him to have eternal life

"Protestors can topple all the Jefferson monuments they want (and he clearly had some major issues) but nobody can deny he was the principal author of possibly the greatest governmental document throughout history".
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you mean the one that gave literally all power to rich white males like himself and the other "founders", didn't even give white male soldiers who fought to the death alongside Washington the right to vote if they didn't pass the wealth test, didn't allow any women or minorities voting rights, and wrote the right to own slaves as he did, right into the document?

that document?????

could have saved ink and just written, "all power to me and the very few like me, and fk everyone else".

funny how those who get to write the rules always seem to do that.

not my definition of greatness.

but hey, as Bill Barr says, the winners get to write history.
 
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SoccerSammy

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"Protestors can topple all the Jefferson monuments they want (and he clearly had some major issues) but nobody can deny he was the principal author of possibly the greatest governmental document throughout history".
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you mean the one that gave literally all power to rich white males like himself and the other "founders", didn't even give white male soldiers who fought to the death alongside Washington the right to vote if they didn't pass the wealth test, didn't allow any women or minorities voting rights, and wrote the right to own slaves as he did, right into the document?

that document?????

could have saved ink and just written, "all power to me and the very few like me, and fk everyone else".

funny how those who get to write the rules always seem to do that.

not my definition of greatness.

but hey, as Bill Barr says, the winners get to write history.
We were definitely better off as colonists under British imperial rule. How silly of me to have forgotten!
 
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i'vegotwinners

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We were definitely better off as colonists under British imperial rule. How silly of me to have forgotten!

A), totally false choice, so non productive and only self serving. (nice false indignation play though).

B) i doubt slaves felt King George was their imperial ruler.

or native Americans.

C), how much better off the non land holder common man or woman was, i suppose would be an interesting discussion topic.

not exactly something history tells us much about. (not that US history is a strong suit of mine).

new boss, same as the old boss??

perhaps the Canadians could chime in on that.

post US independence, just how much better off was the common man or woman in the US than in Canada. (weather not withstanding).

i have not the slightest idea myself.
 
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PhishPhan682

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We were definitely better off as colonists under British imperial rule. How silly of me to have forgotten!
sam the soccer

we should pray for this dude.

I'll do with you as long as you take the moses and burning bush trip with me
 

SoccerSammy

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at 7:05 AM?

no sir. Sam, see you don't know me but I know you.

I think you are a closet Tom Crean fan.
No closet fan. TC brought us 2 B1G titles in 4 years. Before 2013 we had one “title” in 20 years, which was shared with half the league
 

birdforbogey

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Its funny... I was just talking to a friend of mine over dinner last night. She runs an HR team at one of the major hospital clusters here.

Post-Covid or at least going forward, they have been instructed to keep a lot of the business continuity processes/measures that were implemented in Feb. So, working remotely, separation of teams and locations etc.

Either the authorities here think there is no end in sight or that its prep for the next possible pandemic which is equally scary.

Then she was bitching about her boss who is ol' skool and may struggle to work in that context. He needs people around and may struggle to manage people who work remotely as he ain't the manage by objectives type. More the let the structure drive it.
This is the AOTF, did you get any?
 

PhishPhan682

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No closet fan. TC brought us 2 B1G titles in 4 years. Before 2013 we had one “title” in 20 years, which was shared with half the league
what was your favorite part about his coaching?

I always enjoyed his 2-3 zone offense as well as his pace.
 

SoccerSammy

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what was your favorite part about his coaching?

I always enjoyed his 2-3 zone offense as well as his pace.
So Boeheim are him for lunch. The tourney is a tricky think. I always respected him for leaving a pretty good thing at Marquette to take a job nobody wanted. Thanks sampson
 

UncleMark

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Protestors can topple all the Jefferson monuments they want (and he clearly had some major issues) but nobody can deny he was the principal author of possibly the greatest governmental document throughout history.
No, that was Madison.