Tucker Carlson: Not just a pretty face

[JamieDimonsBalls]

I’m picky about my sashimi after living in Japan where it was always freshly caught the day it was served. I rarely eat it in the Midwest. If they get it flown in that day I’ll eat it. Most places don’t do that.

There are a couple good places* in the major Midwestern cities, but I've never had much courage to try it in Milwaukee, St. Louis, Indy, etc.

*Good, relative to someone that didn't live in Japan or San Fran/Seattle/Vancouver

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

You are pretty much wrong about everything here, except I have always lived as a “majority” race. But I read, think, and talk to people, including a Chachtaw who has become a pretty good friend, but he is a lawyer so there is that.

Your first problem is that you see race and skin color as a “culture”. While I don’t deny that groups of people coalesce around skin color, the culture that might spring from that had nothing to do with race. The point is that in the US we can have a common culture that is comprised of people of various races. This is likely aspirational, but it should always be the goal.

Your second problem is that you, like many liberals, see world history as groups victims and victors. That is very Howard Zinn-like, so that might be what you are taught. While that is no doubt true in the sense that the world is largely shaped by war, you are flat dead wrong if you believe that the loser culture is lost to the winning culture. There is no better example of how wrong you are than the American West. Almost everything that is associated with our Western Culture is rooted in Spanish and Mexican culture. Spanish culture dominates everything you think of when you think of western culture. We do have the English system of law out here in Colorado (you do know what “Colorado” means, don’t you?) but most of what made up our history is largely Spanish. And Spanish is a native language in America, don’t let that slip by you. (We need to be bilingual in many places). In pockets in the West, native culture has blended with English and Spanish to form a common culture.* In South and Central America, we see blends of Spanish and Inca, Mayan, and Aztec, to form a common culture.

I agree America has always been seen as a place where people can excell with individual effort. I have written about that often here as I have said some liberal approaches to a heavily regulated society with ever expanding safety nets inhibits that. But the key is still a common culture, common goals, common objectives, and a common morality.

*Sadly there are those “multiculturalists” who want to rip apart the common culture we have built in favor of, well, segregated cultures.

Until you define common culture in terms of what you think it should be, you’re still speaking in platitudes.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Until you define common culture in terms of what you think it should be, you’re still speaking in platitudes.

Thinking of a culture in terms of what it “should be” is pretty much how a liberal thinks. A liberal would determine the cultural formula and regulate society into that formula.

A conservative sees culture as the product of many influences including history, traditions, morals, religion, government, commerce, family and more. It is not possible for a conservative to honestly answer what a culture should be.

That said, I agree we must start with a common aspiration so we don’t sink our culture into a system of child abuse and human sacrifice for example. I’d say the Declaration of Independence is a good place to start.

 

[Ladoga]

You're both wrong, we only allow red meat and potatoes in the midwest.

Gravy - a beverage where I come from.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Thinking of a culture in terms of what it “should be” is pretty much how a liberal thinks. A liberal would determine the cultural formula and regulate society into that formula.

A conservative sees culture as the product of many influences including history, traditions, morals, religion, government, commerce, family and more. It is not possible for a conservative to honestly answer what a culture should be.

That said, I agree we must start with a common aspiration so we don’t sink our culture into a system of child abuse and human sacrifice for example. I’d say the Declaration of Independence is a good place to start.

Yawn. So in other words: platitudes, platitudes, more platitudes. You’re the one discussing common culture and then can’t even begin to describe what it should look like.

If all you have is: no Sharia law, then don’t we have a common culture?

You’re doing that thing again where you don’t say anything of tangible or measurable substance so you can always claim victory. It’s what makes you a dishonest poster. Try to separate your professional instincts from posting here. I don’t mean that as a knock against attorneys. I mean that as a character flaw of your story that you cannot stop being the lawyer on a public forum.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Yawn. So in other words: platitudes, platitudes, more platitudes. You’re the one discussing common culture and then can’t even begin to describe what it should look like.

If all you have is: no Sharia law, then don’t we have a common culture?

