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[IU Scott]

So does that mean that CBS only cares about the NCAAT? No it doesn't and that was the topic, until Scott chimed in

Maybe not CBS but I have heard some people say that the college basketball season is meaningless and the only thing that matters is the tournament. I heard people say that on Mike & Mike which is on the same station that airs hundreds of college basketball games a year. there are many shows on the air that does not pay attention to college basketball until the end of the football season. Some never mention anything about college basketball until around championship week.

As avid college basketball fans we will discuss it year around but there are many out there that does not think anything matters until the tournament.

 

[Shirtsandskins]

Maybe not CBS but I have heard some people say that the college basketball season is meaningless and the only thing that matters is the tournament. I heard people say that on Mike & Mike which is on the same station that airs hundreds of college basketball games a year. there are many shows on the air that does not pay attention to college basketball until the end of the football season. Some never mention anything about college basketball until around championship week.

As avid college basketball fans we will discuss it year around but there are many out there that does not think anything matters until the tournament.

Stay on topic Scott...spa was refuting a posters contention that CBS was trying to spread the message that the only thing that matters is the NCAAT. We are talking about CBS, not random fans.

You do this all the time and then you get bent out of shape when posters get frustrated with you

 

[Shirtsandskins]

OK, the next time I want to post something I will get your permission to see if it is good enough to post.

Yes do that

 

[IU Scott]

Stay on topic Scott...spa was refuting a posters contention that CBS was trying to spread the message that the only thing that matters is the NCAAT. We are talking about CBS, not random fans.

You do this all the time and then you get bent out of shape when posters get frustrated with you

Where did I say random fans but people on air with ESPN has said this.

 

[Shirtsandskins]

Where did I say random fans but people on air with ESPN has said this.

It doesn't matter, random fans or ESPN analysts...neither have anything to do with the topic CBS!!!

Back on the road Scott

 

[TheSpa]

Maybe not CBS but I have heard some people say that the college basketball season is meaningless and the only thing that matters is the tournament. I heard people say that on Mike & Mike which is on the same station that airs hundreds of college basketball games a year. there are many shows on the air that does not pay attention to college basketball until the end of the football season. Some never mention anything about college basketball until around championship week.

As avid college basketball fans we will discuss it year around but there are many out there that does not think anything matters until the tournament.

You're swerving so you don't have to respond to the point, which wasn't factual, something you claim to be concerned with.

 

[IU Scott]

You're swerving so you don't have to respond to the point, which wasn't factual, something you claim to be concerned with.

I never once said that all CBS cared about was the tournament.

 

[Shirtsandskins]

I never once said that all CBS cared about was the tournament.

Oh good lord...no you didn't, but you joined a conversation on that topic, with your patented randomness....back on topic

 

[TheSpa]

I never once said that all CBS cared about was the tournament.

Then why are you citing both CBS December games (you weren't accurate) and nameless people on ESPN radio as proof of that very point? As usual, you're all over the place, all because you aren't able to support what you say. Try relying on facts for a change.

 

[IU Scott]

Then why are you citing both CBS December games (you weren't accurate) and nameless people on ESPN radio as proof of that very point? As usual, you're all over the place, all because you aren't able to support what you say. Try relying on facts for a change.

Yes they did promote the road to the final four in December games but never said that means that is the only thing they cared about. You guys can find any little thing to nit pik about to try to meet your agenda.

 

[Shirtsandskins]

Yes they did promote the road to the final four in December games but never said that means that is the only thing they cared about. You guys can find any little thing to nit pik about to try to meet your agenda.

We have an agenda against CBS? We aren't nit picking we are trying get you on the topic. If you want to talk FF promotions, go ahead but this conversation is about the CBS conspiracy theory

Remember a couple of posts ago when I said you would get bent out of shape?

 

[TheSpa]

Yes they did promote the road to the final four in December games but never said that means that is the only thing they cared about. You guys can find any little thing to nit pik about to try to meet your agenda.

You were responding in direct support of that false premise, but now you're saying something different?

