Recruiting Priorities

[TMFT]

I'm semi-stealing the concept of this from a post on the PU board.

What do you think should be IU's recruiting priorities? For example:

How important should culture buy-in be? Like, would you pass on a high 4* if he doesn't seem to get "it," or does talent trump?

Do you work the FL (and the South) pipeline hard or do you try to take control of your backyard in Indiana and make serious inroads in the region (Chicago/Louisville/Detroit)?

More JUCOs & transfers to fill needs, or more under-the-radar projects to develop into 2-year contributors & 1-yr. or spot starters?

I've been really impressed with CTA's recruiting thus far & with the resulting product on the field. I just want to see what you all thought too.

And for me, the answers are to lean toward culture, work FL (this was the toughest pick for me), and transfers. Clearly that's simplistic and there's a lot more nuance in the "real" answer, but that's where I am in broad strokes.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

In my eyes, we stick with what has been our blueprint during the CTA tenure.

We work from inside out recruiting, Indiana and Florida as our base. Then we go from there.

As far as transfers, I think we'll continue to see us go down that road when needed. You almost have to with the way the rules are set up. Players want to play. If we can upgrade our team, why not.

Culture has always been a big thing with CTA. LEO has been around since he was hired and isn't going anywhere. It's always nice to get the higher ranked kids, but if they don't fit culturally here, they're not going to be brought in.

This staff has shown that it can recruit and recruit well. Last year it showed that it can win. We need to continue that trend this year, if there is a season. Should be fun to watch.

 

[crossfire74]

I'm semi-stealing the concept of this from a post on the PU board.

What do you think should be IU's recruiting priorities? For example:

How important should culture buy-in be? Like, would you pass on a high 4* if he doesn't seem to get "it," or does talent trump?

Do you work the FL (and the South) pipeline hard or do you try to take control of your backyard in Indiana and make serious inroads in the region (Chicago/Louisville/Detroit)?

More JUCOs & transfers to fill needs, or more under-the-radar projects to develop into 2-year contributors & 1-yr. or spot starters?

I've been really impressed with CTA's recruiting thus far & with the resulting product on the field. I just want to see what you all thought too.

And for me, the answers are to lean toward culture, work FL (this was the toughest pick for me), and transfers. Clearly that's simplistic and there's a lot more nuance in the "real" answer, but that's where I am in broad strokes.

You often hear Chris Ballard the GM from the Colts talk about getting guys that fit their locker-room, and I think the same thing applies to IU and what CTA and staff are trying to do. They follow and offer a lot of kids, but they really seem to narrow their focus on kids that fit the mold of the type of players they want representing IU, regardless of what ranking services rate the kids. For example if they have a 3 star that really fits vs a 4 star that doesn't fit, then they will focus on the 3 star.

All schools/programs take chances on a kid from time to time, and IU is no different, but so far, we haven't had too many bad apples in CTA's era and the culture of the program is extremely clean and built on Christian principles. Sure some kids make bad choices, and you aren't going to prevent some things, but thankfully IU is winning and still doesn't have the atmospheres of many high end college programs.

As for what CTA wants, I think you are absolutely right in that he wants as many 4 year players as possible, then he can mix in grad transfers or JUCOs to fill gaps at positions that injuries or transfer leave a little short. CTA will always prioritize instate kids first then mix in Florida and other areas as well. I do think the more success we have the more national we will become in our recruiting.

 

[fpeaugh]

You recruit the best players, regardless if they’re from Bedford or Alaska. We need to focus on one thing and one thing only...continuing to upgrade our talent level.

 

[IndyIUFan66]

Culture is clearly big for CTA as I'd say the OG we just signed (Vincent Fiacable) was younger brother & son of IUFB players who really wants to be at IU, but talent wise seemed to be "2 to just barely a 3 star" but with size & seemingly potential. That could have potentially been held out for a 3 to almost 4-star potential talent, but who may not be a "bad apple" but might feel IU is his "fallback school" vs dream school. Don't think you want a locker room of "fallback choice" kids.

Per transfers, CTA seems to have a good handle on 2-3 max a year, which seems about right to me. I'd rather get to where I think team is just about starting this year, of having an ability to RS most of your FR class (except absolute two-deep talent studs) so that you build a roster of older, stronger, more mature players who get the culture and have more experience. A starting Red-shirt FR should still be a better option than a true FR due to the fall, spring/summer weights and summer camp, just a lot more film and actual experience!

But let's also admit: the higher quality talent we sign, the better and smarter the coaches will look as great talent sure makes things become easier to coach up!

As per recruiting locals, 100% agree, IU should always target those true D1 level talent from the top 10-20 players in Indiana and skim those who really want/need. Florida is a "second home" for IUFB and we've been having good success from there and hope that continues. We've now found two years in a row a great OL from Tennessee, which would be nice to keep building upon (along with two great defensive contribuutors in Cam Jones and Jaylin Williams.( The south has great HS football, but need to pick right battles there.

OH has also been a good area for IU that hopefully continues as well. Lot of good momentum to build off of, especially if we can have a great season this year that repeats some of the magic!