You’re doing that thing again where you don’t say anything of tangible or measurable substance so you can always claim victory. It’s what makes you a dishonest poster. Try to separate your professional instincts from posting here. I don’t mean that as a knock against attorneys. I mean that as a character flaw of your story that you cannot stop being the lawyer on a public forum.

I will get beat up over this but I would say a "Western" concept of the law and how it interacts with government. An agreement on inalienable rights and liberty. If you want that defined start with the founding documents of this country. Egalitarianism. I would like a culture that values hard work and self sufficiency as much is possible. A culture that extols the virtues of helping your neighbors (and I mean truly helping, not paying some bureaucrat to "help" for you, although that is sometimes necessary.)

I think a culture that is heavily defined by Western Civilization is not a bad thing. Particularly when it comes to how the country actually operates. Civics should be the tie that binds. From there you add in all the cultural flavors that make places interesting.

I just hate the idea that we have to attack things that originated in "white" areas. It is so asinine. All of the racial and cultural advances in this country came about because a bunch of white guys baked that possibility into the cake.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Yawn. So in other words: platitudes, platitudes, more platitudes. You’re the one discussing common culture and then can’t even begin to describe what it should look like.

If all you have is: no Sharia law, then don’t we have a common culture?

You’re doing that thing again where you don’t say anything of tangible or measurable substance so you can always claim victory. It’s what makes you a dishonest poster. Try to separate your professional instincts from posting here. I don’t mean that as a knock against attorneys. I mean that as a character flaw of your story that you cannot stop being the lawyer on a public forum.

What? Another stupid ad hominem. You aren’t contributing.

A checklist for common culture? That’s nuts. A social culture is more like a process of how we get along than a list of dos and don’ts.

 

[iuwclurker1]

I will get beat up over this but I would say a "Western" concept of the law and how it interacts with government. An agreement on inalienable rights and liberty. If you want that defined start with the founding documents of this country. Egalitarianism. I would like a culture that values hard work and self sufficiency as much is possible. A culture that extols the virtues of helping your neighbors (and I mean truly helping, not paying some bureaucrat to "help" for you, although that is sometimes necessary.)

I think a culture that is heavily defined by Western Civilization is not a bad thing. Particularly when it comes to how the country actually operates. Civics should be the tie that binds. From there you add in all the cultural flavors that make places interesting.

I just hate the idea that we have to attack things that originated in "white" areas. It is so asinine. All of the racial and cultural advances in this country came about because a bunch of white guys baked that possibility into the cake.

Explain how any of the cultural aspects you advocate are not already baked into the culture of immigrants when they come here.

Egalitarianism. Check.
Hard work. Check.
Self-sufficiency. Check.
Helping neighbors. Check.

Immigrants tend to have to work harder than long-time residents, be more self-sufficient, be more helpful, one neighbor with another, just to survive.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

I will get beat up over this but I would say a "Western" concept of the law and how it interacts with government. An agreement on inalienable rights and liberty. If you want that defined start with the founding documents of this country. Egalitarianism. I would like a culture that values hard work and self sufficiency as much is possible. A culture that extols the virtues of helping your neighbors (and I mean truly helping, not paying some bureaucrat to "help" for you, although that is sometimes necessary.)

I think a culture that is heavily defined by Western Civilization is not a bad thing. Particularly when it comes to how the country actually operates. Civics should be the tie that binds. From there you add in all the cultural flavors that make places interesting.

I just hate the idea that we have to attack things that originated in "white" areas. It is so asinine. All of the racial and cultural advances in this country came about because a bunch of white guys baked that possibility into the cake.

This is a good attempt and an honest one. Kudos. But now, do you believe that we don’t have this today? Are you concerned that the more immigrants we have the less likely we are to retain these values and model? If so, why?

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

What? Another stupid ad hominem. You aren’t contributing.

A checklist for common culture? That’s nuts. A social culture is more like a process of how we get along than a list of dos and don’ts.

You’ve missed the point. And I stopped caring that you did two posts ago.

 

[iuwclurker1]

You’re the one discussing common culture and then can’t even begin to describe what it should look like.

Exactly. If one can't define the culture of a group, one can't articulate the differences between that group and another. The only cultural difference Carlson indicated, iirc, was speaking Spanish (or not speaking English). I've been to El Rodeo several times, heard them speak Spanish amongst themselves, but it never stoped me from getting my burritos and fajitas.

