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Tomorrow (Thursday) is going to be a circus

I don’t think it’s always about hate. It’s about precedent.

Pre-Trump, we had certain “gentleman’s agreements” on how disputes should be handled, and certain things were off limits from interference.

Trump threw those right out the window. And those were the things that largely held the foundations of our government together.

So, yes, these things still matter a great deal. Even if we get the answers after either it’s clear he lost, or even after he leaves office.
I don't disagree, but I think a lot of people will care a lot less about those high-minded ideals after he's no longer in office. "It's over, we're tired, let's just move on" is what I expect to be the prevailing opinion. Hate might be a more important driver against that thinking than it is at the moment.

How do you think he feels about Kavannaugh & Gorsuch now? This is a guess, but I think he probably felt like they would side with him. Because they “owe” him. That’s how a purely transactional narcissist with no hint of a moral compass thinks.
I'm 100% sure you're right about that.
 
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Yeah, and unless something drastic changes (like COVID miraculously disappearing) he’s going to be in office for another 2.5 months or so.

That time period terrifies me. He’s already proven that when he feels threatened, his ONLY mission from that point forward is to tear everything down.
He'll be in office longer than that. He'll be President until at least noon 20 January 2021, unless he resigns or leaves office for some reason. I won't miss him when he's gone.
 
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Deutsche Bank will have to comply with the ruling, although it sounds like there will be appeals.
 
As an aside, McGirt is at least the second time Gorsuch has been the fifth vote in an important case involving interpreting laws defining the rights of Native tribes in terms favorable to the tribe. I don't recall any of the discussion during the Gorsuch nomination revolving around the possibility that he might represent a sea change on the court regarding these issues. Traditionally, states have had quite a bit of success warning the courts about the unintended consequences of promises made over a century ago. Twice now, Gorsuch has essentially argued, "Too bad, promises are promises."

He’s consistent. He’s always been guided by the principles of textualism- which essentially means that the ONLY thing you can review while interpreting a statute/law/contract etc. is the text of the document itself.

Other conservatives expand that a little bit, by looking at the surrounding circumstances at the time. That legal interpretation theory is called “originalism”. It allows for more deviation than textualism, basically.
 
I don't disagree, but I think a lot of people will care a lot less about those high-minded ideals after he's no longer in office. "It's over, we're tired, let's just move on" is what I expect to be the prevailing opinion. Hate might be a more important driver against that thinking than it is at the moment.
That was the sentiment of many after Nixon in 1974, but that was only after he'd been fully exposed, humiliated, and forced to leave the office. Even then, there was enough ill will toward him that Ford and all the other Republicans paid a severe political price. I think the visceral contempt for Trump goes much deeper than that and will carry over long after he has left office.
 
An important observation about both cases is that neither one is over. Both opinions were of the kind that will lead to further arguments at the lower courts, further rulings, and further appeals. A lot of the political juice that people were hoping to get from these cases is going to dry up, unless Trump wins in November, or a lot of people hate Trump enough to enjoy his downfall even after he's left office.
I don't think I could imagine a less satisfying outcome for either side if I tried.
 
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First opinion is a pleasant surprise. Gorsuch sided with the liberals in that the Creek reservation remains "Indian Country" for purposes of federal law, because Congress has never explicitly revoked its promises, and as such, defendant McGirt, convicted of murder in a state court, is granted a new trial in federal court.
That is a shock!
I can't wait to see how Trump trashes Gosuch, et al.
That has to be the best circus show we have witnessed yet! I am glued to the TV!
 
Honestly what are people hoping to learn from his tax returns? That while rich he's not worth quite as much as claimed? I've always thought he should release them though.
 
The consistent theme through the many Trump related cases that have made their way to the SC is that he is doing things that have never been done in the history of our country. Hell even Nixon handed the tapes over. Trump is historically corrupt.

Cortez88, if you haven't read Bolton's latest book, you should as it confirms what you are saying. Bolton has worked with other administrations and presidents, and the way Trump conducts business drives Bolton crazy.

What amazes me is how Trump gets away with it. Having said that, where is it written that a president must follow certain protocals and precedents?
 
This is actually aimed at his accountants and banks. They are the ones who were subpoenaed. They will comply.
Accountants have state licenses and many accounting firms and banks are regulated by state financial departments. Yes, they will comply.
 
