Preferred Coaching Traits

IndyMitchell

Recruit
Apr 29, 2008
84
49
18
Each of the last 4 coaching fires has been a bad fit at IU. I don't necessarily feel that any of them are poor coaches at the right place but each had a style that didn't work for Indiana fans. Winning is always paramount but it didn't feel right even with wins.

These are a few of my thoughts on what I remembered and respected from the teams under CK. 1. Max effort was a given
2. Unselfish passing was a given
3. The shot fake drew lots of fouls and easy points
4. The players were prepared for whatever was thrown at them. CK seemed to always let them work through challenges without giving the timeout. He didn't seem to like the other teams to go back to their bench getting the confidence from knowing that IU was shaken.
5. Each guy knew EXACTLY what his role was. The guy that set the screens and got their blockouts were just as valuable as the leading scorers. The bench guy knew exactly what they were on the floor to give. MD was done once he gave up the keys in order to get the prized recruits.
6. The better players played the most minutes and were expected to play great but it was the CULTURE that was the focus. It wasn't all about that star. If the star drives the bus, then the team won't reach it's potential.
7. CK knew all of the players strengths and their weaknesses. The offense and their game plan was based on what was needed to expose the opponents weakness. I felt like AM ran the exact same formula and just hoped it would improve or work well enough each game/opponent.
8. With CK there was a huge hate for losing. Everyone is a competitor and prefers winning but it's totally different for some. I think some of the players' desire to do anything to avoid a loss is because of the culture that CK created and demanded.
9. The coach took the losses personally. Hearing a press conferences from TC or AM would kill me when they explained how the team needed to get mentally tougher or certain players were soft. That killed me as a fan. He needs to own that he didn't get those guys ready or didn't put them in a position to success and grow in confidence. That arrogance of acting like they have it all figured out but the guys on the team are the problem. As someone that played many sports through the years, I learned to always put it on myself if my team didn't win. I can't sit back and blame less gifted guys or less experienced guys and act like I won my matchup so I am better than a teammate. We all win together or no one acts like they won.
10. If you play smart, you don't have to be the tallest and just the highest to win. Indiana basketball was pure enough that playing the game the right way was more important that making the highlights. TC did a lot of things right and won a decent amount of games at IU, obviously winning the Big Ten several times. He also recruited some really good players. The problem was that he wanted the team to out athlete the opponent. His formula was never about playing smarter or with the better game plan. It was all about his players having enough talent to beat their opponent. As we all saw, that works when your team is loaded but any rebuilding year or lighter in talent years result in a lot of losing.

Knowing a lot less about the coaching options than AD Dolson and many others, it is tough to know who the best fit at IU would be. I am just hoping this list is close to what he is looking for as well. My hope is that Chris Beard is that guy but who knows. He seems to have a lot of traits that CK had and his teams have always played the right way...even when they lose most of their team after their nice runs in 2018 & 19. John Beilein or a former IU guy could probably work as well but I am still hoping it's Chris Beard. Many coaches could find a way to win but I am also hoping that the Culture fits Indiana basketball.
 
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IUbball_lifer

Redshirt
Mar 31, 2019
152
191
43
What is working are spread, penetrate, and kick offenses like Alabama, Baylor, USC, Oregon. Michigan and Gonzaga too, although they are posting more with Dickinson and Timme. Anyway, like the NBA, you take it to the rim or you kick for a 3 pointer. Or you post, get the double team, and kick for the 3 pointer. You can’t deny success and analytics. Numbers don’t lie. Pitino had it figured out 20 yrs ago.
 

go_iu

Senior
Feb 22, 2004
2,148
1,101
113
Each of the last 4 coaching fires has been a bad fit at IU. I don't necessarily feel that any of them are poor coaches at the right place but each had a style that didn't work for Indiana fans. Winning is always paramount but it didn't feel right even with wins.

