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Freaking Wisconsin.......

Wasn’t Harvey 18 and a college student? Wasn’t it one adult being “disrespectful” to another? Should Harvey have broken away and punched Knight in response to Knight grabbing him?
I can tell you never saw Animal House. Age 18 may be “adult” for legal purposes, but comparing an 18 year old “adult” with a 60+ year old isn’t comparable socially (see exhibit, “Hey, Knight!” audio clip). I forgot, you must be from the “no touch here/no touch there school of doting upbringing, paranoid in nature. Believe me, I know the social world of those Brown Co. high school kids and it’s pretty small with B-town just down the road a bit, being there in lickity-split.
 
I can tell you never saw Animal House. Age 18 may be “adult” for legal purposes, but comparing an 18 year old “adult” with a 60+ year old isn’t comparable socially (see exhibit, “Hey, Knight!” audio clip). I forgot, you must be from the “no touch here/no touch there school of doting upbringing, paranoid in nature. Believe me, I know the social world of those Brown Co. high school kids and it’s pretty small with B-town just down the road a bit, being there in lickity-split.
Yeah, I’ve seen Animal House many times, though that has nothing to do with this. Would you have been okay if Harvey had slugged Knight, since Knight was the aggressor?
 
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Yeah, I’ve seen Animal House many times, though that has nothing to do with this. Would you have been okay if Harvey had slugged Knight, since Knight was the aggressor?
Sorry, but in the world I live in, the Harvey kid was the initial aggressor, the verbalizing bully. Knight didn’t grab him without provocation of demeaning address.
 
Sorry, but in the world I live in, the Harvey kid was the initial aggressor, the verbalizing bully. Knight didn’t grab him without provocation of demeaning address.
Lmao, "verbalizing bully." You're part of group that sees no problem with beating children but "Hey, Knight" is aggressive to the point of bullying. What's even ****er is you're talking about a 60 year old, well known coach who was viewed as a tough guy feeling bullied by that comment by a random 18 year old strident. You must really think Knight is a snowflake if you think that was bullying.

The kid wasn't taunting him. He wasn't heckling him. He just greeted Knight without using a title. The horror! Knight is probably emotionally scarred by such bullying.

Your comment is hilarious because it's so ridiculous.
 
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Sorry, but in the world I live in, the Harvey kid was the initial aggressor, the verbalizing bully. Knight didn’t grab him without provocation of demeaning address.
Should Harvey have hit him? How often did you hit your kids, or other kids whom you believed treated you disrespectfully? What about co-workers or friends and acquaintances, especially when you were only trying to teach them a lesson?
 
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Hit 18/19 FTs and 12 3 pointers at home to nip Purdue....SS misses 2 3 pointers toward the end when PU down 2. Now 9-6 on the season, despite the fact that the only player they had with above average offensive ability quit the team.

Still.......most boring team in the country.
That was a great win for the Badgers and a wonderful loss for the lousy Boilers!!
 
Should Harvey have hit him? How often did you hit your kids, or other kids whom you believed treated you disrespectfully? What about co-workers or friends and acquaintances, especially when you were only trying to teach them a lesson?
Oh, so getting one’s attention by placing a hand on another one’s arm is now an assault according to the media reports from a snot-nosed kid just out of high school. Now, you think Knight hit the kid so the kid should have hit back?
 
I met coach knight several times. Once at the golf course he was in front of us. He was great. Treated us with respect as we did him. We even gave him some shit when he hit one a mile but hooked it in the woods. He also chatted with us after the round. All we talked was golf. Not one word about hoops. Maybe it helped he just hung the 81 banner. Huge grin!

Regarding Wisky: I had three wisky players in Reed Beck 5 in my dorm room partying after we destroyed them at home. We had won some ridiculous number of games against them. They expected to lose before the game started. My how things have changed. Got to give Barry credit. He’s done very well as AD.
 
Lmao, "verbalizing bully." You're part of group that sees no problem with beating children but "Hey, Knight" is aggressive to the point of bullying. What's even ****er is you're talking about a 60 year old, well known coach who was viewed as a tough guy feeling bullied by that comment by a random 18 year old strident. You must really think Knight is a snowflake if you think that was bullying.