Honestly what are people hoping to learn from his tax returns? That while rich he's not worth quite as much as claimed? I've always thought he should release them though.
Who paid him off, whom did he pay off, what countries is he indebted to, odd income streams, how non generous he is, evidence for lies, fraud... you know, the general Donald Trump-like stuff
 
Get ready for the tweetstorm. Trump loses in Vance 7-2, with only Alito and Thomas siding with the POTUS. Court essentially says that Trump can challenge subpoenas on specific points relating to his official duties, but that issues touching only his personal affairs do not need to meet a heightened standard. Sent back down for the lower courts and legal teams to hash things out, so the grand jury isn't getting the records right away, but it seems inevitable they will get most of what they want.
I just read the syllabuses.

If Aaron Burr hadn't tried to subpoena President Jefferson's records and established the anti-Trump precedent relied upon by SCOTUS today, I don't know where we'd be.

And, to think, all these years I've been pissed at Burr for shooting that little prick Hamilton and for trying to start his own independent country in the Texas/Mexico area. Who would have thunk that I would ever say anything positive about Burr (a V-P whose personal avarice surely rivals Trump's Presidential greed).
 
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We won't see any of the Trump tax crookedness in any detail until after November, so for him it is not devastating.
Nixon resigned about 19 months after getting reelected, but Nixon was younger, smarter and more politically capable.

I think Trump would set a new record by several months, if we just tell him he would be the best President ever at resigning just after getting reelected. He likes to set new "records," and is too stupid to know the difference.
 
He's taken the SCOTUS decision well I see....




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They need to publish a massive book of all his tweets combined with multiple pages of all the shit that happened on the past four years --- and so you guys can tell the grandkids that somehow grandpa survived that time. Otherwise, they'll think it's so unbelievable that grandpa is probably just spewing nonsense.

This is the current generation's virtual Vietnam.

All the future generations need to know is that we suffered for them, and things are better "now".
 
I just read the syllabuses.

If Aaron Burr hadn't tried to subpoena President Jefferson's records and established the anti-Trump precedent relied upon by SCOTUS today, I don't know where we'd be.

And, to think, all these years I've been pissed at Burr for shooting that little prick Hamilton and for trying to start his own independent country in the Texas/Mexico area. Who would have thunk that I would ever say anything positive about Burr (a V-P whose personal avarice surely rivals Trump's Presidential greed).
Now that I've scanned all the opinions (I haven't read them in depth; doubt I will bother), the situation seems pretty straightforward:

First, remember the situation. The 2nd Circuit ruled against the President, and sent the case back down to the district court for further proceedings. So, this wasn't a final adjudication, which is why the talking heads are saying it might not be until after the election until the grand jury actually gets the documents.

Anyway, the majority affirmed the 2nd Circuit, so the case does get sent back down to district court.

Alito actually agreed with the majority that the President does not enjoy blanket immunity from subpoenas while in office. However, he agreed with the DOJ's argument that subpoenas issued to the President should withstand heightened scrutiny, and would have reversed the 2nd Circuit and sent the case back to examine the issue of heightened scrutiny.

Thomas also actually agreed with the majority on the blanket immunity question - Trump actually lost this key point 9-0 - but suggested that the President might successfully argue on the same grounds that, even if he is not immune from the issuance of a subpoena, enforcement of said subpoena should be enjoined while in office, and so he would have vacated the entire thing and sent it back to the district court to start over with this in mind. It's unclear whether anyone actually argued this point, or Thomas simply pulled it out of wherever Thomas pulls out his idiosyncratic ideas that regularly lead to him filing dissents that no one else signs.

Long story short, Trump lost this one just about as badly as someone can lose, but because it's been remanded with the understanding that Trump's legal team might still develop some arguments against at least some parts of the subpoena, anything they do come up with will require further appeals, delaying for some time the actual handing over of the documents to the grand jury.
 
They need to publish a massive book of all his tweets combined with multiple pages of all the shit that happened on the past four years --- and so you guys can tell the grandkids that somehow grandpa survived that time. Otherwise, they'll think it's so unbelievable that grandpa is probably just spewing nonsense.

This is the current generation's virtual Vietnam.

All the future generations need to know is that we suffered for them, and things are better "now".
I can see VSM doing exactly that, adding chapter and verse numbers, and giving it the title, “The Newer Testement”.
 
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