Tucker Carlson sure does grill up a good ol' American nothingburger though.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

You’ve missed the point. And I stopped caring that you did two posts ago.

Actually you are missing the point. I keep trying to explain that a common culture is a dynamic evolving thing. It simply cannot be described in absolutes. Consider our history. We have moved our common culture from slavery to civil rights, to corrective affirmative action. We moved the culture from seeing women as chattles to equal participantion. Recently we have moved the culture to accept same sex marriage. We have done little things like stopping litter to big things like civil rights laws and notions of equality. We steadfastly oppose things like child abuse and battering women and homosexuals. The constant movement of our culture is unmistakable and irresistible. I suppose this ability to change and adapt is the most important feature. For you to suggest to me that I can define common culture in terms of a list of features shows that you do not see culture as I do. But unlike you, I won’t suggest that you are a “dishonest poster”. I’ll simply recognize we don’t similarly view the nature, purpose, and function of the common culture.

 

[IUCrazy2]

This is a good attempt and an honest one. Kudos. But now, do you believe that we don’t have this today? Are you concerned that the more immigrants we have the less likely we are to retain these values and model? If so, why?

I think we do have it today but I think there is a movement within the country among some people to reject these things because they view them as "white" as opposed to "American".

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Actually you are missing the point. I keep trying to explain that a common culture is a dynamic evolving thing. It simply cannot be described in absolutes. Consider our history. We have moved our common culture from slavery to civil rights, to corrective affirmative action. We moved the culture from seeing women as chattles to equal participantion. Recently we have moved the culture to accept same sex marriage. We have done little things like stopping litter to big things like civil rights laws and notions of equality. We steadfastly oppose things like child abuse and battering women and homosexuals. The constant movement of our culture is unmistakable and irresistible. I suppose this ability to change and adapt is the most important feature. For you to suggest to me that I can define common culture in terms of a list of features shows that you do not see culture as I do. But unlike you, I won’t suggest that you are a “dishonest poster”. I’ll simply recognize we don’t similarly view the nature, purpose, and function of the common culture.

All of your other posts imply that we do not have a common culture and imply that we have cultural conflict. I don’t disagree with anything you said I’m this post, mainly because you’re no longer heavily implying that immigration will smash this common culture.

Again, if we get to agree that common culture means no barbarism and Sharia Law, then fine, we agree. But what the hell difference does that make and what the hell does this have to do with Carlson’s invented problems?

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

I think we do have it today but I think there is a movement within the country among some people to reject these things because they view them as "white" as opposed to "American".

I don’t think that’s at all what people are saying and I think you’re misinterpreting it. It’s more nuanced.

I don’t know if anybody that comes to the US to try to change our culture away from hard work and he fruits thereof. I don’t know if any socio-economic groups that actively campaign against this way of life. Where there is, let’s call it white-checking discussion, it usually revolves around difficulties that some ethnic groups may have in attaining these fruits of labor considered historical treatment of said groups and continued perceived adverse treatment. I don’t think anybody considers they are trying to change our value system.

This is why I will not have any converstion about common culture being at risk without first hearing what exactly is at risk.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Explain how any of the cultural aspects you advocate are not already baked into the culture of immigrants when they come here.

Egalitarianism. Check.
Hard work. Check.
Self-sufficiency. Check.
Helping neighbors. Check.

Immigrants tend to have to work harder than long-time residents, be more self-sufficient, be more helpful, one neighbor with another, just to survive.

Those things are not already baked into the culture of every immigrant when they come here. Some of these people come from some places where those things are not ingrained in their culture. Yes, they may need to be hard workers and such to get along here (or they should be) but to say that hard work is a part of every culture is flat wrong.

You also have differences in things like the females role in society, the value of life, property rights, etc. Are you viewing this strictly from the prism of Latinos coming to the country? They will tend to have similar culture to ours in many cases but that is not always true for African, Middle Eastern, or Asian immigrants. (Iam painting with broad brush as each of those areas includes a myriad of cultures, some that would be more compatible and some that would not.)

