Here we go again
- Thread starter zeke4ahs
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I'm not sure or not if you're implying that only veterans can criticize those who were able to avoid the draft and/or make that avoidance an issue.
Me, personally, that's one thing I'll never criticize Trump for. I don't begrudge anyone avoiding the draft in the Viet Nam era. I missed it by a hairs breadth myself; not sure what I would have done had I been called up. I do remember I started reading up on Canada at the time.
You didn’t serve in “this lifetime.” Did you serve in a previous lifetime?
If I were of draft age in the Vietnam era, I likely would have tried like crazy to avoid getting drafted, had I not supported the war (and I probably would not have supported it).
But would I have lied about a made-up health problem, using Daddy's connections to get a doctor to "verify" that made-up health problem, a health problem that then immediately disappeared forever?
I don't think so.
But would I have lied about a made-up health problem, using Daddy's connections to get a doctor to "verify" that made-up health problem, a health problem that then immediately disappeared forever?
I don't think so.
Funny how that shit works. When it's your ass on the line, it tends to effect your thinking.
I don't blame someone for avoiding nam. My issue is don't go beating your chest about how pro-military you are, when you concocted a fake letter to avoid serving. It's nothing unsual for Trump becaude he is an amoral character.
Exactly, you're coming right out and saying it. No implications.
My brother, much my senior, was deeply traumatized by the Vietnam War. He never recovered. I almost enlisted in the Air Force. When I went into the office to take their test, my results came back as 95 on all four (or however many) categories. That pissed me off. I knew I was better than 95 on math and I wasn't going to take that disrespect. Later they would have discovered I had a heart defect and dumped me anyway, but that's neither here nor there.
In your rare posts to me, I don't recall you not inveighing against me. Fine, your choice. My impression is you're better and smarter than your pathetic attempt at taking me down in defense of your choice of president. I get it. You feel there's not better choice so you swallow your pride and vote for a serial rapist, a pathological liar, a bankruptcy tycoon, a con artist, and yes, a draft dodger. Fair enough. You gotta do what you gotta do. Own it, maestro. Just like Trump ought to own being a draft dodger, a serial rapist, a pathological liar, a bankruptcy tycoon, and a con artist. I owned my past and I own my present.
One last thing, we're all in this together. I care about every American. In fact, I care about every human being. My invective toward Trump is purely pragmatic -- he's a piece of shit trying to ruin my and your country for his own gain.
The two women that E. Jean confided in 23 years ago have come forward, confirming her conversations with them in of all places the lying New York Times.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/27/us/politics/jean-carroll-trump-sexual-assault.html
E. Jean seemed to travel in pretty high social circles. Interestingly one of her confidants was married to Geraldo Rivera at the time and when they tried to get in touch with him he was traveling and not available for comment. Doesn’t he still work for Fox News? What a story just waiting for Fox to break open!
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/27/us/politics/jean-carroll-trump-sexual-assault.html
E. Jean seemed to travel in pretty high social circles. Interestingly one of her confidants was married to Geraldo Rivera at the time and when they tried to get in touch with him he was traveling and not available for comment. Doesn’t he still work for Fox News? What a story just waiting for Fox to break open!
It is interesting. I don't discuss details of my personal case in public, no one should for various technical reasons, but far more interesting for you is your own.
Seriously, this is interesting. What is the issue with you discussing previous lives? Which military? I love history and it would be awesome to get first hand accounts.
Do you have any former lives? I don't, that I know of. But if I did, I agree it would be interesting to know about them.
Not that I know of. It would be awesome to hear from someone that had former lives and remembers them.
I do understand your curiosity. I'm curious too but I'm not really at the point where I can answer your questions safely or adequately. It's the technical nature of the beast. At this point, my recall is fragmentary and, how should I describe it, gruesome, in a nutshell. Discussing details in such an uncontrolled context can restimulate my case (and theoretically could restimulate yours or those of others). It's an ethical point.
In a couple of years I might be in a position where I could describe stuff freely. Especially when I'm able to recall pleasant events. My recall has already improved and is likely to improve exponentially more. Then I could probably relate stuff that's not likely to be restimulative for anyone. Think of it this way. Most of your military career was probably fairly nondescript. Small parts of it might have been ghastly. So far, I'm not able to recall the nondescript stuff. Nature of the process.
I can vouch for that. Some stuff would be simply too weird for me to relate. I have some memories I wouldn't mind talking about (non-military). I think it's best I relate it in terms of how the recall helped me in my present life and leave out certain details. That makes it less likely to be restimulative.
This happened in the 1800s. My wife and I had a young daughter who became very ill. Doctor couldn't save her. What was particularly amazing about this recall was the vividness and strength of my feelings for her. Not surprising that I had those feelings of course, but to re-experience them. Also the relief I gained from recounting several times it was second to none. I know I'm not saying much but that's as much as I care to say about it.
I've had many other recalls, some vivid, many not so much. It's a process. I've been reluctant to discuss it at all in the past for reasons you might guess, but no more. I couldn't care less what others think but at the same time I'm not out to shock anyone. It's just really cool stuff.
lol Thetan's not an adjective as far as I know... but I think you're right. My awareness level is too low.
