I'll take Northam serving out his term, and if that happens you can both buy me a scotch.
I agree. As I said above, if he was going to resign he'd have already done so. The Lt is a goner. The AG will also stay.
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I'll take Northam serving out his term, and if that happens you can both buy me a scotch.
You two are both wrong. This isn't just posing or virtue signalling. Times have changed -- at least if you're a Democrat. This isn't the same time as it was decades ago when West Virginia sent a former Klansman to the Senate or Democrats defended Bill Clinton against what really was a right wing conspiracy.I agree. I think much of the outrage is disingenuous posing. How many of these people were calling for Robert Byrd's head in the 70's, 80's, 90's, or beyond? And that guy was an Exalted Cyclops in the KKK. The fact is...whether any of The Woke admit it or not...things were different 35 years ago. If that's not so, why was Robert Byrd in office for so long?
You two are both wrong. This isn't just posing or virtue signalling. Times have changed -- at least if you're a Democrat. This isn't the same time as it was decades ago when West Virginia sent a former Klansman to the Senate or Democrats defended Bill Clinton against what really was a right wing conspiracy.
Democratic politicians are calling for the resignation of other Democratic politicians because they actually believe that racism and sexual assault are disqualifiers. And even if some politicians are posing, they're doing that because Democratic voters demand that they do.
Ralph Northam's "poor costume decisions" didn't just hurt his support among talking heads and politicians. His support plummeted 40 points overnight among actual Virginians. Democratic politicians are way more upset about this shit than Republicans are because Democratic voters are way more upset about this shit than Republicans are.
And let's just stop for a reality check. I can't read this board for a single day without encountering claims that modern Democrats have become annoyingly woke social justice warriors hung up on identity politics. But now we're supposed to imagine that nothing at all has changed, and it's just like when Robert Byrd (deceased) was a senator. You guys really need to get your stories straight.
Nor do I understand how it's possible for Democrats to have demonstrated hypocrisy by calling for the resignation of Democratic politicians. Even if Democrats are able to find a way out of this mess without handing Virginia to a Republican who was elected because someone drew his name out of a bowl, that still wouldn't be hypocrisy.
Those old yearbook pictures have aged badly. They were taken when times should already have changed, even though the changes are much clearer now. Well, times are changing again. I wonder how all this will read 20 years from now. Will people look back and wonder, "How did Democrats get all hung up on racism and sexual assault, when they should have tended to something important?" Maybe. But I doubt it.
You two are both wrong. This isn't just posing or virtue signalling. Times have changed -- at least if you're a Democrat. This isn't the same time as it was decades ago when West Virginia sent a former Klansman to the Senate or Democrats defended Bill Clinton against what really was a right wing conspiracy.
Democratic politicians are calling for the resignation of other Democratic politicians because they actually believe that racism and sexual assault are disqualifiers. And even if some politicians are posing, they're doing that because Democratic voters demand that they do.
Ralph Northam's "poor costume decisions" didn't just hurt his support among talking heads and politicians. His support plummeted 40 points overnight among actual Virginians. Democratic politicians are way more upset about this shit than Republicans are because Democratic voters are way more upset about this shit than Republicans are.
And let's just stop for a reality check. I can't read this board for a single day without encountering claims that modern Democrats have become annoyingly woke social justice warriors hung up on identity politics. But now we're supposed to imagine that nothing at all has changed, and it's just like when Robert Byrd (deceased) was a senator. You guys really need to get your stories straight.
Nor do I understand how it's possible for Democrats to have demonstrated hypocrisy by calling for the resignation of Democratic politicians. Even if Democrats are able to find a way out of this mess without handing Virginia to a Republican who was elected because someone drew his name out of a bowl, that still wouldn't be hypocrisy.
Those old yearbook pictures have aged badly. They were taken when times should already have changed, even though the changes are much clearer now. Well, times are changing again. I wonder how all this will read 20 years from now. Will people look back and wonder, "How did Democrats get all hung up on racism and sexual assault, when they should have tended to something important?" Maybe. But I doubt it.
I'll take Northam serving out his term, and if that happens you can both buy me a scotch.
You two are both wrong. This isn't just posing or virtue signalling. Times have changed -- at least if you're a Democrat. This isn't the same time as it was decades ago when West Virginia sent a former Klansman to the Senate or Democrats defended Bill Clinton against what really was a right wing conspiracy.
Democratic politicians are calling for the resignation of other Democratic politicians because they actually believe that racism and sexual assault are disqualifiers. And even if some politicians are posing, they're doing that because Democratic voters demand that they do.
Ralph Northam's "poor costume decisions" didn't just hurt his support among talking heads and politicians. His support plummeted 40 points overnight among actual Virginians. Democratic politicians are way more upset about this shit than Republicans are because Democratic voters are way more upset about this shit than Republicans are.