 

[Coach Monte]

So does that mean that CBS only cares about the NCAAT? No it doesn't and that was the topic, until Scott chimed in

Do the math. CBS paid $8.8 billion recently for the exclusive rights to March Madness. Not the regular season. Someone asked for a link showing that they were hyping the tournament during the regular season; I did exactly that. The top-rated regular season basketball game typically draws a 2.0 to 2.5 rating...IU's Sweet 16 game pulled a 6.9, so of course CBS has much more of a vested interest in the tournament games when they are generally getting 2x, 3x, 4x the rating of your average regular season games. To pretend otherwise is just arguing for the sake of arguing. But, of course, with 1500 posts in five weeks since joining this forum, the majority being with the intent of taking a flamethrower to Crean and anyone who shows any sign of supporting him, seems like you're all about arguing for the sake of arguing.

 

[Stuffshot]

CBS has said that "the only thing that matters is the NCAA tournament"? Can you link that quote for me?

I referred to the CBS hype, not a statement. But you knew that.

 

[Shirtsandskins]

Do the math. CBS paid $8.8 billion recently for the exclusive rights to March Madness. Not the regular season. Someone asked for a link showing that they were hyping the tournament during the regular season; I did exactly that. The top-rated regular season basketball game typically draws a 2.0 to 2.5 rating...IU's Sweet 16 game pulled a 6.9, so of course CBS has much more of a vested interest in the tournament games when they are generally getting 2x, 3x, 4x the rating of your average regular season games. To pretend otherwise is just arguing for the sake of arguing. But, of course, with 1500 posts in five weeks since joining this forum, the majority being with the intent of taking a flamethrower to Crean and anyone who shows any sign of supporting him, seems like you're all about arguing for the sake of arguing.

And after all that it still doesn't mean that CBS only cares about the tourney...and certainly doesn't show that the conspiracy theory about them pushing that message is true...which is what this convo was about,..... until you and Scott chimed in with unrelated factoids

If they only care about the post season they wouldn't bother with regular season games
ers in a game

Spa asked for proof that they were hyping it in "every game in Dec" not a singular game...which is what your post referenced. You didn't provide the proof that was requested Despite your claim that your link "did exactly that".

Any chance that you can post without taking personal shots? if not I will put you on ignore. No need to waste my time on people that can't show some semblance of maturity

 

[Coach Monte]

You seriously can't read one thing of mine without projecting something that I never said. I never mentioned any conspiracy theory. And I never mentioned that they only care about the tournament. Damn, dude, your reading comprehension is for crap. Is this like you getting confused that Niego posted the Montross/Bradley stuff yesterday? I also never said anything about hyping the tournament four months early, which if you could actually read you'd notice I prefaced my post with the video link saying that it was a January game.

 

[Shirtsandskins]

You seriously can't read one thing of mine without projecting something that I never said. I never mentioned any conspiracy theory. And I never mentioned that they only care about the tournament. Damn, dude, your reading comprehension is for crap. Is this like you getting confused that Niego posted the Montross/Bradley stuff yesterday?

Ok, let me walk you through this

...this conversation started because iirc, stuffshot mentioned the CBS hype machine putting out the message that the only thing that matters is the NCAAT. <Conspiracy theory.

Spa asked for some proof of them pushing that message

Scott cited every game in dec having NCAAT promos

Spa asked for proof that every game in December had promos

You then linked an ancient CBS promo,

I said that doesn't prove that it happens every game and it isn't poof of CBS pushing a message

I didn't say you said anything about conspiracy theories...I said that your link didn't answer either question. I also said that the theory was what we were talking about before you chimed in with unrelated factoids...which shouldve indicated that I wasn't saying you said it

Now Tell me again about reading comprehension?

 

[Harpo Marxist]

IU's recruiting is "erratic"......good and bad.....it lacks consistency.....a word that rears its ugly head during the season....oops.....I've had my third drink.....

 

[Coach Monte]

You're right. CBS picks that exact mid-January date to start running promos for the tournament. By some miracle, I happened to find the one that represents that earliest possible starting point. The NCAA Tournament and everything that goes with it never gets mentioned prior to Jan. 15th. Since you have an answer for everything, must be the gospel truth.

If you never hear about the Road To The Final Four before conference play, you don't watch CBS. Plain and simple.

 

[IU Scott]

Do the math. CBS paid $8.8 billion recently for the exclusive rights to March Madness. Not the regular season. Someone asked for a link showing that they were hyping the tournament during the regular season; I did exactly that. The top-rated regular season basketball game typically draws a 2.0 to 2.5 rating...IU's Sweet 16 game pulled a 6.9, so of course CBS has much more of a vested interest in the tournament games when they are generally getting 2x, 3x, 4x the rating of your average regular season games. To pretend otherwise is just arguing for the sake of arguing. But, of course, with 1500 posts in five weeks since joining this forum, the majority being with the intent of taking a flamethrower to Crean and anyone who shows any sign of supporting him, seems like you're all about arguing for the sake of arguing.

