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So UCLA....

The takehome msg here is: unless you have someone in your pocket, don't fire your coach. Getting rid of Alford to get Cronin? LMAO. Is it a joke?
 
The takehome msg here is: unless you have someone in your pocket, don't fire your coach. Getting rid of Alford to get Cronin? LMAO. Is it a joke?

Well, I agree that it's wise, when possible, to have a successor identified and lined up before you fire a coach. It seems that Nebraska did that with Hoiberg.

But there was no way UCLA was going to be able to hang on to Alford. He was on thin ice for quite some time -- I was surprised he made it as long as he did. I would imagine, at this point, that UCLA is kicking itself for not getting rid of Steve after the end of last season, rather than doing it mid-season.
 
The takehome msg here is: unless you have someone in your pocket, don't fire your coach. Getting rid of Alford to get Cronin? LMAO. Is it a joke?

I guess my surprise is they went from offering Calipari 8 million a year a few weeks ago to Cronin, who isn't better than the guy they fired. What about Bennett? Beard? Any number of guys could've been a better choice.
 
I guess my surprise is they went from offering Calipari 8 million a year a few weeks ago to Cronin, who isn't better than the guy they fired. What about Bennett? Beard? Any number of guys could've been a better choice.

The Calipari offer was a PR move to placate/impress boosters, with zero expectation that it would get Calipari to leave.
 
Someone mentioned having a successor ready when you fire your coach. I think the best you can have is a list of your top choices before you make the change. Schools ask for permission to speak with coaches. That would tip your hand that a change was coming. Coaches say they won't talk about a job while a coach still has the job. I am sure it depends on the job and how certain coaches view the job.

Has UCLA had anyone put their names in the transfer protocol? I am curious how the players will react to Cronin. Anyone there we would want? They quit on their coach. I don't think I would be too interested in anyone connected to that.
 
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Well, I agree that it's wise, when possible, to have a successor identified and lined up before you fire a coach. It seems that Nebraska did that with Hoiberg.

But there was no way UCLA was going to be able to hang on to Alford. He was on thin ice for quite some time -- I was surprised he made it as long as he did. I would imagine, at this point, that UCLA is kicking itself for not getting rid of Steve after the end of last season, rather than doing it mid-season.

They did with Alford the same thing they did with Howland and with Lavin and will eventually do to Cronin.

The Calipari offer was a PR move to placate/impress boosters, with zero expectation that it would get Calipari to leave.

That may well be true, but they still end up in a place and with a coach no better than the last guy, or the guy before that, or the guy before that or the guy before that. Boosters will not be impressed or placated with Cronin.
 
I guess my surprise is they went from offering Calipari 8 million a year a few weeks ago to Cronin, who isn't better than the guy they fired. What about Bennett? Beard? Any number of guys could've been a better choice.
UCLA did not want to pay TCU's buyout. Maybe the same for these two. I guess Archie needs a raise after today... 8 mil for Cronin? WTF...
 
They did with Alford the same thing they did with Howland and with Lavin and will eventually do to Cronin.



That may well be true, but they still end up in a place and with a coach no better than the last guy, or the guy before that, or the guy before that or the guy before that. Boosters will not be impressed or placated with Cronin.

I would think they would give Howland longer time given what he's done. UCLA's admin is as incompetent as IU.
 
UCLA did not want to pay TCU's buyout. Maybe the same for these two. I guess Archie needs a raise after today... 8 mil for Cronin? WTF...

They offered Calipari the 8 million per, can't imagine they hired Cronin for much more than a third of that figure. Otherwise, WTF does a buyout matter if you are going to throw 8 million @ a guy like Cronin who is a nice enough guy and a decent coach, but...
 
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UCLA made a mockery of this process. Can't get out of their own way.

I cannot fathom how badly they eff'ed this up. It wasn't a splash hire, it wasn't a ripple hire, it wasn't a "meh" hire...it was a WTF hire. Interested in seeing the details of the contract....edit...it's 6 years $24 million. So they hire Cronin @ $4 million per who historically has performed no better than the guy he replaces, Alford, who was making $2.6 million per.

