Labor shortage

DANC

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There's been a labor shortage for shit service jobs since way before the pandemic.

One of the arguments against Andrew Yang's automation take over was the fact that there was a massive labor shortage and automation is needed to do shit, burger flipping jobs.

My suspicion from a 50 year old retiree is there's new online markets the youth is extremely interested in that I have no clue about (crypto, nft, tic tok, fortnight, second life, etc) along with the stigma that working fast food is loser work.

I also suspect that the more we tighten immigration, we're going to discover that illegal immigrants play a huge role in our economy.

As far as unemployment benefits, it's simply job insurance for everyone including you. It fills up during the good years and helps transition during the bad years.

As people are finding out, the older you get the less desirable you become (you're at the peak of salary, you've leveled off from a climber to a sustainer, you have less future years to offer but still have to be trained and indoctrinated into the company culture, etc).

Anyway, since the job insurance program has started we haven't had an economic depression or any kind of extended unemployment crises.
No, we've just passed the bill to our grandchildren, great-grandchildren, and probably more descendants.
 
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IUCrazy2

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There's been a labor shortage for shit service jobs since way before the pandemic.

One of the arguments against Andrew Yang's automation take over was the fact that there was a massive labor shortage and automation is needed to do shit, burger flipping jobs.

My suspicion from a 50 year old retiree is there's new online markets the youth is extremely interested in that I have no clue about (crypto, nft, tic tok, fortnight, second life, etc) along with the stigma that working fast food is loser work.

I also suspect that the more we tighten immigration, we're going to discover that illegal immigrants play a huge role in our economy.

As far as unemployment benefits, it's simply job insurance for everyone including you. It fills up during the good years and helps transition during the bad years.

As people are finding out, the older you get the less desirable you become (you're at the peak of salary, you've leveled off from a climber to a sustainer, you have less future years to offer but still have to be trained and indoctrinated into the company culture, etc).

Anyway, since the job insurance program has started we haven't had an economic depression or any kind of extended unemployment crises.
To the first part of your argument, maybe there is some secret Tik Tok economy where all the teens and twenty somethings are able to replace traditional jobs. I think that is absolutely true for some people...but I highly doubt it is replacing jobs for millions. Additionally, we were told that people needed fair pay for these "shit jobs" and I can tell you that the pay being offered in my area is close to or over double the minimum wage in many instances. So it is apparently the jobs that people object to as opposed to the pay. So at that point the answer should be, great, you think you are too good for those jobs...that is all good. But they are available so you don't get to sit at home on someone else's dime until you can find that $80k a year job for a person with next to no skills.

I am not arguing against unemployment benefits. I am arguing against unnecessary unemployment benefits being collected because people are "too good" to work.

And before you bring it up, my first job was washing dishes.
 
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hoot1

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Back in 2016 Pew did a study about what Americans thought of their jobs.

In part the study concluded the following,

About half (51%) of employed Americans say they get a sense of identity from their job, while the other half (47%) say their job is just what they do for a living.

Given that almost half of the working Americans just work because they have to make a living, we shouldn't be surprised that a good many Americans are willing to remain on the dole while it lasts.
 

TommyCracker

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No, we've just passed the bill to our grandchildren, great-grandchildren, and probably more descendants.
You've been a champion of fiscal frugality on here from day one.

'Conservative fiduciary responsibility' has been a joke since Ronald won in 1980.

Interesting and predictable that fable is being thrown around again.

Hope your grandchildren are learning Chinese since your republican leaders have put us massively in debt, or was that massive spike in our deficit leading to getting deeper in debt during Trump's reign some kind of investment that's going to pay it all back?

No, it was just a massive cut of our tax base for optics with absolutely no idea or care about how to replace it.

Yeah, dumbass 'Cut and Spend' fiscal policy. Makes sense.

Your great grandchildren would like to tell you Xiexie Ni.
 