The kid wasn't taunting him. He wasn't heckling him. He just greeted Knight without using a title. The horror! Knight is probably emotionally scarred by such bullying.

Your comment is hilarious because it's so ridiculous.
Bullying can be verbal and isn’t necessarily physical. A comment was made that Knight initiated the teaching lesson described by the kid’s attorney, his uncle, as an “assault”. I say bullshit, the kid was the agitator who initiated the blown out of proportion confrontation. You thinking I’m in a group of people who condone physical abuse of children and you thinking a teacher grabbing a student’s arm to get their attention for a lesson in manners is wrong is the pathetic thing here. I stand by my claim that yelling a disrespectful address to another person is a form of bullying in today’s overly politically correct way of thinking.
 
Oh, so getting one’s attention by placing a hand on another one’s arm is now an assault according to the media reports from a snot-nosed kid just out of high school. Now, you think Knight hit the kid so the kid should have hit back?
Placing a hand? Why lie about it? He grabbed him. No one, except you, disputes that. Should Harvey have hit him in response?
 
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Placing a hand? Why lie about it? He grabbed him. No one, except you, disputes that. Should Harvey have hit him in response?
So at what point does a placement of a hand qualify as a grab? How many lbs. of pressure per square inch elevates it to “grab” status? At what point can a grab charge be described as “assault”? At what level of continuum of hand placement, grab and assault justifies physically harming another person in ‘“hit back”?
 
So at what point does a placement of a hand qualify as a grab? How many lbs. of pressure per square inch elevates it to “grab” status? At what point can a grab charge be described as “assault”? At what level of continuum of hand placement, grab and assault justifies physically harming another person in ‘“hit back”?
At what point are you willing to acknowledge that Knight did, in fact, grab Harvey? Harvey said so. Knight said so. Only you have now denied that it occurred. And should Harvey have punched him in response to it? If the roles were reversed and Harvey grabbed Knight, would Knight have been justified in punching Harvey?
 
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BS to that. RMK played the players who were here, and he didn’t even have Big George. Now please explain how this is different?

I mean, early 1970s compared to late 2010s. To whatever extent CAM is having issues with SBoR, entitled players, lack of respect, handcuffs on discipline, etc. you can be sure none of that was happening when RMK took over.
 
Wasn’t Harvey 18 and a college student? Wasn’t it one adult being “disrespectful” to another? Should Harvey have broken away and punched Knight in response to Knight grabbing him?

Yes oh yes he should have. knight however, would have been given the death penalty for the gruesome murder that would have occurred directly after.
 
At what point are you willing to acknowledge that Knight did, in fact, grab Harvey? Harvey said so. Knight said so. Only you have now denied that it occurred. And should Harvey have punched him in response to it? If the roles were reversed and Harvey grabbed Knight, would Knight have been justified in punching Harvey?
I don’t deny that Knight reacted with a touch or grab, but whatever it was it certainly wasn’t meant to be physically harmful or mentally harmful to the kid’s psyche and certainly not qualifying as an assault. All I know about the incident is what was reported in the media. In some reports by the attention grabbing media it was described as an assault by Knight. Some reported it as a grab. Has anyone in the media taken the time to hear Knight’s interpretation of it? Did Knight describe it as an assault, a grab, or a placement of hand on forearm? Show me! The reports were always one sided by the easily offended. You are so fixated on this “hit back” thing. Is grabbing someone’s arm to get their attention (not physically harming them in doing so) justifiable for being stricken back with a closed fist to the face? Where is it you get off on this need to strike back in hit? Do you consider yourself a tough guy never to be reckoned with or what? Has anyone ever called to your attention of a chip on your shoulder? FWIW, you’re probably not old enough to remember a Puerto Rican police officer telling Bob’s Pan Am team he had to vacate the practice gym. This guy, de Silva, arrested him for physically “assaulting” him after Knight merely admonished him in protest with a finger pointed in his face. His players vouched for their coach. That’s the kind of bullshit I’m talking about with the Harvey kid and the Snowflakes who believe everything they read as truth. Attorney’s like the Harvey kid’s uncle are some of the biggest, attention grabbing bullies I know.
 
