My experience with Covid-19 in Mexico

DrHoops

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My contributions to discussions here dwarf yours and always have if for no other reason than I bring objective thought and bigger picture perspective. You are a shallow and narrow parrot and one that uses terms he doesn't understand to boot.

It isn't difficult to look up the term Sparky.

Hope this helps

I don't think many people agree with you on that, but it's cool that you have some false sense of confidence. You da man! ;)
 

DrHoops

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That's how it is in most successful countries. Plus over here you are scanned (for contact tracing) -- with your ID and get your temp taken whenever you enter a supermarket, pet store or bank etc. The shopekeepers cant sell you things or you cant enter a shop unless you have a mask. In fact you cant leave the house without a mask -- I think there's a $200 fine. Been like this since Feb or early March.

If you are visiting Singapore, or if I travel and return, I will need to be wearing a GPS bracelet for yout 14-day quarantine period.

https://www.straitstimes.com/singap...s-to-singapore-on-stay-home-notice-outside-of

Common sense. Something the Republican Party knows nothing about.
 

DrHoops

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The problem is the Trump Admin. They have turned this into a political issue. I actually had a slim hope that this MIGHT bring the country together, given that a virus shouldn't be a partisan issue. Trump ruined that from day one and at this point it's still way too late. We're 18th in the world in testing and the countries we've passed have done such a good job controlling the virus that they simply don't need to test as much anymore. No wonder no one in the world will let Americans into their countries. It's embarrassing.

This is a great personal experience and I have had two similar ones on recent trips in the United States (one to a small lake in Indiana and the other on a family trip to the beaches in NC). I am confident that there are pockets of disciplined behavior as well as “storm the gates” behavior around the world (i.e. look at the pictures in London when they opened the bars back up).

What is interesting is Mexico is considered a global hot spot, so despite the efforts they don’t seem to be in control and health officials recognize that they have very limited testing capacity and the real numbers are likely worse than even the trends reported.

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus/country/mexico

The unfortunate is this thing is difficult to control because it is difficult to control human behavior. What seems reasonable to some appears unreasonable to others. I’m taking precautions myself, but I’m also not sitting in a closed up home waiting for it to pass. I do believe in the United States that litigation concerns are driving more of the behavior than actual safety concerns ... and that comment is not to say that there are not safety concerns so do not misinterpret, but unfortunately we have established a heavy litigation society and this will be felt for years to come ... I just hope we can continue to develop the best science/care so we can all move forward on this rock.
 

DrHoops

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Its just crazy watching it from afar. Things are working out elsewhere ... and yet there are a million excuses for not doing the right thing within the States.
Makes no sense.

There is ZERO excuse for the wealthiest country in the world...with only 4% of the population having 25% of the cases. It's obscene. Just look at this idiot. He is in charge and he doesn't even understand his OWN charts:


Jonathan Swan's head looks like it's going to explode listening to Trump's stupidity.
 
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sglowrider

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There is ZERO excuse for the wealthiest country in the world...with only 4% of the population having 25% of the cases. It's obscene. Just look at this idiot. He is in charge and he doesn't even understand his OWN charts:



Jonathan Swan's head looks like it's going to explode listening to Trump's stupidity.

The scary thing is that there just doesn't seem to be a plan never mind an end game.
 
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sglowrider

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There is ZERO excuse for the wealthiest country in the world...with only 4% of the population having 25% of the cases. It's obscene. Just look at this idiot. He is in charge and he doesn't even understand his OWN charts:



Jonathan Swan's head looks like it's going to explode listening to Trump's stupidity.

swan.jpeg
 
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IUAPEX

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The problem is the Trump Admin. They have turned this into a political issue. I actually had a slim hope that this MIGHT bring the country together, given that a virus shouldn't be a partisan issue. Trump ruined that from day one and at this point it's still way too late. We're 18th in the world in testing and the countries we've passed have done such a good job controlling the virus that they simply don't need to test as much anymore. No wonder no one in the world will let Americans into their countries. It's embarrassing.

I’m not a Trump fan ... but I am also confident that regardless of who was at the helm we would still be experiencing polarizing politics and the actual COVID results would be similar as local and state governments would have continued to have the most influence.

our country has created an argumentative position rather than one of collaboration and we have ourselves to blame for it. I sure would like to see politicians like Bayh and Lugar back in office.
 

Courtsensetwo

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tbf Jonathan's probably getting his WH credentials pulled soon. And will never have another question answered by the Orange Bonehead ever again.

What surprised even me was Trump fumbling through those 8 x 11 charts that he clearly had no idea the content of.

"Look at this bar chart...I have no idea what it means but look t the pretty colors"
 
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bawlmer

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I’m not a Trump fan ... but I am also confident that regardless of who was at the helm we would still be experiencing polarizing politics and the actual COVID results would be similar as local and state governments would have continued to have the most influence.

our country has created an argumentative position rather than one of collaboration and we have ourselves to blame for it. I sure would like to see politicians like Bayh and Lugar back in office.