And let's just stop for a reality check. I can't read this board for a single day without encountering claims that modern Democrats have become annoyingly woke social justice warriors hung up on identity politics. But now we're supposed to imagine that nothing at all has changed, and it's just like when Robert Byrd (deceased) was a senator. You guys really need to get your stories straight.
Nor do I understand how it's possible for Democrats to have demonstrated hypocrisy by calling for the resignation of Democratic politicians. Even if Democrats are able to find a way out of this mess without handing Virginia to a Republican who was elected because someone drew his name out of a bowl, that still wouldn't be hypocrisy.
Those old yearbook pictures have aged badly. They were taken when times should already have changed, even though the changes are much clearer now. Well, times are changing again. I wonder how all this will read 20 years from now. Will people look back and wonder, "How did Democrats get all hung up on racism and sexual assault, when they should have tended to something important?" Maybe. But I doubt it.
Sorry Bing, I think Lt Governor is out. An accusation of rape now from another woman. He needs to be gone.
I may be mistaken, but I thought those were the only two actual assault allegations, outside of Ivana, who now says she was never raped.So that only leaves 17 others....
And both things can be true. People do and say things to advance their careers.
Ralph Northam and I are both 59 years old. I attended law school while he was attending the Eastern Virginia Medical School. We were both 25 in 1984. Sadly, I don't have to imagine what it was like to be 25 in 1984. That's part of my life.My viewpoint is not based on anything other than the age/life-point of these people at the time these things occurred.... Not the era it occurred in. I don't think people that have lived exemplary adult and professional lives should be disqualified from service because of poor choices (to an obvious limit) made during coming of age years.
But again....I'm not the target market for Dems, I suppose. So I just kind of watch from the sidelines.
I'm of the opinion that neither the Gov nor the AG should resign over poor costume decisions from 30+ years ago. But I also found the Kavanaugh thing ridiculous (which supposedly occurred at an even much younger age). So I'm not likely the type of person that matters in these topics.
I don't know the details of the It Gov....but if true.... that's actually a full fledged adult operating at a professional level....and fully fair game.
I agree. I think much of the outrage is disingenuous posing. How many of these people were calling for Robert Byrd's head in the 70's, 80's, 90's, or beyond? And that guy was an Exalted Cyclops in the KKK. The fact is...whether any of The Woke admit it or not...things were different 35 years ago. If that's not so, why was Robert Byrd in office for so long?
https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/08/politics/dems-justin-fairfax-resign/index.htmlThe only hypocrisy I see is the refusal to call for Fairfax's resignation. What he was credibly accused of was more serious than Northam, and the AG. He was accused of a criminal offense by a Stanford professor who gained nothing from reliving her horrific trauma.. He then proceeded to smear political allies and his accuser. Yet, no one in the democratic party would call for his resignation. Why? Imo, the sole reason is because they did not want to be seen as attacking an up and coming black leader. If he was a white male, forget about it. Now we have a second rape accusation from a Duke classmate. If they continue to stand by fairfax and remain silent it's an outrage of unimaginable proportions.
Knee-jerk reaction based on headline phobia. This requires an investigation. We can't ruin a man based on unproven statements in a politically charged environment. Way too many agenda-driven folks willing to accuse on both sides.
An investigation in all these situations is the reasonable and responsible thing to do. I mean a real investigation, not some farcical “investigation” like they did with Kavanaugh where people were begging to be questioned by the FBI and were ignored.
It's become clear that if everyone resigned who ought to resign, this would hand control of the executive branch to the very Republicans who just lost the last election -- and to the very Republican who holds his seat because someone drew a name out of a bowl. In any event, the party hasn't sorted any way out, and no one is resigning.Apparently most Democrats (57%) and most African-Americans (58%) don't think the Gov should resign. That surprises me because based on the posts here, I thought it was near unanimous among Democrats that his days were numbered and he had to resign. 65% of Virginians didn't think that they knew enough to determine whether the LtGov should resign (this was before 2nd allegation) and that an unproven allegation alone doesn't make a person guilty.
Poll: https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...8500644dc98_story.html?utm_term=.72505a8a2f9a
Virginia Democrats are hunkering down to the demoralizing reality that they'll head into the 2020 elections with a badly damaged leadership and a badly damaged brand. This is a disaster for Virginia Democrats.
However immune Republicans may be, Democrats are not immune to racism or sexual assault. That's unexploded ordnance, waiting to go off.Political disasters and scandals don’t seem to hurt republicans as much.
However immune Republicans may be, Democrats are not immune to racism or sexual assault. That's unexploded ordnance, waiting to go off.
Here the ordnance didn't quite kill the politicos off, but it may leave them as political zombies. They might still hold the levers of government, but without the political capital to accomplish anything, and instead of leading the party in 2020, they'll be holding it back. Virginia Republicans must be giddy.