I mean, early 1970s compared to late 2010s. To whatever extent CAM is having issues with SBoR, entitled players, lack of respect, handcuffs on discipline, etc. you can be sure none of that was happening when RMK took over.
Just stop with the SBoR having any kind of effect on how players are handled by their coaches. It has no bearing whatsoever.
 
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Talented players stayed more than 2 years, transfers weren't nearly as common, IU was within 20 years of their most recent championship, he was left a relatively competitive roster, the fact there wasn't as much talent, overall, as there is now, do I need to go on? Basically, Crean didn't leave much and freshmen and sophomores tend to be inconsistent.

But he didn't have his own players! How in the hell could he have done that? Smiling Face...……...and without George McGinnis too.
 
I can tell you never saw Animal House. Age 18 may be “adult” for legal purposes, but comparing an 18 year old “adult” with a 60+ year old isn’t comparable socially (see exhibit, “Hey, Knight!” audio clip). I forgot, you must be from the “no touch here/no touch there school of doting upbringing, paranoid in nature. Believe me, I know the social world of those Brown Co. high school kids and it’s pretty small with B-town just down the road a bit, being there in lickity-split.

You know Animal House was a fictional movie right?

I wouldn't base too many life decisions on that, although maybe it's too late! That just struck me as funny.
 
That and there were only 2 ranked teams in the B10 at the end of 1972 (IU 6 and Minn 10), the NIT was the main tourney at that point with the NCAA taking place afterwards. There was no 3 point shot. Do I need to continue?

I'm old enough to remember people grumbling about Knight's slow, methodical, boring style of play when he first got here. We were the Hurryin' Hoosiers, for cryin' out loud. Going to the Final Four in his second year quieted that shit down.
 
Bullying can be verbal and isn’t necessarily physical. A comment was made that Knight initiated the teaching lesson described by the kid’s attorney, his uncle, as an “assault”. I say bullshit, the kid was the agitator who initiated the blown out of proportion confrontation. You thinking I’m in a group of people who condone physical abuse of children and you thinking a teacher grabbing a student’s arm to get their attention for a lesson in manners is wrong is the pathetic thing here. I stand by my claim that yelling a disrespectful address to another person is a form of bullying in today’s overly politically correct way of thinking.
Bullying can absolutely be verbal. That isn't why I'm laughing at you. I'm laughing at you because you think an innocuous greeting like "Hey, Knight" is aggressive and bullying. What's even funnier is that you seem to think that Knight felt bullied by it otherwise you wouldn't be using it in his defense. By that measure, grabbing the kid's arm is practically attempted murder.

What would've been a non-aggressive greeting? "Hey, Coach Knight"? Or is the "Hey" too aggressive? "Hi, Coach Knight"? Maybe the kid should have prostrated himself as well?

The reports were always one sided by the easily offended.
This is ironic considering you think a greeting of "Hey, Knight" qualifies as bullying.

You must live a rough life always feeling bullied when people greet you. I imagine the non-verbal head nod without speaking in greeting is especially aggressive.
 
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You know Animal House was a fictional movie right?

I wouldn't base too many life decisions on that, although maybe it's too late! That just struck me as funny.
Sure, the movie was a parody of college fraternal organizations but I challenge anyone to dispute a certain degree of truth here. My point was that maturation of social skills between an 18 year old college student isn’t at the same level as that of a 60+ year old college teacher (coach).
 
Bullying can absolutely be verbal. That isn't why I'm laughing at you. I'm laughing at you because you think an innocuous greeting like "Hey, Knight" is aggressive and bullying. What's even funnier is that you seem to think that Knight felt bullied by it otherwise you wouldn't be using it in his defense. By that measure, grabbing the kid's arm is practically attempted murder.

What would've been a non-aggressive greeting? "Hey, Coach Knight"? Or is the "Hey" too aggressive? "Hi, Coach Knight"? Maybe the kid should have prostrated himself as well?

This is ironic considering you think a greeting of "Hey, Knight" qualifies as bullying.

