International students

[Marvin the Martian]

International students are being told if their university goes online only, they must leave. That is potentially tens (hundreds) of millions of dollars sucked right out of the US economy because foreigners = bad.


https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/im...IQv_ZiDP2cIzjYl2Rm_jCB63S-CxUiSl8A5fQV1ybt4Kk

 

[mcmurtry66]

International students are being told if their university goes online only, they must leave. That is potentially tens (hundreds) of millions of dollars sucked right out of the US economy because foreigners = bad.


https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/im...IQv_ZiDP2cIzjYl2Rm_jCB63S-CxUiSl8A5fQV1ybt4Kk

Not to mention the financial impact on universities. Those kids usually pay full freight.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

This is structural racism. We aren’t educating millions of black students so that they can attend these universities, so the answer has been use foreign students to receive US education. It might take years, and some universities might fold, but we need to figure out how to fill those seats with our own youngsters.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

This is structural racism. We aren’t educating millions of black students so that they can attend these universities, so the answer has been use foreign students to receive US education. It might take years, and some universities might fold, but we need to figure out how to fill those seats with our own youngsters.

I would love for more Black and Latino students to go to college, but is not the usual debate that 4 year college is not for everyone? We do not produce nearly enough STEM graduates inside our population as is. A HUGE part of that is that Americans do not like those difficult degrees. They would rather do something that pays more (business) or is easy (law).

If you are still reading, that was a joke for our over abundance of lawyers here using Gladwell's point that in places like Harvard kids that wash out of STEM move to law.

 

[hoosboot]

This is structural racism. We aren’t educating millions of black students so that they can attend these universities, so the answer has been use foreign students to receive US education. It might take years, and some universities might fold, but we need to figure out how to fill those seats with our own youngsters.

Yeah, that's why this decision was made...concern over structural racism. Totally.

 

[UncleMark]

Tangential to the topic, Rutgers announced today that they will be online only for the first semester. The big question is how that will effect football.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

A HUGE part of that is that Americans do not like those difficult degrees.

Agreed. I think meaningful K-12 reform can address this.

 

[CO. Hoosier]

Yeah, that's why this decision was made...concern over structural racism. Totally.

You are probably correct. However, Trump believes immigration reform helps black employment, so I wouldn’t rule out a similar attitude about education.

 

[sglowrider]

And there's always a tweet....

 

[Marvin the Martian]

And there's always a tweet....

View embedded media

That sounds like his 2015 tweet that the confederate flag had run its course and needed left in museums. But no, racists like Miller are not having an impact.

 

[IUCrazy2]

No, what is happening is that white collar workers are getting wise to what happened to the blue collar jobs in this country and they have started making noise about it.

Like all the tech conglomerates, in the middle of a huge spike in unemployment, saying that they need more foreign (read cheap) labor to fill their positions. The corporations don't support all the international students and the foreign labor out of largesse and they are not always doing it because U.S. labor is not available, they are doing it to start pushing the price for labor down like what has happened to factories. They will start offshoring more as soon as they can as well.

Trump, Trump, Trump...he is a this and a that and blah, blah, blah. ivegotwinners at least has one thing pegged although I do not normally agree with him on the cure, but we have a uniparty when it comes to economics and the reason that Trump and Bernie (before the Democrats caved to elect Biden) have done so well lately, despite their flaws, is because they have actually addressed some of those issues.

The Never Trump wing of the Republican Party better figure some stuff out for after Trump is gone because their Supreme Court has failed to deliver big time with John Roberts and it is clear they have no stomach for the culture stuff they always run on. I for one am not on board with getting ass raped by corporations anymore because of some idea about a rising tide. The tech companies actively sensor our content and the corporations have put their thumb down on the social scales opposite of how I think.

The Uniparty running this country better figure stuff the hell out because they are going to get gobbled up by increasingly hostile and aggressive movements from both the left and right.

 

[Cortez88]

No, what is happening is that white collar workers are getting wise to what happened to the blue collar jobs in this country and they have started making noise about it.

Like all the tech conglomerates, in the middle of a huge spike in unemployment, saying that they need more foreign (read cheap) labor to fill their positions. The corporations don't support all the international students and the foreign labor out of largesse and they are not always doing it because U.S. labor is not available, they are doing it to start pushing the price for labor down like what has happened to factories. They will start offshoring more as soon as they can as well.