Good Job UCLA!
 
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Well, I agree that it's wise, when possible, to have a successor identified and lined up before you fire a coach. It seems that Nebraska did that with Hoiberg.

But there was no way UCLA was going to be able to hang on to Alford. He was on thin ice for quite some time -- I was surprised he made it as long as he did. I would imagine, at this point, that UCLA is kicking itself for not getting rid of Steve after the end of last season, rather than doing it mid-season.
It “kinda seems” like Purdue did it that way with Painter being named a whole year ahead of time before Keady’s announced departure. Let him sit on the bench for a year learning from his guru while schmoozing his way around with the players and recruits during the transition.
 
I cannot fathom how badly they eff'ed this up. It wasn't a splash hire, it wasn't a ripple hire, it wasn't a "meh" hire...it was a WTF hire. Interested in seeing the details of the contract....edit...it's 6 years $24 million. So they hire Cronin @ $4 million per who historically has performed no better than the guy he replaces, Alford, who was making $2.6 million per.

Good Job UCLA!


I listen a lot to WLW out of Cincy. The powers to be there wanted Cronin gone, although some of the sportswriters and fans like him. I agree that he seems like a very odd choice for them.
 
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I would take Archie all day over mick Cronin. I guess he doesn’t mind being the 67th option for UCLA. What a terrible hire for the team with the most championships ever
 
I would take Archie all day over mick Cronin. I guess he doesn’t mind being the 67th option for UCLA. What a terrible hire for the team with the most championships ever
It happened only because Wooden was a cheater, turning a blind eye on Sam Gilbert creating an unfair advantage in landing recruits. It probably cost us a national championship in ‘73.
 
It happened only because Wooden was a cheater, turning a blind eye on Sam Gilbert creating an unfair advantage in landing recruits. It probably cost us a national championship in ‘73.
I feel your pain friend, we deserved 75
 
Wooden and Sam Gilbert were cheating their a$$ off to 10 titles. Wooden was the smiling old grandpa hiding Satan behind the curtain with wads of cash and benefits to UCLA recruits. HBO has a special on UCLA's Sam Gilbert's illegal payouts and benefits to players and recruits. NCAA should take all of Wooden's titles away. Wooden - 0*
 
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I listen a lot to WLW out of Cincy. The powers to be there wanted Cronin gone, although some of the sportswriters and fans like him. I agree that he seems like a very odd choice for them.

I dunno why I care lol, but this got me digging into Cronin a little more. The first 7 years as UC head coach they were still in the old Big East and finished no higher than 3rd, with the rest being 6th, 8th, 10th, 10th, 11th and 16th and had an overall conference record during those 7 years ten games under .500 @ 57-67. They missed the NCAA's his first four years. To be fair, the Big East was a beast back then, but his conference record only improved after the Big East breakup.
 
harry-potters-invisibility-cloak-may-become-a-reality
...Hires Cronin? That is a lateral move @ best. Not a big "Hire Alford" guy or anything, but Steve has a nearly identical career winning percentage and has coached twice as many games

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nc...ck-cronin-as-head-coach/ar-BBVLTaX?li=BBnb7Kz
According to this thread, at least three current D-1 coaches "can't coach", aren't "good coaches" or are just barely adequate (using some other vague language).

Regardless whether the poster is really a coach or former coach as he/she/it claims, it's interesting that virtually all of these vague criticisms fail to identify even one specific coaching decision that they consider bad or that everybody in the whole world agrees is bad.

The faults with this approach are well known.
tumblr_inline_o0yltcs9Da1t5e46p_500.gif
 
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UCLA did not want to pay TCU's buyout. Maybe the same for these two. I guess Archie needs a raise after today... 8 mil for Cronin? WTF...
It's not 8 mil for Cronin. He signed a 6 year 24 mil. Has any of you on here actually watched Cronin coach? He's a good defensive coach and if he can get the top recruits to come to UCLA will do a great job there.
 