You must live a rough life always feeling bullied when people greet you. I imagine the non-verbal head nod without speaking in greeting is especially aggressive.
“Hey, Coach Knight” or “Hi, Coach!” and we might not be having the basketball struggles we see today. “Hey, Knight!” from a young kid is disrespectful to an older adult, a teacher vs student on school grounds. Knight didn’t touch/grab/assault (take your pick in belief) Harvey because he was retaliating for being bullied. He reacted by offering the kid a life lesson in manners of respect for much older adults, using no uncertain means to establish his attention. The media reporting this chance encounter as an “assault” by a bully coach against a poor, innocent student is even more ridiculous than saying Knight roughed him up because Knight felt he had been bullied. “Hey, Knight” is a form of bullying, albeit it relatively mild, in today’s Snowflake world of hypersensitivity. Do you find being called Snowflake offensive? If so, you’ve just been bullied or, God forbid, assaulted by a media that already hated you.
 
Sure, the movie was a parody of college fraternal organizations but I challenge anyone to dispute a certain degree of truth here. My point was that maturation of social skills between an 18 year old college student isn’t at the same level as that of a 60+ year old college teacher (coach).

it's just funny to pick a movie that was an absolute parody and such an over the top embellishment and quote that as a basis for anything in real life . And while there are a lot of things I'd defer to Coach Knight on, social skills are going to be at the bottom of that list.
 
I don’t deny that Knight reacted with a touch or grab, but whatever it was it certainly wasn’t meant to be physically harmful or mentally harmful to the kid’s psyche and certainly not qualifying as an assault. All I know about the incident is what was reported in the media. In some reports by the attention grabbing media it was described as an assault by Knight. Some reported it as a grab. Has anyone in the media taken the time to hear Knight’s interpretation of it? Did Knight describe it as an assault, a grab, or a placement of hand on forearm? Show me! The reports were always one sided by the easily offended. You are so fixated on this “hit back” thing. Is grabbing someone’s arm to get their attention (not physically harming them in doing so) justifiable for being stricken back with a closed fist to the face? Where is it you get off on this need to strike back in hit? Do you consider yourself a tough guy never to be reckoned with or what? Has anyone ever called to your attention of a chip on your shoulder? FWIW, you’re probably not old enough to remember a Puerto Rican police officer telling Bob’s Pan Am team he had to vacate the practice gym. This guy, de Silva, arrested him for physically “assaulting” him after Knight merely admonished him in protest with a finger pointed in his face. His players vouched for their coach. That’s the kind of bullshit I’m talking about with the Harvey kid and the Snowflakes who believe everything they read as truth. Attorney’s like the Harvey kid’s uncle are some of the biggest, attention grabbing bullies I know.
So, would Harvey have been justified to push Knight’s hand away or otherwise break his grip? Would a gentle push to get Knight to back away from him be justified? Have you ever made physical contact in this manner with another adult in an effort to gain both control over and exert your influence over another person? How did they react?

In PR, didn’t Knight make physical contact with the police officer? Do you consider that appropriate? Have you ever done this, even when you felt justified?

Still not sure why you won’t respond as to what physical action you believe Harvey should have taken in response to Knight grabbing him. Do you have an opinion other than a blanket defense that BK had no accountability for his actions?
 
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it's just funny to pick a movie that was an absolute parody and such an over the top embellishment and quote that as a basis for anything in real life . And while there are a lot of things I'd defer to Coach Knight on, social skills are going to be at the bottom of that list.
But tell me this, in the parody depicted in the movie, is there not some degree of truth regarding the rowdiness of partying in a college fraternity, dorm, or apartment? I mean, good God, as a freshman I went to an IU publicized and sponsored showing of the movie "Deep Throat" held in the cafeteria of Wright Quad.
 
But tell me this, in the parody depicted in the movie, is there not some degree of truth regarding the rowdiness of partying in a college fraternity, dorm, or apartment? I mean, good God, as a freshman I went to an IU publicized and sponsored showing of the movie "Deep Throat" held in the cafeteria of Wright Quad.
I have a social experiment for you. When you’re next in a store or restaurant or on an airplane and feel disrespected by a clerk or waiter or flight attendant, grab them by the arm and forcefully (but politely) address their lack of manners and otherwise improper conduct to them. Specify that they were being disrespectful to you and that you’re merely teaching them a lesson about proper deportment. Emphasize your age difference if you believe that to provide worthwhile context, but be sure to make your point regarding their need to respect you. See what responses you receive in response to your actions and then report back. Should be fun.
 