He is not new to the board just changed names probably a few times.

 

[Shirtsandskins]

You're right. CBS picks that exact mid-January date to start running promos for the tournament. By some miracle, I happened to find the one that represents that earliest possible starting point. The NCAA Tournament and everything that goes with it never gets mentioned prior to Jan. 15th. Since you have an answer for everything, must be the gospel truth.

If you never hear about the Road To The Final Four before conference play, you don't watch CBS. Plain and simple.

Ok who and what are you arguing?

No one said CBS didn't run promos, of course they do..Scott claimed that the promos ran in every game in the month of December(note Scott picked the month)....spa asked for proof that the NCAAT promos did in fact run in every game in Dec...then you in a moment of pure brilliance that can only come from coach monte, you linked a promo from Jan 1991 to prove that....hell I have no idea why you provided that link

Now tell me again about reading comprehension

 

[IUINSB]

I see all your menstrual cycles have synced up.

 

[Coach Monte]

"Now tell me again about reading comprehension"

And, again (using the voice I use with my 4 year old), I prefaced by saying this was a January commercial. I understood correctly. I explained the distinction for the hard of understanding. It's tragic beyond belief that people weren't setting their VCRs in the good ol' days to record 15 second promo snippets in case of the advent of YouTube. I reiterate again...if you haven't heard mention of Road To The Final Four during non-conference play, then you're not watching television (or you're forwarding through the commercials, or you're taking advantage of a ten second break in the action to go bitch about Crean, whatever).

 

[Shirtsandskins]

"Now tell me again about reading comprehension"

And, again (using the voice I use with my 4 year old), I prefaced by saying this was a January commercial. I understood correctly. I explained the distinction for the hard of understanding. It's tragic beyond belief that people weren't setting their VCRs in the good ol' days to record 15 second promo snippets in case of the advent of YouTube. I reiterate again...if you haven't heard mention of Road To The Final Four during non-conference play, then you're not watching television (or you're forwarding through the commercials, or you're taking advantage of a ten second break in the action to go bitch about Crean, whatever).

You didn't read anything anyone wrote, then added anunrelated link and now your pissed because its being dismissed ...go ahead muscles, keep on being you

 

[Coach Monte]

Hmm, interesting read here...page 35 of the hardback copy of "Last Dance," book about the history of the Final Four that came out in 2006. And I quote:

"Together with Len DeLuca, then a CBS executive, (Billy) Packer also came up with the idea of turning the entire basketball season into a promotional vehicle for the NCAA Tournament and, specifically, the Final Four. There was no way to replace the magic Enberg/Packer/McGuire, but the "road" concept allowed CBS to establish its own identity."

Tell me again how it's unrelated and that CBS didn't run with that concept from start to finish, not just late in the season, as described. Oh, are those pesky facts backed up with citations getting in the way again?

 

[TheSpa]

Hmm, interesting read here...page 35 of the hardback copy of "Last Dance," book about the history of the Final Four that came out in 2006. And I quote:

"Together with Len DeLuca, then a CBS executive, (Billy) Packer also came up with the idea of turning the entire basketball season into a promotional vehicle for the NCAA Tournament and, specifically, the Final Four. There was no way to replace the magic Enberg/Packer/McGuire, but the "road" concept allowed CBS to establish its own identity."

Tell me again how it's unrelated and that CBS didn't run with that concept from start to finish, not just late in the season, as described. Oh, are those pesky facts backed up with citations getting in the way again?

Of course they've run promos throughout the year, but that's far different than trying to make a truly uninformed argument that they're saying the regular season doesn't matter.

 

[Coach Monte]

Of course CBS isn't going to come out and say the regular season is meaningless. They've got a business to run, after all, bills to pay from mid-November to early March. But the narrative obviously exists even if CBS doesn't say it. What was the argument for so long against a football playoff? It was that every regular season game mattered, that every matchup had potential BCS ramifications. When a 10-18 team suddenly catches fire for one weekend in conference tournament play, it does serve to render the regular season meaningless in a way that couldn't happen in football. Now, those instances are far and few between, but CBS counters any perception along those lines by reminding consumers to look at the big picture, keep that eye on the prize. It was a clever slogan and promotion, and the fact that they've made it a cornerstone of their marketing for three decades is impressive.

