Didn’t say that. Just saying the Phinisee initiated the contact on this play, the Illinois player was entitled to the space he occupied, and his foot and leg didn’t move. This, no foul occurred, and none was called.
Well played game, screwed by the refs 2x in the last minute
- Thread starter demunn
- Start date
I can watch it again, but as I said, I replayed it 3-4 times and from what I saw, the kid plants his foot inside of RPs, so Phin's foot caught it as he started to move. It was a close play and as such a good play, but I saw a pattern all game of IL positioning themselves to push IU out of bounds. It's how they play and I have no problem with it; it's exactly how I played, but I also got whistled for a lot of fouls, and rightfully so. I don't have any problem that it wasn't called, and at home at the end of the game, it's what I would assume. We didn't do enough in other areas (namely, getting in front of their drives and cutting them off), but I do think this was a foul that just wasn't called, and I'm pretty certain it was too close to make the declaration it wasn't a foul... unless you have an agenda.
Last comment because I don't have the will-power to keep going back and forth with someone who clearly has an anti-IU agenda. I stated from the get-go that the play in question by rule could absolutely be construed as a foul but wouldn't expect it to be called in that scenario.
The replay you keep clamoring 100% shows the foot of the Illinois player impeding the movement of Phinisee. It makes zero difference in the world if the foot of the Illinois didn't move or if Phinisee initiated the contact. The Illinois player impeded the driving lane of the space that both players were entitled too. That by rule is a foul and therefore could have been called as such. It's not the reason why IU lost and have stated that since yesterday.
RP was a bit out of control and probably should’ve gathered himself a bit. Bang bang play, though.
When the defender initiated the contact, a foul should be called. He just didn’t in this situation. And it has nothing to do with whether I like Miller or not (I’ve never said I don’t like him, so you made that up), it’s just the rules of the game. I’m obviously not a big fan of whining about refs and using them as an excuse.
Phin is entitled to the area around his space. It's called area of vertically. When the Illinois player planted his foot between Rob, he invaded that space. Thus, it is a foul.
It's not hard to understand those that have played the game at the high school level or above.
It's not hard to understand those that have played the game at the high school level or above.
Except these aren't facts. They are your opinions, and you just proclaim them as fact. The fact is, that you can cause a foul by getting too close to someone and impeding their progress, which is exactly how I saw this. You don't have to be moving. Those are facts and yet you are trying to argue against them, by saying he wasn't moving. Whether it happened in this case is subjective, but it is a fact that you can cause a foul without moving if you position yourself improperly or late or into another players space. It happens all the time on block/charge calls and in positioning your body to force the ballhandler out along the baseline, for which IL got whistled a few times yesterday. The interpretation of that here, is just an opinion, not fact. I think if you had 10 refs review it, about half would see it as a foul, and half as a no-call.
Nope. There’s no imaginary protective cone that can’t be invaded. If you’d actually ever played, you would’ve known that. You didn’t.
See, this is where you give yourself away. You insert words and concepts that are just wrong. Here's my quote:
Now, how can you say or imply I'm using it as an excuse?
It’s all opinion. I’m sorry you’re so upset. You don’t seem to understand the rules or how the game is officiated, though.
Because you’re whining about a non call without offering anything that could reasonably conclude that the ref messed up. He didn’t. It was a bang bang play. You’re just upset because it has to have been some error by the ref. It’s an emotional reaction, not a rules based one. I get it, it was a tough loss.
Why do you think over the back call exists?
The player gets the space from the floor all the way up.
If you would have played, you would know this. It's clear, you have not though, so you don't know what you're talking about.
I played, started Jr and Sr year in high school...still play 2 church/club leagues at age 52. Been playing for 47 yrs. Coached, ref'd youth and middle school ball. Does my opinion count?
Honestly you're not going to change your mind, you are borderline anti-IU and very anti-CAM and this team. This feels a lot like arguing with my wife...or even worse, my mother in law. Kobiyashi Maru.
This wasn’t an over the back situation. Besides, players can and do go over the back legitimately without fouling. IU list a game that way last year. You obviously never played if you believe otherwise.
There most definitely is; the cylinder rule.
The “cylinder rule” became part of the verticality rule (Rule 4-38) for the main purpose of helping to rebalance the rules between offense and defense by creating freedom of movement for an offensive player to attempt a normal basketball move.