It “kinda seems” like Purdue did it that way with Painter being named a whole year ahead of time before Keady’s announced departure. Let him sit on the bench for a year learning from his guru while schmoozing his way around with the players and recruits during the transition.
I think PU did it right. Painter got to figure out the coaching landscape there and so the transition was very smooth. It's the way you do it when a coach has been there a lot of years. How much better would IU have turned out of we had been able to set up a better exit for Coach Knight and to bring in his successor ahead of time?
 
harry-potters-invisibility-cloak-may-become-a-reality

According to this thread, at least three current D-1 coaches "can't coach", aren't "good coaches" or are just barely adequate (using some other vague language).

Regardless whether the poster is really a coach or former coach as he/she/it claims, it's interesting that virtually all of these vague criticisms fail to identify even one specific coaching decision that they consider bad or that everybody in the whole world agrees is bad.

The faults with this approach are well known.
tumblr_inline_o0yltcs9Da1t5e46p_500.gif

Man, did you mean to quote me here? If so, where did I say in this thread that anyone was a "bad" coach, insinuate that I am a former coach or use vague criticisms of 3 D-1 coaches? I am actually happy to have Miller as our coach, and while I don't believe Cronin is a bad coach, all I am questioning is whether UCLA made a good hire considering they fired a guy with twice as many games coached who had as good a track record W/L-wise in Alford. The same could be said of their past few coaches to be honest. I am wondering how they go from offering Cal 8 mil, to Barnes 6 mil, to Dixon but not willing to do the buyout to their 4th choice in Cronin @ 1.5 million per year more than Alford. My critiques were not vague and were grounded in facts and stats.
 
I think PU did it right. Painter got to figure out the coaching landscape there and so the transition was very smooth. It's the way you do it when a coach has been there a lot of years. How much better would IU have turned out of we had been able to set up a better exit for Coach Knight and to bring in his successor ahead of time?
It’s probably best we never know. Depression is a deep hole.
 
Wooden and Sam Gilbert were cheating their a$$ off to 10 titles. Wooden was the smiling old grandpa hiding Satan behind the curtain with wads of cash and benefits to UCLA recruits. HBO has a special on UCLA's Sam Gilbert's illegal payouts and benefits to players and recruits. NCAA should take all of Wooden's titles away. Wooden - 0*
The thing of it is, this didn’t become mainstream knowledge until after the fact of 10 championships. Knight knew- he hated the sonofabitch. People today still turn a blind eye to it because everyone loves a feel-good story. Mild mannered coaching genius publishing books on motivation. The SOB motivated his players to sign with UCLA by offering cash and car incentives secretly via alumnus Gilbert. Wooden always had a barn load of studs at his disposal. A lot of coaches could have won with the glamor boys he got year in and year out. You think Purdue doesn’t continue to worship the man, too? Even the refs loved Wooden and his studs, as Downing found out.
 
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The thing of it is, this didn’t become mainstream knowledge until after the fact of 10 championships. Knight knew- he hated the sonofabitch. People today still turn a blind eye to it because everyone loves a feel-good story. Mild mannered coaching genius publishing books on motivation. The SOB motivated his players to sign with UCLA by offering cash and car incentives secretly via alumnus Gilbert. Wooden always had a barn load of studs at his disposal. A lot of coaches could have won with the glamor boys he got year in and year out. You think Purdue doesn’t continue to worship the man, too? Even the refs loved Wooden and his studs, as Downing found out.
Still .. we see year after year highly talented teams underachieving. (Hasn’t that been the lesson of the past few Marchs?) At least Wooden kept them together and motivated, and, as Letterman used to say, it’s something.
 