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So, would Harvey have been justified to push Knight’s hand away or otherwise break his grip? Would a gentle push to get Knight to back away from him be justified? Have you ever made physical contact in this manner with another adult in an effort to gain both control over and exert your influence over another person? How did they react?

In PR, didn’t Knight make physical contact with the police officer? Do you consider that appropriate? Have you ever done this, even when you felt justified?

Still not sure why you won’t respond as to what physical action you believe Harvey should have taken in response to Knight grabbing him. Do you have an opinion other than a blanket defense that BK had no accountability for his actions?
If it was such a traumatic thing for Harvey to be "accosted" by Knight, yeah, I think he might have reacted to move his arm away, but he didn't, so I don't think it was such a big deal to him what Knight did until he mentioned it to his attorney uncle who had earlier written a derogatory piece against Knight...he had a bone to pick with him. His uncle contacted the press, knowing all hell would then break loose. The Harvey kid later said he regretted ever mentioning the incident. It caused him to feel compelled to transfer to another school afterwards. I really don't think Knight's response to Harvey was that big of deal to the kid at the time. It just morphed into something greater because it involved a larger than life figure with the name of Bob Knight and one of his adversaries relishing in the attention he got for blowing the whistle on him.

I've never grabbed another adult to get their attention so I don't know how they would react. It would probably depend on how much the person either liked or hated me.

In PR, all the IU players said it didn't happen the way de Silva claimed it did. All Knight did was point his finger in his face (not poking him in the eye while doing so!), certainly not the assault claimed by the police officer in a country steeped in social unrest at the time where every American was considered an "ugly American". There was real tension between the US and PR at the time of these Pan American games. Our starting guard, Kyle Macy, had his jaw broken by an opposing player during one of the games. For Christ's sake, now THAT was a rough foul of malicious intent but no one remembers that, only that Knight "beat up" a police officer.
 
I have a social experiment for you. When you’re next in a store or restaurant or on an airplane and feel disrespected by a clerk or waiter or flight attendant, grab them by the arm and forcefully (but politely) address their lack of manners and otherwise improper conduct to them. Specify that they were being disrespectful to you and that you’re merely teaching them a lesson about proper deportment. Emphasize your age difference if you believe that to provide worthwhile context, but be sure to make your point regarding their need to respect you. See what responses you receive in response to your actions and then report back. Should be fun.
As *ucked up as much of the youth has become, I fully expect to be spit upon by some young punk before being yelled out and possibly struck in the face with a fist in retaliation as their perceived fairness to my violating their God-given space with an attention grabbing touch on the arm. What is so sad is that so many youth of today just don't get "it".
 
If it was such a traumatic thing for Harvey to be "accosted" by Knight, yeah, I think he might have reacted to move his arm away, but he didn't, so I don't think it was such a big deal to him what Knight did until he mentioned it to his attorney uncle who had earlier written a derogatory piece against Knight...he had a bone to pick with him. His uncle contacted the press, knowing all hell would then break loose. The Harvey kid later said he regretted ever mentioning the incident. It caused him to feel compelled to transfer to another school afterwards. I really don't think Knight's response to Harvey was that big of deal to the kid at the time. It just morphed into something greater because it involved a larger than life figure with the name of Bob Knight and one of his adversaries relishing in the attention he got for blowing the whistle on him.

I've never grabbed another adult to get their attention so I don't know how they would react. It would probably depend on how much the person either liked or hated me.

In PR, all the IU players said it didn't happen the way de Silva claimed it did. All Knight did was point his finger in his face (not poking him in the eye while doing so!), certainly not the assault claimed by the police officer in a country steeped in social unrest at the time where every American was considered an "ugly American". There was real tension between the US and PR at the time of these Pan American games. Our starting guard, Kyle Macy, had his jaw broken by an opposing player during one of the games. For Christ's sake, now THAT was a rough foul of malicious intent but no one remembers that, only that Knight "beat up" a police officer.
I keep asking you what Harvey’s response should’ve been and you keep avoiding the question. Why is that?

