Vanity Fair article on COVID

hookyIU1990

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This 60 Minutes segment is a bit maddening. Peter Daszak getting virtually no pushback and no details about his involvement with the lab in Wuhan.
 
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Mas-sa-suta

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Background checks
Legal gun sales must go through a current FFL holder. The government has many phone operators answering the FFL holders calls, who have FBI and other resources doing background checks on the person buying the weapon.

The key word is LEGAL.

Gun Control affects only LEGAL buyers.

Criminals don't care about laws.
 
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UncleMark

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Legal gun sales must go through a current FFL holder. The government has many phone operators answering the FFL holders calls, who have FBI and other resources doing background checks on the person buying the weapon.

The key word is LEGAL.

Gun Control affects only LEGAL buyers.

Criminals don't care about laws.
What about gun shows and private sales?
 

hookyIU1990

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What about gun shows and private sales?
An FFL at a gun show still has to do the background check. Everything else is a private sale, regardless of location. It's already illegal for a private individual to knowingly sell a firearm to someone who can't legally purchase a weapon.
 
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mcmurtry66

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An FFL at a gun show still has to do the background check. Everything else is a private sale, regardless of location. It's already illegal for a private individual to knowingly sell a firearm to someone who can't legally purchase a weapon.
What documentation is exchanged in a private sale?
 

hookyIU1990

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What documentation is exchanged in a private sale?
If I don't know the person, I ask for an Indiana DL, since it's illegal to sell to someone from out of state, and a current IN LTCH. If a person doesn't have the LTCH, we can always go to the gun shop and they'll run the background check for a couple of bucks.
 
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mcmurtry66

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If I don't know the person, I ask for an Indiana DL, since it's illegal to sell to someone from out of state, and a current IN LTCH. If a person doesn't have the LTCH, we can always go to the gun shop and they'll run the background check for a couple of bucks.
Interesting. I never knew.
 

UncleMark

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If I don't know the person, I ask for an Indiana DL, since it's illegal to sell to someone from out of state, and a current IN LTCH. If a person doesn't have the LTCH, we can always go to the gun shop and they'll run the background check for a couple of bucks.
Are you as the seller required to do any of this? Do sellers get prosecuted for not taking these steps?
 

hookyIU1990

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Are you as the seller required to do any of this? Do sellers get prosecuted for not taking these steps?
Not required to, but if I sell to someone from out of state or to an improper person, it's a felony at the federal level. 10 years and a hefty fine is my understanding.
 
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TheOriginalHappyGoat

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Margaritaville
This what happens when someone has the audacity to question Fauci?

I know I know. It’s all about Newsmax

I don't doubt Rand Paul receives death threats. I highly doubt they are because of Fauci.
 
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UncleMark

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Not required to, but if I sell to someone from out of state or to an improper person, it's a felony at the federal level. 10 years and a hefty fine is my understanding.
I'm sure you're doing things correctly. I just wonder how diligent others might be. I suspect the word "knowingly" would come into play in there somewhere. If you don't require proof, how could you knowingly make an illegal sale?
 

hookyIU1990

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I'm sure you're doing things correctly. I just wonder how diligent others might be. I suspect the word "knowingly" would come into play in there somewhere. If you don't require proof, how could you knowingly make an illegal sale?
If you're knowingly making an illegal sale, you'd pay no attention to any sort of background check requirement though.
 

Crayfish57

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If you're knowingly making an illegal sale, you'd pay no attention to any sort of background check requirement though.
Usually from seeing guns sell at an estate auction they go to a gun shop unless you have whatever is needed (I dont know what that is) They have gotten really careful. That being said I was at a sale some yrs back getting towards Chicago with a shady auctioneer and they were handing them out , not just long guns everything and amunition. The auctioneer was from a distance and they were packed up and gone in no time. Another time I saw one that auctioneer had been a state cop and i'm sure a bad one as he was also a bad auctioneer and bad building inspector, sold handguns and then passed ammunition out .
 

Mas-sa-suta

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Usually from seeing guns sell at an estate auction they go to a gun shop unless you have whatever is needed (I dont know what that is) They have gotten really careful. That being said I was at a sale some yrs back getting towards Chicago with a shady auctioneer and they were handing them out , not just long guns everything and amunition. The auctioneer was from a distance and they were packed up and gone in no time. Another time I saw one that auctioneer had been a state cop and i'm sure a bad one as he was also a bad auctioneer and bad building inspector, sold handguns and then passed ammunition out .
What is needed in that case is to be the holder of a current, valid FFL. FFL holders must keep records of each transaction and are subject to audit by the ATF.