Still .. we see year after year highly talented teams underachieving. (Hasn’t that been the lesson of the past few Marchs?) At least Wooden kept them together and motivated, and, as Letterman used to say, it’s something.
A few differences between them and now. Freshmen couldn't play then so every player basically had a redshirt year to learn, develop, and get acclimated to the college game. Players also rarely left school early so it was often experienced talent. This is in contrast to talented but young Duke and UK teams. I think they also had 15 scholarships so teams could stockpile more talent resulting in less parity than today.

That said, I think he was still a good coach for the reasons you mentioned at the very least. Not the greatest ever but certainly above average.
 
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I would take Archie all day over mick Cronin. I guess he doesn’t mind being the 67th option for UCLA. What a terrible hire for the team with the most championships ever

Why would he mind being their last option if they throw him 8 mil a year? lol
 
Someone mentioned having a successor ready when you fire your coach. I think the best you can have is a list of your top choices before you make the change. Schools ask for permission to speak with coaches. That would tip your hand that a change was coming. Coaches say they won't talk about a job while a coach still has the job. I am sure it depends on the job and how certain coaches view the job.

Has UCLA had anyone put their names in the transfer protocol? I am curious how the players will react to Cronin. Anyone there we would want? They quit on their coach. I don't think I would be too interested in anyone connected to that.

Sure you can have someone lined up. You go through intermediaries. That way no one actually talks to anyone but everyone knows what is going on. Plausible deniability.
 
Still .. we see year after year highly talented teams underachieving. (Hasn’t that been the lesson of the past few Marchs?) At least Wooden kept them together and motivated, and, as Letterman used to say, it’s something.
He was able to keep them together and motivated with cash incentives. How hard can that be in the 1970’s?
 
I doubt UCLA could have attracted either Bennett or Beard. They have better jobs right now. UCLA is a hot mess. Who'd want it?
Well, Mick Cronin I guess, after they couldn't hire anyone else.
 
I think PU did it right. Painter got to figure out the coaching landscape there and so the transition was very smooth. It's the way you do it when a coach has been there a lot of years. How much better would IU have turned out of we had been able to set up a better exit for Coach Knight and to bring in his successor ahead of time?
RMK would have only supported his son as his successor in that fashion. Firing RMK did avoid that disaster.
 
...Hires Cronin? That is a lateral move @ best. Not a big "Hire Alford" guy or anything, but Steve has a nearly identical career winning percentage and has coached twice as many games

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nc...ck-cronin-as-head-coach/ar-BBVLTaX?li=BBnb7Kz

If UCLA had a brain, they'd probably just hire back what they fired in Ben Howland. He did well there, didn't bring home a NC, but had them very close a couple of times. I also wonder why they didn't push go on Hoiberg? Long ago this year?

It reminds me of our admins … push out the overpaid/underachieving mediocre, to pay more for new unproven mediocre
 
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Pretty easy to win multiple nattys with 7'2"+ Kareem Jabbar (Lew Alcindor) and 6'11" Bill Walton. Two of the best best big men to ever play the college game.
 
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I guess my surprise is they went from offering Calipari 8 million a year a few weeks ago to Cronin, who isn't better than the guy they fired. What about Bennett? Beard? Any number of guys could've been a better choice.
Bennett and Beard are both outstanding coaches but they aren't good
choices for the bruins from a recruiting stand point. Neither was
Jamie Dixon. UCLA is a four and five star type recruit program.

I do believe Cronin is a tad better than Alford in the recruiting area.
 
https://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-mick-cronin-ucla-basketball-identity-20190409-story.html

Good article about the reality of UCLA now. An excerpt from the article:

UCLA basketball is a long-struggling place still searching for a new identity in a changing landscape. It is a dusty former dynasty that has won one national title in 45 years, none in 24 years, and twice in the last four years missed the NCAA tournament entirely.

UCLA basketball is no longer a blue-blood program, it is a blue-collar program, one that can be fixed only with rolled-up sleeves and grinding work and a guy unafraid of both.

UCLA basketball is, to be perfectly honest, a lot like Cincinnati basketball, which makes lifting Cronin from the Bearcats not a forced or fumbled decision, but a good one.
 
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