These are a few of my thoughts on what I remembered and respected from the teams under CK. 1. Max effort was a given
2. Unselfish passing was a given
3. The shot fake drew lots of fouls and easy points
4. The players were prepared for whatever was thrown at them. CK seemed to always let them work through challenges without giving the timeout. He didn't seem to like the other teams to go back to their bench getting the confidence from knowing that IU was shaken.
5. Each guy knew EXACTLY what his role was. The guy that set the screens and got their blockouts were just as valuable as the leading scorers. The bench guy knew exactly what they were on the floor to give. MD was done once he gave up the keys in order to get the prized recruits.
6. The better players played the most minutes and were expected to play great but it was the CULTURE that was the focus. It wasn't all about that star. If the star drives the bus, then the team won't reach it's potential.
7. CK knew all of the players strengths and their weaknesses. The offense and their game plan was based on what was needed to expose the opponents weakness. I felt like AM ran the exact same formula and just hoped it would improve or work well enough each game/opponent.
8. With CK there was a huge hate for losing. Everyone is a competitor and prefers winning but it's totally different for some. I think some of the players' desire to do anything to avoid a loss is because of the culture that CK created and demanded.
9. The coach took the losses personally. Hearing a press conferences from TC or AM would kill me when they explained how the team needed to get mentally tougher or certain players were soft. That killed me as a fan. He needs to own that he didn't get those guys ready or didn't put them in a position to success and grow in confidence. That arrogance of acting like they have it all figured out but the guys on the team are the problem. As someone that played many sports through the years, I learned to always put it on myself if my team didn't win. I can't sit back and blame less gifted guys or less experienced guys and act like I won my matchup so I am better than a teammate. We all win together or no one acts like they won.
10. If you play smart, you don't have to be the tallest and just the highest to win. Indiana basketball was pure enough that playing the game the right way was more important that making the highlights. TC did a lot of things right and won a decent amount of games at IU, obviously winning the Big Ten several times. He also recruited some really good players. The problem was that he wanted the team to out athlete the opponent. His formula was never about playing smarter or with the better game plan. It was all about his players having enough talent to beat their opponent. As we all saw, that works when your team is loaded but any rebuilding year or lighter in talent years result in a lot of losing.

Knowing a lot less about the coaching options than AD Dolson and many others, it is tough to know who the best fit at IU would be. I am just hoping this list is close to what he is looking for as well. My hope is that Chris Beard is that guy but who knows. He seems to have a lot of traits that CK had and his teams have always played the right way...even when they lose most of their team after their nice runs in 2018 & 19. John Beilein or a former IU guy could probably work as well but I am still hoping it's Chris Beard. Many coaches could find a way to win but I am also hoping that the Culture fits Indiana basketball.
It doesn't have to be that complicated ...

Try to not **** anybody in the bathroom of a restaurant
Try not to overlook your assistants attempting to buy players
Try not to overlook paying for hookers for said players

That doesn't sound all that complicated or overbearing on our end, just end the stupid game and hire him if he can play within the lines. He's not really in a position where he can step outside them again without completely ruining his legacy
 
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TMB333

Recruit
Feb 20, 2021
49
68
18
Each of the last 4 coaching fires has been a bad fit at IU. I don't necessarily feel that any of them are poor coaches at the right place but each had a style that didn't work for Indiana fans. Winning is always paramount but it didn't feel right even with wins.

These are a few of my thoughts on what I remembered and respected from the teams under CK. 1. Max effort was a given
2. Unselfish passing was a given
3. The shot fake drew lots of fouls and easy points
4. The players were prepared for whatever was thrown at them. CK seemed to always let them work through challenges without giving the timeout. He didn't seem to like the other teams to go back to their bench getting the confidence from knowing that IU was shaken.
5. Each guy knew EXACTLY what his role was. The guy that set the screens and got their blockouts were just as valuable as the leading scorers. The bench guy knew exactly what they were on the floor to give. MD was done once he gave up the keys in order to get the prized recruits.
6. The better players played the most minutes and were expected to play great but it was the CULTURE that was the focus. It wasn't all about that star. If the star drives the bus, then the team won't reach it's potential.
7. CK knew all of the players strengths and their weaknesses. The offense and their game plan was based on what was needed to expose the opponents weakness. I felt like AM ran the exact same formula and just hoped it would improve or work well enough each game/opponent.
8. With CK there was a huge hate for losing. Everyone is a competitor and prefers winning but it's totally different for some. I think some of the players' desire to do anything to avoid a loss is because of the culture that CK created and demanded.
9. The coach took the losses personally. Hearing a press conferences from TC or AM would kill me when they explained how the team needed to get mentally tougher or certain players were soft. That killed me as a fan. He needs to own that he didn't get those guys ready or didn't put them in a position to success and grow in confidence. That arrogance of acting like they have it all figured out but the guys on the team are the problem. As someone that played many sports through the years, I learned to always put it on myself if my team didn't win. I can't sit back and blame less gifted guys or less experienced guys and act like I won my matchup so I am better than a teammate. We all win together or no one acts like they won.
10. If you play smart, you don't have to be the tallest and just the highest to win. Indiana basketball was pure enough that playing the game the right way was more important that making the highlights. TC did a lot of things right and won a decent amount of games at IU, obviously winning the Big Ten several times. He also recruited some really good players. The problem was that he wanted the team to out athlete the opponent. His formula was never about playing smarter or with the better game plan. It was all about his players having enough talent to beat their opponent. As we all saw, that works when your team is loaded but any rebuilding year or lighter in talent years result in a lot of losing.