And criminals don't care about laws, ordinances, or background checks.

Those abridge only the rights of law-abiding citizens.
 
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Spartans9312

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The government could make doing business with the Chinese more trouble than it is worth for the "Masters of the Universe" if the will was there. And it appears 80% of the public is on board. Did you know the Chinese are threatening a nuclear arms race in the midst of this too?

We are heading to Cold War 2.0, the sooner we stop enriching our enemy in this upcoming ideological conflict the better.

Why do our elites have to tell half truths or lies by omission: Covid, lockdown, CCP expansionism and militarism, who the threat to our way of life is, inflation causes etc
 

hookyIU1990

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This 60 Minutes segment is a bit maddening. Peter Daszak getting virtually no pushback and no details about his involvement with the lab in Wuhan.
Now there's supposedly video of live bats within the Wuhan Lab facility after Daszak claimed that live bats weren't kept in the lab because that's not how science works and it's a conspiracy theory. He's gone on to admit that he didn't actually ask them if they had live bats in the facility. It's from Sky News, so take it for what it's worth. A google search didn't show any other sources, so I'm wondering if anyone else looks into it to prove or disprove it.

 

mcmurtry66

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Now there's supposedly video of live bats within the Wuhan Lab facility after Daszak claimed that live bats weren't kept in the lab because that's not how science works and it's a conspiracy theory. He's gone on to admit that he didn't actually ask them if they had live bats in the facility. It's from Sky News, so take it for what it's worth. A google search didn't show any other sources, so I'm wondering if anyone else looks into it to prove or disprove it.

science did an amazing job of saving us from the pandemic created by science
 
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hookyIU1990

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science did an amazing job of saving us from the pandemic created by science
That's gov't and bureaucracy at all levels.

“The government is good at one thing. It knows how to break your legs, and then hand you a crutch and say, 'See if it weren't for the government, you wouldn't be able to walk.” - Harry Brown

 

outside shooter

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Now there's supposedly video of live bats within the Wuhan Lab facility
Of course any Research Institute studying pathogens carried by animals will have an animal vivarium to house the animals for the collection of their blood, feces, etc.

It is a facility that animal care personnel, only, can access, and is not part of the research lab where samples are analyzed. It is often on the same physical site, in a different building, with extremely limited access.

I have worked at a Research Institute with an animal vivarium, for 16 years. I have never been allowed to enter it. I am a tenured faculty member, but I am no vet or animal care expert. My lab does not house animals. The site? Sure...
 

hookyIU1990

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Of course any Research Institute studying pathogens carried by animals will have an animal vivarium to house the animals for the collection of their blood, feces, etc.

It is a facility that animal care personnel, only, can access, and is not part of the research lab where samples are analyzed. It is often on the same physical site, in a different building, with extremely limited access.

I have worked at a Research Institute with an animal vivarium, for 16 years. I have never been allowed to enter it. I am a tenured faculty member, but I am no vet or animal care expert. My lab does not house animals. The site? Sure...
According to Daszak, that's not how science works. Samples are taken and sent to the lab. Animals are released. Everything else is a nutter conspiracy theory. There were no bats in the lab.

He's a lying sack of garbage trying to cover his tracks.
 
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IUCrazy2

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Why do our elites have to tell half truths or lies by omission: Covid, lockdown, CCP expansionism and militarism, who the threat to our way of life is, inflation causes etc
The Euros are whores. All you have to do is throw enough money their way and they are fine with turning a blind eye to anything you please.

W.R.T. China and Russia, people do not like Trump but I believe anyone in a position of power who is not interested in assessing our current arrangements with "allies" is nuts. What is NATO protecting against now? What do we get from relationships with them? I can think of two that could possibly change with a readjustment of our position with that organization. We could potentially lose forward operating bases and perhaps some intelligence sharing. As mentioned before, the Euros are whores when it comes to business, those relationships are not going anywhere.