However immune Republicans may be, Democrats are not immune to racism or sexual assault. That's unexploded ordnance, waiting to go off.
Here the ordnance didn't quite kill the politicos off, but it may leave them as political zombies. They might still hold the levers of government, but without the political capital to accomplish anything, and instead of leading the party in 2020, they'll be holding it back. Virginia Republicans must be giddy.
What a delusional statement to make!I’m sure they are. Voters have this magical ability to remember everything a dem did and suddenly develop full-on amnesia when it comes to republicans.
Northam seems determined to stick it out so we might both be out of the bet.You’re on.
That doesn't look like a good bet at this time.I'll take Northam serving out his term, and if that happens you can both buy me a scotch.
Just heard some people speaking about this. Their response was that in the short period Dems have been in office, they have expanded Medicare and implemented some important criminal justice reforms. Both were popular things Dems campaigned on. That may be one reason , from a poll cited, that even Black people were against Northam leaving office.
I’m sure they are. Voters have this magical ability to remember everything a dem did and suddenly develop full-on amnesia when it comes to republicans.
Yes, I linked the poll which showed most Virginia Democrats and Africa-Americans didn’t think he should resign. This is after our WC Democrats nearly unanimously posted it was necessary for him to resign as part of principle of holding their Democratic office holders accountable for their racist actions.Just heard some people speaking about this. Their response was that in the short period Dems have been in office, they have expanded Medicare and implemented some important criminal justice reforms. Both were popular things Dems campaigned on. That may be one reason , from a poll cited, that even Black people were against Northam leaving office.
When the Northam news broke, Democrats rose as one to demand his resignation, and his Virginia support dropped by over 40 points overnight. Then the news broke that the lieutenant governor was credibly accused of sexual assault. Then the news broke that the attorney general had blackfaced skeletons in his closet. Then it became clear that if everyone resigned who ought to, Democrats would hand the executive branch right back to the Republicans they' just defeated -- and that the Republican speaker of the house who'd occupy the governor's office had gained his position because someone drew a name out of a bowl.Yes, I linked the poll which showed most Virginia Democrats and Africa-Americans didn’t think he should resign. This is after our WC Democrats nearly unanimously posted it was necessary for him to resign as part of principle of holding their Democratic office holders accountable for their racist actions.
Not at all, I agree with you and essentially said the same in an earlier post.When the Northam news broke, Democrats rose as one to demand his resignation, and his Virginia support dropped by over 40 points overnight. Then the news broke that the lieutenant governor was credibly accused of sexual assault. Then the news broke that the attorney general had blackfaced skeletons in his closet. Then it became clear that if everyone resigned who ought to, Democrats would hand the executive branch right back to the Republicans they' just defeated -- and that the Republican speaker of the house who'd occupy the governor's office had gained his position because someone drew a name out of a bowl.
In light of these developments, Democrats are struggling to make the least worst decision in response to a political disaster that has Virginia Republicans giddy. Your post is oblivious to all of this.
Interesting that Virginians appear to prefer lying racists and sexual predators to republicans.
Then I don’t understand why you’re dissing those who called for Northam’s resignation.Not at all, I agree with you and essentially said the same in an earlier post.
My point in making essentially the same post was that these newly bedrock principles would be sacrificed to keep a Democrat in that office. There was pushback on that notion, but not from you. You think the objective of keeping the office was more important than the principles. We agree on what Democrats would do - and I also think Republicans would do essentially the same in this situation.Then I don’t understand why you’re dissing those who called for Northam’s resignation.
I have never thought that Democrats should give the executive branch back to Republicans. I'm dismayed it's come to that, because it's a disaster for Virginia Democrats.My point in making essentially the same post was that these newly bedrock principles would be sacrificed to keep a Democrat in that office. There was pushback on that notion, but not from you. You think the objective of keeping the office was more important than the principles. We agree on what Democrats would do - and I also think Republicans would do essentially the same in this situation.
I’m not the party and I didn’t elect the imbecile. I’ll throw a stone or two when I feel like it, thank you.I have never thought that Democrats should give the executive branch back to Republicans. I'm dismayed it's come to that, because it's a disaster for Virginia Democrats.
It's obtuse to call people hypocrites if they don't carry every principle to its logical extreme. Every principle collides with other principles. That's why free speech advocates don't become hypocrites when they agree it should be illegal to shout "Fire!" in a crowded theater.
And no, Republicans obviously wouldn't react the same way in this situation, because they'd never have become so exercised about the blackface. (Or the sexual assault.) Polls show that Democrats care much more about this than Republicans do.
Indeed, what principles do Republicans have these days? I don't think the party that knowingly elected the unfit corrupt pussy-grabbing racist imbecile is really in a position to throw stones.
I’m sure they are. Voters have this magical ability to remember everything a dem did and suddenly develop full-on amnesia when it comes to republicans.