 

[IUCrazy2]

I don’t think that’s at all what people are saying and I think you’re misinterpreting it. It’s more nuanced.

I don’t know if anybody that comes to the US to try to change our culture away from hard work and he fruits thereof. I don’t know if any socio-economic groups that actively campaign against this way of life. Where there is, let’s call it white-checking discussion, it usually revolves around difficulties that some ethnic groups may have in attaining these fruits of labor considered historical treatment of said groups and continued perceived adverse treatment. I don’t think anybody considers they are trying to change our value system.

This is why I will not have any converstion about common culture being at risk without first hearing what exactly is at risk.

If it is more nuanced they are doing a piss poor job of getting their point across.

I frankly like to scour the comments left on articles and on social media postings to get an idea of what people are really thinking. I do not see much kumbaya on either side. I see the groups becoming more entrenched. Viewing the world from the prism that we are all Americans is now considered "white privelege". I must see that I have advantages and only someone from a position of privilege could dare think that we are all on the same team. I am the star player and I need knocked down a peg because the only reason I got where I am is because my Dad is the coach. So screw my Dad, he did good things but he was an unfair person. Screw the system we ran. It won a bunch of games but it was set up to get me shots.

I increasingly do not feel like a sizable portion of the "team" wants to play with me anymore.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

longer heavily implying that immigration will smash this common culture.

I never said that or implied this. This inference is 100% on you.

 

[hoot1]

I think what people fail to understand is that multi-culturalism is the culprit. Shouldn’t we strive for a common culture? A common culture in in the US seems to me is what the founding fathers, Lincoln, and MLK envisioned. It’s not easy to achieve and might always be an aspiration. Sadly, it seems to me that we have abandoned the notion of a common culture and common social compact as we drift towards maintaining and furthering our cultural differences. Cultural and individual assimilation is not seen as a worthy goal.

Is it a common culture that our founders considered important to achieve, or a country of individuals willing to compromise with others with different ideas in order to achieve common goals? Then once consensus is achieved and laws passed, we continually refine laws and goals as dictated by a majority.

What we hold in common is the belief that in spite of not agreeing on everything our system of governing complete with private ownership and individual rights is a system which works for the common good. When it doesn't work or needs altering, we can the change laws and re-evaluate values to promote the common good. Learning through trial and error is important as a majority and its elected representatives can be wrong. Furthermore what works at one point in time can change as time goes on.

 

[iu_a_att]

If it is more nuanced they are doing a piss poor job of getting their point across.

I frankly like to scour the comments left on articles and on social media postings to get an idea of what people are really thinking. I do not see much kumbaya on either side. I see the groups becoming more entrenched. Viewing the world from the prism that we are all Americans is now considered "white privelege". I must see that I have advantages and only someone from a position of privilege could dare think that we are all on the same team. I am the star player and I need knocked down a peg because the only reason I got where I am is because my Dad is the coach. So screw my Dad, he did good things but he was an unfair person. Screw the system we ran. It won a bunch of games but it was set up to get me shots.

I increasingly do not feel like a sizable portion of the "team" wants to play with me anymore.

Kumbaya...but viewing the world from the prism that we are all Americans ignores the fact that some of us get treated poorly simply because of the color of our skin. Denying that reality and blocking efforts to change it is unfair...and definitely not kumbaya.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Kumbaya...but viewing the world from the prism that we are all Americans ignores the fact that some of us get treated poorly simply because of the color of our skin. Denying that reality and blocking efforts to change it is unfair...and definitely not kumbaya.

Agreed. Having an equal system in place would be a goal. Punishing current generations for the sins of their great great grandparents would not.

I guess the main problem we have is that through all of the decrying of white privilege, I have yet to hear a tangible plan on a path forward. White people get out of the way is not a plan.

 

[iu_a_att]

Agreed. Having an equal system in place would be a goal. Punishing current generations for the sins of their great great grandparents would not.

I guess the main problem we have is that through all of the decrying of white privilege, I have yet to hear a tangible plan on a path forward. White people get out of the way is not a plan.

kumbaya again..."white people get out of the way is not a plan"...but persuading the coach's son that we might win more games if he made more assists rather than tried to win the game on his own all the time might help. If the coach's son got better at feeding the middle the big guy might be more inclined to throw the ball back outside for the occasional open three.

