Whats amazing is today the fans would want Coverdale to transfer out, because it's a wasted scholarship. No one wants to wait till there Jr's to see high quality play.
The Purdues take on Franklin, Newman et al
- Thread starter mushroomgod_1
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I specifically listed the criteria YOU used to explain Crean's termination. (Like anyone here needs a summary from a grubby little Boiler) Nowhere in my response to you did I mention season wins and loses, because you didn't until you were completely chumped. How very Purdue of you to ignore their comparable records in the Tournament. I think if you check the record you'll see that Indiana still has 5 National Titles while Purdue continues to have 0. You'll also see that despite those 26 wins in each of the last three seasons, Painter has yet to translate that into any kind of Tournament success or National relevance, and remains employed by that sh!thole of a university. Again, the expectations of the two programs are on full display.
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That’s not at all what I’m saying. That’s not what started this. I’ve said all along I like Archie and think he will do well at IU, but I hope he can land primarily 4 and 5 star players. Otherwise he won’t succeed.
So far he did that last class. Hopefully he does that as well in 2019 and Franklin is not the norm.
Coverdale was IN Mr Basketball and averaged 11 points 5 assists his sophomore year. No one would have wanted him to transfer.
Not sure if you’re too young or too old to remember but man you’re badly off on this one.
Ok, I misunderstood. I agree with you, and am also confident in Archie's ability to bring in 4 and 5 star BASKETBALL PLAYERS. (no more Hanners, Gelons and Aprils)
Reasons I would choose IU over Purdue are obvious, but I have tried to think objectively.
Many that aren't familiar with the Midwest or the B1G don't know much about Purdue. Friends of mine confuse Purdue with Vanderbilt and forget they are in the B1G. The recognition factor has something to do with it. They simply aren't seen as a basketball university of choice regardless of what they did in a prior year. They rarely get mentioned by the national sports media and there are no ESPN shows produced about them.
Painter is seen as a good coach, but there is something about him that screams "no fun". Archie may be reserved, but in a way that he won't talk you to death and is cool and collected. Painter is from the Bruce Webber mold that if he gets mad, you almost feel like laughing instead of getting frightened. Crean had a lot of that quality.
In a way, the dark and dull colors of Purdue fit their coach, WL, and the lack of any major success. IU is bright, colorful and easier to market than black and urine.
Mentality of the fans has to be something recruits feel. Hearing "IU sucks" during a visit when Purdue is playing someone other than IU is not attractive. If I am a recruit and hear that, I am going to think the team and the fans are too focused on their rival and likely have an inferiority complex when it comes to IU. Why would you want to play at a school that feels inferior? That is why I hope Purdue never stops the chants.
Regardless of what Purdue fans think, IU players are the most recognized and popular athletes in the state. The colors and the IU logo are more recognizable. We don't need names on the backs of jerseys because people know who is wearing #11 on any given year.
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Coverdale wasn't ranked in the top 150, and RMK redshirted him and sent him to prep school for a year. I am guessing you would have been more disappointed about Cov than Franklin.
OK, so this 56 year old whiffed bad on Coverdale. My point still stands that no one wants to wait 3 years for production.
Spoken like one who really has no idea. You do not know that Archie or anyone else requires "primarily 4 and 5 star players" to succeed. However it increases the likelihood statistically or otherwise it is not an absolute because that success has happened in the past and will again sans "primarily 4 & 5 star players". Whatever, the Game (and "success") is about far more than recruiting-stars, but at this point since we're respectively impervious to each other's views on the subject I'll let it go at that.
"Hopefully...Franklin is not the norm". Is this based on anything beyond your exalted armchair sense of his ranking or is there actually something substantive or experiential involved in your cavalier dismissal of an IU recruit? Were you similarly aghast at VO and OG's recruitment, both of whom were mere 3 star-ranked recruits? Perish forbid that IU would ever have a "norm" that allowed for Players like them...
Am thinking you played as much ball in your life as IU's last Coach.
Crean didn’t want 3 stars over 4 and 5. No coach does. He just couldn’t get enough 4 and 5 stars to want to play for him. It’s actually very basic.
So Archie doesn't really want Armaan Franklin. Who knew? Per your 'rationale' he only offered and signed him because he knew he "couldn’t get enough 4 and 5 stars to want to play for him". So much for the straight comparison between Miller and Crean.
Assuming that TC & Staff had zero aptitude for spotting talent, intangibles, potential, etc., and were only desperately sifting through 'leftovers' to fill rosters, how does that invalidate any of the questions you dodged? Do you know AF won't be another OG/VO level talent before his time is all said and done at IU? Do you object to a "norm" that allows Archie & Co. to take a fly on those they think have what it takes to help bring a banner to IU, or do you simply assume that you know better? Have you ever played basketball outside of a gym class?