 

[TheSpa]

Of course CBS isn't going to come out and say the regular season is meaningless. They've got a business to run, after all, bills to pay from mid-November to early March. But the narrative obviously exists even if CBS doesn't say it. What was the argument for so long against a football playoff? It was that every regular season game mattered, that every matchup had potential BCS ramifications. When a 10-18 team suddenly catches fire for one weekend in conference tournament play, it does serve to render the regular season meaningless in a way that couldn't happen in football. Now, those instances are far and few between, but CBS counters any perception along those lines by reminding consumers to look at the big picture, keep that eye on the prize. It was a clever slogan and promotion, and the fact that they've made it a cornerstone of their marketing for three decades is impressive.

The argument against the college football playoff was really twofold: Administrators were concerned about extending the season (this has largely been dismissed), and there was great consternation about the impact a CFB would have on the lucrative bowl system. No one, absolutely no one, argued that it would render the regular season as meaningless. If anything, it created greater meaning on the season because teams released losses would likely knock them out of contention.

Again, you don't seem to understand the difference between CBS' obvious desire to promote college basketball and the tournament (the ultimate goal of any team is to make and then win the tournament) and the simplistic and nonsensical take that they've wanted to or made the regular season meaningless. Just like you took one rather obscure magazine reference and attempted to broad brush it as a dominant view (quite U successively), you've failed here to comprehend how the promotion of the tournament naturally complements the regular season, rather than rendering it meaningless. It's both wrong and pointless.

 

[Coach Monte]

Would you mind directing me to the post where I said that CBS (or the NCAA) was doing or saying anything about rendering the regular season meaningless? Not what anyone else on this thread said. And not, as I actually said, that this was a narrative that had been discussed at length in regards to a football playoff. Again, not by officials, because that would be counterproductive. But between Dan Patrick, Mike & Mike, 1st Take, PTI, etc. that had been beaten into the ground as a discussion point.

As for the Bradley/Montross thing, that was not a single case (and not obscure, it was in the 2nd biggest preseason magazine of that era behind Street & Smith). It's the one I have the most fun with, it might be the most ridiculous I've seen. But if you don't think that, at complete random, I could grab from any list any year from any expert and find prognostications and rankings that we'd all find completely laughable in hindsight, you're fooling yourself.

 

[TheSpa]

Would you mind directing me to the post where I said that CBS (or the NCAA) was doing or saying anything about rendering the regular season meaningless? Not what anyone else on this thread said. And not, as I actually said, that this was a narrative that had been discussed at length in regards to a football playoff. Again, not by officials, because that would be counterproductive. But between Dan Patrick, Mike & Mike, 1st Take, PTI, etc. that had been beaten into the ground as a discussion point.

As for the Bradley/Montross thing, that was not a single case (and not obscure, it was in the 2nd biggest preseason magazine of that era behind Street & Smith). It's the one I have the most fun with, it might be the most ridiculous I've seen. But if you don't think that, at complete random, I could grab from any list any year from any expert and find prognostications and rankings that we'd all find completely laughable in hindsight, you're fooling yourself.

Your mundane posts, along with Scott's, have been driving that very point into the ground. Go back and read them if you can't remember what you've droning on about.

As for the hype contained in recruiting publications, most people who know sports are able to sort out what's real and what's fluff. If you're that bothered by it, maybe you should find something else where your knowledge is broader so you don't get so upset every time someone makes a prediction that isn't ultimately accurate.

 

[Coach Monte]

I can remember exactly what I said. The fact that you can't point out a single instance of me saying the words you seem intent to put in my mouth drives that home.

Hard to "get so upset" about recruiting rankings since they are something I put practically no stock into. Maybe you can enlighten me one which ones are accurate and which ones are fluff so I can benefit from someone who actually "knows sports."

 

[TheSpa]

I can remember exactly what I said. The fact that you can't point out a single instance of me saying the words you seem intent to put in my mouth drives that home.

Hard to "get so upset" about recruiting rankings since they are something I put practically no stock into. Maybe you can enlighten me one which ones are accurate and which ones are fluff so I can benefit from someone who actually "knows sports."

You've been fanning the "it's all about the tournament" throughout this thread. Suggesting otherwise is disingenuous, at best.

