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Player development & roster consistency

Try to comprehend. 3 of Crean's recruits stayed committed. They were not the style of recruit for CAM system. He re-recruited them because as late a start as he got the roster would have been depleted. Now he has to reconstruct it and find kids for his system. He might have to end up getting 3-4 new players depending on who else leaves. To me,it's addition by subtraction.They just don't fit his style of play. Durham might be the only one who gets it..
 
It does stink to be perpetually young...playing PROGRAMS that always seem veteran loaded...Mich St..Wisconsin..Michigan . and Purdue loses 4 starters and still somehow returns a team of kids that play like veterans
I remember when IU used to do that
 
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Try to comprehend. 3 of Crean's recruits stayed committed. They were not the style of recruit for CAM system. He re-recruited them because as late a start as he got the roster would have been depleted. Now he has to reconstruct it and find kids for his system. He might have to end up getting 3-4 new players depending on who else leaves. To me,it's addition by subtraction.They just don't fit his style of play. Durham might be the only one who gets it..
Addition by subtraction...

Needs to go like this:
Addition by subtraction, then addition...

The subtraction isnt concerning to me...its the ‘then addition’
 
Ground breaking article implying successful teams have: consistency of roster, player development, and a team culture. Who knew?

Per this article, things are going to take time. The question remains: how much time?

https://www.thedailyhoosier.com/arc...an-older-team-rooted-in-his-system-next-year/
I read that article in an extremely negative slant towards Archie...but I have a negative viewpoint of Archie.

Were there any positive ways to view to that article?
 
2 commits...Losing 7-8 players...

I dont see the system being built...
Are you counting walk-ons in that 7-8 number? If so, then the incoming number at this time is 3. There is a preferred walk-on already committed.

Nathan Childress from Zionsville.
 
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I'd like to see a poll of how many fans are willing to patient through 2022.

Heck there were some posters on here who will still being patient at Creans 9th year. That would be happy to give archie 6 or 7 years without any judgment at all.
 
Losing 7-8? Huh?
Are you counting walk-ons in that 7-8 number? If so, then the incoming number at this time is 3. There is a preferred walk-on already committed.

Nathan Childress from Zionsville.

Quoted from OP article:
Out of the 17 players on the 2018-19 roster, only 8 will be back next year. One of those eight is Jerome Hunter, who hasn’t played and no one seems to know for sure if he ever will.
 
I read that article in an extremely negative slant towards Archie...but I have a negative viewpoint of Archie.

Were there any positive ways to view to that article?
I do not read it negatively but rather read as though the writer went to some lengths to keep it impartial by adding caveats as

"IU was just inches away from the NCAA Tournament in 2019 after all. It won’t take much to change the narrative, and a return to the big dance would do that while also showing two straight years of progress over Miller’s year one.

But given the direction of the roster and college basketball in general, we probably shouldn’t expect year three for Miller to be transformational."

The writer could have criticized CAM on this season but didn't (inches away from the tournament) and also provided leeway about next season "But given the direction of next season..."

I read it as giving CAM a pass for 2-3 years going forward with the last part "Realistically, it might not be until more like 2022 or even 2023 when Miller’s own recruiting classes start to graduate. Athletic Director Fred Glass called this thing a “serious rebuild,” and that is probably how much time Miller will need to complete that kind of job. "

2-3 years on top of the 2 years on the job, therefore 4-5 years to turn this ship around. Postive...Negative...really depends on your perspective & timeline.
 
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What can Archie hang his hat on?
After 2 years as head coach - what can he look at and adamantly say is improved because of his being Head Coach at Indiana?



I havent felt worse about the overall direction of the program since the 2 low Mike Davis years in a row...
 
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What can Archie hang his hat on?
After 2 years as head coach - what can he look at and adamantly say is improved because of his being Head Coach at Indiana?



I havent felt worse about the overall direction of the program since the 2 low Mike Davis years in a row...

Defense. Miller has absolutely changed the defensive culture at Indiana in 2 years. IU lost 7 games by 5 points or less/OT. Defense was good enough to win most of those games, but with a bunch of personnel not fit to Archie's system along with several untimely injuries that never allowed the Hoosiers to get any kind of consistency with their rotations, it is what it is. Let Archie continue to build the program and recruit guys for his system and we'll know in a year or two if he's the guy.
 
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What can Archie hang his hat on?
After 2 years as head coach - what can he look at and adamantly say is improved because of his being Head Coach at Indiana?

I havent felt worse about the overall direction of the program since the 2 low Mike Davis years in a row...

Defense. Its fairly impressive that we were rated 30th by KenPom in defensive efficiency with the constantly changing lineups due to injury and Morgan playing/defending the 5 much of the year. Defense slipped a little as the season went along, but I feel like that was mainly due to the extra focus given to re-calibrate the offense
 
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Defense. Its fairly impressive that we were rated 30th by KenPom in defensive efficiency with the constantly changing lineups due to injury and Morgan playing/defending the 5 much of the year. Defense slipped a little as the season went along, but I feel like that was mainly due to the extra focus given to re-calibrate the offense
I agree the offense had a big effect on the defensive numbers...
How did the offensive numbers turn out?

The Win-Loss number was not too impressive.
 
