Guv sounds like a politician today.
- Thread starter TheOriginalHappyGoat
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It seems a hard line to walk. It seems likely the plan is overly ambitious but we will see.
Marion and Lake counties start on May 11th. Cass County doesn't start until May 18th due to the Tyson plant. I think Indiana is taking a smart approach with this.
Seems that way to me too but at least he’s left the door open, in theory, to move back if things go south. That’s the responsible approach.
They are admitting cases WILL go up. If cases go up, how can progress to stages 3, 4, and 5 happen?
It might be overly ambitious but I think it is worth a shot. 50% capacity for restaurants is a much better approach than ripping the bandage off. We are lucky to have a Governor that is actually taking this seriously. I like that he is being cautious and is willing to adapt to the plan he has outlined.
As I’m understanding it, cases going up is not part of that calculation. At least they’re being honest about that. Hospitalizations and hospital capacity is what they’re looking at.
That is a good point. Although, Indiana is paying out $45M to perform contact tracing during the reopening phase, so I am hoping that this will help slow down or flatten the cases.
I don’t completely agree with this approach but I agree with you that it seems to to be thoughtful and with a purpose. Much better the macho ‘Merica approach of some other states. And he’s made it clear he’s willing to go back if we slip backward.
Yes, but with no real effective treatment*, does it really matter. It appears one gets sick and what the end result is has little to do with human intervention. The hospital can make one more comfortable and that is about it.
*yes, the remdesivir may alter this, somewhat.
He looked like a guy who probably knows this is too aggressive but he has to sell it to keep certain interests happy. I don't know about you but I have little interest in going to a restaurant a week from now at 50% capacity where I can't sit at the bar and the waiters are wearing masks. Does that seem like a nice night out? No thanks. A haircut would be nice though.
I wish Trump would tweet about it so it would go away. I am way more leery about remdesevir, given it has never been approved for any purpose, outside of emergency trial use status. Feels like Gilead has a developed a square peg and they are searching for a hole to hammer it into.
What concerns me most are the statements yesterday, anyone not going back to work because of fear will lose unemployment. It is exactly what I kept telling VPM what would happen, not that he ever bothered to reply. So the 60 teal old diabetic or COPD and a public job now faces one hell of a choice. Die slowly, or more quickly, but please die.
Here is the Indiana DOH chart that makes me doubt that Indiana has plateaued yet:
Statewide Positive Cases by Day
I can't extract this chart to insert separately on this site, but it's available at https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm .
I'm 65 years old with compromised lungs and am taking home more money on the enhanced unemployment than what I was drawing as salary. Then there's the wife who checks every risk box except obesity. I'm not looking forward to going back to work on Monday.
Good luck Mark. I do not know if there is anyway to know a right answer.
Certainly I am not speaking about all conservatives, but there are more than a few who rejoice in Darwinism. And to them, this is just an opportunity to thin the herd. I mentioned my concerns about what do we do for people with real health concerns when we open up, I never heard a conservative make a suggestion. I still await that. There are people for who going to work is close to a death sentence, what should be done for them? Maybe the good pastor will somehow suggest Jesus wants people to die for their employer.
For me, I get the $600 is too much in some circumstances. If an employee cannot return to work, their unemployment should be capped at some figure between 75% and 100% of their wage. Or maybe social security expanded downward in age.
I may get a reprieve. Lovin' the public teat.
I really don't quite understand what people expect..... the virus is likely to be with us for upwards of 2 years. We aren't going to keep the economy shut down until a vaccine exists. The entire point of stay at home was not to overwhelm the HC system.... if that's not an issue, then we open up and people make their own choices beyond that.
What do we do with the people with legitimate, serious, health concerns? With no UBI, no UI, what options are there for them? It is not even winter, we cannot just set them outside the igloo.
Does anyone know the financial viability of insurance companies? Maybe Anthem at am have it in their contracts they can raise rates mid year. Otherwise, 6 more months of increasing hospitalizations would seem to present problems for them.
I think this is exactly what most people expect. The problem is that your last statement isn't true. Most people won't be making their own choices. Most people will be told whether or not they have to go back to work. They will have some control over how much risk they expose themselves to, but there will be a baseline exposure that they will be forced into.
What do you propose? Putting everyone that's fearful of getting sick on100% govt income from 2 years? That's insane. Again.... the entire argument for shutdown was not overwhelming the system. That was it. Now we're moving the goalposts, it seems.
Overall health care usage has fallen through the floor.... Health insurers are more than fine. Most doctors/ nurses have no business. They probably should be cutting/ refunding premiums.
I got a refund from Allstate this month for my auto insurance.....as driving is down so much we're over- paying.
Sure. So what's the alternative? Anyone who self selects can sit at home for two years and get paid $50k/yr?
"Most people won't be making their own choices. Most people will be told whether or not they have to go back to work." And you know this how?
Because I'm not an idiot?
I don't know that there is an alternative. But that doesn't change the fact that it's a problem, and we shouldn't be brushing that problem off with inaccurate language like "let people make their own choices" and so forth.
If you had COPD, would you return to work?
The simple math is that lower paid workers, often without insurance, are most at risk. Corporate leaders will be far more likely to work from home then the dollar store clerk. The goalposts are not moving as much as the American reality that poorer people are expendable is just being exposed.
To clear something up, I should have said above that I'm not sure there is a politically palatable alternative. Obviously, there is an alternative, and it's the one twenty is dismissing out of hand - just give people free money for two years. But it's worth at least discussing whether that alternative shouldn't be dismissed out of hand, and for the reason Marvin highlights: because the reason it is dismissed out of hand is that our society has decided that the regular guy is expendable.
I get that $1000/week is probably too much. But there has to be a way we can do this. There has to be a way to keep high risk people alive. I still believe if they are forced to work, companies should be forced to insure them.
Yanno, if you want to be all JDB about it, how about this -- paying me 100% of my current income would be a helluva lot cheaper than having Medicare pick up the tab for two or three weeks in the ICU.
the funny thing about that alternative is that the same people who are saying it’s impossible and we absolutely can’t just pay people to stay home are the ones saying that it’s impossible to stay home and they need the freedom to get back out to restaurants and haircuts. Almost nobody is enjoying being stuck at home, but the Republican bogeyman of the welfare fraudster just keeps coming back.
Actuarially??? I don't care about those other bastards, I'm talking about me.
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