 

[82hoosier]

You recruit the best players, regardless if they’re from Bedford or Alaska. We need to focus on one thing and one thing only...continuing to upgrade our talent level.

Nobody is ever going to convince me that dirtbag Antonio Allen’s issues with heroin and cocaine dealing were not known to other members of the team and possibly the coaching staff. The Hoosiers picked up a few four-star losers during that period under Kevin Wilson. I’m not particularly blaming CKW for this but it’s easy to look the other way when a program is in desperate need of talent. I think honest recruiting is Coach Tom Allen’s strength. He is not going to make compromises. Go with quality individuals.

By the way I recently unblocked you. I don’t know for how long

 

[vesuvius13]

The way the coaches are recruiting are fine with me. I expect the transfers will be greatly reduced as the roster starts getting full with the players they want here.

Getting players that are better than rated and fits with the culture is better than higher rated and don't fit the culture IE Mullen, Penix, Bedford, McFadden, C Jones, R Taylor, Whop, etc.

 

[Grateful Redbeard]

With the very small class that will be coming to IU next year, I want CTA to find guys that fit our needs to a T. I think that has been happening so far. 2 DE's from IN. A legacy Olineman from IN. A TE from Bloomington. A 4* CB from FL. It's a great start. Now go get a few more of the top rated IN kids, like Donaven McCulley, and this small class could be a great class for IU.

 

[destewart]

The way the coaches are recruiting are fine with me. I expect the transfers will be greatly reduced as the roster starts getting full with the players they want here.

Getting players that are better than rated and fits with the culture is better than higher rated and don't fit the culture IE Mullen, Penix, Bedford, McFadden, C Jones, R Taylor, Whop, etc.

I fear transfers have become deeply imbedded in today’s college football culture. Witness the players leaving strong programs like Stanford, Clemson, Alabama, Georgia, Michigan, et al. Teams would not be consistently recruiting classes of 18-25 players if it was otherwise. The transfer portal has become the humane response to the less honorable “running off” of players who would not see the field.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

I fear transfers have become deeply imbedded in today’s college football culture. Witness the players leaving strong programs like Stanford, Clemson, Alabama, Georgia, Michigan, et al. Teams would not be consistently recruiting classes of 18-25 players if it was otherwise. The transfer portal has become the humane response to the less honorable “running off” of players who would not see the field.

Stanford is a odd case though.

Just because you go there for the four years doesn't mean you'll get into their grad programs. That's a really prestigious school, so you've got to know going in that if you go there and you redshirt, there's a pretty good chance that you'll end up transferring if you don't go pro.

A lot of times it's not because someone doesn't want to come back, it's because they can't come back.

 

[TMFT]

Stanford is a odd case though.

Just because you go there for the four years doesn't mean you'll get into their grad programs. That's a really prestigious school, so you've got to know going in that if you go there and you redshirt, there's a pretty good chance that you'll end up transferring if you don't go pro.

A lot of times it's not because someone doesn't want to come back, it's because they can't come back.

This might be a dumb question, but what are the NCAA requirements for graduation progress? I guess I've always taken it for granted, but are athletes required to graduate in 4 years? In other words, are all RS-Seniors in grad school?

Depending on the answer above, I suppose that doesn't stop individual top-academic schools like Stanford from requiring 4-year graduation & grad school enrollment to get the 5th year.

On a personal note, I would gladly get trucked by some behemoth 50x/day & never see the first blade of grass on game day in exchange for a free UG degree & a free year of grad school at a place like Stanford.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

This might be a dumb question, but what are the NCAA requirements for graduation progress? I guess I've always taken it for granted, but are athletes required to graduate in 4 years? In other words, are all RS-Seniors in grad school?

Depending on the answer above, I suppose that doesn't stop individual top-academic schools like Stanford from requiring 4-year graduation & grad school enrollment to get the 5th year.

On a personal note, I would gladly get trucked by some behemoth 50x/day & never see the first blade of grass on game day in exchange for a free UG degree & a free year of grad school at a place like Stanford.

Once you get your four year degree, you have to apply to get in grad school. Stanford is such a prestigious school that they get apps from all over the country and don't care if you went to the school for the first four years you were there or not. They're taking the top of the top they can get. That's why they have such a high turnover number every year.

There's absolutely nothing that David Shaw can do about it either. Stanford is all about academics first, and rightfully so.

We see players at IU sometimes post that they got in so and so masters program (Jovann Swann actually posted something about him getting accepted to his program not long ago).

I hope I explained that well enough.

 

[TMFT]

Once you get your four year degree, you have to apply to get in grad school. Stanford is such a prestigious school that they get apps from all over the country and don't care if you went to the school for the first four years you were there or not. They're taking the top of the top they can get. That's why they have such a high turnover number every year.

There's absolutely nothing that David Shaw can do about it either. Stanford is all about academics first, and rightfully so.

We see players at IU sometimes post that they got in so and so masters program (Jovann Swann actually posted something about him getting accepted to his program not long ago).

I hope I explained that well enough.

Thanks for the explanation. I'm clear on that insofar as being on the team doesn't automatically get you into a grad program.