In all seriousness (I don't get too serious), just monitor things from the sidelines for a while and I don't think it will be too long before you'll be finding out more.
I often provoke my liberal friends by saying Scientology is that last refuge of bigotry for liberals. That irks them a bit, not believing they have any bigotry in their marrow. Not all liberals of course, but there's an element of truth to that. Where does bigotry come from? Ignorance of course.
I discussed the topic of recall with one of the most highly renowned profs at IU and he also teased me like you. At the end I asked him where he had gotten his opinion of Scientology. Newspapers. I had to laugh. This was a guy who made his name with absolutely controlled studies, perfect literature reviews, and the works. That's when I had the realization that a scientist is skeptical of what he knows and curious about what he doesn't. In the twilight of his decorated career in researching memory, he was telling me that his final conclusion was that memory was inherently fallible, and when I suggested it might be not so fallible his curiosity was blocked by...newspapers.
No offense, but I don't think Scientology even cracks the Top Ten of liberal bigotry.
No you don't get it. Trump was not my choice for POTUS and I did not vote for nor support him. Right or wrong I did not vote for POTUS period. For me voting for Hillary because you didn't like Trump was like eating a dog turd because you didn't like broccoli. But that's just me. Perhaps in some very small way by not voting I helped Trump get elected. If that were true I can live with it.
As a Nam vet who had dog turds thrown at him upon arrival back in the states the term I posted about just strikes a nerve and it is as simple as that. I wasn't defending Trump nor was I insulting those who have never served.
Not complicated at all and certainly not the scenario your post suggested.
To be fair, there is no "perhaps." Your abstinence on the election was mathematically equal to half a vote for Trump. So, yeah.
It was also equal to half a vote for Hillary. But only you can look back on history and decide if 50/50 was morally acceptable to you.
I will continue to not judge people for refusing to vote, but I will continue to point out the mathematical reality of that choice. It's entirely up to you to decide it your decision was the right one.
"Perhaps". My 1/2 votes for each negated each other. If you and I were standing in a VERY long line to vote and the waiting period could be excessive and I told you I was voting for X and you told me you were voting for Y then we could shake hands and leave as our votes would have negated each other. Something like that.
This was the one and only time I never cast a vote for POTUS. As for morally acceptable. Like I said I can live with it and I sleep good.
Like I said, the mathematics are irrefutable. It's entirely up to you as an individual to decide on the morality of your choice. I will not try to fill that role.
Fair enough. Frankly, I don't get why Trump being a draft dodger and me calling him out on it would strike a nerve for you. I can understand people going to Canada in the 60s, I can understand religious grounds for not going to war, Cassius Clay went to jail for how many years, all that is real to me. Cheating and lying isn't. That's what Trump did. Do bone spurs prevent someone from running logistics behind the lines? I can't fathom you or anyone else respecting that (and I'm not saying you do respect that).
I was in Slovenia when Clinton attacked Belgrade (iirc he attacked the Russian embassy or whatever). I wasn't really paying too much attention to politics at the time until a Serbian worker who was hauling off the rubble from our bathroom remake asked me why I bombed Belgrade. I was furious. Wtf was Clinton bombing Belgrade and embarrassing me with his bullshit?
My personal philosophy is that if a ruler can't prevent a conflict, he should resign. If he gets us involved in a war, he should resign. Japan never would have attacked us at Pearl Harbor if we hadn't insinuated ourselves into their affairs in the years previous.
I hate the idea of people dying for my country while deeply respecting the unfathomable sacrifice that involves for more than just that soldier.
I despise Trump for treating so many people as his own pawns, for lying through his teeth unceasingly, for representing our Nation in such a primitive manner, for taking the world backwards by decades, for being a confidence artist, for ruining our environment, and for so many other things. If me calling him out on being a draft dodger gets under your skin, I guess that's an unfortunate side effect of a message I think needs to be delivered at every turn by every American who cares about the future of our nation.
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https://time.com/5616020/jean-carroll-told-friends-attack/
Confirmation that she told two women ( both acclaimed journalists) about the attack at the time. But Joe Biden rubs women’s shoulders.
Confirmation that she told two women ( both acclaimed journalists) about the attack at the time. But Joe Biden rubs women’s shoulders.
A bigot by definition doesn't tolerate views and credes other than his own.
This makes compromise almost impossible.
IMO bigotry exists among both liberals and conservatives to such an extent that our Congress has become dysfunctional. This disfunction results in executive power as in executive orders going unchecked by both Republican and Democratic presidents.
While I respect your right to your opinion, I find the bolded to be quite an amazing statement. For a lot of reasons.
Your scores were all 95s. Great! The only separated those PERCENTILE score into groups of 5 points. Since you cannot get 100 percentile (you'd have to be higher than yourself) you got angry at USAFs honest assessment of your abilities. Well, sounds good.
I volunteered - same scores as you - and as soon as I had a security and training upgrade I volunteered for Viet Nam. 18 months later, I was sent to southern Turkey. Had some TDYs to Southeast Asia. I would never have dreamed of taking any action to avoid serving. I never understood why anyone would.
I realized that. I was miffed that they scored in groups of 5. If they wanted to show me respect, they blew it. Then again, I was young. So be it. AIr Force would have been cool.
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