Trump, Trump, Trump...he is a this and a that and blah, blah, blah. ivegotwinners at least has one thing pegged although I do not normally agree with him on the cure, but we have a uniparty when it comes to economics and the reason that Trump and Bernie (before the Democrats caved to elect Biden) have done so well lately, despite their flaws, is because they have actually addressed some of those issues.

The Never Trump wing of the Republican Party better figure some stuff out for after Trump is gone because their Supreme Court has failed to deliver big time with John Roberts and it is clear they have no stomach for the culture stuff they always run on. I for one am not on board with getting ass raped by corporations anymore because of some idea about a rising tide. The tech companies actively sensor our content and the corporations have put their thumb down on the social scales opposite of how I think.

The Uniparty running this country better figure stuff the hell out because they are going to get gobbled up by increasingly hostile and aggressive movements from both the left and right.

I think when you reference the blue collar worker, you mean the white blue collar worker. The blue collar worked still exists in this country. It’s just that demographics have changed and the majority of those blue collar workers are Hispanic. They are still blue collar and they still Americans. They just ain’t white.

Hispanics will represent the second largest demographic of eligible voters in the 2020 election. This will be the first time that group is greater than the black vote. This tide isn’t changing and it isn’t going away.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

The tech companies actively sensor our content and the corporations have put their thumb down on the social scales opposite of how I think.

The tech companies shouldn't have to but idiots keep believing anti-vaxx, anti-mask, birther, truther, flat earth idiocy. If you are one of those, I have sympathy you believe that filth but none that you can't spew it on Facebook.

I was looking at a mask ad the other day on Facebook. It was for a valve mask and I was going to comment that people shouldn't buy them. In the comments it was already brought up and the company said they in fact had a double filter in the valve. But in those comments were at least 30 comments by the same "person". They spoke about how masks kill people. They posted masks do no good because a virus isn't a living thing passed by people but is more like a cancer that grows from within the body. All sorts of stuff like that.

The sad part is you and I know people are believing that. Something about Americans makes us want to believe there is some big global conspiracy against us. It works. It elected a president.

FDR had no idea about Pearl, JFK was assassinated by a lone gunman, the Twin Towers were brought down by crazed Islamic fundamentalists, Obama was born in the US, vaccinations work, Epstein killed himself, masks probably work but at worse do no more damage than acne, 5G is not involved in COVID, a pedo ring was not run out of a pizza place in DC, Sandy Hook was not a false flag operation. The Clintons haven't murdered dozens of people. And I'm still missing dozens, hundreds of bizarre theories out there. Sadly the Time Cube site has gone away, it was the best example of the craziest site on the internet and if people never saw it, Wiki still has an article about it.

We've given crazies an open platform and all they have done is get more crazy and attract more people. If sunlight worked as a disinfectant, why do all those conspiracies above have fairly numerous followings? Suing them like Alex Jones is probably a better solution but I'm not sure that will work.

There are legitimate grey areas, and in those I think free speech has to win. But if you haven't looked around, the crazy conspiracy theorists are winning, easily.

 

[82hoosier]

Trump needs to be more sensitive about immigrants. Win or lose he is going to have to shop for a new wife after the elections

 

[IUCrazy2]

The tech companies shouldn't have to but idiots keep believing anti-vaxx, anti-mask, birther, truther, flat earth idiocy. If you are one of those, I have sympathy you believe that filth but none that you can't spew it on Facebook.

I was looking at a mask ad the other day on Facebook. It was for a valve mask and I was going to comment that people shouldn't buy them. In the comments it was already brought up and the company said they in fact had a double filter in the valve. But in those comments were at least 30 comments by the same "person". They spoke about how masks kill people. They posted masks do no good because a virus isn't a living thing passed by people but is more like a cancer that grows from within the body. All sorts of stuff like that.

The sad part is you and I know people are believing that. Something about Americans makes us want to believe there is some big global conspiracy against us. It works. It elected a president.

FDR had no idea about Pearl, JFK was assassinated by a lone gunman, the Twin Towers were brought down by crazed Islamic fundamentalists, Obama was born in the US, vaccinations work, Epstein killed himself, masks probably work but at worse do no more damage than acne, 5G is not involved in COVID, a pedo ring was not run out of a pizza place in DC, Sandy Hook was not a false flag operation. The Clintons haven't murdered dozens of people. And I'm still missing dozens, hundreds of bizarre theories out there. Sadly the Time Cube site has gone away, it was the best example of the craziest site on the internet and if people never saw it, Wiki still has an article about it.