My real question (possibly badly asked) was whether Stanford or the NCAA has any requirements for time limits on getting the 4-year degree. Like, does Stanford require its athletes to finish a BA in 4 years, or can they put themselves on a track to do a 4-yr degree in 5 years? For example, by taking light credit loads & no summer school or by doing a double major with regular class loads so that they can finish in 5 years.

If there are no time limits, I'd imagine most schools would work the schedules to be able to keep kids on campus for 4 playing years, even if it took 5 years total.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

Thanks for the explanation. I'm clear on that insofar as being on the team doesn't automatically get you into a grad program.

My real question (possibly badly asked) was whether Stanford or the NCAA has any requirements for time limits on getting the 4-year degree. Like, does Stanford require its athletes to finish a BA in 4 years, or can they put themselves on a track to do a 4-yr degree in 5 years? For example, by taking light credit loads & no summer school or by doing a double major with regular class loads so that they can finish in 5 years.

If there are no time limits, I'd imagine most schools would work the schedules to be able to keep kids on campus for 4 playing years, even if it took 5 years total.

I'm fairly certain you have to be a full time student to be on scholarship, so you would get a four year degree in four years.

If that weren't the case, schools like Stanford would be working the system like crazy to keep their kids.

 

[TMFT]

I'm fairly certain you have to be a full time student to be on scholarship, so you would get a four year degree in four years.

If that weren't the case, schools like Stanford would be working the system like crazy to keep their kids.

Full-time students are a minimum of 12 hours. BA degree requirements are like 120 total hours, so 10 semesters. So someone could do a BA in 5 years without falling to part-time status (but would seem like a bit of a waste of a free education). If it's the same as it used to be, a traditional "full-load" was like 15 hours, so that'd get you done in 8 semesters.

Note: I had to look up current requirements because I didn't want to pull the "back in my day" card.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

Full-time students are a minimum of 12 hours. BA degree requirements are like 120 total hours, so 10 semesters. So someone could do a BA in 5 years without falling to part-time status (but would seem like a bit of a waste of a free education). If it's the same as it used to be, a traditional "full-load" was like 15 hours, so that'd get you done in 8 semesters.

Note: I had to look up current requirements because I didn't want to pull the "back in my day" card.

Yea, I believe students take 15 credit hours now. Some even take summer school as well to graduate faster.

It's been a while since I was in college so I wasn't sure either. Lol.

 

[destewart]

Full-time students are a minimum of 12 hours. BA degree requirements are like 120 total hours, so 10 semesters. So someone could do a BA in 5 years without falling to part-time status (but would seem like a bit of a waste of a free education). If it's the same as it used to be, a traditional "full-load" was like 15 hours, so that'd get you done in 8 semesters.

Note: I had to look up current requirements because I didn't want to pull the "back in my day" card

Sounds reasonable, but how come It never impacted their football program to such a significant effect previously and when it happened this year it was after they had their first losing season in ten years?

 

[vesuvius13]

Yea, I believe students take 15 credit hours now. Some even take summer school as well to graduate faster.

It's been a while since I was in college so I wasn't sure either. Lol.

We know they have 5 years as the NCAA allows 5 years to play 4.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

We know they have 5 years as the NCAA allows 5 years to play 4.

They have five years of eligibility, yes. But do they havr five years to get a four year degree? I think they only have four years for that, correct (I don't know, as stupid as that sounds). I thought if you went for your fifth year, you have to go in a master's program.

 

[4IUSox2]

They can be on Scholarship 5 years, play 4 seasons. They CAN still be pursuing an undergrad degree in academic year 5/playing season 4. Doesn't need to be a grad program unless they already graduated.

Prior to AP classes, Testing out of hours and MOST true frosh being redshirted, the basic formula for football players was graduating after fall semester their 5th year.

 

[Baller23Boogie]

They can be on Scholarship 5 years, play 4 seasons. They CAN still be pursuing an undergrad degree in academic year 5/playing season 4. Doesn't need to be a grad program unless they already graduated.

Prior to AP classes, Testing out of hours and MOST true frosh being redshirted, the basic formula for football players was graduating after fall semester their 5th year.

Yea, just read the NCAA rules. Have to have 80% of your credits after year four to be eligable to play year five if not graduated by then.

If you have graduated in four years and want to play though, you either have to get accepted in grad school at the school you're either in or transfer out.

 

[TMFT]

Yea, just read the NCAA rules. Have to have 80% of your credits after year four to be eligable to play year five if not graduated by then.

If you have graduated in four years and want to play though, you either have to get accepted in grad school at the school you're either in or transfer out.

If I were a RS-JR who is not a great student, I'd get to looking really hard at adding a 2nd major I had no intention of completing, just to not have to deal with the hassle of grad school.

Kind of like how I saved a 100 level sociology class until my last semester on campus and only took 12 hours (took 18 hours a couple semesters to compensate). I barely set foot in class that last semester, had an absolute ball. I'm not sure it ever rose to the pinnacle of a good time in college (I refer to that as the "Sheehey-level"), but it wasn't bad.