 

[iuwclurker1]

I think we do have it today but I think there is a movement within the country among some people to reject these things because they view them as "white" as opposed to "American".

This is definitely a spit-out-your-coffee-lol post. It's precisely a certain segment of white Americans who are creating the false narrative you just described and evidently have bought in to.

IUCrazy, you stereotype waaaaaay too much.

 

[iuwclurker1]

Those things are not already baked into the culture of every immigrant when they come here. Some of these people come from some places where those things are not ingrained in their culture. Yes, they may need to be hard workers and such to get along here (or they should be) but to say that hard work is a part of every culture is flat wrong.

You also have differences in things like the females role in society, the value of life, property rights, etc. Are you viewing this strictly from the prism of Latinos coming to the country? They will tend to have similar culture to ours in many cases but that is not always true for African, Middle Eastern, or Asian immigrants. (Iam painting with broad brush as each of those areas includes a myriad of cultures, some that would be more compatible and some that would not.)

Non-stop stereotyping. Most of what you're describing is attributable to individual as opposed to cultural differences and probably more common among Americans than immigrants. Your stereotype allows you to general individual differences to the cultural difference you're inventing.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

If it is more nuanced they are doing a piss poor job of getting their point across.

I frankly like to scour the comments left on articles and on social media postings to get an idea of what people are really thinking. I do not see much kumbaya on either side. I see the groups becoming more entrenched. Viewing the world from the prism that we are all Americans is now considered "white privelege". I must see that I have advantages and only someone from a position of privilege could dare think that we are all on the same team. I am the star player and I need knocked down a peg because the only reason I got where I am is because my Dad is the coach. So screw my Dad, he did good things but he was an unfair person. Screw the system we ran. It won a bunch of games but it was set up to get me shots.

I increasingly do not feel like a sizable portion of the "team" wants to play with me anymore.

Dude, with respect, if you’re expecting to see civility and intelligence in Internet article comments sections, you’re gonna have a bad time and think less of the human race. Those people, if they’re really people, are the scourge of the Earth.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

I never said that or implied this. This inference is 100% on you.

Ok

 

[iuwclurker1]

Dude, with respect, if you’re expecting to see civility and intelligence in Internet article comments sections, you’re gonna have a bad time and think less of the human race. Those people, if they’re really people, are the scourge of the Earth.

You read my mind.

 

[sglowrider]

Get bent. Seriously, you think that the U.S. is any different than anywhere else? I believe you said that you are ethnic Chinese (I could be wrong about that, if I am, forgive me). But taking your analogy, how awesome has it been for Tibetans and Uighurs to live under the Han Chinese? Any correlation to Native Americans? And I believe you are in Singapore, no?

https://www.google.com/amp/m.scmp.com/week-asia/society/article/2135120/racist-landlords-malaysia-chinese-privilege-singapore-why-asia-so?amp=1

Guess it looks like y'all have a bit of a racism problem there to. You probably do not notice it because you moved to a place where you got to be the dominant culture. Maybe you got a little racisty racism in you too, hmm?

I am glad you found your way to backward ass Indiana so that all of us stupid hicks who help support the state school could help give you an education though.

Apologies if I had not made myself clearer earlier -- and as a result, you missed my point.

I guess I am disappointed between the ideals of what America stands for and its creeping new reality. The fact that its becoming less welcoming goes against the grain fo of what the ideals of America stood for.

No other country have had such lofty ideals and this is what made the country the shining house on the hill -- and not because it has the most guns in the world. Its the reason what its revered around the world.

This country of immigrants.

They say that the youth is wasted on the young -- in this case, the American Dream is wasted on some.

The other point; until you walk in the shoes of a minority where you can be picked on, for no other reason than for your skin colour, you will not recognise dog whistles when you hear it.
If you think people are being sensationalist, then you will fail to learn from people who offer different perspectives on life -- and you are poorer for it.

 

[sglowrider]

That was whiny white privilege at its finest. A snowflake, if you will. Keep in mind that it’s still a helluva lot harder for a minority to get ahead in this country white folks (and especially white males) have everything set up specifically for them.