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TommyCracker

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To the first part of your argument, maybe there is some secret Tik Tok economy where all the teens and twenty somethings are able to replace traditional jobs. I think that is absolutely true for some people...but I highly doubt it is replacing jobs for millions. Additionally, we were told that people needed fair pay for these "shit jobs" and I can tell you that the pay being offered in my area is close to or over double the minimum wage in many instances. So it is apparently the jobs that people object to as opposed to the pay. So at that point the answer should be, great, you think you are too good for those jobs...that is all good. But they are available so you don't get to sit at home on someone else's dime until you can find that $80k a year job for a person with next to no skills.

I am not arguing against unemployment benefits. I am arguing against unnecessary unemployment benefits being collected because people are "too good" to work.

And before you bring it up, my first job was washing dishes.

Every generation is lazy as f to older generations.

I started working in 5th with a paper route, detassled corn one summer, organized files at the local hospital, worked at Pizza Hut, then Target during college unloading trucks in the morning.

Compared to my grandfather who grew up during the depression I was a complete dead ass lazy pussy that had no respect for hard work.
 

DANC

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You've been a champion of fiscal frugality on here from day one.

'Conservative fiduciary responsibility' has been a joke since Ronald won in 1980.

Interesting and predictable that fable is being thrown around again.

Hope your grandchildren are learning Chinese since your republican leaders have put us massively in debt, or was that massive spike in our deficit leading to getting deeper in debt during Trump's reign some kind of investment that's going to pay it all back?

No, it was just a massive cut of our tax base for optics with absolutely no idea or care about how to replace it.

Yeah, dumbass 'Cut and Spend' fiscal policy. Makes sense.

Your great grandchildren would like to tell you Xiexie Ni.
"China is going to eat our lunch? Come on, man,”


You dims are in charge now - fix it!
 

DANC

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Every generation is lazy as f to older generations.

I started working in 5th with a paper route, detassled corn one summer, organized files at the local hospital, worked at Pizza Hut, then Target during college unloading trucks in the morning.

Compared to my grandfather who grew up during the depression I was a complete dead ass lazy pussy that had no respect for hard work.
Your grandfather sounds like a real sweetheart.
 

Bulk VanderHuge

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Your grandfather sounds like a real sweetheart.
Learn to read, dumbass. He didn't say his grandfather said that. TC said it about himself, in comparison to his grandfather's life
You are literally the stupidest, most bitter poster on this board. Go find a pile of sand and a hammer, and pound that sand right up your ass...if you can locate it.
 

Bulk VanderHuge

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Sure as hell beats being a plastic butter knife like you. Actually you are more like a plastic spork
8c22bbee22b80d2faa273fb9167662b5.gif
 
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Stuffshot

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As someone just shy of 50 who will be in the job hunt soon, this terrifies me. I think it’s a real thing and it is part of the reason I’m being proactive and moving before I hit the big 50.
Yes, it's a real thing faced by 50+ people. Good luck.

I think the reason is purely economic in that employers seem to think an older worker is too expensive, having accumulated a lot of small wage increases over the years. To make it worse, employers seem entirely unwilling to ask an older worker to take a pay cut or a lower paying reassignment in order to keep a job. Instead, they move quickly to the nuclear option of termination.

There is just no reason to think employers have determined that younger workers (say, 25-year-olds) are inherently better, more loyal, more productive workers, which would give them an innocent, justifiable reason to fire older workers. There are too many accounts of younger workers refusing to work overtime or Saturdays, skipping job interviews, not showing up for the first day after accepting a job offer or resigning after just a few weeks in a new job without even having another job to move into.

Also, when you begin your job search, be prepared for employers who have no intention of hiring from your age group but still have you come in for a job interview so they can say they interviewed someone in your age group. Symptoms of this include posting job criteria that end up not matching the questioning that arises during the job interview. Another example is posting job criteria with qualifications or experience that you don't have, but they still have you come in for an interview anyway and then basically make you admit you don't have the experience they claim they're looking for (which they already knew).

Employers have become expert in disguising their age discrimination. Again, good luck.
 

Stuffshot

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But you don't sharpen your own? As an aside, a chainsaw is a top 5 purchase in my lifetime. I even enjoy helping neighbors/family cut up shit. I'M IMPORTANT
Blowing up stumps would also be fun. Do you have any interest to learn that one, too?
 
