Poll: Breakout freshman for IU this year
- Thread starter TR32
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IU's outside shooting has been consistently weak under CAM. If Leal can help fix outside shooting, then he will be the breakout freshman. I don't think Geronimo gets enough minutes to achieve breakout status.
VanPastorMan
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I'm hoping Galloway and Lander can also hit some outside shots. If they can do that then this team could really be clicking.
I'm not sure we'll find a dead-eye knock down shooter, especially as a freshman. My hope is that we see some improvement across the board in Durham, Hunter, and Phinisee and also with Lander/Leal getting some of Green's minutes. Hunter will also be a better shooter than Smith was, so again, we have a better overall shooter taking the minutes of a guy who wasn't a good shooter. Just being decent shooters would be a marked improvement I think. I'm really looking for Phinisee to take a step up. I think he was injured most of last year and with him being healthy and the competition coming from Lander, I think he'll respond. Oops, but to answer the question, I think Lander will make the biggest impact as a freshman; likely the only freshman starter, which alone gives him a big head start.
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I'm thinking it's Geronimo as we know the least about him. But I agree, a breakout outside shooter would be critical to making us a threat.
He's raw and needs skills work, especially with his handle. I doubt he breaks out this year but should get some minutes due to his athletic ability which hopefully translates into defense. Can't teach a 7'1 wingspan ..
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Galloway isn't a shooter, he's a swiss army knife, shooting is well known to be his weakest skill. His shot mechanics are a bit jacked up.
Lander's shot also needs work but that's not what Lander was recruited for. His job will be in transition to push pace and in half court run the PnR, things he should excel at due to handle and quickness, and something a ball control guard like Phinisee just doesn't do well. His defense and how quickly he picks it up, will decide if he starts along with Phin or is a backup.
but ...
Considering Miller has changed the offense not only because of overall personnel but also to better fit Lander's game .. is there any doubt it's in the coach's plans he'll be the breakout or get the opportunity to be?
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Leal has that in him though expecting him to excel in a crowded backcourt as a frosh is probably not going to happen. Heard he's much stronger than the staff expected and that he's having some problems as he's aggressive attacking the rim but too aggressive and getting himself in trouble doing it. Early in practice though so there's plenty of time... if he gets minutes it will be because of his ability to shoot.
Galloway is getting early praise due to his composure and defense.
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More. Please.
Happens every year - almost as if there's a 'cone of silence' over IU practices.
No one is allowed in practice due to covid so it's doubly tough getting anything.
Lander will have the most success, but he won'r set the world on fire right away. I would expect a role similar to Yogi's freshman year. More than that would be a bonus.
Yogi stepped into a role where he was the least solid offensive player on the team. Zeller, Watford, Hullz, and Dipo were all far better than he was at that time on the offensive end.
Lander is not in any way stepping into the same type of situation or near as talented a team. He'll have far more opportunity than Yogi did .. and may end up being the second option after TJD.
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I think Lander is going to be great but I picked Geronimo. He's underrated.
I worry about Lander trying to do too much and getting caught up in turnovers, with flashes of brilliance and scoring.
Yea, he's a freshman and a young one.
We'll see soon enough. I hope .....
The point about the new offense being an indicator of what we will do still stands. Durham and Phinisee have never been effective players on the ball screen or pushing the pace because neither are much of a threat to score or breakdown the defense in that way.
Durham without the ball in transition though is pretty good and he does have a knack for recognizing when a big has sealed his man*. Phinisee may be better off the ball than with it, he shoots better off the catch than he does the dribble..
Why change the focus of the offense if it isn't being done for Lander to run? It fits him better than our other guards.
*Seriously, if you get what I'm talking about Durham does that all the time. It's about the only time he's effective with the ball.
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Brunk, Durham - have peaked. Solid but not game changers.
Hunter - Since we never knew his injury, we do not know healing time, recurrence rate, etc. I think he has a shot to improve significantly.
Phinisee - Due to injuries last year he also may rise.
Franklin - Would be great to see a giant step but I am not expecting it.
TJD - Normal improvement from Frosh to Soph.
Race - I am completely not sure. Need help here.
Freshmen - I have no expectations from them other than back up minutes.
Hunter - Since we never knew his injury, we do not know healing time, recurrence rate, etc. I think he has a shot to improve significantly.
Phinisee - Due to injuries last year he also may rise.
Franklin - Would be great to see a giant step but I am not expecting it.
TJD - Normal improvement from Frosh to Soph.
Race - I am completely not sure. Need help here.
Freshmen - I have no expectations from them other than back up minutes.
Yeah, I saw a report that said both Franklin and Galloway had been looking really good in practice. Of any freshman not named Lander, I suspect that Leal will have the best opportunity to earn minutes, strictly because of his potential as a shooter. If he can do that, he should help the team. I have to say the pictures Cliff Marshall posts of these guys are impressive, but I don't know how much it's helped up til now. But Leal looked beast-like in his, and Geronimo also looked much more defined. Also claims that Lander has put on 15-20 lbs. Hopefully we'll see the fruits of that on the court. I really believe this team has the potential to compete with anyone in the Big if healthy. I'll give them making the tourney last year, which is why a 7th-8th place finish doesn't really excite me. I think a top 4 conference finish is realistic for this group, and a S16 (or better) and a couple wins over PU and that would be progress and "success" to me. I'm not going to be happy until we are competing and winning B10 titles, but top 4 feels alot more like we're on that arc than 7th to me.
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glad they're hitting the weights. But hoping someone can also hit 8 out of 10 free throws. Watching IU guards clank FTs has been a tough bill to swallow.