The country is going to change towards a minority (aggregated) majority situation in the next few decades.

And, that’s perfectly fine. Our country’s composition has changed multiple times since it’s founding, and it’ll change multiple Times more in the future.

I think what most are missing is the the tone, and especially the last part of that segment. When he basically says that immigrants are bad, and they’re too many immigrants due to reckless immigration policy. THAT is the racist part. It’s immigrants being bad simply because they’re “different”. At least that’s how I took his commentary.

That is what I think the OP is getting at with this post. And he’s correct, IMO.

I get what many are saying. I’m a white guy. I used to think and feel the same way. Until I married a black woman, and had two beautiful mixed race kids. After letting my guard down and listening to her, I can spot white privilege quickly now. And not much else pisses me off more than seeing white people act entitled now. And yes, I also realize that I used to act like that at times.

The OP’s point about seeing things through different lenses is spot on, IMO. Unless you try to see it from a minority’s point of view, we’ll never move forward as a country. They’re got an entirely different story re: America. And it’s just as valid as the majority's story (white people). And there’s no reason why we can’t start having these discussions, so we can start breaking down mistrust and stereotypes. I promise you that at their core, people are all the same. It just takes some empathy and understanding sometimes.

This.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

Sushi > Sashimi

You’re wrong.

Ceviche > Both

 

[sglowrider]

Ceviche > Both

I eat everything. Allcomers.

As long as their arent moving, I am ok

Thought I had a fresh lobster in Beijing once... the head/eyes was still moving and staring at me when they served the body to me.

 

[iuwclurker1]

I eat everything. Allcomers.

As long as their arent moving, I am ok

On our pre-freshman canoe outing to Quetico we drank the lake water without incident. At one location, we couldn't take a cup from the lake without the water teeming with little bugs of some sort. Our biology prof said, "If you can see it, it can't hurt you."

 

[sglowrider]

On our pre-freshman canoe outing to Quetico we drank the lake water without incident. At one location, we couldn't take a cup from the lake without the water teeming with little bugs of some sort. Our biology prof said, "If you can see it, it can't hurt you."

Did he drink the water too?

 

[iuwclurker1]

Did he drink the water too?

Yup. There was nothing else to drink. Could've boiled it but who felt like doing that. We weren't grannies.

Only thing he did that pissed me off was get up really early one morning and caught himself a walleye and fried it and ate it in front of all of us. All we ever caught were northern pike, which were fine too.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Ceviche > Both

It’s good. It’s not as versatile.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Is it a common culture that our founders considered important to achieve, or a country of individuals willing to compromise with others with different ideas in order to achieve common goals? Then once consensus is achieved and laws passed, we continually refine laws and goals as dictated by a majority.

What we hold in common is the belief that in spite of not agreeing on everything our system of governing complete with private ownership and individual rights is a system which works for the common good. When it doesn't work or needs altering, we can the change laws and re-evaluate values to promote the common good. Learning through trial and error is important as a majority and its elected representatives can be wrong. Furthermore what works at one point in time can change as time goes on.

The common culture or social compact involves many things. I don’t think the FF’s tried to cover any more than simply the system of governance. The bottom up ”consent of the governed” approach was kinda new and is part of our common culture.

 

[zeke4ahs]

Ceviche > Both

I'm still salivating on the ahi belly I had last week in Maui. May be the best thing I've ever eaten. Along with Hula Pie, that is.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

I'm still salivating on the ahi belly I had last week in Maui. May be the best thing I've ever eaten. Along with Hula Pie, that is.

WTF is ahi belly?

Hula Pie was my nickname in high school.

 

[TheOriginalHappyGoat]

WTF is ahi belly?

Hula Pie was my nickname in high school.

Different parts of the tuna are used for different things. Belly is especially suited for sashimi because it's really fatty. It's just like how you cut up a cow, but in the ocean.

 

[anon_mlxxvlbug9dpa]

Different parts of the tuna are used for different things. Belly is especially suited for sashimi because it's really fatty. It's just like how you cut up a cow, but in the ocean.

I didn’t realize that an ahi was big enough to have meat that could be butchered into parts more specific than “ahi.”