Disagree. The appropriate response here was consistent, informed federal leadership. The CDC was supposed to be the US ace-in-the-hole. They failed miserably in many ways, but most notably leaving the country without working tests for a month as the virus was starting to spread.

States should not have had to compete with each other for PPE and tests. That was tragically foolish.

The White House developed decent reopening guidelines, then the President undermined them with LIBERATE tweets and encouraged reopening despite states not meeting the gating criteria in the WH guidelines.

Diagnostic companies developed a steady stream of tests that with proper planning and oversight could have been utilized to develop a smart test-and-trace strategy to manage through reopening the economy. Instead everyone demands tests, the labs are working beyond capacity. So we're paying billions for tests results that are useless because they're out-of-date by the time they're received.

There's no question at all we would be better off against COVID and economically with better federal leadership.
 

IUAPEX

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Disagree. The appropriate response here was consistent, informed federal leadership. The CDC was supposed to be the US ace-in-the-hole. They failed miserably in many ways, but most notably leaving the country without working tests for a month as the virus was starting to spread.

States should not have had to compete with each other for PPE and tests. That was tragically foolish.

The White House developed decent reopening guidelines, then the President undermined them with LIBERATE tweets and encouraged reopening despite states not meeting the gating criteria in the WH guidelines.

Diagnostic companies developed a steady stream of tests that with proper planning and oversight could have been utilized to develop a smart test-and-trace strategy to manage through reopening the economy. Instead everyone demands tests, the labs are working beyond capacity. So we're paying billions for tests results that are useless because they're out-of-date by the time they're received.

There's no question at all we would be better off against COVID and economically with better federal leadership.

Fair enough ... but I think “there is no question” has a bit of bias in it. Here are the questions I have:

1. Would we have been more prepared in advance with supplies (I doubt it).

2. Would we have been able to allocate more efficiently without political haggling (I doubt it)

3. I agree the communication around it would have been more consistent, but still not convinced that Americans behavior would have been drastically different (you think it was hard to impose rule ... just think of the red states responses to Hillary).

4. I also agree we could have had a more organized approach with PPE/Test distribution, but not sure that was our issue as compared to controlling behavior. Although contact tracing would certainly have helped if we could impose control.

5. Testing could also have been better on the front end which may have instilled more “fear” and Americans can sometimes self manage from the fear aspect. We spent a lot of time in the early days without testing and wondering if it was “legit” or not ... spoiler it was legit.

I hear your points ... I’m just of the opinion that it would not be as dramatically different as you assume and think there certainly could be a “question” as to how much we would have thwarted the economic impact had Trump not been in office. My guess is the stimulus discussions would have been vastly different.
 
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bawlmer

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Fair enough ... but I think “there is no question” has a bit of bias in it. Here are the questions I have:

1. Would we have been more prepared in advance with supplies (I doubt it).

2. Would we have been able to allocate more efficiently without political haggling (I doubt it)

3. I agree the communication around it would have been more consistent, but still not convinced that Americans behavior would have been drastically different (you think it was hard to impose rule ... just think of the red states responses to Hillary).

4. I also agree we could have had a more organized approach with PPE/Test distribution, but not sure that was our issue as compared to controlling behavior. Although contact tracing would certainly have helped if we could impose control.

5. Testing could also have been better on the front end which may have instilled more “fear” and Americans can sometimes self manage from the fear aspect. We spent a lot of time in the early days without testing and wondering if it was “legit” or not ... spoiler it was legit.

I hear your points ... I’m just of the opinion that it would not be as dramatically different as you assume and think there certainly could be a “question” as to how much we would have thwarted the economic impact had Trump not been in office. My guess is the stimulus discussions would have been vastly different.

Lots of variables at play, especially political distrust around shutdowns. But a GOP White House, particularly this WH, had the odds in its favor to influence the mask resistors for the public good. They not only didn't consistently try, they frequently egged-on the resistance.

The goal initially was to avoid shutdowns, certainly a nationwide shutdown (South Korea succeeded here). The failure of our initial response started the dominoes falling. A highly-functioning CDC would have given us our best shot out of the gate.

You're right the supply shortages were years in the making. But the solution cried for a federal effort that never came.

Probably the greatest and most easily avoided failure was not following a plan such as was developed by the White House to minimize, then respond and control inevitable outbreaks.

I did post here and elsewhere early on that it would be counter-productive to attack the Administration because it would only lead to more erratic behavior. But in Trump's own words, "it is what it is."
 
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outside shooter

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I’m not a Trump fan ... but I am also confident that regardless of who was at the helm we would still be experiencing polarizing politics and the actual COVID results would be similar as local and state governments would have continued to have the most influence.

our country has created an argumentative position rather than one of collaboration and we have ourselves to blame for it. I sure would like to see politicians like Bayh and Lugar back in office.

I find it hard to reconcile your two paragraphs. I agree wholeheartedly with the second. I worked on Lugar's campaigns. I was a diehard supporter and he was a great man. If he were president, he would not be ignoring the science and he damn sure wouldn't be spouting 20,000+ lies. Character matters. Leadership matters.