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Cortez88

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Yes, it's a real thing faced by 50+ people. Good luck.

I think the reason is purely economic in that employers seem to think an older worker is too expensive, having accumulated a lot of small wage increases over the years. To make it worse, employers seem entirely unwilling to ask an older worker to take a pay cut or a lower paying reassignment in order to keep a job. Instead, they move quickly to the nuclear option of termination.

There is just no reason to think employers have determined that younger workers (say, 25-year-olds) are inherently better, more loyal, more productive workers, which would give them an innocent, justifiable reason to fire older workers. There are too many accounts of younger workers refusing to work overtime or Saturdays, skipping job interviews, not showing up for the first day after accepting a job offer or resigning after just a few weeks in a new job without even having another job to move into.

Also, when you begin your job search, be prepared for employers who have no intention of hiring from your age group but still have you come in for a job interview so they can say they interviewed someone in your age group. Symptoms of this include posting job criteria that end up not matching the questioning that arises during the job interview. Another example is posting job criteria with qualifications or experience that you don't have, but they still have you come in for an interview anyway and then basically make you admit you don't have the experience they claim they're looking for (which they already knew).

Employers have become expert in disguising their age discrimination. Again, good luck.
Aren’t you just a ray of sunshine. Damn.
 

JamieDimonsBalls

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Back in 2016 Pew did a study about what Americans thought of their jobs.

In part the study concluded the following,

About half (51%) of employed Americans say they get a sense of identity from their job, while the other half (47%) say their job is just what they do for a living.

Given that almost half of the working Americans just work because they have to make a living, we shouldn't be surprised that a good many Americans are willing to remain on the dole while it lasts.

meh I’m not so sure that’s proper equivalence. It’s good for some people not to have their profession define their identity. But, even if it doesn’t, you can still work.
 

TheOriginalHappyGoat

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I think most of the anger at that point should be directed at those who are borrowing trillions of dollars in the credit of our children and grandchildren so that people can sit at home when there is clearly work available literally everywhere. That being said, yeah, we should be angry at people who are capable of working but won't.

Bunch of entitled assholes, "well that job does not pay enough", well, in a just world it would pay more than the zero that your lazy ass should be receiving to sit at home. There is a time and place for welfare, this ain't it.

Twenty's original post says that BW3 is offering above what all the lefties have been saying is a "fair" minimum wage by a few dollars an hour. And people are turning it down...not because the wage is not good at that point, but because the extra $80 a week is not worth it to get off their lazy ass. Why go to all that trouble to go earn your money when a little scrimping here and there can let you be at home all day?

It would be one thing if we were in the middle of a depression and work was hard to come by, but you cannot go out these days without tripping on a help wanted sign. And last I checked we had 11 million people collecting unemployment. That is not hard times, it is lazy, mooching, dickheads.
As has already been demonstrated numerous times, this is just a myth. Very few people are doing better with unemployment than they would with a job. The average person on unemployment in America is pulling in $125/week in benefits, and that includes the 40% or so who are getting extra benefits from Covid.

There may be some specific cases where sitting at home is better. I knew someone who was an assistant manager at a local restaurant who got furloughed last summer, and for a couple of months, her Indiana benefits plus the Covid extras added up to almost exactly what her paycheck would have been. So that kind of thing does happen. But it's clearly not the norm. The numbers prove that.

The reason there are so many unfilled positions is that there is a tremendous labor shortage. Cancel all unemployment benefits nationwide tomorrow, and that will still be the case.
 

larsIU

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Blowing up stumps would also be fun. Do you have any interest to learn that one, too?
I used to work at a landscaping company in college and the owner, when he was pissed or drunk or both, would take a Bobcat and “gnaw” on a stump for a while. Always said it made him feel better. I can see why.
 
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JamieDimonsBalls

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As has already been demonstrated numerous times, this is just a myth. Very few people are doing better with unemployment than they would with a job. The average person on unemployment in America is pulling in $125/week in benefits, and that includes the 40% or so who are getting extra benefits from Covid.