The Japanese also said that they are interested in continuing the current relationship with China. Business is business they say. And I am all for them continuing to do as they please. However, our leadership also has to realize that all this "business is business" with China is feeding a beast that is becoming increasingly belligerent, testing borders, expanding their nuclear arsenal, and has a stated goal of knocking the U.S. off our pedestal. Given that, shouldn't it be incumbent upon all of these "allies" (I use that term loosely, these are more protectorates than anything else) to begin defending themselves a bit more.

Our main sticking point with Russia is all the military hardware we have in Europe. We are creating a problem based on our protection of people who get gas from those we are protecting them from. And most of the talk out of this silly gathering when it came to "defense" was around climate change. We don't need a forward military presence to protect the Europeans from global warming.
 
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IUCrazy2

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Did Colbert claim that Stewart's mouth was only a c**k holster for any particular politician?
No, the comedian has spoken, the party of science will now accept the science that was conspiracy for the past year. Because they follow the experts. Guys like John Stewart, with his PhD in virology. Not like the guys in the articles linked throughout this thread with science backgrounds. Nope, the guy with the clown nose has spoke that which was verboten so now it is not so verboten anymore. And much like Chris Wallace is already doing, they will begin to claim that Trump should have done more to pursue this former conspiracy theory that was so forbidden that it could not be talked about anywhere...
 

larsIU

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The Euros are whores. All you have to do is throw enough money their way and they are fine with turning a blind eye to anything you please.

W.R.T. China and Russia, people do not like Trump but I believe anyone in a position of power who is not interested in assessing our current arrangements with "allies" is nuts. What is NATO protecting against now? What do we get from relationships with them? I can think of two that could possibly change with a readjustment of our position with that organization. We could potentially lose forward operating bases and perhaps some intelligence sharing. As mentioned before, the Euros are whores when it comes to business, those relationships are not going anywhere.

The Japanese also said that they are interested in continuing the current relationship with China. Business is business they say. And I am all for them continuing to do as they please. However, our leadership also has to realize that all this "business is business" with China is feeding a beast that is becoming increasingly belligerent, testing borders, expanding their nuclear arsenal, and has a stated goal of knocking the U.S. off our pedestal. Given that, shouldn't it be incumbent upon all of these "allies" (I use that term loosely, these are more protectorates than anything else) to begin defending themselves a bit more.

Our main sticking point with Russia is all the military hardware we have in Europe. We are creating a problem based on our protection of people who get gas from those we are protecting them from. And most of the talk out of this silly gathering when it came to "defense" was around climate change. We don't need a forward military presence to protect the Europeans from global warming.
Sure they're whores to use your scenario. But it's not just a "little" intelligence gathering. I suspect it's quite a bit more than that. Don't we want to be the ones paying the best? And China is a wayyyy different beast than was the old USSR. China is competent. They learned from the USSR's mistakes. They will continue to do so while adopting an economic capacity that is rivaled only by our own.

If we're going to unwind our China position we best do it soon before we can't. I suspect we won't because nearly unfettered capitalism is our Rosebud. Agree China will be belligerent, especially in their corner of the world. I'd be worried as hell in Japan with their aging populace and limited natural resources (they are an island after all). South Korea too. SK and Japan are going to make peace with China and likely find ways be benefit from their largesse (much like Mexico/Canada do with the US). We need to dominate the western hemisphere economically and geopolitically. To do so requires Europe and don't think they don't know it.
 
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IUCrazy2

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Sure they're whores to use your scenario. But it's not just a "little" intelligence gathering. I suspect it's quite a bit more than that. Don't we want to be the ones paying the best? And China is a wayyyy different beast than was the old USSR. China is competent. They learned from the USSR's mistakes. They will continue to do so while adopting an economic capacity that is rivaled only by our own.

If we're going to unwind our China position we best do it soon before we can't. I suspect we won't because nearly unfettered capitalism is our Rosebud. Agree China will be belligerent, especially in their corner of the world. I'd be worried as hell in Japan with their aging populace and limited natural resources (they are an island after all). South Korea too. SK and Japan are going to make peace with China and likely find ways be benefit from their largesse (much like Mexico/Canada do with the US). We need to dominate the western hemisphere economically and geopolitically. To do so requires Europe and don't think they don't know it.
Dominating the western hemisphere would have nothing to do with Europe, they are in the eastern hemisphere. The Monroe Doctrine is more of a Western Hemisphere focus where the "old world" is left to their old problems and the U.S. seeks to keep their involvement out of "our block".