Let's try a different tack: True "basic" is that success in the Game is about far more than recruit rankings based solely on athletic ability. There's dedication, discipline, intelligence and attitude just for starters. Is there a single collegiate rating service that assesses and/or incorporates those critical variables into their rankings? There is not. The Game is also (perhaps more so) about chemistry, camaraderie and teamwork, none of which can be assessed before recruits begin working with their teammates. The only people that are remotely qualified to adjudge those variables and the potential for integration and an expectation of synergy on the Court that leads to success are the Coaches. I seriously doubt that Archie & Co. are bemoaning AF's commitment. In fact I can only think of one person that is...
The only reason I even bother with this is because you chose to basically throw AF under the bus before he's even set foot in AH. NCAA BB championships are as much about intangibles as athletes. There is no guaranteed formula for any number of reasons (including those based almost entirely on recruiting the best talent - see UK), one of them being for lack of a better term, magic - that chemistry, synergy, harmonic or whatever between teammates that gave rise to the sporting maxim "On any given day..." Archie is trying to create that magic, and while most of Hoosier Nation supports his decision-making as part of that, a narrow and simplistic criterion for success has resulted in you dismissing his first commitment for 2019. By extension, this year's IU Team really doesn't have a prayer, so may be better if you don't watch the games since like AF the 2018 Hoosiers just don't/won't have what it takes because They just didn't/don't have enough collective recruiting stars.
Deliver IU from fans like you.
I’m absolutely certain that Archie wouldn’t have offered and taken AF if there was a 5 star at his position that he could’ve landed. That’s just basic recruiting 101.
That’s no knock on AF, it’s just reality. Given the choice no coach in the history of basketball would choose a 3 star recruit over a 5 star. It would be like having the #1 pick in your fantasy football draft and taking Joe Flacco. Is he a good player? Yes, of course...he’s a starting QB in the NFL. But compared to the other options I don’t think anyone would choose him besides maybe his Mother.
And for every VO/OG you can name I could list 20-30 you’ve never heard of. The percentages speak for themselves on this.
I was responding to someone else. Grubby little Boiler? Wow. I won't call you names. What expectations are you referring to? And just what national relevance has IU shown? I think if you check the record the last title was 31 years ago. That "shithole of a university "was ranked way higher than IU by a very recent report. You also failed to mention that Haas suffered a broken elbow early in the tournament. Yes, IU was nationally prominent back in Knight's day. No doubt. Have they been since? What does it say when they keep hiring coaches? Davis, Sampson, Crean? I used to read that they could get whoever they wanted to coach IU. Well, it hasn't worked. I think Miller may be the answer. I do think he's the best hire since Knight.
I doubt Archie gets a scouting service listing and discounts someone because where they are on the list. Many coaches find a good 3 star while recruiting their higher rated team mates. OG was offered because he stood out while Crean was recruiting his team mate. Even Crean was good enough to recognize a kid playing above his rating sometimes. It is important to not get too cocky and think you can turn Priller into the next Larry Bird.
Are you still here? Do you really desire validation that badly? I know, what a silly question to ask a Purdue fan. It's not all that surprising that you don't know what expectations I was referring to, again, as a Purdue fan. That actually speaks volumes. Do you really think Indiana has no national relevance? Or is somehow only on par with Purdue in that regard? Is this really even debatable? Indiana has been nationally prominent with each and every coach you mentioned. And it will continue to be for the foreseeable future. You already know this.
Nobody's ever thought Indiana could get any coach it's ever wanted. That's a terribly false statement not grounded in any kind of reality. Maybe that's why Purdue fans keep thinking they hear it. But I wonder, if Indiana and Purdue were both looking for coaches at the same time, who do you think could likely get the first/better choice? You're lying to yourself if you think it would be Purdue. Indiana keeps hiring coaches because the school is run by incompetent fools and expectations haven't been met. Purdue keeps retaining Painter because expectations are being met. And as I've clearly pointed out to you already, the results between Indiana's previous coach and Purdue's current coach have been pretty similar. Yet, here you are, trying just as hard as you can, to still not get the difference between the programs.
"Ranked way higher than IU by a very recent report." Yes, I forgot that random people that only Purdue fans seem to meet think the school is in the Ivy League. I was referring more to the smell on campus and the fact that aesthetically it looks like a North Korean prison camp. But keep touting that very recent report.
I know exactly when Indiana's last title was. When was Purdue's? And I mean legitimate titles, not ones voted on by a bunch of bakers 30 years after the fact.
If I mention Haas at all it will be in regard to his proclivity to spread STDs around that sh!thole university. And if you want to mention injuries causing Tournament letdowns, I could bring up Scott May, or Landon Turner, or Kent Benson, or Allen Henderson, or Tom Coverdale, or Jordan Hulls, etc...Get the picture? Then we're not talking 5-0, it would be more like 9-0.
So since you won't go away, what else would you like to wax poetic about?