There may be some specific cases where sitting at home is better. I knew someone who was an assistant manager at a local restaurant who got furloughed last summer, and for a couple of months, her Indiana benefits plus the Covid extras added up to almost exactly what her paycheck would have been. So that kind of thing does happen. But it's clearly not the norm. The numbers prove that.

The reason there are so many unfilled positions is that there is a tremendous labor shortage. Cancel all unemployment benefits nationwide tomorrow, and that will still be the case.

Not sure where you get $125/week from, but your argument is logical to me. Per the data below, the average Weekly Benefit nationwide is $318/week.

D7kDkHb.png


That being said, we continuously hear from the small business community, recruiters/staffing firms, etc. that people were telling them directly upon outreach that they prefer not to work until the stimulus ends. Logically, there is no way that even an extra $600 or $1000 really changes the math for someone (average UE benefit moves from $15.3K to $22.5K annualized).

For someone making $12/hour, the breakeven point is close ~25.5 hours/week excluding the benefit and ~37.5 hours/week including an extra $600. Right now, overtime would seem rather plausible, for those that were interested.
 

TheOriginalHappyGoat

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Not sure where you get $125/week from, but your argument is logical to me. Per the data below, the average Weekly Benefit nationwide is $318/week.

D7kDkHb.png


That being said, we continuously hear from the small business community, recruiters/staffing firms, etc. that people were telling them directly upon outreach that they prefer not to work until the stimulus ends. Logically, there is no way that even an extra $600 or $1000 really changes the math for someone (average UE benefit moves from $15.3K to $22.5K annualized).

For someone making $12/hour, the breakeven point is close ~25.5 hours/week excluding the benefit and ~37.5 hours/week including an extra $600. Right now, overtime would seem rather plausible, for those that were interested.
Hmm, I posted it in another thread, and it was based on the total benefits paid divided by the number of people getting benefits. The numbers you provide may be figured differently than how I did it (back of the napkin method). Either way, there simply isn't enough money being paid out to make it worthwhile to avoid work for most of those people. It could also have been a different time period used.

Of course, as I said before, I still support ending the extended benefits. Even if it only helps a little, we need every bit of help we can get.
 

BCCHoosier

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There's been a labor shortage for shit service jobs since way before the pandemic.

One of the arguments against Andrew Yang's automation take over was the fact that there was a massive labor shortage and automation is needed to do shit, burger flipping jobs.

My suspicion from a 50 year old retiree is there's new online markets the youth is extremely interested in that I have no clue about (crypto, nft, tic tok, fortnight, second life, etc) along with the stigma that working fast food is loser work.

I also suspect that the more we tighten immigration, we're going to discover that illegal immigrants play a huge role in our economy.

As far as unemployment benefits, it's simply job insurance for everyone including you. It fills up during the good years and helps transition during the bad years.

As people are finding out, the older you get the less desirable you become (you're at the peak of salary, you've leveled off from a climber to a sustainer, you have less future years to offer but still have to be trained and indoctrinated into the company culture, etc).

Anyway, since the job insurance program has started we haven't had an economic depression or any kind of extended unemployment crises.
Agree on the immigrant part. Between immigrants being amongst the hardest working people I know and the fact they also tend to have more kids (lack of births becoming a problem) simply shutting down the border is no easy solution. It will create other issues.

Good luck finding enough roofers, drywallers, or landscapers without immigrants. They arrive early and work late. Their work ethic exceeds most US citizens.
 

stollcpa

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Agree on the immigrant part. Between immigrants being amongst the hardest working people I know and the fact they also tend to have more kids (lack of births becoming a problem) simply shutting down the border is no easy solution. It will create other issues.

Good luck finding enough roofers, drywallers, or landscapers without immigrants. They arrive early and work late. Their work ethic exceeds most US citizens.
It’s not hard to understand where lack of work ethic coming from. It’s only going to get worse. Keep printing “free money”. That will fix everything. Pay a few trillion in reparations. That will help too. And don’t forget something for the hundreds of genders that are being discriminated against.
 