Excellent trolling on your part I must say.
But without initiating contact, there is no foul. You’re simply wrong here. Sorry. Never cared for whiners.
There absolutely is, and the space between your legs is a good example of it. A defender could plant his foot between your legs without making contact, which is exactly what I think happened here, impeding the ballhandlers' progress. Again, it's subjective if it happened, but that it can is not, and you're wrong.
Initiating contact has literally NOTHING to do with the rule. You're arguing for the sake of arguing right now.
So, in your view, he’s fouling just by putting his foot there? Or, if his foot is there, contact initiated by the other player is still a foul on the D? You sure you played? The game isn’t officiated that way, and never has been.
Of course it does. You’ve misinterpreted the rule. Watch a little more and you might learn.
so...hypothetically speaking....I fall to the floor on the court. I sit there for a second, see my opponent dribbling towards me. I extend my leg and foot out...but hey, my leg was there first, so position established. My opponent trips over my extended leg and foot and loses the ball. Foul is not on me, because my foot and leg were there first?
That's not how it works. Ever.
It was obvious that the refs were going to swallow the whistles during the final 2 minutes and not cross the rabid home crowd. Not the first time that's happened in B1G. Won't be the last.
Why bother with this clown? He's clearly doing this for a rise.
So, you’re there on the floor and your opponent, seeing you, nonetheless dribbles right into you and trips. You’re saying that’s a foul on you? In your scenario, you extended your leg as he approached and could reasonably be whistled for doing so intentionally. That’s a foul. But that’s not what happened yesterday.
Bottom line is we were only down 2 when TJD went to the line. Do you even watch the games?
No, I’m “doing it” because you’re whining about the refs where it isn’t warranted. Stop acting like a child.
Ord doesn't want facts, it doesn't fit his narrative.
You'd have to ask a ref if that's a foul. In my view it's a moot point because it's never going to be called until there is contact that gives the defender an advantage. It's sort of like on the interstate if you drift in to my lane, you're in the wrong and breaking the law, but if I can avoid contact, you're probably not getting cited. But to me, his foot clearly gets on the inside of Phin's, so that when he starts to move, he trips over it. That's a foul. And as I've said, I'm not surprised it wasn't called (I even said that for the most part, I thought we got pretty good treatment from the refs for being on the road), and don't think it cost us the game.
Not Ord, but what facts am I missing, and what narrative am I trying to fit? I doubt you’ll respond since all you’re doing is drive by trolling, but that seems all the rage here.
So is the offensive player prohibited from entering the defensive players safe zone, too? Consistency would demand that your standard be applied evenly, yet that’s not how the game is officiated. But according to one poster, going over the back without making contact is a foul, too, so you never know.
your scenario is even more pointless. Rob didn't see his leg and intentionally dribble towards it. Again I'm not blaming the refs. I think we lost because we continue to play soft at the wrong times, and Green shot us into a hole around the 5 minute mark and the game went from tied to us down 8 in a short span. I just think the refs swallowed their whistles several times in the final 2 minutes, and each time, it benefitted the home team. But if you want to win on the road, you have to be wiling to play 5 vs 8 plus 17000 friends. Games like yesterday are won (or in our case, lost) because of upper classmen guards and their leadership. Of which, we have little-to-none.
Certainly, it's called a charge.
I'm not going to argue with you if it was a foul, as I've said, I think it's subjective and some refs would call it and some would not. My argument with you is you were trying to say 1) it's not a foul because the defender has his foot planted and didn't move, 2) that Phin initiated the contact, and 3) that it was a "Fact" that it wasn't a foul.
And, here you go: go to 3:10 and play from there. Don't see how you can say he didn't trip him, but I know you will!
His foot was extended. It should've been called a foul.
FWIW...the Kobiyashi Maru was a training simulation test for Star Trek officers....it means ' The No Win Scenario'.
I’m not saying the officiating was great, but I think you guys are trying to stretch and bend the rules to make a foul where there wasn’t one. I know a few in the discussion are upset because I didn’t take the easy party line and just fall into place, but not every call is a bad one, and that don’t think they got it wrong on that play.
Y'all getting Ordy'd up in this thread. It's a zero sum outcome with him and he'll troll you all day long. Utilizing the ignore function is the correct choice.