Knowing a lot less about the coaching options than AD Dolson and many others, it is tough to know who the best fit at IU would be. I am just hoping this list is close to what he is looking for as well. My hope is that Chris Beard is that guy but who knows. He seems to have a lot of traits that CK had and his teams have always played the right way...even when they lose most of their team after their nice runs in 2018 & 19. John Beilein or a former IU guy could probably work as well but I am still hoping it's Chris Beard. Many coaches could find a way to win but I am also hoping that the Culture fits Indiana basketball.
Don't care who the coach is, Stevens, Beard etc, no school wins year in year out at a high level without breaking the rules. If Duke, KU, Zona etc are paying the best players to come, no kid is going to pass up the money to go to IU - who has no recent history of success during their lifetimes. With the transfer portal in full swing, rarely will team be able to keep a team together for 4/5 years to build the chemistry necessary to compete against the paid guys. The NCAA is not going to clean it up. They cannot afford to admit all their storied programs had success because they cheated. It ruins their whole model. It's a new age. It's never going back to 1987 no matter how many IU retreads you bring in. The best players aren't coming for free. IU is at a crossroads. If they want to win big, they will have to get even more involved in the 'game' or they will remaining a middling program forever. You simply can't have it both ways.
 
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oldcougar77

All-Big Ten
Apr 21, 2004
4,653
5,534
113
What is working are spread, penetrate, and kick offenses like Alabama, Baylor, USC, Oregon. Michigan and Gonzaga too, although they are posting more with Dickinson and Timme. Anyway, like the NBA, you take it to the rim or you kick for a 3 pointer. Or you post, get the double team, and kick for the 3 pointer. You can’t deny success and analytics. Numbers don’t lie. Pitino had it figured out 20 yrs ago.
What works is having players who can make open 3s. If IU spreads the floor, people are still gapping and taking away the drive. They are still going to double TJD because they don't give a damn if any of the other 4 players on the floor shoots a three.

Every offensive system sucks if your players don't have the skills to make it work. Any number of offensive systlems work if you have players who can score. There is no magic formula.
 
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fkfootball

All-Big Ten
Apr 28, 2014
4,950
5,238
113
Don't care who the coach is, Stevens, Beard etc, no school wins year in year out at a high level without breaking the rules. If Duke, KU, Zona etc are paying the best players to come, no kid is going to pass up the money to go to IU - who has no recent history of success during their lifetimes. With the transfer portal in full swing, rarely will team be able to keep a team together for 4/5 years to build the chemistry necessary to compete against the paid guys. The NCAA is not going to clean it up. They cannot afford to admit all their storied programs had success because they cheated. It ruins their whole model. It's a new age. It's never going back to 1987 no matter how many IU retreads you bring in. The best players aren't coming for free. IU is at a crossroads. If they want to win big, they will have to get even more involved in the 'game' or they will remaining a middling program forever. You simply can't have it both ways.

I want a guy who wins. I really could care less how he does it. Just don’t get caught like Sampson.
 
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IUbball_lifer

Redshirt
Mar 31, 2019
152
191
43
What works is having players who can make open 3s. If IU spreads the floor, people are still gapping and taking away the drive. They are still going to double TJD because they don't give a damn if any of the other 4 players on the floor shoots a three.

Every offensive system sucks if your players don't have the skills to make it work. Any number of offensive systlems work if you have players who can score. There is no magic formula.
Oh, you gotta make the shot? Got it.
 