If China is to be the main concern and we are likely to have allies in Japan and South Korea become more friendly with our largest competitor, at what point do we begin to adjust our position as guardians of the world's peace and trade? We operate at great expense to ourselves so that we (and our protectorates) are able to conduct all of this international trade. If there is a new paradigm where they will seek to benefit from economic partnerships from our rivals while expecting U.S. protection from the same, we should perhaps be questioning our current relationships.

Our friends expect us to both block the jaws of the dragon while they feed him. At a certain point that is no longer a beneficial relationship for us to have.
 
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IUCrazy2

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And much like Chris Wallace is already doing, they will begin to claim that Trump should have done more to pursue this former conspiracy theory that was so forbidden that it could not be talked about anywhere...
And right on cue, cosmic is already doing that in another thread.
 
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larsIU

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Dominating the western hemisphere would have nothing to do with Europe, they are in the eastern hemisphere. The Monroe Doctrine is more of a Western Hemisphere focus where the "old world" is left to their old problems and the U.S. seeks to keep their involvement out of "our block".

If China is to be the main concern and we are likely to have allies in Japan and South Korea become more friendly with our largest competitor, at what point do we begin to adjust our position as guardians of the world's peace and trade? We operate at great expense to ourselves so that we (and our protectorates) are able to conduct all of this international trade. If there is a new paradigm where they will seek to benefit from economic partnerships from our rivals while expecting U.S. protection from the same, we should perhaps be questioning our current relationships.

Our friends expect us to both block the jaws of the dragon while they feed him. At a certain point that is no longer a beneficial relationship for us to have.
I use "western" more as a way of viewing the old world relationships we've cultivated for 200 years.

We have allies in Japan and South Korea for economic and political reasons. Vestiges of WWII and the Cold War. Those relationships predate the rise of China. The paradigm is going to shift. SK and Japan will do whatever business most benefits them economically and geopolitically. How long are we going to be able to compete with China in that space? Unless and until SK and Japan believe China is going to invade them or turn them into economic deserts they will continue to build relationships with them, likely at our expense (to some degree). I'm struggling to understand what we can actually do, absent military action or economic isolationism, to stop this from happening.

I don't believe either military action or economic isolationism are in the cards. So what's our play? At this point I think we need to either sharpen whatever we're doing now to block China's rise (which isn't working anyway) or further engage them to make their interests even more tied/aligned with our own. Make Russia the odd man out. I don't care.
 

mushroomgod_1

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Here's another guy that's magically found disturbing information (now that Trump is gone)... :


Ahh the good old days..., back when real scientists based their hypothesis on (drum roll)..., literally anything other than politics... 😣

The Left will be the death 💀 of us all at the rate things are going...😞

Yep....he couldn't wait to sign onto that letter, even though he didn't know WTF was going on. It was the woke (anti-racist) thing to do. He's full of shit.
 

IUCrazy2

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I use "western" more as a way of viewing the old world relationships we've cultivated for 200 years.

We have allies in Japan and South Korea for economic and political reasons. Vestiges of WWII and the Cold War. Those relationships predate the rise of China. The paradigm is going to shift. SK and Japan will do whatever business most benefits them economically and geopolitically. How long are we going to be able to compete with China in that space? Unless and until SK and Japan believe China is going to invade them or turn them into economic deserts they will continue to build relationships with them, likely at our expense (to some degree). I'm struggling to understand what we can actually do, absent military action or economic isolationism, to stop this from happening.

I don't believe either military action or economic isolationism are in the cards. So what's our play? At this point I think we need to either sharpen whatever we're doing now to block China's rise (which isn't working anyway) or further engage them to make their interests even more tied/aligned with our own. Make Russia the odd man out. I don't care.
You have to let China be China for awhile IMO. Currently the consequences of doing business with China (or Russia) are expected to be shielded from these countries by the U.S. You have to have a frank conversation about the willingness of this country to continue that expensive, one sided relationship.

"But we get so much from Europe, Korea, and Japan." From an economic perspective I agree. They are willing to do business with Russia and China, why would we believe that relationship would end if our military relationship were to he adjusted? And if our saying, "Hey this is a heavy burden and we need more help" is considered a deal breaker for them, then they really are not allies anyway. They are protectorates. We need to get out of the protection racket, those kinds of relationships are more of a liability than anything else.
 