And saying you put no stock in recruiting ratings while posting on a site that was literally conceived as forum for recruiting (and the hype that surrounds it, just like the magazines that ruled prior to the Internet), is laughably both ironic and ignorant. A site, by the way, that regularly contains breathless soliloquies about future college stars, even though the vast majority of posters have never seen them play. And for a school that once featured a coach who gaslit the entire notion of recruiting hype by inventing a player to see if recruiting gurus would take the bait.

So, it means nothing to you while you patronize it in multiple formats for decades. You bet.

 

[Coach Monte]

Aside from talking about a kid from my hometown who IU is recruiting, when do I ever jump in conversations about high school kids and their recruitment? I can count the number on one hand in over a decade on this forum and I'd still have fingers left over. There's plenty of conversation on this board that doesn't have anything to do with recruiting. And, yet again, words in my mouth on your part ("it's all about the tournament"). Never said it, never hinted at it. Just pointed out that promos could be found (or see, if you watch a CBS game for more than 30 minutes) and providing proof that hyping the Final Four from Day 1 is CBS's marketing philosophy and has been for over thirty years. Anything else you're reading into it beyond that is of your own doing/imagination.

 

[TheSpa]

Aside from talking about a kid from my hometown who IU is recruiting, when do I ever jump in conversations about high school kids and their recruitment? I can count the number on one hand in over a decade on this forum and I'd still have fingers left over. There's plenty of conversation on this board that doesn't have anything to do with recruiting. And, yet again, words in my mouth on your part ("it's all about the tournament"). Never said it, never hinted at it. Just pointed out that promos could be found (or see, if you watch a CBS game for more than 30 minutes) and providing proof that hyping the Final Four from Day 1 is CBS's marketing philosophy and has been for over thirty years. Anything else you're reading into it beyond that is of your own doing/imagination.

As I said, you're disingenuous, at best.

 

[Coach Monte]

And you put words into my mouth at every stage of the conversation, at best.

 

[Stuffshot]

Aside from talking about a kid from my hometown who IU is recruiting, when do I ever jump in conversations about high school kids and their recruitment? I can count the number on one hand in over a decade on this forum and I'd still have fingers left over. There's plenty of conversation on this board that doesn't have anything to do with recruiting. And, yet again, words in my mouth on your part ("it's all about the tournament"). Never said it, never hinted at it. Just pointed out that promos could be found (or see, if you watch a CBS game for more than 30 minutes) and providing proof that hyping the Final Four from Day 1 is CBS's marketing philosophy and has been for over thirty years. Anything else you're reading into it beyond that is of your own doing/imagination.

I love this thread. I speak truth and they start yelling at you and IU Scott.

Don't worry. This point will be easy to demonstrate next fall when CBS starts its Road to the Final Four drumbeat in October (CBS can't help itself).

 

[Shirtsandskins]

I love this thread. I speak truth and they start yelling at you and IU Scott.

Don't worry. This point will be easy to demonstrate next fall when CBS starts its Road to the Final Four drumbeat in October (CBS can't help itself).

And when they pay millions to air regular season games the truth will be clear

 

[Coach Monte]

"And when they millions"?

The truth is already clear. CBS doesn't use the NCAA Tournament as a vehicle to drive up interest in regular season games. CBS does use regular season games to drive up interest for the NCAA Tournament. CBS paid $10.8 billion for the rights to broadcast the NCAA Tournament. CBS's current regular season deals for coverage of SEC, Big 10 and Big East games is not even a billion ($951 million).

 

[TheSpa]

"And when they millions"?

The truth is already clear. CBS doesn't use the NCAA Tournament as a vehicle to drive up interest in regular season games. CBS does use regular season games to drive up interest for the NCAA Tournament. CBS paid $10.8 billion for the rights to broadcast the NCAA Tournament. CBS's current regular season deals for coverage of SEC, Big 10 and Big East games is not even a billion ($951 million).

CBS does use the tournament to promote the regular season, and vice versa. They care about both, regardless of what you and Scott foolishly believe.

 

[IU Scott]

CBS does use the tournament to promote the regular season, and vice versa. They care about both, regardless of what you and Scott foolishly believe.

I never said that they did not care about the regular season but it does promote the tournament all year which is all right with me. With the difference in what they pay for the season compared to the tournament it shows what they feel is more important.