76-1

All-American
Mar 22, 2017
7,483
10,891
113
Indiana
Each of the last 4 coaching fires has been a bad fit at IU. I don't necessarily feel that any of them are poor coaches at the right place but each had a style that didn't work for Indiana fans. Winning is always paramount but it didn't feel right even with wins.

These are a few of my thoughts on what I remembered and respected from the teams under CK. 1. Max effort was a given
2. Unselfish passing was a given
3. The shot fake drew lots of fouls and easy points
4. The players were prepared for whatever was thrown at them. CK seemed to always let them work through challenges without giving the timeout. He didn't seem to like the other teams to go back to their bench getting the confidence from knowing that IU was shaken.
5. Each guy knew EXACTLY what his role was. The guy that set the screens and got their blockouts were just as valuable as the leading scorers. The bench guy knew exactly what they were on the floor to give. MD was done once he gave up the keys in order to get the prized recruits.
6. The better players played the most minutes and were expected to play great but it was the CULTURE that was the focus. It wasn't all about that star. If the star drives the bus, then the team won't reach it's potential.
7. CK knew all of the players strengths and their weaknesses. The offense and their game plan was based on what was needed to expose the opponents weakness. I felt like AM ran the exact same formula and just hoped it would improve or work well enough each game/opponent.
8. With CK there was a huge hate for losing. Everyone is a competitor and prefers winning but it's totally different for some. I think some of the players' desire to do anything to avoid a loss is because of the culture that CK created and demanded.
9. The coach took the losses personally. Hearing a press conferences from TC or AM would kill me when they explained how the team needed to get mentally tougher or certain players were soft. That killed me as a fan. He needs to own that he didn't get those guys ready or didn't put them in a position to success and grow in confidence. That arrogance of acting like they have it all figured out but the guys on the team are the problem. As someone that played many sports through the years, I learned to always put it on myself if my team didn't win. I can't sit back and blame less gifted guys or less experienced guys and act like I won my matchup so I am better than a teammate. We all win together or no one acts like they won.
10. If you play smart, you don't have to be the tallest and just the highest to win. Indiana basketball was pure enough that playing the game the right way was more important that making the highlights. TC did a lot of things right and won a decent amount of games at IU, obviously winning the Big Ten several times. He also recruited some really good players. The problem was that he wanted the team to out athlete the opponent. His formula was never about playing smarter or with the better game plan. It was all about his players having enough talent to beat their opponent. As we all saw, that works when your team is loaded but any rebuilding year or lighter in talent years result in a lot of losing.

Knowing a lot less about the coaching options than AD Dolson and many others, it is tough to know who the best fit at IU would be. I am just hoping this list is close to what he is looking for as well. My hope is that Chris Beard is that guy but who knows. He seems to have a lot of traits that CK had and his teams have always played the right way...even when they lose most of their team after their nice runs in 2018 & 19. John Beilein or a former IU guy could probably work as well but I am still hoping it's Chris Beard. Many coaches could find a way to win but I am also hoping that the Culture fits Indiana basketball.

I like the way Beard goes about things but I think he's a perfect "fit" at Texas Tech... I don't think he gives that up to come here... (but I have even fewer sources than f2 so you may get your man)...
 

IndyMitchell

Recruit
Apr 29, 2008
84
49
18
What works is having players who can make open 3s. If IU spreads the floor, people are still gapping and taking away the drive. They are still going to double TJD because they don't give a damn if any of the other 4 players on the floor shoots a three.

Every offensive system sucks if your players don't have the skills to make it work. Any number of offensive systlems work if you have players who can score. There is no magic formula.
That is partly true. You have to have a baseline of talent to work with. However, some coaches have an ability to get more out of guys than others. AM was just too flat. He seemed to just go through the motions. The right leader or coach can push the guys to elevate their play.
 

IndyMitchell

Recruit
Apr 29, 2008
84
49
18
I like the way Beard goes about things but I think he's a perfect "fit" at Texas Tech... I don't think he gives that up to come here... (but I have even fewer sources than f2 so you may get your man)...
I have zero sources so I have no idea if he has any interest. I just really respect how how he pushes decent but not elite talent to play at a very high level. Would Coach Knight or Pat Knight put in a good word for Bloomington and IU? If not, I still want it to be a guy that instills a lot of these traits that the 70-90's IU teams had.
 