Sure we are a stubborn country, but there are other stubborn countries. None except for Brazil and perhaps India have botched this pandemic so badly. India I can attribute to poverty and poor health care.

For Brazil & the USA it comes down to grossly incompetent leadership and willfully bad decision-making by those leaders. The bad decisions are too many to list, but for one, we know that Trump & his advisors decided early on that this epidemic would be only a "blue state problem" and so letting it bloom would offer the political benefit of laying all of the blame on Democratic governors. Would Lugar have done that? McCain? Bayh? Either Clinton? Either Bush? Reagan? Romney? Hell, even PENCE? No way...
 
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IUAPEX

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I find it hard to reconcile your two paragraphs. I agree wholeheartedly with the second. I worked on Lugar's campaigns. I was a diehard supporter and he was a great man. If he were president, he would not be ignoring the science and he damn sure wouldn't be spouting 20,000+ lies. Character matters. Leadership matters.

Sure we are a stubborn country, but there are other stubborn countries. None except for Brazil and perhaps India have botched this pandemic so badly. India I can attribute to poverty and poor health care.

For Brazil & the USA it comes down to grossly incompetent leadership and willfully bad decision-making by those leaders. The bad decisions are too many to list, but for one, we know that Trump & his advisors decided early on that this epidemic would be only a "blue state problem" and so letting it bloom would offer the political benefit of laying all of the blame on Democratic governors. Would Lugar have done that? McCain? Bayh? Either Clinton? Either Bush? Reagan? Romney? Hell, even PENCE? No way...

I recognize the validity of your point, my initial paragraph was simply to state that I think the polarization in our country would remain regardless and would unfortunately curtail a reasoned approach that all of us would have desired. I’m just skeptical on how our country works together politically anymore ... and it continues to deteriorate.

The states and local governments still have the highest ability to influence behaviors and thus effect the spread.

My skepticism is on high alert with our political landscape and if Hillary had been in office there would have been different political
haggling but it would have existed and thwarted desires outcomes.
 

bigmac76

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I can’t tell you how many people I see that say the virus will be over after the election. The stupidity.
My Dentist...an IU Grad told me the same $hit story the other day "Biden will get elected and the C19 will be gone in less than a week"....WTH...should consider a new dentist??
 
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sglowrider

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I think it has like 95% accuracy which would make it the level of a ''good'' antibodies test kit. As any healthcare official would say ''but that means you have at least 5% false positives.''

Therefore its best used for surveyance purpose to figure out the spread for future localised lockdowns.

https://www.thejakartapost.com/news...als-super-quick-saliva-test-for-covid-19.html

The company said they are in the process of getting regulatory approval. Each test costs less than 25 cents and it expects the device will eventually cost less than $200.
 
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NPT

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I have spent the last 17 days/18 nights in Tulum, Mexico (I recommend a Jr. Suite at The Beach. Amazing hotel). I was amazed at how much more seriously the Mexican people and local government treat this virus vs our idiotic government.

First, you you have to fill out an online form before you leave detailing your contacts with anyone having Covid-19. That’s before you even leave to fly there. Secondly, they take your temperature on arrival at Immigration. Everyone has a mask on. You cannot get into ANY restaurant (which are all open air, by the way. Nothing enclosed at all) without having your temperature checked. Even a little outdoor taco stand/bar took my temperature before I could belly up. You are not allowed in public without a mask. No walking down the street without a mask. The police drive down the road every hour or so announcing that everyone is to wear a mask. Even the drug dealers who are lingering around are wearing masks. Before you leave, you fill out a similar online questionnaire about your contacts in Mexico.

So, on my return through Immigration in the US, I went through Global Entry, no one took my temperature, no questions asked. Nothing. Yet, even though the United States has 1/4 of Covid-19 cases globally, they have the gall to exclude Mexicans from traveling to the US! It’s shocking, actually.

The coup de grâs though, was jumping in the cab to get home. I was wearing my mask, but the driver wasn’t. He immediately said Covid-19 is a hoax and he refuses to wear a mask. Then he said 500,000 people die of the flu in the US every year. He was only off by about 99%. I can just imagine the guy listening to right wing radio all day long.

Great to be back in the wealthiest and most advanced country in the world. What a joke.
Sounds like the wall is a good idea after all, it will keep US citizens from rushing to Mexico.:eek:
 

Zizkov

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Its just crazy watching it from afar. Things are working out elsewhere ... and yet there are a million excuses for not doing the right thing within the States. Its really not that complex.
It just makes no sense.
I couldn't agree more, it is crazy to watch from afar. What needs to be done to get it under control is well known and not complicated or difficult, but somehow still out of reach for the US.

It's probably more difficult now because the US wasted the initial lockdown arguing about it. Now doing all that needs to be done is going to come at a much higher cost.
 

outside shooter

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I think it has like 95% accuracy which would make it the level of a ''good'' antibodies test kit.

If it's cheap, you take it twice, like an A sample and a B sample in a drug test.

Then 0.05 error becomes (0.05)^2 = 0.0025 error = 99.75% accurate, when you get the same result.