We've given crazies an open platform and all they have done is get more crazy and attract more people. If sunlight worked as a disinfectant, why do all those conspiracies above have fairly numerous followings? Suing them like Alex Jones is probably a better solution but I'm not sure that will work.

There are legitimate grey areas, and in those I think free speech has to win. But if you haven't looked around, the crazy conspiracy theorists are winning, easily.

I am not talking about conspiracy theory people that I agree with. I am talking about some fairly boilerplate conservatives that get gobbled up.

That being said, I do not think the conspiracy theorists should get deplatformed either. Only egregiously hateful things and calls to violence should be on the table as things that get removed (there may be another few things here and there we agree on, I consider a call to harassment as a potentially violent thing, if you would want to give that a separate category, I would be open to that discussion too). Free expression means free. If Twitter, Facebook, etc. want to control the info passed on their forums, that is fine, but I believe that the rules on how they are treated should change along with it.

But my grievance with the Chamber of Commerce is much deeper than tech companies.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Trump needs to be more sensitive about immigrants. Win or lose he is going to have to shop for a new wife after the elections

That's his problem.

If companies need to bring in labor because they say that U.S. labor is not available, they should have to pay a premium for the labor. First it should be law that they have to pay them the median salary for their job for that area and then I would slap a 10% fee on top of that which goes directly to underprivileged Americans who agree to get a degree in that field.

I expect American companies to be American first. If you are a "global" company then I don't feel the need to provide you any sort of protections. Guess the choice is theirs. Free trade has shipped our jobs to poor countries all while we import their workers. It has been a disaster for the lower middle class. "Learn how to code!" Good luck with that, the digital market and a cheap labor pool in places like China and India that have huge populations are going to make jobs like programming, accounting, customer service, etc. be easy to offshore as well. And UBI is not the answer I want to hear. I want to work, having a job is good for people.

 

[twenty02]

That's his problem.

If companies need to bring in labor because they say that U.S. labor is not available, they should have to pay a premium for the labor. First it should be law that they have to pay them the median salary for their job for that area and then I would slap a 10% fee on top of that which goes directly to underprivileged Americans who agree to get a degree in that field.

I expect American companies to be American first. If you are a "global" company then I don't feel the need to provide you any sort of protections. Guess the choice is theirs. Free trade has shipped our jobs to poor countries all while we import their workers. It has been a disaster for the lower middle class. "Learn how to code!" Good luck with that, the digital market and a cheap labor pool in places like China and India that have huge populations are going to make jobs like programming, accounting, customer service, etc. be easy to offshore as well. And UBI is not the answer I want to hear. I want to work, having a job is good for people.

Oh great. Another populist parading around as a conservative whining about evil corporations. Just what we need.

 

[82hoosier]

That's his problem.

If companies need to bring in labor because they say that U.S. labor is not available, they should have to pay a premium for the labor. First it should be law that they have to pay them the median salary for their job for that area and then I would slap a 10% fee on top of that which goes directly to underprivileged Americans who agree to get a degree in that field.

I expect American companies to be American first. If you are a "global" company then I don't feel the need to provide you any sort of protections. Guess the choice is theirs. Free trade has shipped our jobs to poor countries all while we import their workers. It has been a disaster for the lower middle class. "Learn how to code!" Good luck with that, the digital market and a cheap labor pool in places like China and India that have huge populations are going to make jobs like programming, accounting, customer service, etc. be easy to offshore as well. And UBI is not the answer I want to hear. I want to work, having a job is good for people.

I don't know where one would go to get a degree in meatpacking or migrant agricultural labor.

Years ago a friend of mine got a job working as a sheep herder in the Rocky Mountains. He saw an ad in the newspaper and applied for the job. The employer was quite surprised that someone answered the ad.. The reason the job was posted in the paper was that it was a requirement that the job had to be posted for at least 2 weeks before it could be outsourced to Immigrant labor.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

This is structural racism. We aren’t educating millions of black students so that they can attend these universities, so the answer has been use foreign students to receive US education. It might take years, and some universities might fold, but we need to figure out how to fill those seats with our own youngsters.

You are mistaking this to be a capacity issue, of which there is an abundance of options. Because generations, particularly those of means, continue to reproduce less, we NEED immigration, or did you forget?