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BCCHoosier

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It’s not hard to understand where lack of work ethic coming from. It’s only going to get worse. Keep printing “free money”. That will fix everything. Pay a few trillion in reparations. That will help too. And don’t forget something for the hundreds of genders that are being discriminated against.
It is deeper than that and you know it. All of "us" need to look in the mirror on how we are raising kids. Technology has made things too easy/too comfortable starting at a young age.
 
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mcmurtry66

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It’s not hard to understand where lack of work ethic coming from. It’s only going to get worse. Keep printing “free money”. That will fix everything. Pay a few trillion in reparations. That will help too. And don’t forget something for the hundreds of genders that are being discriminated against.
i'm with ya stoll but it's a new world order. The English have found easier ways. two examples: my stoker's best friend's 21 yr old bro made 90k last year between his youtube channel and playing call of duty. still lives at home. bought himself an M3 at the end of the year. my stoker works 15 hours a week doing property management for two super loaded families. she made over $30k last year re-selling boxes they threw out and some clothes. took at best two hours a week. i think that paid more than the actual job for 15 hours a week. she told the wives they should do an online store together but they had no interest. new season new clothes and they didn't want to bother with the hassle. who knew there was a whole world out there willing to pay premium prices just for luxury clothes' boxes.

as tommy said above my grandfather too was a product of the depression. he was solidly middle class but drove a chevette (worst looking car i've ever seen) and took a single roll of HI Ho's in his briefcase for lunch everyday. he'd roll over in his grave if he could see me every morning pissing money away at starbucks.

kids today don't want to work at six flags in the heat or pizza hut in the grease. they'd rather make dough from home and more and more are pretty damn creative about it
 
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Crayfish57

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i'm with ya stoll but it's a new world order. The English have found easier ways. two examples: my stoker's best friend's 21 yr old bro made 90k last year between his youtube channel and playing call of duty. still lives at home. bought himself an M3 at the end of the year. my stoker works 15 hours a week doing property management for two super loaded families. she made over $30k last year re-selling boxes they threw out and some clothes. took at best two hours a week. she told the wives they should do an online store together but they had no interest. new season new clothes and they didn't want to bother with the hassle.

as tommy said above my grandfather too was a product of the depression. he was solidly middle class but drove a chevette (worst looking car i've ever seen) and too a single roll of HI Ho's in his briefcase for lunch everyday. he'd roll over in his grave if he could see me every morning pissing money away at starbucks
I learned to drive in a Chevette, nasty cars but I think gremlins were worse and Pinto's right there and more flammable. Ho Ho's? I think I knew someone that would argue if you only had one it was just a Ho vs HoHO a 2 pack and he wasnt trying to be funny about ho's LOL. I have to ask what a stoker is?
 

Bulk VanderHuge

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I learned to drive in a Chevette, nasty cars but I think gremlins were worse and Pinto's right there and more flammable. Ho Ho's? I think I knew someone that would argue if you only had one it was just a Ho vs HoHO a 2 pack and he wasnt trying to be funny about ho's LOL. I have to ask what a stoker is?
A stoke is the totally annoying term COH incessantly refers to his wife by, and now mcm666 has adopted it in homage. Please do not join the club.
 

mcmurtry66

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I learned to drive in a Chevette, nasty cars but I think gremlins were worse and Pinto's right there and more flammable. Ho Ho's? I think I knew someone that would argue if you only had one it was just a Ho vs HoHO a 2 pack and he wasnt trying to be funny about ho's LOL. I have to ask what a stoker is?
oh for sure re gremlins and pintos. he traded in his old karman ghia for a chevette and would brag about it's roominess. bought my grandmother a K car and bragged about it for a year. the people of the depression carried it with them their entire lives
 

Crayfish57

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oh for sure re gremlins and pintos. he traded in his old karman ghia for a chevette and would brag about it's roominess. bought my grandmother a K car and bragged about it for a year. the people of the depression carried it with them their entire lives
My grandparents did for sure, inherited my Gpa's 1970 Chevy pickup for first car, seat was broke through and had to sit on a board. Depressions will do that whether its a large one or just your own . I know I spend a lot different than I did at one time after not having a choice.
 

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