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mushroomgod_1

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The only thing I think that was intentional on the Chinese side after the virus got out was the cover up. That being said, they learned a whole lot over the past year from COVID. Usually when one thinks of bioweapons they think of diseases with smallpox like death rates being unleashed on an opponent. China learned that the comparatively mild (COVID had a lower death rate than SARS IIRC) virus with a decently high infection rate would shut down most of the developed world. And the disease would have plausible deniability on their end that a large portion of the world, including western scientists, would be more than happy to accept.

If I were war gaming a takeover of say, Taiwan, from the Chinese side, my opening moves would be the release of a disease similar to COVID with a slightly higher death rate across all age demographics. Overload the hospitals like what happened in Italy. Follow that up with cyber attacks to U.S. infrastructure when the hospitals are overloaded and people are forced to shut down. Then invade.

China has 1 billion people and there is a decent percentage of them that they feel are expendable. I think they would gladly accept 2% or 3% population reduction in trade for Taiwan.

And again, I do not think anything was planned on their side w.r.t. COVID, but sometimes you can learn quite a bit from mistakes. COVID was the most successful mistake "attack" on the U.S. and Europe since WW2.

I agree with your first sentence, except I think they knew what they were doing when they did not shut down air travel out of china. Was that part of the cover-up, or was it a definite decision so that other countries would not come out of the epidemic (then) in relatively better shape than China? In other words, did they not shut down the plane travel out of China just because they didn't want to look bad, or was it to 'share the wealth' concerning the disease?
 

IUCrazy2

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I agree with your first sentence, except I think they knew what they were doing when they did not shut down air travel out of china. Was that part of the cover-up, or was it a definite decision so that other countries would not come out of the epidemic (then) in relatively better shape than China? In other words, did they not shut down the plane travel out of China just because they didn't want to look bad, or was it to 'share the wealth' concerning the disease?
They have a face saving culture. That is mixed with a totalitarian government that punishes those who make the party look bad. I think that creates a scenario where low level people try to hide problems from those up the chain. One, to avoid looking bad and two to avoid punishment. So that allows mistakes to compound until they cannot be hidden anymore.

I don't think this was intentional malice. I think it was ineptitude.
 

larsIU

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Currently the consequences of doing business with China (or Russia) are expected to be shielded from these countries by the U.S.

I agree that's largely how it stands today. My concern is over what our consequences are for doing business with China. We can't really unwind that right? The US and China are both now "too big to fail" as the failure of either would cause global economic catastrophe. So here we are. China is going to soon realize the headache of keeping your economic partners happy as they extend their reach into Africa and the ME. Sure SK and Japan (and Europe save maybe the UK) rely on the US to be the dude around the corner with a bat should anybody decide to pull some shit. We've just always had the biggest bat and the most friends willing to come to our aid (however little that might appear to be).

Now there's a new kid. And this kid makes the old kid we used to kick around look like nothing. I honestly don't believe the US has a policy for China that makes much sense.

1. We aren't going to war. So that "bat" we've always had is become archaic. We need to update it at the very least to begin to win a 21st century battlefield (hint: cyber warfare - which I'm sure we are HEAVILY invested/engaged in).
2. We aren't going to unwind our economic interests relative to China. At least not that I can see. You might have a different opinion on that.
3. We have to maintain and nurture our allies/relationships in order to provide balance to China's ever growing economic scale. We don't want that balance to tip over to them. As I mentioned earlier, economic isolationism is a non starter in today's world. We're too big.
4. We have to work on figuring out how to influence China's economic policy, not the other way around. How do we force their hand?

It's a good discussion. China is clearly the largest and most looming threat on our horizon. Islamic terrorists are really just gnats. An annoyance. We've mostly figured out how to contain that issue. Russia is run by the mob and about as organized. We have to be concerned with their cyber warfare capabilities but I believe we can handle that. Africa is a dumpster fire with no oil. South America is what it's always been. Australia is basically the US in the southern hemisphere. Which leave southeast Asia. Specifically the worlds production facilities in India and China, with China becoming more and more a global powerhouse in tech and finance. We let everybody come to school here. What did we think they would do, go back home and plant rice?

We're in a global economy now where we're now surprised there's a new power coming for the throne. To be fair, and regardless of partisan distinction, the time to stop China's rise has long since passed. We need to really deal with the world as it exists today.