The entire point should be to allow students from a foreign country to study here and try and keep them, assuming they are upstanding and interested in doing so.

 

[JamieDimonsBalls]

Epstein killed himself,

He did have some help though.

 

[Cortez88]

Oh great. Another populist parading around as a conservative whining about evil corporations. Just what we need.

The current GOP is a nationalist populist party. The prediction that it will become more so as demographics change and non-college whites harden in their resistance to that change. Unless something drastically changes, the GOP will look like some of those far right European parties. Here’s a good thread showing that there are and will be less and less non-college whites.

 

[twenty02]

The current GOP is a nationalist populist party. The prediction that it will become more so as demographics change and non-college whites harden in their resistance to that change. Unless something drastically changes, the GOP will look like some of those far right European parties. Here’s a good thread showing that there are and will be less and less non-college whites.

View embedded media

I agree.

 

[meridian]

This is structural racism. We aren’t educating millions of black students so that they can attend these universities, so the answer has been use foreign students to receive US education. It might take years, and some universities might fold, but we need to figure out how to fill those seats with our own youngsters.

It's strange to see you coming to the defense of the blacks. Better late than never. Welcome aboard!

 

[toastedbread]

Oh great. Another populist parading around as a conservative whining about evil corporations. Just what we need.

It is a fact that corporations want cheap labor. Tech salaries are stagnant. The problem is that Trump had 4 years to address this and did nothing. Now he throws a bone to the masses.

His H1B ban was a joke. Already they could not receive visas due to coronas. Sounds great to the foaming at mouth masses who don't dig into the details. Anyone within the country is able to change status. The biggest problem with OPT beyond the labor supply issue is that those folks are indentured servants to their companies as are H1B. Their status is tied to those companies. Talk about lack of negotiating leverage. Moreover, companies do not pay FICA on OPT. So yes, American workers get screwed.

My biggest problem with this student policy is the complete lack of due process. These changes should not take place abruptly.

Finally, Trump doesn't give a damn about policy or details. He doesn't give a crap about American workers. It's an act. Trump cares about one thing and one thing only. Himself.

 

[toastedbread]

You are mistaking this to be a capacity issue, of which there is an abundance of options. Because generations, particularly those of means, continue to reproduce less, we NEED immigration, or did you forget?

The entire point should be to allow students from a foreign country to study here and try and keep them, assuming they are upstanding and interested in doing so.

Why am I not suprised that someone who works on Wall St. wants a limitless supply of labor?

 

[twenty02]

It is a fact that corporations want cheap labor. Tech salaries are stagnant. The problem is that Trump had 4 years to address this and did nothing. Now he throws a bone to the masses.

His H1B ban was a joke. Already they could not receive visas due to coronas. Sounds great to the foaming at mouth masses who don't dig into the details. Anyone within the country is able to change status. The biggest problem with OPT beyond the labor supply issue is that those folks are indentured servants to their companies as are H1B. Their status is tied to those companies. Talk about lack of negotiating leverage. Moreover, companies do not pay FICA on OPT. So yes, American workers get screwed.

My biggest problem with this student policy is the complete lack of due process. These changes should not take place abruptly.

Finally, Trump doesn't give a damn about policy or details. He doesn't give a crap about American workers. It's an act. Trump cares about one thing and one thing only. Himself.

The unemployment rate was like 3% prior to the pandemic. We had a serious labor shortage issue in many industries.

Tech salaries are stagnant? Yeah silicon valley is a really struggling with their local economy. RSUs out the ass. Hell, I know half a dozen people without even thinking about it...with fairly lackluster tech credentials that are making six figures + working for Salesforce right here in cheap ole Indy.

 

[toastedbread]

The unemployment rate was like 3% prior to the pandemic. We had a serious labor shortage issue in many industries.

Tech salaries are stagnant? Yeah silicon valley is a really struggling with their local economy. RSUs out the ass. Hell, I know half a dozen people without even thinking about it...with fairly lackluster tech credentials that are making six figures + working for Salesforce right here in cheap ole Indy.

Yes, they have been stagnant for awhile due to increased labor supply.

Data science is supposedly the most cutting edge, yet,...

https://www.techrepublic.com/articl...ing-should-you-still-become-a-data-scientist/

The percentage of foreign students working in tech is enormous. Wall st. loves it. Pay 100k to software instead of 200.

 

[tooold4]

Speaking of evil corporations....