Hopelessly repetitive dodging. The 'fantasy football' reference explains a lot. Have fun rooting for this IU year and all its crappy sub-optimal players.
And there you have it, folks...
If you can't win the argument, change the argument. We've gone from Basketball program expectations to WSJ subjective School rankings.
But wait a second...it's difficult to compare the two Universities because they're so different in the studies they offer. Indiana has a focus on Medicine and Law while Purdue focuses on Engineering and Animal Husbandry.
A better comparison would be of similar areas of endeavor, don't you think...like Business.
Oops...
U.S. News and World Report (2018)
Best Business Schools
Indiana (Kelley) #27
Purdue (Krannert) #53
But since this is a basketball board and this started as a basketball discussion...
Indiana 5
Purdue 0
If we are so irrelevant why do you come here. If IU is so irrelevant why do we still get put on national TV as much as any big ten team. If we are so Irrelevant why do we always get one of the best matchups in the ACC/Big Ten challenge.
And yet, how to explain the number of Mr Basketballs that went to IU over Purdue in the last 20-21 years? You wanna compare that? Little brother. Please continue the chants. It only further solidifies this point and is ongoing proof. The party is over. You know it. We know it. How many in state 5 stars is Purdue gonna get? 4 stars? Stop with that last FF stuff. Purdue’s last FF probably predates your existence.
If you want to wager on who will finish higher in the B1G this year, I’ll be glad to take your money.
Predates me? More likely the last titles predate you. Let's see. Purdue loses 4 starters and you are brave enough to wager. Wow. Where were you last year when Purdue won 30? "Little brother" has fared better lately. All that stuff tell me is Painter must be pretty good. If he's getting less talent and still finishing higher. IU had a great run with Knight. No doubt. But that ended a long time ago. I don't blame you for wanting to recapture that.
Let's see, where to start. PU has fared better lately? Using what; a sample size of 3-4 years? Do the numbers 97-60 (at Mackey) and 83-55 mean anything to you? They should, and they were not that long ago. The last time IU was in the National Championship game was 2002, the last (only?) time that PU was in the Final Four was 1980. Go home little brother, set the table and make big brother a sammich.
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I'll just leave this here ..
https://www.hammerandrails.com/2018/9/14/17854206/purdue-sports-yahoo-names-purdue-fans-the-worst
https://www.hammerandrails.com/2018/9/14/17854206/purdue-sports-yahoo-names-purdue-fans-the-worst
That's the rebuttal, here's the source:
https://scholarblogs.emory.edu/esma/2018/08/25/college-football-brands-and-fans-2018/
Apparently the pU critic didn't begin to understand the analytic rationale or is just in denial, the latter being wholly consistent with the fanbase's piss-colored view of the world.
https://scholarblogs.emory.edu/esma/2018/08/25/college-football-brands-and-fans-2018/
Apparently the pU critic didn't begin to understand the analytic rationale or is just in denial, the latter being wholly consistent with the fanbase's piss-colored view of the world.
I have actually witnessed 3 championships, how about you OH! that's right PU has none.
I agree with you but you want to be factually correct PU has been to two final fours one which was in the late 60's but that was before I was born.
I was born the year Purdue last made the NC game. Their only NC game. I hope Painter stays at Purdue forever. Most Purdue fans I know are convinced that they’ll finish higher than IU. Much higher. They believe IU will finish between 5th and 7th. Even since Knight, IU has been to a FF and a NC game. IU’s historical greatness precedes Knight, but you know that. Purdue will ALWAYS be little brother to IU. Always. It’s why you chant IU sucks at EVERY sporting event. It’s pathetic.
It’s been a train wreck with IU hoops since the idiots tried to de-emphasize basketball. Those days are now over. You know it. I know it. Now, run along and start your chant.
Edit: You should hang a banner for that 30 win season.
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Look. IU has a wonderful history of basketball. No denying it. But that was a long time ago. I remember the 2 FF for Purdue. I was at the 1980 FF. Like you I do enjoy the past. But that's what it is...the past. I still hope, like you do, that my team can finally push through. I just don't think it will happen for either team this year.
Sunday is a day of rest - if you won't repent at least relent.
He can barely type. What do you expect?
Amazes me why you would want to spend so much time on the board of a team that is so irrelevant.
No, you look. The audacity it takes to come over here and tell us all how irreverent our history and tradition are, because it's "in the past" is truly remarkable. Especially considering it's coming from a Purdue fan. Could there really be a more irrelevant program in the country than Purdue? Maybe Illinois? Never done sh!t on a national level, yet wants to lecture us on how it really is.
One would think that after being owned throughout this entire thread, you would have simply crawled back over to your own board. But no, here you remain, in all your Boiler glory, continuing to take the abuse like the good little cuck you are.
Btw, it didn't go unnoticed that you stopped replying to the posters who were punishing your absurd logic.
P!ss off, Boiler. You bring nothing to the table.
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