I agree the offense had a big effect on the defensive numbers...
How did the offensive numbers turn out?

The Win-Loss number was not too impressive.

I'll agree that offense and wins left a lot to be desired, but you were asking about the thing that Archie can hang his hat on, and I answered that question
 
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I agree the offense had a big effect on the defensive numbers...
How did the offensive numbers turn out?

The Win-Loss number was not too impressive.

The offensive numbers also improved. They started out pretty well, plummeting during the losing streaks, then rebounded at the end of the year to improve over the previous year.

BUT...the offensive numbers, while improving, are not anywhere close to where they'll need to be to compete at a high level in the NCAA's. So, Miller deserves continued scrutiny in that area.

The wins also improved, but by not as much as we'd hoped they would. But IU's strength of schedule was tougher this year, which contributed to the record. But even with all the injuries we had this year, we actually did improve on both sides of the ball.
 
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I read that article in an extremely negative slant towards Archie...but I have a negative viewpoint of Archie.

Were there any positive ways to view to that article?
I'm in the camp labeled "Not really impressed after year 2"

Reading the article though, I have to take issue with this passage and premise:
Beyond that, this Indiana team is on track to be something that Miller hasn’t yet found a way to escape — young.

Out of the 17 players expected on next year’s roster, the experience distribution should look something like this: five upperclassmen to 12 underclassmen. Baked into that assumption are guesses that IU picks up a grad transfer like Joey Brunk, and then fills out its remaining openings with freshmen. The Hoosiers currently have three open scholarships for next season.

Perhaps even more important than seemingly perpetual youth is a lack of continuity. Out of the 17 players on the 2018-19 roster, only 8 will be back next year. One of those eight is Jerome Hunter, who hasn’t played and no one seems to know for sure if he ever will.

That’s all a far cry from a core group of upperclassmen that have played in a coach’s system for four years.

When you inherit young teams that have had unbalanced recruiting classes, you're going to stay young for a few of years. There's not much that can be done. This year's Texas Tech is the only team I can think of in the last 10 years that has been able to plug holes with transfers and make any noise.

There are plenty of other things to be worried about right now other than having a young team. How did this team lose 12 of 13 in conference? When is the offense going to get better? Why can't these guys make free throws? Where is the offense going to come from and what is the offensive philosophy going forward?

This year sucked. Fortunately(?), next year's team doesn't have a very high bar when it comes to offensive improvement. The defensive side of things we should still be a top 40 or better squad. A tourney appearance needs to be the minimum acceptable outcome of next season. I had swallow hard and grit my teeth to write that last sentence.
 
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Archie’s first class was a bust. Forrester transferred, Anderson couldn’t see the court, Hunter may never play again, and Langford was an underwhelming one and done. Only Phinisee may be a long term contributor. You can’t go 1/5 in a class and expect to win.

No school that takes basketball seriously would tolerate three years of missing the tournament with no discernible system in place or player development.

I am sick of the excuses for this program’s ineptitude.

It should not take six freaking seasons to build a competitive roster.
 
I'll agree that offense and wins left a lot to be desired, but you were asking about the thing that Archie can hang his hat on, and I answered that question
My point was - if you slow down the offense enough - and shorten the game/possessions...the defensive numbers will improve. So how did the offense #s compare to the last 3-5 seasons...

If Tom Allen runs the ball 3 or 4 downs and lets the play clock run down all game...puts 8 in the box on D...he might win time of possession stats and rushing ypg...

This years team needed to score faster and more often...
 
3 years...

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I'm on board two more year's.
Cody & company gave T.C. a bunch more time.
I'd bet money even if we don't go dancing next year .
Archie get's one more...But he will be put on notice....
Idk Hell I've seen three national championships.
And four state championships ..
I'm good with my basketball life.~
 
I'm on board two more year's.
Cody & company gave T.C. a bunch more time.
I'd bet money even if we don't go dancing next year .
Archie get's one more...But he will be put on notice....
Idk Hell I've seen three national championships.
And four state championships ..
I'm good with my basketball life.~
that’s selfish
 
My point was - if you slow down the offense enough - and shorten the game/possessions...the defensive numbers will improve. So how did the offense #s compare to the last 3-5 seasons...

If Tom Allen runs the ball 3 or 4 downs and lets the play clock run down all game...puts 8 in the box on D...he might win time of possession stats and rushing ypg...

This years team needed to score faster and more often...

The numbers I'm relying on are tempo-free. The pace of play is factored into the metric. The offense and defense were better on a per-possession basis, compared to the rest of D1.
 
He's including graduating players and walkons in that number. 7-8 is technically an accurate number, but Forrester is the only remotely "unexpected" departure
He's also leaving out the incoming walk-on to make it look like the ratio is worse than it is. At the moment it's 7 out to 3 in, not 8 out to 2 in.

And half of those players had almost no minutes this past year.
 
He's also leaving out the incoming walk-on to make it look like the ratio is worse than it is. At the moment it's 7 out to 3 in, not 8 out to 2 in.

And half of those players had almost no minutes this past year.
And Hunter is effectively like a new player coming in. If you add him to our recruiting class it would make it top 20 nationally.
 
Let's say Hunter is not right then the recruiting class is below average. As we stand right now I see maybe 12 wins..
 
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