I watched a James Carville interview this week and of course the media picked on what he said about the president resigning before the election.
Meh.
What he said about voter suppression in Georgia was far more interesting. What to do about it? he said he can drink a Pepsi and doesn't have to drink Coke, he doesn't have to fly on a Delta airplane. He thinks that putting some pressure on the Atlanta based corps. could induce the lobby to put pressure on the governor to ease up on voter suppression. Makes a lot of sense to me. It could be a win-win situation if say Coke comes out with a few press releases in condemnation of suppression. Brand loyalty can be lost.

 

[Fro]

I follow a YouTuber who's an international student right now in the US and she's pretty pissed off/scared. Judging from the comments this is doing pretty major damage to the USA's rep.

We want people around the world to believe in the "American Dream" and smart folks to be able to move here and work and start their own businesses. Great for the country & economy.

 

[mcmurtry66]

I follow a YouTuber who's an international student right now in the US and she's pretty pissed off/scared. Judging from the comments this is doing pretty major damage to the USA's rep.

We want people around the world to believe in the "American Dream" and smart folks to be able to move here and work and start their own businesses. Great for the country & economy.

harvard and mit just filed suit.

 

[IUCrazy2]

Oh great. Another populist parading around as a conservative whining about evil corporations. Just what we need.

Lol, way too simplistic. Just count me out on the idea that the holiest of all grails is to ensure that corporations are always right. What is good for the Chamber of Commerce is not always what is good for the country as a whole. Particularly when those members view themselves as more a party to the "global community" than they are a member of the "U.S. community".

We can dial up Rockfish and he has about 30 links on speed dial that show the growth in income inequality. Corporations got their taxes cut to 20%, they practically demand benefits to move into a city, and when they decide to move...free t0o go. Corporations are not evil, they are designed to maximize profit. Well I am someone who believes there is a happy medium between them making money and everyone else getting ****ed. They will do what is good for them, but right now, things are so good for them that it has the balance off kilter. Time to move the scales back a bit.

You cannot have a functioning society with that big of a gap between haves and have nots. For years we were told this stuff would trickle down if corporations were just given some breaks. It didn't. I am willing to listen to what you have to say, hell I have voted for that shit my entire life. People are greedy and corporations are run by people. Their goal is to make money, I think there are ways they can make money but also be forced to kick in more to actually support the damn people who work for them and the places they live. The streets in Indiana are a mess and every time you hear about a new business moving into the area, it is followed by the sweetheart tax deal they got to do so. "Well the workers they hire will pay that.." Horseshit. You want to know how I know that, because that is how things run now and it ain't working.

 

[toastedbread]

Lol, way too simplistic. Just count me out on the idea that the holiest of all grails is to ensure that corporations are always right. What is good for the Chamber of Commerce is not always what is good for the country as a whole. Particularly when those members view themselves as more a party to the "global community" than they are a member of the "U.S. community".

We can dial up Rockfish and he has about 30 links on speed dial that show the growth in income inequality. Corporations got their taxes cut to 20%, they practically demand benefits to move into a city, and when they decide to move...free to go. Corporations are not evil, they are designed to maximize profit. Well I am someone who believes there is a happy medium between them making money and everyone else getting ****ed. They will do what is good for them, but right now, things are so good for them that it has the balance off kilter.

They don't view themselves as part of any community. All they care about is the almighty dollar. Look what's happening right now with the Tennessee Valley Authority. Couple hundred american workers are training their foreign H1B replacements. Meanwhile the head of that quasi government body receives a few million per year. It's sick what's going on, but some only care about the almighty dollar.

 

[IUCrazy2]

They don't view themselves as part of any community. All they care about is the almighty dollar. Look what's happening right now with the Tennessee Valley Authority. Couple hundred american workers are training their foreign H1B replacements. Meanwhile the head of that quasi government body receives a few million per year. It's sick what's going on, but some only care about the almighty dollar.

Right.

For years the "conservative" movement has been an exchange. There was the Twenty02 side of the party that is very pro business. They had people who are probably more economically moderate voting for them in exchange for platitudes about socially conservative issues. And the GOP always made sure the the Chamber of Commerce got taken care of and the CoC for the most part stayed out of the cultural stuff. Well now they have waded into the cultural stuff and they did so on the side of the left. If you are a poor evangelical in Mississippi and the Supreme Court, tilted conservatively, still is not giving you the social messages you want, why vote for the GOP at all? Because you really disagree with the alternative. That's it. That is how Trump got elected. I don't know why this is so hard for people. The racial component involved was based on jobs. If more people were comfortable economically they would not give a crap about immigration. Health costs, school costs, and an increasing wealth gap put people on the defensive. Trump was an inartful messenger but many of you are nuts if you don't think his economic plans resonate with a bunch of people across party lines.