Amen, brother, which is why I said I'm not sure how much it's helped. It looks impressive, but are we seeing more wins or fewer injuries? At best I'd say the jury is out. This could be a watershed year, and frankly I think we're due to overachieve for once. Hope we get to see it, but this is a big year for Archie.
remember the thread about vertical jumps?
that was a classic.
all those impressive videos from off season workouts, and it didn’t really seem to translate to Ws, Who would have thunk it?
The guards weren't the ones missing them. Durham is over 80, Phin was at 73.
Lander is a willing facilitator while being available to score when the team needs a lift. I expect him to play this role early and be a leader in his second year like Yogi did in his first two years.
Clearly their situations were different. Lander will have more opportunities to play. I could actually see Phinisee and Lander averaging similar numbers.
Great stuff folks...keep it up.
I fall in the Leal camp simply because of the need for a shooter.
Non-frosh I have been waiting for Franklin to explode and I may wait forever but he just seems to have Sheehey nose for the ball.
I like this roster and Trey would make a big difference once TJD steps out.
I fall in the Leal camp simply because of the need for a shooter.
Non-frosh I have been waiting for Franklin to explode and I may wait forever but he just seems to have Sheehey nose for the ball.
I like this roster and Trey would make a big difference once TJD steps out.
And you're not an IU fan, yet that doesn't stop you from posting here. How about we let him play a game or two of college ball before we decide what he can and can't do?
I agree with whoever said TJD, Race and Brunk are going to get a lot of easy dump off dunks and layups with Lander. Whether injury, instincts or style of play, we haven't had anyone be able to do that successfully and regularly for some time. As much as I believe in Phinisee, it's not a strength of his and Lander comes with that reputation. Symbiotic relationship, we need some shooters to pull defenders out of the lane and open it for drives. That's why our offense has been so inept.
Phin's numbers are decent but I'd like to see a PG above 75. And there was Devonte....
Brunk and Smith were another story. Smith's high arch looked beautiful, until it dented the rim. Brunk looks like he's in physical pain when he shoots FTs.
I guess my point was that we've heard too much about bench presses and vertical leap, all the while fielding some of the worst shooting IU teams I have ever seen. I know we pride ourselves on the B1G being the black n blue division but honestly NCAA ball has changed nationwide.....they opened up and sped up the game. Inside muscle, as much a I relish the days of the motion offense, feeding the low post, has been phased out for a spread offense were six foot ten guys are popping 3s. Maybe I should have rolled 3pt shooting in with the FTs in my complaint.
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Maybe so, and I know you love statistics over observations, but really, was there ANYONE for the last few years you've felt comfortable with going to the line at the end of the game when we need to make FTs? I've been pretty confident in Durham and I thought Green was a good FT shooter generally, but no one inspired confidence in me. I think that's what CBH is referencing. Not just FT's made with a double digit lead against Timbuktu U... but trying to catch or hold off a good B10 opponent under 2 minutes... do you have those stats from last year, 'cause I agree with him... we could use more makes then.
Yes, 20 years and counting for the black and blue division of CBB winning a national title. IMHO, the B10 officiating isn’t helping the league win a title either. All the while, as IU fans, we get stuck looking at a program that is mired in the bottom third of the conference, having to listen to how “top to bottom” the league is better than ever.
Is the conference style/officiating hurting the leagues chances of Winning a title?
Is the league not worthy of a title?
What other power conference is title-less over the last 20 yrs?
Damn it K, if ESPN analysts start referencing symbiosis am going to hold you personally responsible. The booyah about team ecology and court ecosystems is bad enough...
The ”cure” to the physical nature of the conference that is effectively endorsed by the officials is for coaches (and their AD bosses) to come together and demand a new and different standard of play. To do so, however, would require a “rising tide lifts all boats” appeal, and it would have to be spearheaded by the dean(s) of Big Ten coaches (Izzo, primarily, and Painter). Only they have the gravitas to lead the change, and they (Izzo, for sure) definitely have the ability to kill any initiative. Obviously, the message has to be that the style of play has diminished the BiG at the national level, and that recruiting and prominence are and will continue to suffer as a result. The challenge is to convince the two most experienced and successful coaches to endorse and push for an “evolved” approach to the style of play that has served them both well. Not sure why they’d go for it. Otherwise, a football guy (Kevin Warren) will need to intervene in any area of which he knows little and force change. Don’t hold your breath.
Two will be in fully in the rotation with Lander and Galloway, Leal will contribute and Geronimo will be bled in, in spots. As a whole, this class truly gives the team quality depth that it has lacked several seasons now. Singularly, Lander is expected to make a splash, the team to has two true point guards to run the team. Galloway from what is reported will add an edge to the team that has been missing, a little down and dirty toughness.
So who in the last couple years have you felt comfortable with shooting big FTs at the end of a close game? Who do you expect that might be this year? Phinisee and/or Lander would be huge. It is so much nicer when your primary ball-handlers are confident going to the line. I think I recall that Lander was north of 80% in high school, but it woudn't surprise me to find out Phin was too. RIght now, I guess I'd say Durham though, if those big shots were coming today.
I haven't felt truly 'comfortable' with anyone at the FT line, late in the game- when it counts- since Yogi his Sr season. This yr, I'd say, if anyone...goes to Durham. He's probably the most consistent, and the most experienced.
Like you said, anyone can be an 80% FT shooter up 25 late in a November game vs Cupcake U. Lots of people are driving range heroes, but can't keep their drives out of the trees when it matters.