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All4You

Sophomore
Mar 12, 2007
834
1,341
93
A guy who can teach/coach, who views this place as a destination gig, has a respect for the history while wanting to make his mark on it, who connects with the kids in such a way that they not only buy in but are also willing to be held accountable (a guy who recognizes when the kid needs a pat on the back or a kick in the ass, and can foster a relationship with his kids that they are willing to accept both). Give us that guy, and the winning will come.
 

oldcougar77

All-Big Ten
Apr 21, 2004
4,653
5,534
113
That is partly true. You have to have a baseline of talent to work with. However, some coaches have an ability to get more out of guys than others. AM was just too flat. He seemed to just go through the motions. The right leader or coach can push the guys to elevate their play.
No argument here. I believe Archie's failure at IU likely had multiple causes - some his, some the players'. I still think he'll have success somewhere else but it's been pretty obvious the last couple of years that there was a lot of frustration on both sides. Especially toward the end of both seasons. I don't think that was going to change next year without major roster changes and/or some significant improvement in offensive strategy.

Hiring Archie was the right move at the time. It didn't work out, but hindsight is 20/20. There wasn't anybody in the country who thought it was a bad hire in the spring of 2017. I have my theories as to what went wrong, but I don't have anything to back them up except my own observations.
 

Crazy8

Redshirt
Aug 18, 2001
108
74
28
1. Play defense or go home.
2. Learn how to make a shot.
3. Accept your role on the team.
4. Get ready to run until you puke when you tell the coach to F off.
5. Don't screw your teammate's girlfriend.
6. Act like you hate losing when a team like Purdue comes here and wins.
 

IndyMitchell

Recruit
Apr 29, 2008
84
49
18
Looking back on this list...Dolson hired the right guy. This first couple months has been fun to watch! The talent and depth is like we haven’t had in years. I am hoping the player development and coaching moves match!
 

TR32

All-American
Nov 20, 2009
6,469
2,787
113
The thing about IU under Knight was that you knew they could potentially win any game. It was just a given that even with obvious talent discrepancy they would battle close most of the time and generally have a chance at the end, and if it came down to a coaching opportunity with under a minute to play, Knight was tough to beat.

All else aside, it was the consistent winning and expecting to and knowing how to win that set Indiana apart.

I don't expect Woodson to replicate it. But with the coaching staff on board and some momentum in recruiting, it will be interesting to see if they can start off with a bang.
 

T.M.P.

Hall of Famer
Jul 2, 2014
19,215
16,063
113
f it came down to a coaching opportunity with under a minute to play, Knight was tough to beat.
Unless the other coach ran a high ball screen that Knight constantly and stubbornly had his players go under.

Sure ....

Signed,

Rick - I owned RMK - Pitino.
 

Big Red Crimson Buffalo

Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Aug 28, 2001
15,390
8,833
113
Here are the 5 traits I look for in a coach:

1. Spastic
2. Tan
3. Wears Glasses
4. Tracks Deflections
5. Diet Coke

That’s the ideal guy. Now, we just got to find him!
 
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Beorik

Freshman
Sep 25, 2019
468
379
63
Unless the other coach ran a high ball screen that Knight constantly and stubbornly had his players go under.

Sure ....

Signed,

Rick - I owned RMK - Pitino.
I beat Pitino 6 out of 9 meetings while he was at Kentucky.

Signed,
Bobby - Pitino is my bitch - Knight
 
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Fpeaugh2

Redshirt
Mar 16, 2021
186
218
43
Don't care who the coach is, Stevens, Beard etc, no school wins year in year out at a high level without breaking the rules. If Duke, KU, Zona etc are paying the best players to come, no kid is going to pass up the money to go to IU - who has no recent history of success during their lifetimes. With the transfer portal in full swing, rarely will team be able to keep a team together for 4/5 years to build the chemistry necessary to compete against the paid guys. The NCAA is not going to clean it up. They cannot afford to admit all their storied programs had success because they cheated. It ruins their whole model. It's a new age. It's never going back to 1987 no matter how many IU retreads you bring in. The best players aren't coming for free. IU is at a crossroads. If they want to win big, they will have to get even more involved in the 'game' or they will remaining a middling program forever. You simply can't have it both ways.
Don’t kid yourself...IU plays the “game” as much as anyone. We’re not any “cleaner” than the other schools you mentioned.