People get pissy about populism and nationalism, but the reason those things tend to show up is because the people with the power have settled on a society that the people feel is off balance. You see it on the right and the left, people are pissed about the same thing, it is getting too hard for middle class people to get by, particularly younger middle class people. If you (not you toasted, the universal you) are someone who doesn't like having the government involved with business, then you need to convince businesses that they are not acting properly enough to keep regulation out.

 

[82hoosier]

25% of the student body at the University of Southern California are international students.

 

[IUCrazy2]

25% of the student body at the University of Southern California are international students.

Yep. They are a private University do they can do what they want. They have their endowment. However, I think state money should be reserved for schools that go out of their way to educate members of the U.S. community.

If you are a Democrat who decries things like institutional racism, how can you argue giving those spots to someone from China as opposed to an African American kid here in the U.S.?

 

[VanPastorMan]

I would love for more Black and Latino students to go to college, but is not the usual debate that 4 year college is not for everyone? We do not produce nearly enough STEM graduates inside our population as is. A HUGE part of that is that Americans do not like those difficult degrees. They would rather do something that pays more (business) or is easy (law).

If you are still reading, that was a joke for our over abundance of lawyers here using Gladwell's point that in places like Harvard kids that wash out of STEM move to law.

Marvin, with the state of inner city education how many of these kids could cut it in a four yr institution? It's why I am for school choice. Let parents pick where their kids go for the best education and then all schools will have to compete for students which will cause the quality of education to go up. Blacks in DC had this choice years ago and they loved it until it was taken away. Black parents get it. Education is the key to upward mobility.

 

[UncleMark]

Finally, Trump doesn't give a damn about policy or details. He doesn't give a crap about American workers. It's an act. Trump cares about one thing and one thing only. Himself.

Anyone who thinks this move has anything to do with actual economic or immigration policy is an idiot. This is Stephen Miller getting his nut once again, nothing more nothing less. Trump likes it because furriners. And these students can't vote, and the university types are lost anyway. Nothing to lose, and Trump and Miller get their jollies.

 

[Cortez88]

Yep. They are a private University do they can do what they want. They have their endowment. However, I think state money should be reserved for schools that go out of their way to educate members of the U.S. community.

If you are a Democrat who decries things like institutional racism, how can you argue giving those spots to someone from China as opposed to an African American kid here in the U.S.?

I agree with this and would go further to say that state universities should cater to in state students first and foremost. I’m aware that this idea creates economic issues now that states legislatures have cut back on funding to state schools. However, in theory, I’d like to see more Indiana kids at IU and Purdue.

 

[IUCrazy2]

I agree with this and would go further to say that state universities should cater to in state students first and foremost. I’m aware that this idea creates economic issues now that states legislatures have cut back on funding to state schools. However, in theory, I’d like to see more Indiana kids at IU and Purdue.

I think when it comes to these issues, the people that actually vote for these parties are not as far apart on what they believe the issues are and what they would be willing to compromise to fix them. The problem is the two parties themselves. They pick the most divisive issues between us to get elected and then they sit around for several years and do it again.

I am not happy with any of my choices anymore.

 

[Marvin the Martian]

I agree with this and would go further to say that state universities should cater to in state students first and foremost. I’m aware that this idea creates economic issues now that states legislatures have cut back on funding to state schools. However, in theory, I’d like to see more Indiana kids at IU and Purdue.

Schools are partly graded on the qualifications of the students admitted. Let's say IU and PU started lowering standards to fill up with in-state kids, would that not lower the value of the degree?

Pretty much any kid can get into a Indiana University and if they do well enough as a freshman, transfer in to IUB. I know people that went that route. Two of my own kids went to IUPUI because they wanted out of Bloomington. I spent a year at what was then IUPUI Columbus, now IUC back in 1980.

There are a lot of options. We are not close to filling our needs internally in STEM. My wife and one of my best friends were math majors at IU. Not a lot of Americans are attracted to math. If we stop bringing in international students we just might close down math departments nationwide.