In Puerto Rico, it was the Pan American team, not IU, and the allegation was that the cop was shaking his finger in Knight’s face and BK brushed it away, resulting in Knight being poked in the eye. Pretty obvious you’re not familiar with that incident. So was Knight justified in making contact with a cop, regardless of the circumstances?
 
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I can't even figure out what you guys are arguing about. Knowingly grabbing someone by the arm while angry is battery. It is a B Misdemeanor in Indiana.

In that situation, a person can use reasonable (but not deadly) force to terminate (or even prevent) such a crime. What is or is not reasonable force depends on the facts, including the sizes of the people involved and the level of the anger.

A punch to the face might be reasonable, especially if the attacker is much larger than the defender. If the sizes are reversed, perhaps not.
 
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Talented players stayed more than 2 years, transfers weren't nearly as common, IU was within 20 years of their most recent championship, he was left a relatively competitive roster, the fact there wasn't as much talent, overall, as there is now, do I need to go on? Basically, Crean didn't leave much and freshmen and sophomores tend to be inconsistent.

Well, thank you for the history lesson. Players could still leave when RMK showed up. George McGinnis being one of them for the NBA. It really is not that much different. I find it totally amusing that so many people state that Archie will be better when he has his own players! BS There are two coaches at least that are doing fairly well (better than IU) at Ohio State and Illinois and they (unfortunately) don't have all of their players yet. Take that argument down the street because I am not buying it.
 
Well, thank you for the history lesson. Players could still leave when RMK showed up. George McGinnis being one of them for the NBA. It really is not that much different. I find it totally amusing that so many people state that Archie will be better when he has his own players! BS There are two coaches at least that are doing fairly well (better than IU) at Ohio State and Illinois and they (unfortunately) don't have all of their players yet. Take that argument down the street because I am not buying it.
Mac went to ABA, not the NBA. Very few players left early back then, and the standard for doing so was based on financial hardship. GM’s dad has died just before he entered IU as a freshman (I believe that was the timing) and his mother needed financial support.
 
Mac went to ABA, not the NBA. Very few players left early back then, and the standard for doing so was based on financial hardship. GM’s dad has died just before he entered IU as a freshman (I believe that was the timing) and his mother needed financial support.
IU: 17-9/7-8

tOSU: 17-9/7-8
UofI: 17-9/9-6

Yeah, they are blowing us away. :rolleyes:

You are correct it was the ABA at the time, not the NBA. Big George eventually played with Dr. J.

Well, you are correct, they are not blowing us away. However, I bet their fans are not clamoring for "their" players as much as our fans are wishing for players to go away. Anyway...………...it's raining outside here in Florida so I think I will just kinda lay back and enjoy the day.

Have a Blessed Day
 
You are correct it was the ABA at the time, not the NBA. Big George eventually played with Dr. J.

Well, you are correct, they are not blowing us away. However, I bet their fans are not clamoring for "their" players as much as our fans are wishing for players to go away. Anyway...………...it's raining outside here in Florida so I think I will just kinda lay back and enjoy the day.

Have a Blessed Day
Don't confuse some of the posters here with IU fans.
 
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Good for Wisconsin. They will now go in the good win category for IU as part of the 3 wins IU will rack up at home to closeout the regular season
 
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But tell me this, in the parody depicted in the movie, is there not some degree of truth regarding the rowdiness of partying in a college fraternity, dorm, or apartment? I mean, good God, as a freshman I went to an IU publicized and sponsored showing of the movie "Deep Throat" held in the cafeteria of Wright Quad.


I don't think it was "publicized or sponsored" by IU......they did permit a 'House' there to advertise and use the cafeteria.

Do you remember the boxing night the Ferguson Frogs put on about that time? Wright Quad was a zoo back then....wild place.
 
I don't think it was "publicized or sponsored" by IU......they did permit a 'House' there to advertise and use the cafeteria.

Do you remember the boxing night the Ferguson Frogs put on about that time? Wright Quad was a zoo back then....wild place.
Yeah, you have to be right there, I believe. I dated a younger gal who lived there...one of our "Little Sisters" if you now what I mean. So I spent a few nights in the Quad, each at her roommate's expense, but I guess that was part of the deal. She only came in on us once, as one of my proudest moments. I missed the Ferguson Frogs thing, but it sounds like a raucous affair of my leaning.
 
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